Arkansas Legislative Council (ALC)

It members would grab you saying members a committee please set your sign seats all non members can take up open seats an audience seats. You'll get states we're going to start in. Members if you would we're going to Here in opening prayer from Senator Terry Rice and then we'll get started so members would stand and we're here to pray. You will join me in prayer lord we thank you for the day we thank you for the spring time at which the lord has we come together we have been sent here by the people to do the business that is best for them or we just pray that you give us wisdom give us inside or keep this open minded to understand things we don't understand. And we pray you forgive us of our see you in Jesus name amen. Thank you senator. And with that a recognized a governor go ahead and I'll start us off good to see you this morning governor. Mr chairman it is good to see you as well represent Wardlaw Senator Rice thank you for leadership on the A. L. C. into each of the members here this is a a big turnout and I look forward to making my presentation which will be fairly brief and then take any questions that the chair dictates is appropriate I we're here today and really a historic fashion because this is never happened before in history we've never had The New emergency powers act ACT four oh three that was passed by this session of the legislature in this is the first application of the emergency powers act had this act being in place over the last year then I would of or someone in my administration would have appeared before you. Six times asking for a continuation of the Emergency I think we're all leased should say that so we'll see how this goes today. I I am optimistic it will go well and that that the people of Arkansas will be appreciative of the way that you're handling the new responsibility under the emergency powers act so today in accordance with the ACT four oh three I'm requesting an extension of the current emergency declaration for an additional sixty days. I'm also requesting a continuation of five executive orders that have been issued during the current emergency those executive orders are needed until such time as the General Assembly passes legislation to replace the executive orders and at that time the executive orders well in there will be nine. Let me first talk about the need to continue the emergency. Even though our cases hospitalizations and deaths from COVID nineteen are down from the dark days of January. We are reminded that we are less than ninety days removed from four thousand new cases in a single day. We're less than ninety days removed from the time that all hospitals in the state of Arkansas we're stretched with over thirteen hundred COVID patients statewide. And we are also in Arkansas not isolated from what is happening in the rest of the country. For two weeks in a row the US cases have seen increases in COVID cases from the previous week that's been eleven percent increase over the last fourteen days our neighbor to the north Missouri has seen a seven percent increase in the last two weeks Tennessee has. Seeing an increase of thirteen percent in new cases in Florida has seen an increase of eight percent in new cases and I'm sure so Arkansas spring breakers were there. In addition. Extending the emergency allows flexibility to manage the vaccination program until we get a greater percent of our Kansans access to three very effective vaccines. Right now we have thirteen percent of our population fully vaccinated. With twenty five percent of our population receiving at least one dose. My goal is to have a nother one million shots into the arms of our Kansans within the next sixty days during the extension of this emergency. If the emergency is lifted. Then many will say a shot is not needed there is no problem everything is fine everything is back to normal the emergency in and of itself sends a message that the virus remains a major public health concern get your vaccination get a shot when you have that opportunity we've all seen a. Resistance of accepting the vaccine and that resistance will increase if the emergency is lifted to San. Another important reason to extend the emergency is that the emergency declaration is necessary for Arkansas families to qualify for supplemental snap benefits there's twenty three point four million dollars each month. That flows through our retailers and our grocers. Into our Kanemi in Arkansas and just as importantly to the families in your district. This twenty three point four million dollars is one hundred percent federally funded money. And it is part of the requirement to receive the supplemental stat benefits is that there is an emergency declaration in place in the state. And so that in and of itself is a good reason to extend the Emergency now one question that might come up as well are we always going to extend emergency just so we qualify for the twenty three million dollars a month the answer is no we're going to be realistic about that and we will in the emergency at the appropriate time and it should not simply be depended upon that fact but it is a relevant factors you consider the current state of affairs. We should also be aware that forty eight states remain under a state of public health emergency and there remains a national public health emergency as well. Finally it is essential to continue the emergency declaration in order to keep the five executive orders in effect until the General Assembly can act these are executive order twenty oh five on telehealth. This allows the utilization of telehealth and the by the executive order of the billing can be reimbursed by Medicaid. this is reflected in house bill ten sixty three that is passed the house it has been amended in the Senate the Emergency Clause failed and is now back to the house for its consideration and I appreciate on all of these the sponsors of the legislation the work is being put into a effect to replace the executive orders with effective legislation but I for one do not want to tell our providers whether it's mental health or whether it is hospitals or whether it is doctors that you can no longer bill during this pandemic for telehealth and so is necessary to continue the executive order and that requires the extension of the emergency. The second emergency order is twenty twelve which is on the is spent suspension of requirements for in person witnessing and notarized legal documents this is house bill thirteen sixty seven it is not been a presented my understanding in House Committee at ins were waiting action on that House Bill so that we can lift and it can obviate the necessity of the executive order the third one is executive order twenty fifty two which ensures flexibility on staffing and immunity from liability for hospitals. And providers while they are treating COVID nineteen in some instances they've had when they've had the large number of COVID cases to adjust staffing ratios it gives them a munity from liability to meet the necessity of the current pandemic that has passed the house is amended in the Senate and the house is on the House calendar I understand this week. The fourth executive order that is dependent upon the current emergency is the protection of businesses from liability related to the corona virus and this protection from liability is reflected in house bill fourteen eighty seven that is currently in the Senate Judiciary Committee. The final one executive order is twenty one oh six which extended the state individual tax filing deadline to may seventeen two thousand twenty one. And this was done in order to provide clarity and information to all the tax filers out there as to that the state is going to mirror what the changes that is made at the federal level I know that Senator Hickey has taken the leadership and and put legislation forward to accomplish the same purpose but the executive order was important so that people had clarity early on and that once the legislation is passed obviously the executive order can go by the wayside. And so all of those executive orders will drop by the wayside once legislation is a past that accomplish the same purpose and so if the legislation is passed in thirty days then the executive orders in in thirty days versus staying in place for sixty days so the ending of all of those final remaining executive orders is depended upon action by this spot. For that for those that are concerned about business restrictions as you know all business restrictions in the state of Arkansas were lifted in late February February twenty six to be precise we notify the legislature all business restrictions are lifted and so today there are no orders directives mandates that apply to businesses in the state of Arkansas. And the mask mandate will no longer be in place as of March thirty one that is two days from now as you know I've said this publicly we have met the criteria and we we will stay true to that and the mask mandate will be lifted two days from now in terms of a statewide mandate. And so in summary. The executive orders will end when the legislature passes a law that replace them but without the Emergency proc let proclamation continuing and without your action today. then twenty three million dollars per month and stat but stat benefits will be gone business and health care liability protections will be gone telehealth services cannot be billed to Medicaid we lose remote witnessing of legal documents and there will be uncertainty on the tax deadline. And so most importantly though and I believe this is the substantive issue those are all practical issues as well as substantive. Importantly to lift the emergency at this particular time would send the wrong message to the people of Arkansas and that would not put our state in good position it would not reflect well on our utilization of the emergency powers act it is my understanding that under the emergency powers act there has to be a motion to terminate my emergency proclamation of course I would ask that that motion not be at past and that the Emergency continue thank you Mr chair and with that I'll turn the program back to you and be stand ready for any questions the members may have. The board just let up. So representative makes you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chairman governor good morning Sir morning question I have and you can tell me if this relates the emergency powers act I've been contacted by landlords who are concerned about the Reprieve that renters have from up paying rent and is you know of course of rats not paid to landlords and they're not able to meet their obligations and and the affect the snowballs and unfortunately you know we we've we've had stimulus but there are citizens who who are abusing that you know that that to. Reprieve that's been offered so I'm wondering if if that's within your authority or for the for federal regulation that as we begin to move out of the pandemic if you have considered a phase back and so right now there's no obligation to pay rent but perhaps make it where in the next month we pay twenty five percent to fifty percent and seventy five to the phase that backend so that landlords can once again be paid by you know by the renters. At represent makes a this is entirely governed by a federal rule that supersedes anything we do in the State of Arkansas it's actually by a CDC rule in which the by the Paid because that avoids the snowball impact and it also does not. Obviate the need for or the requirement for the payment of interest and penalties that accumulate late payment fees and so whenever they lift the moratorium there's going to be a a day of reckoning and so rent has to be paid that's not be and released and so we are very aggressive we want to get the rental assistance money out and that's what we'll continue to concentrate on I thank you Sir. Thank you members just so everybody's clear I'm going to recognize members of council. So if you're a non member will get to you at the very end so the board lit up in the beginning with some non member so I just wanna make sure everybody's clear I'm recognizing council members only for right now. So with that representative Bentley you're recognized. Thank you chairman governor thank you for coming this morning appear on I'm concerned from my child care operators out there that are really struggling with the guidelines that we have in place where children have to be separated parents cannot come in the building is really inhibiting their ability to work with parents and do a great work with children trying to keep them separates really cause some hardships for them and they're ready to be done with those guidelines we have in place so can we look at the are those specific state guidelines that we can relax for them to be able to let their children play because we know that that that age group is not been affected like the other age groups can so those those are my concerns with I want to share what I was in my constituents on that well you have two things in play represent Bentley I mean one is the ordinary rules of child care that are always in place whether there's a pandemic or not and so those that are one issue and I don't know whether that's something that's in concern to your business providers but the other one would be the the special rules that would have been in place during the pandemic itself and as I said all of those have been released in terms of business restrictions and so there's flexibility and so there should not be any emergency related rules that impact them that they cannot adjust from. There are you know best practices still in place for businesses and I've asked our department of health to review those guidelines or best practices to give the best guidance possible and also the most flexibility possible for our business owners because they still to their credit pay a lot of attention to the guidelines and so you know whether it's restaurants they see the guidelines you know they they got flexibility to deviate from them but they still pay attention to them and so I want the guidelines to reflect the reality of where we are and to give the kind of flexibility that good good operators can can use fairly. Senator Hammer you're recognized. Thank you Mr over here cheer up left governor Gilmore hammer. The of the way the language reads is that the health department would have had to within three days submit their guidelines that they would have wanted to continue and that has not been done to my knowledge there for is it your understanding that all the health directives are there by Noel and not in effect even though some of them have been replaced by guidelines as set up is that your understanding and interpretation that's correct senator Hammer. there's no directives issued by the department of health that to have been submitted because all of the directives are gone. Okay so for example the mask mandate issue notice was not submitted as a directive which sent the signal to you is not going to be renewed had I renew the mask mandate that would have been required to be submitted to this body or she's me to the I guess the public health committee into the oversight and review of those committees and so zero directives have been submitted because zero directives are in place all restrictions have been lifted guidelines because they're not mandates because they're not directives because they're not compulsory on businesses do not under the emergency powers act have to be submitted those are simply guidelines okay follow up Mr. You're recognized thank you. There was some concern raised by some restaurant owners that if the mask mandate was not in effect until the fifteenth of April that they would not be able to do their next draw down in some conversations I believe it was made with the health department that because we would be if we renew this public health emergency that that would be sufficient for them to be able to do so are you aware of that or you have any input on that issue to give us some some clarity and peace of mind. I am aware that issue I've talked to members of the restaurant association that they have a. Employee retention tax credit that is available to them that is a useful and Monetizes very well during a difficult time and that credit is only available if the if there are business restrictions in place during that quarter. And so it's a little ironic that is we live business restrictions and we have lifted business restrictions it does change the ability that they have to qualify for these retention tax credits I'm gonna leave it up to the lawyers and those that have followed it very carefully on the federal requirements as to whether a mask mandated sufficient or whether some other type of it and whether the Emergency itself is sufficient I don't know the answer to that that takes of a I'll leave it up to those that are pursuing the credits as to whether they qualify I think my judgment in your judgment should be based upon where we are right now that's a practical consideration just like the the twenty three to twenty four million dollars that that we might lose from stat benefits that's another issue are benefit that our small businesses would lose if we do not continue the emergency and even with the continuation emergency I think it'll be a legal question as to whether the other things that are in place mind to mind to prevent them from accessing that. Mister chair do you think maybe we could get. The lawyers that would have insight to the table to have that discussion to see if there's anything we need to do before we make final decisions and maybe the of board of health to the table at the appropriate time please we do that right now we're going to finish questioning thank you with the governor. Senator Clark you're recognized for a question. Thank you the first. Governor own of executive order twenty thirty three what was that bill number where I am trying to find his or her over to okay let all right got you say that again what was the bill number on executive order twenty thirty three. Arkansas twenty executive order twenty thirty three Hey it's house bill fourteen eighty seven. Okay because I was looking for that in committee and have found it of. Okay snap benefits. Of does that have anything to do at all. with the inability to find people to work and the long lines in like a service that people are finding of around the state now and whether it does or not is there anything that we're doing. Two. Address that as part of the emergency. That should not to impact any lines because those snap benefits are already being provided they've access those these are supplemental benefits and so they would not be any lines involved it is also managed through a DHS are Department of Human Services the lines that to your reference scene which I think I've been significantly reduced but there's still a waiting times for the pandemic unemployment assistance of it's handled through the department of commerce those are really two separate issues well that's a miscommunication on my part governor I'm talking about in restaurants and other places of work because of lack of employees in fact we had in my area we had a a restaurant that was shut down over the weekend because they couldn't find staff of the I was told but is it related to the fact that employers can't find people to work and as a result of that we're beginning to see people complaining about service along lines except for. yeah I think I get your point now Senator skews me for not catching it earlier But yes there's that employers that are having a hard time getting workers obviously with the significant benefits with the expanded unemployment benefits that pandemic on employment assistance benefits with the stimulus check this going as well as other things they it's harder for employers to draw somebody who is out of the work force back into the work force so I do believe that is a a factor and we just got to continue to increase those are workforce because there's employers that do need them our unemployment rate was four point five percent there's people that The jobs out there we just got to match them up with the right employers. It is. The executive branch aware of the the problem those of people may not employers are telling me and and I'm one of them of thirty two people that we can't find. That people will come out will apply and then you you when you call back for interview nobody will return your call etcetera again. The collecting unemployment but not but not necessarily looking for a job. Well that that's a requirement to look for a job if you're on unemployment and so that continues to be the requirement of people Arkansas I believe want to work but it is is discouraging factor sometimes the benefits you have to give up sometimes if you go to work and so up that is a challenge for us but there is a requirement for anybody on employment to be actively seeking a job thank you go. Thank you senator senator Elliots you're recognized. Good morning governing thank you I I would say also remarked that some of the things I've been hearing from people for example who work and some of the restaurants and other public places that there is a real concern if I'm a worker in places where nobody is masking up because these of these of people with of members of their families who you may be have issues and they have kids and that kind of thing I just want to make that a part of our consideration my question is Has anything changed in any substantial way about the methods we're going to use to try to wrap up the number of people that we I'm getting vaccinated anything substantially changed because that the percentage is so low this is going to be affecting everything we do. Except for a first on your point to even know what we're lifting all our business directives and mandates even pertaining to mask employers still obviously want to keep the workplace safe they are free under our system of private sector responsibility to have their own health requirements within their business we respect that and we don't want to do anything to discourage their own decision making for the health of their staff and customers so those are things that of consumers will measure is they pick their place of business as well as employers making those decisions and we want to make sure that distinction is clear in terms of the vaccination I share your concern and we are looking at every which way in order to increase the vaccination rate everything from adding new providers and opened up to more medical clinics to having more mass vaccination clinics yeah to also having a very extensive marketing campaign that I'm sure everybody is seen that we want to continue to emphasize that and a lot of it to me it depends upon the most effective programs or whenever an employer takes the initiative to educate their workforce they might be bringing in a doctor they might I have a healthcare expert they will talk to them about the safety and the necessity of it that can raise the vaccination rate from twenty percent up to seventy percent that difference there is just a matter of of of leadership so there's a lot of things that we're doing stay tuned for tomorrow I don't think it'll be any surprise but I'll be talking to our department of health as to how we need to open it up more now we need to increase our strategies to get more vaccinated all right the. You governor. Senator Chesterfield. Thank thank you governor for joining us this morning I truly appreciate it some of the states of open it up to everyone sixteen and older. Is that your anticipatory set in this that will be a discussion point with the Department of Health is I meet with them later today and I expect any decision on that to be announced tomorrow obviously we we're in a position where we still have not vaccinated everybody in one C. we've got in northwest Arkansas waiting line still to get through one C. we've got in terms of but this much of the rest of the state it's it's more open and there's some capacity to go ahead and open it up to more northeast Arkansas as I talked to Jonesborough they're full right now but you know they can move to one C. so without getting ahead of myself I assure you that that I understand the necessity of key keeping the demand up we're always trying to balance getting reserving enough vaccines to go to the rule areas of our state so we can have equity in our distribution as well as just simply efficiency and we're balancing those two but **** supply increases and I have confidence of an increase in supply we want to be able to continue to open it up one of the One of the things that the Arkansas legislative black caucus is done to schedule them ourselves working with the health department Baptist hill UAMS to establish them in communities because many times the access is the problem so it this weekend we had eight hundred over a hundred people backs and needed in one site in the community but we're also scheduling those sites working with pharmacies. Because pharmacies are very very responsive and so we've got sites every weekend of this month and I'm wondering if that is a part of the agenda for that you've heard of from other legislative wars or is that just you need to those in the African American community because we know that a lot of times people in our community won't go somewhere else but will go to church in get a vaccination I agree with everything you said and I applaud the leadership of your community that have the vaccine clinic this last weekend and I hope more will be scheduled and this is exactly what I'm talking about it is that you know the Department health can go in and we can hold a vaccine clinic and we can just announce were having that but without the local community marketing it through the churches or through other means it's not going to be successful stock to reach the people we want so we need more of what you just outlined and we're certainly supportive of that. Senator Irvin you're recognized. Thank you governor I'm right here hi one of the things I want to ask you about was and I think the importance I know that on your list here of the agenda number for talks about protection of businesses from liability related to Kevin nineteen however I wanted to point out and just. Just give you the opportunity to respond to number three regarding access to health care resources that emerged at that executive order clearly outlines the fact that healthcare providers and emergency responders are also immune from liability is it not true that there's not really any known a cure of cove it and so that this executive order really protects them from being able to have adverse relate adverse and outcomes at. Hi I have those count against them or or then that be their fault because we really there is no known cure of COVID nineteen and they're throwing everything they've got at it from different perspectives and working with their patients to figure out what it is that they need or that they want that I think I just wanted to highlight that the business a liability and unity is very important but equally as important is the health care providers having the ability to treat their patients an emergency responders responding to those covered patients and really trying to mitigate the damage of COVID without really having an axe actual cure for covid and so I just I wanted to give you an opportunity to respond to that because I think that to me is really the meat of that executive order you're absolutely correct intervening this is this is as important as an executive order of any of them the reason the executive order was signed to begin with it is that the hospitals and health care providers come to this and say this is an emergency we've got to have more staffing in place but you know we we might be utilizing that you know up until the are you know a different level of nursing skilled verses in our in in a particular situation because we have huge staffing shortages or because of our COVID patients were not able to keep the same ratio of patients to each staff person and we have to have more flexibility in there as well as a munity and then as you pointed out there's not a cure for COVID so you know there happen to utilize they tried different things you know they're they're trying through through their best medical judgment therapeutics that might have a chance of working and they don't want to be sued just because they tried something that didn't save a life and so that flexibility was hugely and. And it continues to be very important during the coast a course of this pandemic so thank you for highlighting well and and the second thing I want to say I think there's so much confusion out there when a declaration of the state of emergency and so we kinda think pass this as a tornado hits our state and you know of course it's emergency while the tornadoes hitting the state but after a tornado the aftermath of the tornado is when we declares state of emergency so that we can tap into the federal resources that are available to us and we do that systematically when there's a flood when there's a tornado that has Arkansas and so I think a lot of constituents are confused by using that term state of emergency because I mean emergency relief but the tornado hits during the tornadoes hitting is definitely the emergency the aftermath declaration so if you could just I want us to think through this outside of COVID because we now have a new process in place it's gone also going to extend to those other types of situations. You expect express is well is that anybody can or better and that is exactly right uh we ARE at both in the middle of the at pandemic but we're also continuing to respond to the impact of what we've already seen even though our cases are down we're still having to recover from a many different standpoints in our society and access federal resources so you outlined it perfectly thank you and my last follow up is just I appreciate and later in his ability to get the vaccines to medical clinics it's really important that they have the ability to treat our patients with that thank you. Representative Ladyman you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chair a governor thank I'm over here. I got a governor thank you for coming before us this morning I really appreciate that I want to talk about the vaccine a little bit you mentioned something that got my attention when you talk about business leaders making the decision to try to get their employees vaccinated and have a program of their own and I think that's a great idea There was a vaccine clinic on the ASU campus at the First National Bank arena that was very successful few weeks ago and it was pretty much open really wasn't publicize that much but very successful but the business say a large factory industrial operation can do this but if they had incentive if it in other words if the health department had a program so that business leader could contact the health department and not have to do all the legwork. Because the you know it's a captured workforce in a we've done this for flu shots at factors that I worked at so those people or their on site but it's the lake working getting that done so do you think health department might be able to get a contact line or a program where they could business leaders you just call them and work that out. That that's a good suggestion and I would to magnify it to even broader than that the key is that you know the. Manufacture or the business person they might have fifty employees that they can call whether to health department or local pharmacy or the local medical clinic and and have access to the vaccines may come out and do a clinic on site that's exactly the kind of partnership is needed we have our toll free number that any business can call our department of health and say we want to do this and they will be referred to the local I. health department and the health department can help set that up but this is what I want to encourage our provider community as well we can't have and I I don't I want to be positive zero would be negative because they've been incredible partners but you know you can have a provider that gets their assigned doses and they can wait for people to call and make an appointment. Then they say well the demand is not there or you can be on the phone to the local business or manufacture and say can we come out there and do a clinic in your place in your place of business and that's the most successful providers pharmacists medical clinics or those that are doing that we have many of them that are doing that but we need all of them to do that because we're going to get to the point very quickly that even when we open it entirely up to everyone to get a vaccine you're still going to have some resistance we're gonna get state of fifty percent of our population vaccinated this somehow we got to get from fifty percent to seventy percent and that's probably not going to happen by everybody making a call in and make an appointment it's going to be us going out there and having those kind of clinic services related with that you just described. Thank you. President of fielding you're recognized for a question. Overcome the yes Sir the morning thank you for coming been who go let me also state thank you for your leadership the device only getting those through This pair them again in this business governors you know that we don't always please everybody. But we try to please them with the result of a mess that we try to do the right thing but my question is do you not think that live in the mandate on the massive wherein the people my with say well it's all over we can do we want to do. I certainly hope that's not the case and that's not the message we want to send and so that's why it's critical you can do is think about you know the story line that the Arkansas General Assembly supports a continuation emergency and recognizes that that is the best message to everyone that that we need to continue to take it seriously and obviously you know with lifting. That the mask mandate that there is concern already that people not taking this seriously they need to and so it's our messaging and so I'm going to continue to message that let's protect each other until we all get vaccinated let's respect each other and so it's a it's a balance of message I hear your point but let's let's make sure we don't have a double bad message out there and let's renew the Emergency encourage everybody to continue to take this seriously thank you governor thank you Mr chairman. Thank you representative back you're recognized. Thank you Mr thank you governor from coming to die my question is a bit dated but but I think it's still applicable. I've had people early on never worn the vaccines and come calling me complaining that you know they they had gone to the pharmacy the pharmacies are my district that and they you know they were literally I I contacted pharmacist they literally reporting in our justice is I got it and make the but there shipment was limited. And I understood that and I said you know we're doing everything you know and I was. But then less than a week later I'm sending people. To the. Twenty miles down the road outside the district to the spot thank you thirty miles around outside to get vaccines and they're walking in and getting these there's there seems to be some discrepancies as to how these things are I and I and I have talked with DHS and they said well it's the number locations you have that can administrate and but in some cases these teachers. You know they're trying to get packs and hated thank you know that that had the top priority and they they have accident several of them and some of one out of district and to this day I am recommending people to go outside my district to get vaccines and and I just the question here is is there some type of a system that we're trying to maybe modify that a little bit to have someone's putting it in the arms of people then they should get top priority as far more vaccines I agree let's reward success and effort and efficiency and Colonel later does a good job in evaluating that making adjustments as needed hopefully we're beyond what you just described representative back in that you know we are having more in places that have the teachers want to go into your district but you're point also is right as nothing wrong with going outside of your district or twenty miles away to find access that's. You know that the providers the pharmacist particularly they might have a waiting list everybody's call them they've got a waiting list of say a thousand and they have a clinic where they've got to two hundred fifty doses one of them said they have to make. sixty percent of the calls they make for an appointment they've already got the shot. Can you imagine the work that's related to all of that effort and so it's a challenge for us but we're working through it and hopefully we've got sufficient vaccines now that what you describe is not a problem is getting better in your district. It is getting better but I I just have county officials called last week and say where is that place that you were sending people to in Little Rock and I gave the number. Good yeah give that give the toll free number of for the department of health and we can mention that tell me exactly where they need to go thank. All right governor hi. No more members questions for you so I'll let you close and I'm yes co chair rice as well. The governor just for the members and and people may be watching live streaming verify pharmacies you with through the merger C. of rules that legislation is going to put into effect it is critical that we have the extra majority for emergency clause in that legislation so there is not a gap between the sixty days this continues and the legislation going into effect so but that is something that has to happen for this to. Per se correct that's correct otherwise we're gonna have a gap in the unity liability and other things that's covered by the executive orders if they. If there's not an emergency order on there so certainly if you want to and the Emergency the Emergency at effective time of the legislation would be an important criteria thanks firm that being here today. Thank you Senator Rice they'll at at chairman that the only thing I wanted and was going back to that center hammers a comment about the tax credits probably I know as much about that is anybody except for really good lawyers that are involved in the income tax code but my department of health would not be on top of that issue because that's the that's really a federal tax issue there and so they would not be a capable of responding effectively that I just want to make that point I know you're going to hear some more and I look forward to study that further with you if we can be helpful be happy to thank you for being. A courteous and receive me well today is honored to be with you for this historic moment as we try to get ahead of this pandemic and I get it behind us thank you very much thank you governor. So with that committee we do have a. Public here to speak and to senator Hammer question I think D. FNA is here and all they wanted to answer that question so we'll get Paul gear into the table and then senator Hammer you'll be recognized ask questions. Thank you Mr. Paul if you would introduce yourself a record Senator Hammer you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair members of the committee Paul Goehring department of finance administration. One call over here to your left the the question on the table is that we've gotten we have got some concerns expressed to us by some restaurant owners that they would not be able to draw down and you'll have to give me the phrase I can't hear what it is on April fifteenth their next draw down if the mask mandate is not in effect for the purpose of their employees some of us under the understanding that if we allow this emergency powers to continue although the mask mandate goes away the thirty first that they would have adequate coverage to defend himself and drawing down that next payment on April fifteenth because we're under the emergency powers should we vote to pass it this morning and agree with governor could you enlighten us as far as whether that is accurate inaccurate or give some guidance on that issue please yes senator Hammer a D. if they did take a look at this issue because there have been questions about the the in ploy retention credit under the carers act which was enacted by Congress last in March of the twenty twenty. the employee retention credit provides a payroll tax credit for employers so that as an incentive to maintain their staff now to in order to be eligible for the in the federal employee retention credit you have to either have a complete closure of your business or a suspension of your business as a result of governmental mandates. Now the IRS did issue some guidance as to those restrictions on a business that were not a complete closure of the business we did have businesses that were affected by complete closures and in two thousand twenty during the pandemic. If there is not a complete closure in the IRS guidance then the IRS will look and see if there is more than a nominal effect as a result of the golf governmental regulation on that business. And in order to qualify for continue and ability to receive that retention credit it has to be more than a nominal effect and the IRS guidance that was released and I'll be happy to provide that to the members of a L. C. it's higher guidance two thousand twenty one dash twenty and the the guide states that in general terms that a mask requirement that's imposed by the government either either on the employees or customers of the business does not create more than a nominal effect on the business therefore if there is a mask mandate or not and ask mandate it does not have any bearing upon whether or not that business qualifies for the federal retention credit. Okay and so if we grant the governor's request to go forward with the emergency the to extend a public health emergency we're getting rid of all the health department directives that have transition and guidelines will be it's gonna be your testimony today that if they can qualify to draw down on the fifteenth for other reasons other than the mass mandate that those should be able to be afforded them because we would be under the public health emergency declarations that a fair statement. It's a fair statement that they would have to be something other than a than a mask mandate that would have to result in either a complete closure of that business or suspension of that business that's more than just a nominal effect on that business or thank you thank you Mr. Thank you Mr. Senator just for your record thank you very much let me be clear now it doesn't matter if they have amassed mandate they can still draw the money is that what you're saying. The court in the IRS guidance a mask mandate would not create either lifting a mask mandate or having a mask mandate in effect does not create more than a nominal effect and in order to qualify for that federal credit you have to have more than a nominal effects there needs to be a suspension of that businesses operations and in full which would clearly qualify that in business for the federal retention credit. Or there has to be something more than a nominal effect and the IRS would have to opine on whether or not. A different mandate by the by the state would qualify to continue the effect as more than a nominal effect but the but I think the most important part is that the mask mandate either being in place or not in place only creates a nominal effect on the business of that does not have any bearing on the availability of the retention credit. much as been said about OSHA guidelines being instituted in order to. Incentivise the wearing of masks are you familiar with any OSHA guidelines that have been promulgated that will allow that to happen no senator I'm not aware of any should we we follow date that the directives of the Arkansas department of health as well as being fully aware of the CDC guidelines but I I could not speak to any OSHA guidelines with regards to what mask wearing it was set at the federal level that ocean that wearing the mask may become a part of the ocean mandates in order to incentivize folks to wear the mask or the business might close so I'm just want and that's why I'm wondering had those guidelines been put in place or do we still have the same guidelines and that is all just talk at this point I'm not aware of if of any OSHA guidelines to have been issued but certainly we have been always made aware of the department of health guidelines as well as the CDC all right thank thank you senator. Hold on are there any other questions for D. F. and I. C. N. nine thank you both for coming over of Senator Hammer you have one. They're on their way. So with that we'll go ahead and move to the public Mr Kim ki and signed in. Mr jim you would introduce yourself for committee and you're recognized as being. Yes Sir first of all thank you for the opportunity to be here enjoyed talking with you a German Wardlaw and senator rice of the weekend I'm here today to do something that makes a little bit unusual and that is to talk about defending the continuation of wearing masks in the restaurants we have about three hundred employees in the State of Arkansas into restaurants and construction company and what we have found is that we kinda get caught between a rock and a hard place with our guests and our staff many of our staff members as you can imagine I don't think any of us if if anybody in this room enjoys wearing a mask please raise your hand none of us like to do that but we also know that wearing a mask we believe helps protect both their employees as well as our staff no earlier staff but our guests as well and so what we have talked to the governor about and represented the Wardlaw as well as enterprise is to go ahead and extend the mask mandate for a time so that more people have the ability to get a vaccination. My son Jake my youngest son who I get to work with every day and while the sun have taken the lead in making sure that as soon as one C. was in a fact that we were able to get as many of our staff members have actually this possible we've been very successful in that under Jake's leadership and so far have above a hundred fifty of our staff members have been. Vaccinated so really proud of him to the help us protect what we consider to be the heroes in our business and that's those folks that show up every day to server gas and to do so with excellence but also in a safe manner so Jake. Kind of like that. so may seem a little counterintuitive that somebody in the restaurant industry who also and the chairman of the NPP commission for the city of little rock would come in and ask you to actually extend the mandate by we honestly believe that as more people are vaccinated it will increase people's tendency to come back into the restaurants each night as we work one of the most common things that we hear is this the first time that I have been out in a year thank you for being open. we hear a couple saying thank god I got away from my four children tonight for the first time in a year you know those kind of comments so we know that as people's confidence increases and when they see that the mass mandate is still in effect we actually believe that it will help encourage more people to come into the restaurants last year we went from record sales in fourteen of the fifteen restaurants that we own in three states went from record sales one day to either closed or down seventy percent the next day. And so the hospitality industry as you can imagine has at a very trying year so everything that we can do that we think will enhance the guest. Confidence in coming back to the restaurants we think will help the second thing and all the other department of finance administration is an expert with regard to what goes on with the federal government with regard to the RTC the employee retention tax credits we don't think that the mask mandate in and of itself is enough to allow us to continue to get those tax credits we agree with that however on a cumulative basis when combined with the sixty feet restrictions and other elements of our business is being curtailed as a result of the pandemic we believe that on a cumulative basis demand that the mask mandate will help us there as well so in our case and and is it's also the case for many restaurants and hotels we believe that that will help us as I've told my signs it puts another arrow in our quiver in that regard as well. And with that in any questions I'm happy to answer. There are a few questions Representative speaks you referred over. Thank you Mr chair. I'm over here. Right here. My question is can you not put the sign up and demand that people wear the mask in there in your restaurant. It is very ticklish and a yes we do have signs up in all of our restaurants that say a facemask is required when people come into the restaurant it puts our staff in a very difficult position at times because while we ask every person that comes in to wear a mask is frankly kind of infuriates some people they decide to leave but we uh try to be very respectful of everybody's position we want to protect our staff and our gas if we don't have people wearing a mask those who still feel that is very important to do so get equally as irritated and so we're kind of caught between a rock and a hard place and we just do our best to keep your staff safe at our guests safe in every way possible. Thank you Mr chair thank you representative. So senator Chesterfield I hit the wrong button if you hit again I'll come back. You're on thank you ladies and gentleman I was I just wanna make a formal introduction of this gentleman this is my former representative. I he is one of only two Republicans I have ever voted for in my life. Him and when the Rockefeller. It is an honor to have you here Sir and such an honor to have you present your information today jim key was that you meet. Member of this chamber who always cared about everybody which is one of the reasons that I see at I voted for him Jim tell me about the OSHA thing. Is that just something that is being talked about are you aware of it because I know that it was being made a big thing of a couple of months ago that in order to inspire people to wear the mask that is an ocean guideline would be put in place and if you did not it would be a violation of OSHA. You keep up with a lot of this stuff more than I do sometimes could you speak to that please. Yes ma'am not very eloquently but probably know just about as much as you do we know that at one point she was considering that but they never followed through on it We have kind of taken it upon ourselves to do everything that we can to protect our staff we have learned a lot in the last year initially there is a lot of confusion and if debate as to whether. Wearing a mask was in fact effective there's that debate goes on today as we speak of but we are wanted to err on the side of caution inspected protector staff that the as I say for you know three hundred seventy five days or so or eighty days since this all started have to come to work. The other best the server yes. Senator hill did you vote for me on the house and the Senate and did you vote for me when I ran for governor. Senator you know you're recognized. Mr Kate had your import invoice bill about what you're saying do they feel the same way as you do. Yes Sir I think so as I mentioned earlier and I don't think any of this like we're going to ask. I know I certainly don't I would have a designer mask in a circle like where it but you know the point being that They have agreed to do so I in some cases they think it's very important to do so and others they're resistant to it but when we make what we believe to be a compelling case that is not only protecting the person who is working next to them. gas that they agreed to do so and and we appreciate their cooperation. I'm sorry Sir here I didn't turn it off you're good now did they agreed you said your employees agreed agreed to the S. just want to follow up to make sure that they agree to register me party or policy they must do it. is part of our policies they missed it and that's a little different than agreeing to a. Well that's true of thank you they do have the choice of of working with this or not working with this as well. Senator Elliot you're recognized. I thank you Mr chair Mr representative sent a key I. I'm wondering if you just have a sense of when people come into your restaurant if there is more resistance or less resistance to to the mask and that you have at your own place of business and I and I'm recognized in their name I'm not for going at all that there is not a serious balance that needs to be had between the business and the protection of the folks who work there and who come into your your business. Well again it's kind of a mixed bag some people I think really appreciate the fact that we have all our staff wearing masks that we have a sign several signs actually hundred doors telling people that master required as they come into the restaurant we've taken additional steps of having what's called the biozone and restaurants that helps in killing any of the virus that's airborne we have modified in several cases or HVAC systems to. Enhance the safety of our guests and our staff and I think because we have very high standards in our restaurants for cleanliness any how long before this happened in of taken many additional steps during the course of last year I thank our guests for becoming more and more comfortable in coming into our restaurants and frankly I I think they are pretty discerning and they will know which restaurants are more cautious more fastidious about maintaining the health of both their staff and the S. and so I think they appreciate that we have a lot of uh comments from our guests Samus they appreciate the efforts that we may I'm trying to get a resistance quotient is why I was trying to get it out would you say there are more people who read I'm talking about customers who resist the notion of happened to mask up or those who do or do not how many what what how many generally walk away if you can kind of give us if you have any idea about that. We have a few gas that have called me personally that have objected to the fact that we have required them to wear masks as they come in we ask our gas if they get up and go to the restroom as an example to put their masks back on and those gas or agreeable to that some people are kind of surprised go on sorry I forgot and put it on there others that become angry and say well when this is all over if you change your policy I'll come back but I would say that that there are fewer of those that responded that way than those who say that they are more than happy to cooperate and have you had any staff leave because they have to wear a mask it is been very rare Jackson there's there been a. Yeah we've that we've had to in the to the king's brands at petit and Keet cypress we've had another couple so they're probably on its it's it's less than two or three percent of our entire work staff and most that have decided to leave as a result all right thank you for your response yes. Representative Bentley. Thank you chairman just real briefly Mr keep back here a. Hello thank you. And your driving through and getting dinner on the way home multiple times this session so thank you for a great restaurant great service my constituents number restaurant owners would feel just the opposite of you so I think as a as a whole we have to look at our our districts and I know they are very excited by the government in this mass band so I think that you would agree with me that in this nation as we love about America we're free to do as we choose to do and this pandemic has put a lot of strain on the your industry as well specifically SO anyway AS one you do you not think that maybe some of the restaurant owners don't feel the same way issue across the state have you heard that from other restaurant owners yes ma'am I had I agree with that hundred percent and again I'm here representing only myself in our restaurants and not the a and P. commission. Senator Clark you're recognized. Thank you. Senator. Over to your left. One of my favorite elected officials will my favorite restaurateurs. The up the. Go out to eat a lot and lots of restaurants still have the spacing except for several are starting to see people wall to wall of there are people satisfied very satisfied with each arrangement people dissatisfied with the arrangement as things are getting safer isn't that how the market supposed to work. Okay yes as a business major. I would say yes we have taken kind of a moderate approach and have decided to not go to one hundred percent capacity at this point we've had a lot of guests that have said they appreciate the fact that we're still at about eighty percent into restaurants right now our largest capacity is that the Cyprus social we're we concede as many as three hundred people and right now we're receiving about two hundred forty at most and so we're trying to keep the social distancing in place we're not at a hundred percent capacity even in the bar we are trying to manage that in such a way that there is still social distancing between folks that don't know one another so once again it's kind of a ticklish situation where you're darned if you do darn if you dial and so we're doing our best to navigate those troubled waters and keep our staff safer gas safe and and and happy at the same time. Thank you senator thank you Mr. Thank you. Senator Hammer your questions for the department's correct. On L. set the stage for the health department let me ask you one please I'll be fine all right thank you so we've heard testimony today from DFA that says that the mask mandate will not have any effect on a restaurant being able to draw down on April fifteenth and that's from DFA. We have the health department who chose not to as required by law to issue directives which means the mass mandate the the six foot seating arrangements all those things at the been operating under they chose not to issue that as part of the executive order so what I'm hearing is that you're expressing your thoughts as far as your personal concerns but yet those are your thoughts and yours alone and. We as a body. You should not do anything that would go contrary to the messaging that the department of health is putting out or that DFA gives you shirts of the restaurants to be able to draw down. Am I missing something or is that is that a fair description of discussion this morning I think that's a fair description the only thing that I would add as an amendment to that is that is the cumulative effect of all the other things that are we are facing as restaurateurs that we thank you will help us qualify for the RTC but but I agree with what you're saying and and generally speaking the extension of emergency powers is something that very much support I think the governor and you're a hundred percent right doing so and by the way just as a side note. Really proud of our governor and the way that you folks have conducted herself in both chambers to try to navigate this crisis. Thank you they mature for the proper health appropriate time please. Thank you thank you of. Mr representative senator as a center Chesterfield college while ago depreciate you coming to testify. Trusts have been called a lot worse I understand. Thank you very much. So with that members we have the members want questions someone would bring up the department of health and DHS together. And more recognized. Representative Cavenaugh. You guys you would introduce yourself for the record representative Cavenaugh you're recognized for a question thank you Mr. You will recognize self. Thank Mister Clark what for means services Matt Gilmore department health over here to Iraq. Okay for DHS didn't simple quick question on the snap benefits that were receiving the twenty four million a month in the extras that benefits we've been told to different things that we have to have an emergency order a directive to be able to get that money but we've also been told that it could be done through rules so is it true that it could be done through rules and we don't really need this emergency to continue to receive that money that is not correct under the federal requirements that attach to the snap emergency step will benefits those are only available in the state during the month in which there is a declared state public health emergency. Follow up Mr. Read. do we have any idea how many our Kansans are benefiting from this map and what the breakdown is to elderly. I'm I don't have that information often I certainly can check to see if I can get that for you I appreciate that if you could. And my question for the department of health is on the guidelines that we currently have that word current will had been directives but they're now guidelines. Are there any of fines associated with those if the businesses don't follow those guidelines what are the consequences to those businesses. So the only directive there everything else is guidelines is no fun so that we guidelines recommendations there is one directed at the governor mentioned earlier about the mask directive and there is a fine associated with that but that should end on the thirty first follow up. So basically if the guidelines of their and they choose not to follow it as a business there's no consequence to them there is no consequence for the department of health of the state that's correct thank you. A representative. President Dotson you're recognized. Testing. Thank you Mr chair up mark this is probably for you last week you had a lot of uh emergency ordered or emergency rules the came through a L. C. executive subcommittee particular with regards to the Medicaid reimbursement via telehealth are those in effect at this point and I thank you if I recall correctly at the time you said those need to be in effect before the state of emergency came to an end in order for Medicaid reimbursements for doctors to continue are those in effect in it And as that are we clear in that regard at this moment. Yes Sir for things they're within the ages of forty eight yes those are in effect in those are taking care of the I would mention the one thing that's not within our authority that is covered by one of the executive orders on today's agenda it does really telemedicine is that ability for providers to create a professional relationship if from a distance that's something that's waste a scope of practice is outside of our authority and so that is something strictly under the executive order is not something we have an authority to address that would be for an new patients going forward this is not not for Medicaid billing as far as getting reimbursed for existing really patients and not not for existing patients that yes that's my understanding thank you. Senator Dismang you are recognized for a question thank you Mr chairman and just a real quick question on the guidelines just follow up a little bit on some of the discussion what do we anticipate there being a change in the guidelines at any point because my concern is that if the guys so long as the guidelines are in place that's what allows you to have. You know io twenty thirty three as a as a backup but if you're not following the guidelines of to the governor's point when he was talking earlier you're not following those two eighty then you open yourself up to liability issues which I would say you do so long as the guidelines are in place at what point do we look at. You know re evaluating some of those because I would say some of them don't make a whole lot of sense and not put in jeopardy you know get some of our businesses because they're not following entity as well as I discussed earlier that that that's a big concern of mine has been for a while. So our medical team reviews the guidelines fairly often and some of you can notice the top of got a revision dates on them so they are constantly revised I think as we see cases go down I think as we see improvements I think would force before seeing now I think those will go away you know I'm I'm not an attorney so I don't I don't understand how that would work as far as a liability set aside and understand some of it but I think you know as a governor said earlier businesses have the freedom it's a guidelines recommendation I understand what you're saying though that someone to make the case we weren't following recommendations I understand that but I think they will go away I thought I would hope you know I think we all hope as soon as possible we also you know there's concern with variants coming out and you know as the government's earlier some of the states around us are signs and increasing cases so I don't know how fast it will happen but I would anticipate you know as as soon as possible we can get the election moved on so as an example I think the twelve foot rules still in place for health clubs that right of it's a recommendation it's still in places a recommendation and so the you know the issue there is is it if a health club is not following that twelve foot rule and there does happen to be some type of covered related issue then again they're subject to liability but that I would also say or just ask I mean how many outbreaks of we had come from health clubs I'm not aware of any personally maybe in other states but not here in the state of Arkansas at least that I'm aware of that so again I just I just hope we do take a look at those because long as they are in place it's going to be difficult for some of the businesses to alter so you know what they're doing right now because they are fearful one is sure to make sure that they maintain the business protection that's in twenty dash thirty three that's what we do that with some haste thank you Sir. Representative Bragg you're recognized. Thank you Mr here are I know the governor's always wanted to consistency an application but is there anything that would prevent a business or restaurant from continuing a mask mandate on their own initiative. I think that would be up to the as a as a business owner they can pretty much do whatever they want to on that on that standpoint you know I think that's something that they do as a business owner may be made that decision the I don't see an issue you know if if it's a private entity private business they can do as a as they would please I would think Sir okay thank you. President of the representative answered my question thank you. Representative fielding you're recognized. Thank you Mr mat over here do we have a supply of the J. and J. drug that we could I guess go out in the ruler of the Arkansas does this Senate here in central Arkansas. I think the Johnson Johnson Janssen is increasing I don't know that we've got an adequate supply to you know take it around the state and do I think kind of what you're alluding to I think it will increase us and we're seeing an increase weekly but I don't think. I don't have a number for me I don't think we have enough to do that right at the moment but I think that is and we want to do as we see more vexing and state and you know as the governor alluded to earlier as things continue to change with the different phases I think that we think we can look at it and move forward with yeah I think that'll be good you know because of the I do have a lot to ask for but you know the same time this the taking what is available at that time but I do have a lot of requests but it thank you thank you thank you Mr chairman. Thank you representive representative Cavenaugh you're recognized for a question thank you Mr chair this is for you. Matt so on. Dr Romero he has publicly said that he doesn't support lifting the emergency health Grasses that were under until he believes that the federal government says it's over with that statement are the guidelines going to be lifted so as Senator Dismang was saying that businesses don't have to be concerned about liability. So that's the guidelines were drafted and and revised as I said earlier you know fairly often I think that you know those are something that a business owner or a individual can choose to fall if they wish or not you know I think as you know we have a lot of folks that that one some guidelines that want some best practices so I don't know that they will actually you know I don't know how soon it will go away we constantly revising but at the same time you know I had I had a individual reach out to me like last week asking you know if the masked man that goes away what do we do and I said well what invasion that will turn into a a guidance we have got is now on our website for mass and how to use them properly so I think there's a fine line in there somewhere of yes we've got guidelines you know do people want to follow those do they not think that's a personal decision not to make. Thank you. Representatives Missy back yeah I'm back in thank you so in reading the I guess this would be for the health department. either one of you it doesn't matter reading of the proclamation it appears that if a business fails to follow the guidelines that have been established in that proclamation they could lose the liability protection that we currently have on the executive order. Can you. Give me recommendation how we fix that can can we fix that is that something you guys can fix change the the language on that so that these businesses that. I guess are following along with the mask mandate it's gonna be lifted everything else that I think they could be a little bit of danger if they don't follow exactly the guidelines because we're leaving the potentially leaving the the liability protection in their. Again only on the guidelines I think. They're written I understand what you're saying they are not later mentioned and one of the executive orders but at the same time you know there's not gonna be a situation where those guidelines will fit every single situation so I think there's some flexibility there we can discuss that with governor's office and see you know how they would suggest moving forward on that thank you should read that proclamation again at the very bottom and I think you'll see that these businesses if they if they fail to follow exactly the guidelines that we set out you set out. They could lose liability protection that we already have established an executive order emergency order so if you would take a look at that let me know what you think I appreciate that answer will to. The representative representative you're recognized. Senator I'm sorry for me. Thank you so just I know that we have kind of a discussion about the executive orders and the emergency and then a separate discussion about the guidelines and so I think what I want to be clear about is what I want to be clear about is I I do feel like we're at a point of kind of nonsense in such a way so and and let me let me phrase my my question a little bit when you do have some of these restrictions like at a the GM and restaurants and nail salons and beauty salons and things like that but yet you have you know clearly people plain athletic events frighten each other's faces and without a mask I mean it's it's it's and there's such conflicting information what I want to make sure that we're clear about is that. Arkansas businesses can go back to work full capacity because they're such mixed messaging going on at the federal level and so my question to you for the department of health is you know what are these guidelines. Triggered. doesn't trigger any type of finds any type of penalties any type of. Things that that you know or can the business choose choose to follow them or choose not to follow them and if they choose not to follow them then are there going to be any any penalties or consequences of that. So they're strictly guidance recommendations suggestions there is no penalties is associated with them it is a choice for that business owner to follow and I would think that would be something they need to discuss you know how they want to pursue with that or proceed with that with their you know their legal counsel who everybody to strictly a guidance it is a suggestion or recommendation I mean Arkansas is I mean other than the master record that's the only recognized only directed we have in place at the moment so there are no restrictions on businesses there are no restrictions on you know the places that we had directives on those are no longer in place okay and so this Legislative Council question to the chair This this council could actually in the math mandate is that correct could we votes in the mass mandate today. The staff answer that for you okay and then Mister chair I do have a question about virtual schools and how any of these would affect if there's somebody from the department of education here that could answer my questions that be great. Okay I see Branscum back there surely you can come to the table okay great. Senator Irvin yes the mass mandate to the directive of the mass mandate isn't before Legislative Council under the new law the department of health was required to submit that question to the public health committees as well as Legislative Council within three days after the act passed they have not done that therefore the mass mandate will and on March thirty first okay all right thank you. Mr Braskem ri you come to the table to answer senators questions. Senator if you would introduce yourself and committee and senator you're recognized ask questions. David Branscum director of inter governmental affairs department education. The masks are. What was the questions Senator would thank you Mr Francisco represent grants gov the question is are they are is there anything that would impact the schools and their policies on what they're doing right now with virtual schools with being able to take hold classes virtually is there anything before us that would impact that ability for those schools to do did not be able to do that I don't believe so no thank you your. Senator Hammer you have a question thank you thank you Jerry one department of it to stay at the table right I'd like to department did state the table thank you I don't have any questions but I can stay at the table. A. Two I'm one and done you know I mean that's. To the department of health. Prior to covid. Did you have guidelines for other areas non COVID related. We have specific guidances for other you know diseases things like that for anything did you do you have guidelines yes yes Sir yes Sir and we and we tend to we try to follow the CDC as close as possible I can't think of one off top of my head but I can. Just generally I would think we had some you know with some of the infectious diseases that we you know we monitor in the state and work with with individuals I have those on I feel confident saying that but I can't think a lot of money so all right so guidelines are part of the normal course of day to day business for the department of health take a covered out of the picture all together you're in the business of writing guidelines about things that you give to businesses that they are asked to follow as best practices is that fair the mission of the part of health is is is a lot of education and providing public awareness so you know we do that with drinking water we do that with all kinds of things yes Sir okay so when you right when you walk into a business and somebody is not following a guideline do you write them up and does that become part of their permanent files so that six months later you would look back and say we walked into a restaurant XYZ they were not following the guidelines and you put a piece of paper you put a formal documentation into their permanent file or is it just all verbal so the the things that businesses can be written up with outside of code in our promulgated through rules through the whole health committee through the rules committee the What you're speaking of with guidelines with COVID that would not be I mean we might make a recommendation we go in and say you know Senator Hammer you might be a good idea to do this this or this but when I write them a former guideline it will be a promulgate a rule outside of code they'll be written up with from the no one four from when we let the record laps okay so by us transitioning from directives to guidelines COVID related from this point forward until those guidelines go away if you walk into a restaurant and they're not following the guidelines the associate with COVID you're not right name up there's no permanent paperwork three months from now somebody could walk in and they'd never see any evidence that you had a conversation with them about violation or about being notified that they're not in compliance with the guidelines is that correct the the guidances and guidelines on our website with COVID now have no enforcement measures tied to them they're so there would not be any kind of penalty or fine associated with those with that not minimize the legality of somebody being sued if they weren't following of COVID guideline based on what you just said I would deferred an attorney on that. Okay I think it's it's a guideline it's a best practice and we we we try to be as consistent as possible but as far as you know what may or may not happen I would speak on as far as a lawsuit or something like that Sir okay and for the record at if we let the rest of this go through today all the health department directives are complete and gone at this point some of and turned into guidelines but all the directives so people can return to normal at their daycare centers at their restaurants at their churches all those directives are gone is that in my interpreting that correct other than the master record which the governor plans to end on the thirty first yes Sir the eight well I will in the center for shot a lot of people okay thanks. Representive all thank you Mr chair I have two questions if that's okay one for department of health and one for this department of ed. I had a. Of beauty. Cosmetologist takes man asked me was about the mismatch mask mandate on because on beauty shops and barbers because there's came from department of health and not necessarily from the governor's executive orders so if the mask mandate goes away does that include all of our barber shops and all of our beauty shops. Yes yes ma'am we have I think a guidance document or website for the cosmetology establishments and barber shops but the mast reckons the only thing in place right now that would require them to wear a mask okay thank you and then for Mister Brandt scum and I've got as school administrators asking about the mask mandate at our schools for the children and for the teachers if the mask mandate goes away on March thirty first does that also include our education system I would assume so okay but I better let me get back with you on that okay thank you. Senator Davis you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair and I move that we needed I the governor's request to extend the public health emergency that's a proper motion so Committee and I do have a second Committee will have missed Marty Garrity explain what that motion means and and what this vote could entail. Members of the committee under the laws of the way it works is unless a majority of the quorum present votes to deny the request the emergency will be renewed under the governor's request through may thirtieth of twenty twenty one this is the first vote if this if the emergency is renewed then you this body will then take up the executive orders which can be done in one batch or individually. So there any questions to procedure before we move on to discussions. Senator Davis I'm a recognized you to repeat your motion. I move that we deny the governor's request to continue or extend the public health emergency. Thank you. Represent Senator Ballinger. I have discussion on the motion of the proper care I wanna hold. So I have Senator Dismang Senator hammer Senate Chesterfield on the board or those discussion on the motion or questions on procedure. Okay Sir represented Payton in your discussion motion or. The state okay we're so we'll move on to discussion Senator Ballinger your first. Thank you Mr at you know I I appreciate Senator Davis is a motion from from my standpoint I don't think that this is a question it should be seen as a jab at the governor I think the governor has. Has done a good job you know I think he's he has has done you know his best season everything that he's done I feel like is to have been in the the interest of the of the people of Arkansas you know first and foremost the question is whether or not we've done our job and we're not even to some extent we've been allowed to do our job I I'm I'm really disappointed that we didn't jump in and out and I'm at fault too right I could have could have pushed harder and got some these executive orders codified into law faster which will got all that done because it would make this job a little bit easier but I don't think that takes away our responsibility to legislate to be the ones who are directing policy in the state and especially since we're in session to be able to deal with these things I feel like we have an obligation to go back but we have an obligation to to our constituents who need to have a voice in the process it is not good that we go year of having. Governed by executive order being under a state of emergency man clearly there's still a lot of really hard things that we're going through and I do see the uptick in numbers of places this is a very serious time but I don't think it it means that we need to do away with the Republican form of government that we're obligated have under the US and state constitutions so I'd support center Davis is motion and think that even though this is not going to be easy I think this is right. Senator Hammer you're recognized for discussion. Thank you Mr unless I'm misunderstanding it with the governor's asking for. Is a little more time in order to get these executive orders through which are all in the hopper on the legislative branch side to handle in if I'm reading the order right that when these become law the emergency ceases we've already had all of the issues that I've heard the most from my constituents and that is about the mass mandate about the health department directives those seem to be the source of contention the based on testimony today are going to have gone away with the exception of the mass mandate which will go away this week that's where a lot of the source of contention comes I think that we need to allow for the process to continue to work and let's get these through and give them priority status in the lead in the committee meetings in the legislative process because as I read it it will be over soon as those things are taken care of and they'll be no gaps in time so I would appreciate no so that we can go ahead and pushes through and then it'll go away by itself thank you. Senator Davis you're recognized for discussion. Thank you Mr chairman I just wanted to follow up on some of the comments that Senator Ballinger said and this certainly is not intended to be a jab at the governor but. And the truth is he could ask for a shorter period of time if it was to wait for the legislature to pass some of these bills. And I know that the department of health and others say that and nothing changes are already just guidance and recommendation there are no mandates but the truth is these schools and daycares they are continuing to follow a lot of this stuff like it is mandates I haven't stepped foot in my two year old stay here in over a year. She's in a new class I hinder off to people at the front door I'm not allowed to walk in my kids get in trouble or get attention when they don't have their mask on we're not allowed to bring grandparents to kids sporting events even though we were told that sporting events are open back again and you can go in and watch your kids the truth is life is still drastically different even though we're saying that these are not mandates these are guidelines or recommendations that's just not how people are operating there still operating like these things are mandates and we are still being prohibited from living life. We've seen that cases have only risen under all these mandates we've seen him go up and now we see just a few cases every day not many and the truth is we need to be able to return back to normal life there is in fact no emergency the federal government will always dangle something in front of us the always say here's this money if you extend a little longer there's always going to be a reason to extend and I would love to walk in my child's daycare and see her teachers in the classroom she's in but I don't have the opportunity to do so so there are reasons this is not meant to be a jab there are reasons to say we deny this request for extension and I just want to make that clear that I'm not trying to be that as by Senator Ballinger said I'm not trying to take a jab at the governor at the department of health and the work that everyone has done to the best intentions I think and but it's time for us to stand up and speak up for the people of Arkansas on that's the intention of my motion thank you. Senator Clark you're recognized thank you. I think what folks senator Hammer said is reasonable except. I've been here since the second week of January. Of. House Bill fourteen eighty seven dealing with emergency order twenty thirty three will be the first thing we hear and Senate Judiciary this afternoon first time I've seen it but will be the first thing we hear I would have heard it the first week of January had I had it And I think it's incumbent on us that we take anything that needs to be done get it done should have been done way before now we slow walk the the. Legislation that got us to this meeting today of. The and on that note that executive order I'm not a lawyer have no legal education but I was told by many they thought that the order was unconstitutional of there was a move to get us call in the session in may and June to pass something on that we're way past time I think it's time the legislature right thank you. Representative Payton you're recognized. Thank you Mr colleagues whether you love the executive orders or head on with you love the governor not of it's it's a bad way to govern when a governor and I don't say the governor this governor a governor can draft legislation in the form of an executive order and then hold the state hostage with a margin to declaration and demand that we passed and let and codify the executive orders. It's a road that we shouldn't be going down and you know I have nothing against these executive orders I expect I'll vote for for all of them I have nothing against our governor I think he's done a great job and done it all it buys heart with the best intentions. But we have a separation of powers and it was recently pointed out that we all need to stay in our lane and whether or not these executive orders and up codified or not should not determine whether or not we have a state of emergency and regarding the snap benefits in the twenty three million dollars that the government that the federal government his dangling in front of us I just ask you if it's twenty three million today what your price next time. Ten million five million two million. we can't allow that to drive whether or not we keep the state under state of emergency thank you Mr. Representa Ballinger last one. Thank you Mr I own the title representative Ballinger very happily so um. It It one clarification employee would be a bad idea for staff to comment on this but the the reality is it's it's not a situation of extending the state of emergency just for these these these executive orders. Right so it is true that these executive orders will become an unnecessary medicines we pass legislation does the job but the statements he does not end there. This by doing this what you're doing is you're empowering the governor to make another mask mandate if he chooses to do so. To put more order the executive orders that limits the ability for businesses to operate it not that he's going to not that he wants to but that's the point of the the state of emergency gives him the power without legislative approval to put forth more executive orders it gives him the power to legislate. Without the legislature. And that's not where we're at as you know in the state of emergency the legislature very clearly can at can't get together because we are right so we have the ability to do that if there's going to be another mass mandate it should come to the legislative body to be approved by the legislature of people's representatives should have a voice in the process by by voting to to allow this to continue by not voting for this motion you're saying no if there's another mass mandate god you got it I don't want to have to have any say in that I don't want my constituents have any say in that. So from my standpoint it isn't a question of just these executive orders those are good I mean I we should do something legislatively but it's a matter of whether or not the governor should have the sole authority to be able to legislate or whether we should have the ability to to do that step in so that's why I think it's imperative on us for constituents to vote for. Senator Ballinger under the new act if the governor wanted to add another executive order it would be required to come through Legislative Council as well as directives would be required to go through the public health committees and Legislative Council and I may be I may be mistaken which happens upon of on a very often occasion but he could issue the executive orders then we would have within a certain amount of time the opportunity to review and approve or disapprove of is that correct. So essentially mask mandate would be in place and then we have a option to either approve it or not yes it would go into effect immediately and then within Ten days I think. And then it would it would become effective immediately but would required to go through Legislative Council that's correct of next meeting so the question is whether or not that should be something that should be it is decision the legislature has the input before it ever goes into effect or do we just want to give it to the governor and as much as I love their governor respect the government think is one of the great man I just think that the process itself should require some legislative input. Senator garner. Representative or senator I'm sorry one thousand center you're recognized representative Garner. Thank you very much Mister chair and I just have a question about the twenty three million if we don't. Approve the executive order what happens to the folks in Arkansas who are depending on this twenty three million to feed their family. I'm sorry I had. Here but sorry Mister chair I'm just wondering if we don't approve the executive orders if we deny the executive orders how do we. Replace that twenty three million from the governor from the federal government for our Kansans to feed their families. With this motions on the emergency order itself not the executive orders so if this motion fails will take up the emergency one of those but but we we will not get to that point unless we make it through our great thank you very much. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized immediate consideration as a proper motion all those in favor Meeks erased say aye. All opposed ayes have it so if that would take up the question which would be the motion from Senator Davis to deny the emergency request all those in favor say aye. All those opposed. Nos have it with that we'll move on to the emergency emergency executive orders Committee I will deferred to the committee to hear do you want to batch the emergency order executive orders or do you want to hear each one. Okay I would of entertain a motion. motion to batch impact in pass second by Senator Dismang for discussion. Thank you Mr chairman eight so I mean I would like to discuss C. for that's twenty dash thirty three. Okay you want to hear from some because I think it goes back to what we kind of keep talking about so Senator Davis was talking about what happens at day care right now and why are they at hearing to these guidelines even though Department says leases guidelines this point you have to follow them but is the very last sentence on C. for which is why the day cares are still falling the why you're still going to see basking mandates because it's a guideline or whatever it may be in its were read substantially complying with health and safety directives or guidelines issued. I mean on this particular evening and I know where we are it's proclamation is not going to change but that that is at the heart of what I think the problem is right now as long if we want businesses to maintain of you know this liability coverage or or allow them to have to have these This exemption if that were guidelines in place and they're not substantially following the guidelines then we've created a cause of action. And so that that name I'm I'm great with C. four with the exception of or guidelines issued in into the part and health point. They've already said that those change. Regularly and I will tell you that I've just spent the last twenty minutes trying to find the guidelines on the department of health website and it keeps taking me to the CDC page well that's not issued by the department of health is is this isn't an easy process again it changes it's hard to know what's going on and I am concerned that we're going to open up a cause of action for attorneys to go in and kind of pick apart based on this executive order but again I know we're we are in the process maybe that's something we can take care of through statute as we hear house bill fourteen eighty seven but that's to Senator Davis when I think that's why these businesses are still adhering to the guidelines because they want to be able to have the exemption thank you. Representative I Shepherd Speaker Shepherd you're recognized thank you Mr chair and I just I guess is a point of clarification and maybe staff or somebody else can tell me if they disagree. And and maybe I don't have a strong opinion on that particular point but the but as I read it and as this was drafted this is giving businesses a presumption even if you eliminated the presumption liability still potentially attach is based on willful reckless or intentional misconduct this was giving businesses a second bite at the apple so to speak to say well I have complied so even even if the business is not complied the underlying standard is still where they reckless where they will for did they engage in intentional misconduct so I don't see I understand that there's the concern of what the business is a complying then they're setting themselves up in less you completely rework this executive order or even the legislation is presented the underlying question is still where they willful reckless were engaged intentional misconduct in this language about guidelines is simply giving businesses a a a rebuttable are a presumption that allows them to defend themselves if they don't this is not in my view does not attach any liability in other words you can't I guess it could be evidence but that that could be evidence regardless and so I just think it's important staff can correct me if I'm wrong but I don't see that from a legal standpoint that having that language to meet only helps the businesses it can it should not be utilized to hurt them and so I just want to point that out because I've heard that and I tried to dig into it because I I think that is a legitimate concern but as I read it it still goes back to that underlying stuff underlying standard. Thank you Mr Speaker. Hi Senator Irvin you're recognized. I thank you at thank you for recognizing me and questions on are you and this is to Senator Dismang are you talking about section two under. On C. four. Acting and I I mean I guess the question for attorneys because I see where it says be acting in good faith while attempting to comply with health and safety directives or guidelines issued by the governor the secretary of the department of health. So my question I think is. I mean I I hear I heard with Speaker shepherds that but. Perhaps our attorneys could. Y. N. on that language because I. I see I see that is an issue and those problems if they don't follow the guidelines or directives are they opening themselves up for liability I I hear with Speaker shepherd said however I do feel like there needs to be some discussion about this because. The way that that is drafted. It is concerning to me. And I and I know that you have lots of different opinions on this that I think it's important for us to understand exactly. How this relates to the guidelines and directives because. I mean most of the directives and guidelines we're getting are from the CDC in the federal government. Centerman and in. Mister Speaker I don't think that I'm in a position I think this is going to be a case by case basis that the courts are going to look at and to give a definitive out answer it's it's outside the scope of what I can do on this okay thank you. Point of order. I thought we moved for immediate consideration didn't mean we go civil. We're still discussing. We took immediate consideration and a vote on that motion you hollered immediate consideration should read I merely stated which meant go back to the you're recognized at the moment excuse which means go to the vote on the motion we and we are still debating the motion no that's what I'm concerned Senator and your and your you're not correct we took the vote on that motion this is a new motion a new consideration on this motion that's a proper motion all those in favor say aye. All opposed. Noes have it. Seeing no further questions on the merge the orders we have batched and we had a second. All those in favor say aye. All opposed Is have it emergency orders a pass. Members of seeing no further business we stand adjourned.