ALC-Personnel

We have a pretty lengthy agenda today so we're gonna try to stay focused on and what's at hand and and move to the agenda as quickly as possible of course we invite questions and comments and throughout the agent that I mean it makes you item B. and turn it over to you Tony to discuss the manager and I to be is a request by Black River technical college for three swat pole positions at the institution requesting to surrender three nine month faculty positions in return for three nursing and respiratory therapy instructor positions the department of higher education makes the cost of these positions be roughly twenty four thousand dollars based on the eliminations in the additional tuition and fees generated from the new nursing positions at the department of higher education is recommended the requested swap as a three for three swap there's no net increase of positions. Are there any questions. C. nine to have a motion to approve. A second. I have a motion and a second any discussion all those in favor signify by saying aye opposed no motion carries moving on to item C.. I don't see is what poor request from the department of finance administration the agency is requesting to surrender a DFA tax research analyst at a GSO eight in return for a DF a statewide program coordinator to GS eleven the new positions requested based on increased requirements involving duties to the agency the current incumbent of the surrender position we promoted into the new position and will receive a salary increase of about sixty four hundred dollars this in that would be the extent of the cost of the swap opium is recommended the requested swap and this is a one for one swap so there's no net increase. Thank you are there any questions C. nine do I have a motion to approve. As do I have a second. I have a second all right thank you any discussion saying none all those in favor say aye opposed no motion carries item D. item D. is requesting the military department to surrender five positions in return for five new positions all with new classifications request is made based upon a cooperative agreement with the National Guard that require salaries to be paid in comparison to equivalent positions listed within the federal bureau of labor statistics opium is recommended the requested swap of positions in the new titles expected cost of these changes will be about eighty eight thousand dollars it is based on the salary increases for the incumbents being moved into these new positions will be no net increase or decrease in the number of positions based on the request. There any questions. Scene and I have a motion to approve. Second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Opposed no motion carries item E. insurance I didn't E. is a surrender request from parks heritage and tourism to surrender six vacant maintenance assistance positions at just the ones return for for skilled trades men positions at GSO five the new positions will be utilized by various state parks to help develop fix and maintain mountain bike trails across Arkansas these duties require certification by the international mountain bike association to appropriately trained staff the approximate cost of the forty positions will be about two hundred thousand dollars opium is recommended the requested swap will be a net decrease of two positions based on this request. All right S. center Chesterfield you're recognized for a question yes you there will be a net decrease of two positions but the amount of money that's being spent is going to be greater or the sign it's going to be greater. Thank you yes ma'am. Are there any other questions. C. nine to have a motion to approve. That a second I see a second any discussion all those in favor please say aye opposed no. Motion carries item F.. Committee chairman item F. is a request from the department of Veterans Affairs to surrender five lower grade positions in return for three new positions and classifications of adequacy assurance administrator at a GS eleven into nursing home and assisted ministers at just twelve as well as an I. T. senior project manager and I. T. O. nine and a procurement manager at GS away the five new positions in the two new classifications or need to recruit and retain qualified employees in each of the positions OPM has recommended the five new positions as well as the two new classifications and expects the cost to fill all five positions be roughly two hundred eighty seven thousand dollars there is no net increase or decrease in the number of positions based on the request. Are there any questions. C. nine and I have a motion to approve. Second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Posebno motion carries item G. interment item G. is actually two requests and one the requested from the bank department within the department commerce and they're requesting. At eight positions seven growth pole positions and one swat pool one for one swap will this will create a net increase of seven positions at the agency request includes the creation of six new certified bank a senior examiners a GS thirteen two assistant deputy back commissioners at just fifteen and one database administrator lead it IT eleven after the surrender of one bank I. T. administrator the agency is looking to create the requested positions you're the expanded scope and complexity of banking examinations the growing amount of assets under supervision by the department and an end anticipated baking related issues like pandemic relief cybersecurity marijuana banking and cryptocurrency opium is recommended the eight new additional positions as well as the swat pole position creating an new increase of seven position excuse me eight positions I apologize for the agency the expected cost is six hundred fifty eight thousand dollars. All right thank you Senator Caldwell you are recognized for your question thank you managers the position that we or the surrendering is already occupied or is this personal take one of these jobs that are created are they getting a significant pay raise the of this transfer. Yes Sir senator Caldwell that position the bank I. T. administrator is a trade in where they're going to promote the current income and I believe to the higher level position so and the other US six seven positions are up brand new positions they're they're not nothing is being tried you know which position are going to take well I think that they're gonna take yes Sir I'm helpless. Component. They're trading in an I. T. oh A. which is their current of I tend Mr at bank farmer in the going to get an I. T. eleven okay thank you ma'am thank you senator. Thank you miss more healthcare can you say and your name and who you're with for the record please I am K. barn hill on the state personnel director and I'm with the Department of transformation shared service thank you senator Chesterfield you're recognized for your question thank you Mr thank you madam chair I'm trying to find how much the total increase in cost would be what pages it on that as well that's on page thirty. Okay and how much is that causes I think Senator fifty seven thousand dollars okay so the increased income in cost will be seven ACT six hundred fifty seven thousand thirteen dollars yes ma'am and we are gonna get in return what we're going to get six new bank examiners and one higher rated ranked I. T. administrator. The manager. I'm just trying to make sure that my nose on some of the others was recorded is that right. Madam chair. I'm sorry can you repeat that yes I'm trying to make sure I voted no on a couple of these was that recorded yes all right thank you yes I can hear you yes thank you Senator Hammer you're recognized for a question committee chair thanks measure could you tell me what it is that justifies the request as far as it increased workload or what is it that's brought this to us. Senator Hammer the increased increased workload is mainly because of the new bank coming under supervision and of the two to assistant deputy bank commissioners of because of the four large banks and that's banks of ten billion in assets that are coming under state supervision by the bank department. Okay. I'm going to ask you a question so you can be prepared for when we get to the end of. Hi what I want to want to know is for everything that we will have done how many new people have we added to the payroll and at what cost have we added them to the pay roll when we get down to I. And Senator Hammer we've called and Mr at senate here that to answer the questions a little more detail if you would please introduce yourself and stay here with for the record yes ma'am good afternoon jim Hudson chief staff Parma commerce up I think I can probably feel most of it begin deep water audit commissioner Marshall appear to flesh out the answer you the main reason is that the terms of the increasing positions for bank Department their scope of work as increase substantially the just the assets that are under supervision now our way more than what they have been historically. And while our banking industry is probably in rivals every other state that's out there consolidated district one the reasons for that is because we have a good relationship between our banks and our bank department and some of the stuff that you read about the paper what's happening in other jurisdictions is not happening in Arkansas and so we want to make sure that we're adequately staffed that were examining our banks on a regular basis and most importantly the bank's pay for in the bank's wanted it's to them it's a it's a reassurance to have an examination. So the industry's asking court as well well and that's reassuring because what you know I'm like what's happening California another state's New York center where the banks are collapsing are you making the statement then that was what we're doing on this it'll help us put a greater set of eyes on of making sure that if the banks in trouble will detect it sooner than later. Well I think we're already doing that is just staying have a game and not getting behind the power curve at all okay thank you thank manager. Thank you senator Hammer and representative very you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chairman so Mr Hudson can can you tell me how many you know up Tucker had how many new bank charters have been issued in the past twenty four months. I don't but I know someone who does and she's on her way up here. Hey FOR Kamali up you're just a demand. Sesenta Marshall Bank Commissioner for the State Bank department yes Sir so we have had several new bank charter conversion so they were national banks and they converted to state charters we had about three or four those in the last couple years but the key metric here to focus on is the growth in the assets as chief Hudson mentioned ten years ago we had about forty nine billion of assets in the state system in Arkansas under our supervision we have tripled in ten years and we've only increased our staffing by six people for the examiners so that is our our our key metrics to ensure that we're on top of it in those assets continue to grow quarter over quarter great thank you this section. Representative gene you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair of. We just a adopted did have some general revenue and all of them this is different the banking has absolutely no general revenue this all the revenues derived inside the banking industries fees that come to the state to play this is that correct yes thank you. Thank you are there any other questions. C. nine I have a motion to approve mission to have a second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye opposed no motion carries. Thank you I'd M. H.. And chairman item H. is growth for questions Arkansas Department of Emergency Management for three new positions agencies requesting to grant coordinators at a GSO seven in eighty am program coordinator to GSO six these three positions we utilized by ATM to help support disaster management and will coordinate with community organizations and FEMA to assist in mitigation efforts the positions will be one hundred percent federally funded opium is recommended that three new position and estimates the cost will be a hundred and sixty two thousand dollars. Thank you are there any questions scene nine AM motion to approve a second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye opposed no motion carries item I am chairman item eyes a second group requests from emergency management for new title of state fire marshal at a GS twelve this person will serve as the head for fire service in Arkansas in accordance with ACT eight forty one from the ninety first General Assembly opium is recommended the new classification and the additional position and estimates the cost to be about ninety two thousand dollars. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized for a question is this all federally funded or is a state funding. This position I don't know Mr Kerry's here this position is revenue margin. It will be state funded and the additional cost is ninety one thousand eight hundred twenty four forty eight is that right. That includes all benefits for this position that so that's not all costs yes okay that's all I needed to know thank you. Thank you senator Dotson you are recognized for a question thank you madam chair do we not have a state fire marshal already. A. J. Gary Director of Arkansas division of emergency management we do currently have a fire marshal it is a major over the Arkansas state police legislate which he has additional duties besides state fire marshal so through legislation there was uh there removing the fire marshal duties over to the Arkansas division of emergency management which requires creating a full time state fire marshal so this will be a full time state fire marshal position so so we didn't have a full time when under the. Under emergency management previously are we not like I guess now we didn't have any under emergency management there was a fire marshal at the state police but they had more duties than just fire marshal. So they doing away with that position or those duties I guess. No Sir I checked with them because that position is a major well maintained their general duties this is just to add on to what that person already worked at. So would duplicating effort into different agencies. No Sir the all the duties of the state fire marshal got moved from the state police over to the Arkansas division of emergency management so they will no longer be doing fire marshal duties over there. Okay thank you. Yes. Thank you ma'am jump up missed Barnhill so the the major that's the the current fire marshal for the state grand we're moving it over to Adam so do we have to adjust the books to account for another major over at State Police since that position is being moved to Adam. because essentially they're authorizations are going to go up as result because you're adding one over Adam but you're keeping the one that a B. with the state police yes Sir that position with state police is already authorized and they do not want to lose that position because the position is authorized as the state farmers or is that correct this is over at St places a major he's that that's is rank position is the State Farm Marshall along with other duties that his position is State Farm arsenal so legislatively we moved the position to emergency management so you're not moving you're moving the title there but you still got a state police position of a major over at state police headquarters that's gonna be doing state police duties were as in the past. It was State Farm are. So I guess that's where that what the confusion is so do you have to have another authorization such a move in the position to Adam authorization for that major over a state police. No it's already authorized. Of this with you have a I think we're not on the same sheet thank you. Senator Hammer you are recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair. The duties are remain at the state police will be investigative in nature of anything related to arson is that correct right. Right so that portion of the fire marshal duties regardless so however we term it is going to be left at the state police what is getting moved over to Adam will be everything else including some new duties that have been added to the legislation is that correct. Yes that's correct okay and that'll include assisting volunteer fire departments and grant assistance in there it'll also ADD going out and doing some inspection and other duties that were signed in legislation is that correct yes Sir that is correct okay so that's the main thing to stress is that the investigative portion is still going to remain with the major that's at the state police is that correct that is correct yes Sir thanks for a clarification okay thank you N. AJ can you provide me your thoughts to the BLR a copy of the position description for the state please position that will be over there as well as position at the what they're gonna be duty doing it Adam The New fire marshal yes job descriptio Sir and what the position over at DPS is going to be doing yes Sir thank you we can't. Senator Clark you're recognized for a question. Thank you I was obviously either asleep during this debate or happen on the day I was going to the funeral of so was the the far more so as it currently exists of was were we doing an inadequate job. Currently exists it's it's additional duties so in other words the major over to state police the fire marshal's additional duties all the other duties this will put a fire marshal full time dedicated to the fire services yes I heard that and go back to my question war what we were doing. Now inadequate. I can't answer that I know that that those things were moved over her legislation so somebody else could probably answer that better nineteen my second question is the under the state police the far more souls obviously a major in the State Police is of do we have the same authority of under Adam or does it change so much. I would say that of all the duties that would change because this this position will be strictly focused on fire marshal and fire services duties but my question was authority. Right now it's state police major and we move this and created it elsewhere do they have the same authority the authorities would be the same except for that law enforcement investigative piece that was mentioned earlier that investigative piece would stay with this state police investigator so law enforcement please. Okay so so now we have a State Farm Marshall who doesn't investigate. The state fire marshal would not do the law enforcement piece of which is to set the investigation right part of the right. Thank you. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized for a question thank you at the risk of beating this to death that I am still somewhat confused. We have a state fire marshal. Who is housed in the state police. You're going to move those duties. To this position. Will the salary then of the person who is currently doing this. At the state police be reduced. Because the duties have been reduced. No ma'am not to my knowledge. So. We're gonna pay somebody what we're paying now to do less. Well as you recall there was a great place for all of the troopers and majors at the major rights that established their salary and this person would still be being compensated by the president that grid requirements we didn't have somebody over their name State Farm motion. And we paid that person predicated as soon on what they're duties were is that correct. We're just on the brink we were paying them on the right as established by the special language I mean during the day so it didn't matter what they were doing if they achieve that rank. Well I'm sure matters but it didn't affect their compensation level. This is also very interesting. Because you have someone was labeled as a state fire marshal whose rank is major we'll be doing less work because we now have somebody over it Adam who is now state I'm Marshall who will be making somewhere between almost seventy and a hundred thousand dollars. But won't have to do the investigative work and that the major was doing over at the state police department. Am I missing something you. If you look at the job description that is attached for the fireworks it will still haven't Forsman and forcing the fire prevention because it isn't it's not the type of investigative work the state police officers J. you know and they're of criminal investigation no I really don't know okay and I'm I'm I'm. Thank you very much concerned because I am being inundated with with with emails and all this stuff about people one get rabies and yet we're going to create a new position. That takes the place of a position that is currently there and pay that person up to a hundred and one thousand dollars. And yet we're saying that the duties are going to be different Les Paul one more for the other and that's where my confusion lies thank you madam chair thank you thank you and Senator Chesterfield I'm I'm not to recognize Senator Hammer and I think you can provide a little more clarity to this since this was done in response to ACT eight forty one which and he was the Senate co sponsor at Senator Hammer you're recognized thank you madam chair representative Lee Johnson I ran this he carried it primary care secondary in the Senate as we evaluated the fire department business in Arkansas there was a report to give you a bit quick history in two thousand three there's a report that was initiated and we had that re done through legislative audit one of the things that it showed was that there were no advancements in the fire department world especially in the volunteer fire department part of that is because they do not have the support services as far as somebody working with them for all the areas of need including being able to get grants and so what we did was in conjunction with working with all the of fire associations there is broad support for this among all the fires associations and with the agencies was we looked at the duties of the fire marshal at the state police the the the primary duties and what was sucking up a lot of the time of the fire marshal state police was the investigative portion that's why it was being left at the state police because the major would have the ability to authorize you know to a restaurant to actual investigation arson Xcerra and so what we determined was that because lake audit showed that there were no advancements from two thousand three to this time that's why we came up with moving the fire marshal over to Adam so that they could work in conjunction with that and coordinate getting more resources into our fire department Klay going out and doing audits of fire department make sure all the equipment so. There and there are a lot of grants we lost you I if so there's a lot of grants that are available to them but they don't have the resources and that's part of the main duty of what this individual is going to do and correct me if I'm wrong in this but as far as the title that will remain at the state police it won't will be fire marshal or will be major who will be assigned the duties to investigate arson or do you know they're in the the state fire marshal will be at Adam what's left over there will be the major part of that law enforcement investigative piece of it right the actual criminal arrests if there needs to be any criminal rest would have to be done at the state police so that small portion of it of that entire state fire marshal job would be left over at the state police but although proving of plans the permitting for fireworks and all that would go with that state Marshall so be one state Marshall in the state of Arkansas and that would be the one over the Arkansas division of emergency management right and you can either way in a way not on this but yes the farmer shows duties that were over at the state police included a whole lot of things planned reviews issuing a permit all that which was creating some lag in time if you would or at least neglect of being able to pay attention to the fire departments that they need to have given to them in order to be successful and that was part of the reason behind what was created so the law enforcement side the investigative side stage of state police know probably other duties will be assigned to that major of related to the State Police but the support services will now meet under Adam under the Arkansas fire Marshall that was some of the rationale behind why the legislation was run and again I would say that that all the fire department associations and we. We work with both sides and and best a member we got pretty overwhelming support when it went through and I'll be glad to answer any questions madam chairs the chair would allow to be asked if anybody wants to ask me questions thank you senator Hammer representative merry and I'm all for tomorrow I'm all for I think it's a good place for the farmer should be over Adam the only question I have is you're gonna be paying somebody up to a hundred thousand dollars to do just a portion of the duties that this state fire marshal had over ASP saw is something just that bit. Thank you sure I am a lonely elaborate and and kind of give you my my thoughts on what this will be in the future right now we currently don't have any anybody the one stop shop for all of our fire services personnel to to to basically go to we had a board that was over the state police that did fire prevention and then we have the fire protective services over it Adam this legislation also combine that what I see this state fire marshal deleted in addition to the state fire marshal position our duties is to continue to find ways to move fire services in the state of Arkansas for this to be up full time dedicated working with with our personal Adam part of the the buyer services office office of fire services which is a one man shop that distributes out ACT eight thirty three funds all fire departments to work with them and basically what I'm looking for a fire marshal is a that Beijing there somebody you can look down the road five two years and tells word we need to go in the State of Arkansas with our fire services and and what if anything are we missing what can we add to help or volunteer fire departments especially throughout the state. Any other questions. Okay seeing none I have a motion for approval motion I have a second. Any other discussion. All those in favor please say aye. Pose no. Motion carries moving on to item J.. Madam chairman under Jay's request from the Department park church insurers and to authorize the use of certification differentials for employees working in the list of titles the agency will pay up to six percent differential based on correct us recognized me certification levels obtained by the employees to eighty Hughes wastewater operator operator's licenses these are needed to ensure environmental compliance at eighteen different wastewater treatment plants across state parks opium is recommended the use of the differentials and estimates the cost to be about a hundred thirteen thousand dollars. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized for a question thank you and your explain the differentials Jimmy yes ma'am a differential is an add on to somebody's base salary based on a specific skill certification second language hazardous duty this type of of Is this all objective or subjective. Well the certification I would guess would be. Objective you know in the sense that they have to go to eighty you and licensed by eighty Q. they have to go through class of eighty you will oversee that process and the subject of parties. I know that there is a subjective but. So in the past we've used differentials because of the location because it's harder to hire folks in certain areas of the state yes ma'am is this similar to what you're talking about here or is this differential based on professional certification perfect what what is a differential based on I'm seeing waste water level one is two percent waste water level two is four percent less water level three six percent explain to me what that means an end as we deal with this issue. I. Senator Malek K. answer you Senator Chesterfield the the job that you see listed on page forty seven none of those jobs require the waste water treatment certification this state this is additional things that employs obtained that's what we provide it with the differential as such as they have their if they're having all these jobs have to do those duties at some point on top of their normal. And then the certification is recognized what they've achieved in our through that program we using that same objective criteria for all of our state employees. Are we using that same objective criteria for all of our employees. So you know we're saying that if you do this this and this then you get the differential are we using that with other state employees as we go forward yes I. Continue that recognize these type of this is an additional one or thirteen thousand three and fifty nine dollars that's correct you saying all right thank you. There any other questions scene nine have a motion to approve. Question do I have a second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Is no. Motion carries item K.. I'm case request for on call differential for employees in maintenance specialist positions at the department of Veterans Affairs the on call differences provide up to twenty percent employees base salary paid to them while they're on call but not for more than forty eight hours these employees provide services to twenty four hour nursing care facilities opium is recommended the differential expects expects the cost of your twenty six thousand dollars. E. nine I've got a motion to have a second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Is no motion carries item L. Mitchem chairman both items L. and M. or A. R. P. A. requests and like miscellaneous federal grants they require a review of the classifications utilized by the positions that have already been approved by Pierre at least you request included division manager operations manager assistant controller and administers his manager as well as an extra help position that's an IBM for the purpose of the state's broadband projects under economic development opium is recommended the requested classifications your review review will cover both items L. and him. Representative Cavenaugh you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair this is going to be for the department if they can come up. Jim it's anti Stafford commerce. What. Thank you ma'am. My question is on both L. with them or use an arc of funds for these positions when the ark of funds are gone what happens to these positions. Represent Cavenaugh when they are funds are gone for these particular projects have been awarded for for broadband funds will be switching over to a different funding streams of the eyes of the will pick it up so we have to source for the payroll expense the underlying funding stream federal funding streams right now it is our prayer that's paying for all these broadband projects around the around the state but I she will kick in probably within the next nine months or so okay so we'll move the findings from our part to usher okay so with the infrastructure money is gone what happens to those positions there we discontinued and I understand that that's this is this is not a permanent full time position that these are. Long term temporary was best way I know to determine yes ma'am but I doubt emphasize in in this case it's a several year long term temporary position okay thank you. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized yes I just like a running count of how much we have paid for broadband and where we are in our efforts to have broadband spread across the state. Yes ma'am I can print we're gonna prepare a the joint legislative committee on the information technology that will receive a very comprehensive report end of this month and will make sure that is distributed to entire General Assembly I appreciate that very thanks is roughly Senator five hundred million dollars that we spend all over the state in the past three four years and we're already in in terms of where we were where we should be not half done yet but there's more to get done but there's more money coming for that. If the money didn't come which is a pre of the money's coming no we we there are fairly programs out there that that prevent programs that are then passed this is a question of time so I'm I'm wondering two in light of the of the actions by the Congress especially the house of representatives clawing back funds that have not been spent was Arkansas in terms of their I ask that question every time I need to know. Broadband funds are not affected by the decision okay thank you. So Mr has real quick back to representative Cavenaugh question on the indefinite temporary positions if you will do the employee side and I've dealt with this before two three years down the road employed I didn't know that they signed a statement of understanding order no that they understand that job is temporary in nature I believe they do but I would need to confirm that that it every department is supposed to notify an employee at their jobs federally funded and and left us funds run out there would be terminated but I guess my question is is I believe in god we trust everybody else bring documentation so do they have a a letter or something notifying them by the agency that I will confirm that Sir if it had been done I'll make sure is yeah I think it I think it's fair to the employee as well as the department that everybody's on the same sheet of music and then if the opposition's gonna go away they know when the funds drive up drive they're going home yes Sir thank you. Senator Hammer you're recognized thank you you may have answers aged about real quick but the amount that were projected to receive coming down it's like one point two billion or or or what should do you know the amount coming desk Senator again thank you for attending the meeting that we had a couple weeks back The current projections honestly am anywhere from about six hundred million up to about one point four billion in the November release of data the the best estimates that we had at the time were about one point four billion and there was a data released a couple weeks back from U. SEC specific to the map and we're still sort of evaluating the new numbers of as soon as we have that we can we can make that aware work we're not banking on any number until somebody sends us something from the department of commerce of federal level same Arkansas gets this specific amount of that should happen relatively sane but it's anybody's guess okay and is it part of the requirements for receiving those funds that these positions be in place or or is this driven by the fact that we're getting that much money and you you got to have somebody to manage that money make sure we stay L. ater problems. It's really this is more about being good stewards of the money that we're spending right now for our put in so making sure that we have adequate staff to track the money track the projects check receipts so it's it's really supporting existing work for grants that this body's already approved but we need to continue it when we go into the eyes of funding again in several months time right and when all that new money comes down you're not gonna be come back ask for new positions these positions should be adequate to take care of of what's what we've got and what's come is that correct. I would expect it would be you know and until the federal government gives us very clear guidance about what they're expecting from us in terms of monitoring and reporting because it seems like every tranche of money that comes in the reporting back to the federal government those obligations increase based on what we know right now they're adequate right so some of these positions could you'll find out when you get the notification could actually be required as. Being qualified to receive the money you'll know that when the letter comes to it with the best part we have to submit to the federal government at the end of the year is our plan for how we're going to spend this money and part of the plan has to document administratively are we adequately staffed nor to administer the program so would we be adequately staffed now. For the request is coming down if you did didn't have these positions based on what we know right now with the with these positions will be adequately staffed but we would not be otherwise no later I think you know what with these positions we would not be adequate staff for the existing work that we have to do right now it would be even more compounded problem with the new money coming in okay thank you the manager. Thank you are there any other questions C. nine da the motion to approve items L. and M.. The second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Opposed no motion carries thank you. Thank you I am in. I'm chairman item in is a letter from the office personnel management related to report that is required by Arkansas Code twenty one five to twenty six for Max seven ninety six of the ninety third General Assembly the code requires OPM to pull data as of June fifteenth each year and report the number of positions have been vacant for two years or more it also requires these positions be frozen and left unused unless otherwise authorized by the legislature to the date of today's meeting A. L. C. on Friday and the timing of the report and its analysis opium is requesting by letter to provide this reported are July twenty twenty three me. Motion to approve it I have a second. A second any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Is no motion carries I am so minute chairman item is a draft of the rules and procedures are ACT five sixty one of the ninety first General Assembly to be used by this committee and reported to L. C. for the payment of stipends to eligible law enforcement officers that did not receive stipends based on ACT two twenty four of the ninety third General Assembly eligibility has been defined in section two of the procedures and will establish two groups of officers to receive stipends Group One has been defined as those officers at the secretary of state game and fish department transportation parks and tourism and those officers that institutions of higher education that have not already been provided a stipend group two will be those officers eligible under the criteria in section two but will require submission of applications by the respective agencies the amount of the stipends to be paid to Group One has been established in section three of the procedures is based upon salary increases provided to officers over the last two years that did not include merit or promotion increases the amounts to be paid to group two will be determined following the payment of stipends to Group One and following review of the remaining balance of funds in the fund adoption of the procedures is required to move forward and will be used as part of the required report to ALC by September fifteenth. Representative gene you're recognized for a question and this may be to Tony or whoever else standard of just people that have come up so I know how to answer it of airport. Personnel. Who will apply for them to that or if they were of certified officers also. ABC and the tobacco control. Who who is responsible for planning for them. And I know the agency has as far as airport and representative Wardlaw may be able to speak to that. But all other departments would be. Stajan Sienna you're recognized now I'm sorry. So ABC and outside of your airport request those folks will be and have been talked to about being part of a group to of because they are certified law enforcement department of bag is also in that group that does a large group but it is a very small amount of actual officers and I think I describe that correctly madam chair can correct me she's been all meetings with me but it will be a very small group of officers but it's a large group of agencies so they may have like one guard are are a select set of officers I'm not sure about the airport I don't know if they're actual certified law enforcement but if they are they'll be able to apply group to but they have to they have to meet the requirements that Tony referred to well I you know I'm I'm Suman little rocks is under the board of the little rock airport northwest Arkansas I don't know Fort Smith or Jones per in the bigger cities having well those individual boards apply for I just wanna make sure they could but they have to meet the requirements of the law and I understand that but they got to meet a requirement of the if the if if somebody has to a platform who will apply fees airport. Good question I'm guessing the city or whoever's the only operator okay. Representative gene on section two. Number. Two eight two. It be the eligibility criteria is in employees employed by and receive seller authorized eligible state agency or public institution of higher education is a law enforcement officer on or before January thirty first so I don't believe based on this procedure and I may be stepping on toes but that somebody the airport would be eligible. Okay so we funded and I understand the counties are extension of the state but we funded city policemen which are not and we're going to exclude airport people which are also not so I'm I'm just trying to be fair and and and see if we're going to be you know if if it's a level playing field of called the city police we did those last are they are not an extension of the state and I understand these airports or not but I don't know why we would do one and not the other this that's the only question I have. All right and representative brown you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair I have similar questions with regard to the police that Arkansas State Hospital they did not receive the stop in and I have been receiving numerous questions about that. Yes they are included in group two innate they have DHS is in that group and group to and so is the health department I like I said that is a very large agency group but it doesn't include a large number of law enforcement officer the large number will be in Group One that smaller group will be incurred to in any by. My follow up that means that they definitely will get the stipend yes my flaws a qualifying or certified law enforcement yes as long as they fill out the form they apply they will get justice thank you. At based on the research we did it's about a hundred and fifty two law enforcement officers that could qualifying group to if the agency applies and like representive were lost if they meet the definition of law enforcement so that's sort of that number we know and to be the real number for groups you I think she has a follow up. At sorry what what I'm sorry we remind me the number on your microphone. Okay you're recognized I just want to say thank you. Thank you madam chair. The. Also speaking and Senator Clark you're recognized for a question can you tell me the number on your microphone. Thank you. The a and I may have missed this in the discussion of war this state park law enforcement included or not included. At state parks are included in Group One thank you. Thank you and representative more you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair and I don't know who to direct this to I was just wondering what the reasoning behind making group to have to apply to become eligible if they are certified full time law enforcement just look for clarity. Wardlaw thank you madam chair when this was set up initially two years ago it was set up only for state police there is not knowledge of so many certified law enforcement officers set up for state police county and city of there was a amount of funds left over so there is a group that came to to the house members during session and they wanted to extend that to the university please gamefish highway police another set of group of state law enforcement officers will move forward with that we realized there was a lot more so instead of an initiating that act or bill to stipulate X. agencies we left it open for personnel committee so we can absolutely catch all certified law enforcement officers and all agencies across state government so that's the reason they got separated two groups as one group was identified during session the other groups a lot harder to identify because it was a larger number of agencies so we're going to open an application period let them apply it's in the rules they get I think it's sixty days looking at staff they'll have sixty days to apply and then their of their part will go out after that. Okay any other questions C. nine dot a motion to approve. And a second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Opposed no. Motion carries. Okay we'll move on to item P.. Senate chairman a committee members of items P. through T. D. on the agenda are all requests for continuation of previously reviewed personnel related items with the chairs and committees permission I'll give a brief overview of the requests in the committee may backs them together with one vote at the end if there's any questions I'll stop and and take those if need be a item P. is central growth pole positions from higher ed that were received over the last year that were not included into their appropriation acts based on timing I thank you special language growth pole position to department of ed these positions are available to the agency based on special language an appropriation act items are through acts are all differentials which are add ons to the employees base salary for specified reason different differentials may not exceed twenty five percent of an employee's salary and removed from police transfers to a job where defect differential isn't warranted these differences are defined in Arkansas Code include hazardous duty OPM differentials on call differential certification second language geographic education just to name a few of I am why are pole positions including but the opium growth pool and surrender pole positions they're creating during the last year that were not added to the agency's appropriation bill during the session items Z. our labor market rates implemented to compensate employees due to prevailing labor market conditions item eight a our salary administration grids used to compensate and provide advancement opportunities as needed based on duties of the job and labor market conditions. Item B. B. is a continuation of classifications used on positions created under infrastructure investment and jobs act item CC's continuation of classification used on positions created under the American rescue plan act an item D. D. as a continuation of classifications used on positions created using miscellaneous federal grants that would be all the continuations madam chairman. Okay thank you M.. A representative Cavenaugh you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair this is really going to be for a guess it's going to be for the racing division the overnight. We've got someone coming. Thank you the please state your name and who you're with for the record you're recognized. I'll make right of permanent finance administration. Thank you madam chair this is really just. A simple question might not be a simple answer this simple question we don't have any dog Grayson any greyhound racing in the state of Arkansas and these are continuation but yet we're continuing the dog racing veterinarian why do we need a dog racing veterinarian if we have no dog racing in the state of Arkansas. What currently the veterinarian is is still in position there were closing out some records in compliance and reporting but also that the opportunity has been afforded for that veterinary position to join the Oaklawn grade as well moving forward. And I I don't mean to sound. Mainer condescending but there's a big difference between a dog and horse and a quiet and there's a big difference between a small animal vet and a large animal that while I agree that we need vets in the State of Arkansas and we need beds at the tracks the we do we need to make sure that the. For the horses for the will be how do we take someone who is not trained in equine medicine embracing and move them over to our racing position when they're having to evaluate. So it you know of the wellness of an incline verses a wellness of a racing greyhound. It and at amp certainly I understand your question representative Cavenaugh and I'm I'm certainly not the best person to try to answer that but I know that there are there's a number of different services and and that are provided by the veterinarians at that work at Oaklawn and we hire a number of temporary that during the racing season so I I'll be more than happy to ask questions and gather the information get it back if you don't mind I'd like to have that information before Friday because. While I agree we need but Marion's we need that qualified veterans and I'm not trying to put a disbursement or you know anything bad about this bad he's probably very good at greyhound racing but equine and the wellness of iRacing equine athlete is a completely different basis than a racing greyhound Henderson thank you. All right are there any other questions. C. nine do I have a motion to approve items P. three DD. Motion. Someone second. Any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Oppose No motion carries moving on to an item E. reports committee chairman items E. E. F. F. G. G. E. R. all reports that require no action but we'll we'll take questions if there are any by committee members. Okay seen and no questions or comments and will consider those at reviewed and we'll move on to add an H. H. other business and at this time we need to suspend the rules to adopt the supplemental agenda it's been chairman if the committee is so inclined it the only be a motion made to spend rules to take up this request for the request is to allow DF in a burst yes definition OPM to provide merit increases to fourteen hundred employees that are at the Max this increase would actually increase in as opposed to a a bonus to them in so we're going to their base salary and carried him over the great Max motion to suspend the rules to take actions. I have a motion and a second any discussion all those in favor please say aye. Opposed no motion carries at this time we will take at the supplemental agenda. I manager men the first page is the letter as to why the item is late due to when the governor decided what the merit increases would be so that's I exhibit a one and then on the second page I actually have the letter from OPM the sets out the the reasoning behind asking for these in the last legislative session the legislature in class and comp approved language that would allow OPM to pay employees that are currently at their grade Max over the Max only due to merit if the legislature approves of this isn't approval item not a review I so that's what you're looking at is fourteen hundred employees that received performance evaluations high enough to carry them over the Max. Senator Hammer you're recognized for a question our manager like to direct just K. please. Okay would you just give us the lay of the land as far as the process to determine why these fourteen hundred and one nobody else. Well this is not all they will be over five thousand six hundred merit awards these are just the ones that are over maximum are the increase will place them over the maximum they're great and I was the change in legislation that turning mentioned in the past we've order these people with a lump sum payment and now I'm not going to look closer to the Mike please thank you and now we're gonna go ahead and increase their staff salary instead of a warning a lump sum payment so this is going to go into their base and beyond going to culinary yes Sir okay. And and is this based on them achieving an it manager just for my keep my. Range straight here. These three items all pertain to all pertain to kind all pertained what we're getting all the emails but right so. Okay so can I go ahead and just have led to to ask questions that well yes I want to say yes and no to that I mean we're not getting emails specifically on on this it which is the only thing that we have a legislative authority over which is approving Hey above their grade and what we're getting emails on is something that is and strictly an executive branch decision which is merit pay in general and so it off it ties in but you you're free to ask questions because I think it's important that we get some clarity around and everything going on and we have some good information proceed all right thank you so the center the center. Going to be above what was the determination that came to the conclusion that they would be allowed to have this above where they were where they rated as fives were they what is it we got up to that level all the people on this list of fourteen hundred received a four or five on their valuation. Okay so here's my question because in conversations with some people up that I've had their situations were like somebody was a for last time around the last cycle and and if I understand right we're in the middle of a cycle right now is that correct or coming up well with the end of the cycle it with with the I say one fiscal year okay so some discussions like somebody was was out of for the previous cycle they got bumped up to a five but because the agency only had so many fours or fives give that person was dropped down tool for and and just try to rationalize we're gonna we're gonna give these but but how do you come back later if they go from a five to four either because of performance or because there are only so many fours or fives that the agency director was allotted to give no there were there were no stipulations on the fourth and five we actually sent a memo from chief of staff that notified agencies and departments that the bell curve was not in effect the bell curve have been in effect previous administrations. So if I was told by somebody that they were for but agency director only had a choice of which they could only give one five and short straw didn't get to five because the agency only had one five gives that inaccurate information record information I don't think that's totally accurate information because the agencies work by us to go ahead and evaluate employees at whatever level they wore so You know the different departments handle this different ways and some used to say we can only do this this and that's what we train them on the cell system for but however that would change that and now they can do evaluate somebody regardless of the category. The person that was a three that really deserve to be a four be prohibited from being moved up to for because there's not room within the allowances that were given to the agency. It should not occur that should not have occurred. I'm not your man because I see some green light to make come back into the. Thank you senator Chesterfield you're recognized. Thank you madam chair I'm saying. Some of these individuals making as much as three hundred forty nine thousand three and fifty thousand dollars. And the lowest amount I see is like thirty one thousand. The majority of your support staff. Well let me just put it this way your janitors your we are custodial staff. How are they going to get meritorious raises. Because I'd like what I would like to see most about is an example of what criteria you use are you department used to determine was meritorious and who is not is there an objective criteria that goes across Agencies. Okay there are there's forms of regulation farms their standards that have been established each department conflict what standards they want to evaluate their employees on and those standards they they actually write them playing are not particularly have a copy of those standards yes thank I'd like to see a copy because it one agency has all of them have the same standards and some decide they're going to they're going to base it on this part of the standard and not the other part of the standard. I think that to me is unfortunate if you are state employee because it should be that no matter where you work. You know that you're going to be judged based on this. And this alone not how somebody feels or anything else so I think we need to take a look. At what that standard is and make sure that across the board. Everybody is based on the same standard so may we have a copy of that and then secondly. How does someone who is cleaning a building get to be rated meritorious. I mean if the supervisor would have to determine what is meritorious in that case I think it's generally would be keeping the offices sex for clean having everything prepared for special events and a lot of reasons somebody could be considered meritorious well I'd like to see that as well because on this list the little guys missing. We're having people making over thirty one that over thirty thousand dollars is not a lot of money I grant you that. But I'm not seeing people who are making twenty two thousand dollars Francis on you somewhere and I just overlooked it because we do have folks were making twenty some thousand dollars a year. And yet they are not on this list at all did I miss that somewhere in my perusing well I will say on this list there are some great ones and other greats that we see that X. meritorious right the one point out that. There were three thousand nine hundred seventy four employees under grade nine received a meritorious rice there are At a fifty five thousand six hundred seventeen total employed. I'm not questioning that I'm just trying to find out where on this and this is the person who is making twenty some thousand dollars or entry level salary on this list of entities that we're giving salary increases to that's what I'm trying to find out I have not found it in in in perusing this perhaps I'm incorrect or my site is more. Let me ask you use debate I don't like Senator Chesterfield that list is not comprehensive that everyone who was awarded merit pay it's simply that is for act that were at the Max of their grade in over so there's thousand employees missing what makes it great for a person who was a custodian. Sorry this is a great team and I think the maximum salary is thirty three three eighty six okay so that will be helpful as well so I'm not in the move arguing I just need to know what we're doing because I've never gotten this many emails in my life. I have no control over it they don't understand that this is an executive decision but they're looking to the people that they may elect to give them some relief. And I know in this economy people are hurting. I know they're hurting and as I look through this list of people who are already making over a hundred thousand dollars it gives me great angst. When people I know who can't meet the bill sometimes I'm not getting anything. I appreciate you thank you so much. Thank you an representative very you're recognized thank you madam chair so if I could add just a little bit of clarity to this so I guarantee that the governors of the governor once this process picks up she inherited the performs or evaluation system from the previous administration as a cabinet secretary the time myself I hated it it is the worst of evaluation system that I've ever seen consent when I was cabinet secretary by considers legislator now. but I will tell you that. there's other ways that we can find efficiencies or the ability to recognize outstanding performers state employees and we've already in discussions on a guarantee of that that's going to get fixed but I am aware of a an individual I won't say where but at the state park that was made aware of that is a dishwasher the lowest grade that you can get any gotta a merit increase of wine because he did exceptional work there may been a couple of the dishwashers out but he still washed all the dishes so that's the type of service can you depend on supervisors to make that determination about who is adding to the mission who's contributing and who needs to be recognized we do not do enough to recognize outstanding employees so I think that's something that that we're going to address in the future but again governor Sanders inherited a flawed evaluation system from the previous administration and she has a lot of concerns about it she was recognized employees are going above and beyond and I think you're gonna see a performance evaluation system in a merit of incentive program that's going to change it's a paradigm shift in the way that we've always done business so we will delta had a hand of cards in we've we've got to work through it but Rome wasn't built in a day I think we can get it fixed and not with the work and Senator Davis and I have discussed this as well as some folks up missed represent Wardlaw and others have discussed possibilities of how to fix it in the future so I hate it. But the appraisal process of the performance evaluation process has already started that cycle was already in motion people already being about a way to and what is a hate it but we'll we'll get it fixed thank you thank you ma'am shall. Thank you representative Wardlaw you're recognized. Thank you I I didn't know I was gonna get thrown into the restatement Mr Couple questions are just for clarification and I and I agree with most everything represented by agents said. We sent you a list of questions over Mr Barnhill earlier in the week I think the bureau Senate over a half yes Sir I've got a number seven I want to add I'd like for you to define a solid performer for us today for the committee. A solid performer is an employee reports to work does their job every day meets their expectations for their job and they performing and that of. As factory. Way. It in to represent berries point in the past we've been told that folks that we would push to for probably need to be moved back to that solid performer correct Kerr up areas that not correct now I'm sorry did you said employees that are for should be made back to thirty six in in the previous administration we were told okay and approved yes in the previous administration it worked under bell curve concept was so so when we went into January and and I'm not exactly clear when this memo that I've been brought to attention of today when that went out but that was the direction most of these manage or positions were under that we needed to have I guess we've been called it a bill currently is that correct yes that so winded that memo go out to these folks and state government to let him know to evaluate him correctly offer their performance actually that one out in may of this year so just about a month ago is that enough time for them to re evaluate these folks to get him into the correct positions based on their performance in your opinion. You've been doing this a long time I have been so we value your opinion a lot I have a I would say it would have been nicer if we were to that that sooner but a lot of people make changes in that time period to change that so there there were changes that you can see in the system. Okay. Looking at this list you gave us the phone over to Parks and tourism parks heritage and tourism to be to be Frank the date not just appoint a new director or is that incorrect and the secretary at parks the undersecretary for this this position is called heritage division director and if my understanding is right we just got a new one is that correct yes Sir that happened yeah so why would we be given disposition this raise because my understanding you have to be there one year to qualify for this that is definitely one of the requirements That person we gave you the list of all the people that scored in this absolutely I'm looking at there were a hundred forty three exclusions because they did not make the one year requirements on the job is this one of them I would if they're not on the payroll. As of when these are ward I'm trying to find the exact lessee looking but if they're not on the payroll they will not receive Americans. Okay we'll will not reason for asking a question is this is accurate. They shouldn't be in this list that we're approving to go over to Max if they had but if they're no longer in this position because this person has been replaced in the last week of my understand is correct right. So there's a lot received where is the correct list that shows the reflection of the people were proven for over the Max okay that was on the fourteenth that's when list in front of the skis me represent Wardlaw the list of the fourteen hundred into was around it was our and earlier this week are almost last week we actually created the list of any actions that have happened by there are not reflected on this list okay so by Friday full council to get a list it's updated Sir okay but be that be awesome thank you if you could get it to staff personnel they'll get it distributed to the committee. Senator Gilmore you're recognized. Thank you manager is actually kind of caught up in the last line of question forgot that I had my but not because I was gonna go down the same line of questioning that by two colleagues prior had had had asked so I'll just go ahead and state it again and **** questions because I think it's important to be clear on this the previous administration even though and during the time I was elected then serve some of the time while being elected I was well aware that there were there was a bell curve in place had heard that the room had not seen as members specifically asked the governor's office this week if that was still in place and it's per your testimony today is not right that is no longer the case that I wonder how we're treating this I think it's really important to all of this discussion would you agree that were no longer. Sort of grading if you will on a bell curve yes okay and this administration has ended that. Right okay I think it's important to me to state that again probably several times to make sure it's really clear during this whole discussion so thank you I think everyone else ask those questions better but I think it's again to good to read or write thank you. Thank you representative very and I will be back on Senator Gilmore star comment but however because when the evaluation cycle started. The old guidelines were still out there yes Sir so there are a lot of people evaluated under the old administrations are planned so there are a lot of supervisors in first line supervisors out there that did not get the message that you could submit for survives it didn't make any matter just submitted is that is that a correct statement. Yes because it was up to the department to distribute that information to all their ratings. Okay and so did anybody from your office a call any of the directors and say you've submitted to committee for first provides or were they just arbitrarily doing that themselves we did not contact anybody was saying they had too many fourth five okay thank you. Thank you Senator Teague you're recognized. Yes Sir. Okay thank you madam chair so back when I came in a long time ago Kate Wilson as personnel chairman of you know we had a system of what of Kohli's. And then you had the bump up so they can get a code of one two percent whatever it was going to be and then you had a you know people can get pay grade increases or they could be bumped up to the line item maximum that was the systems right now for years and then somehow it's transitioned into of I mean how many state employees are now twenty plus thousand two seven and so there's five thousand that's getting some top race and then the fourteen hundred that we approve in this whatever this is is on top of that are included in the file that's included in the that's losing five thousand so we a coalition and you had that in in some outs transition into this rating system everything like that of so I mean. Which is a better system I mean well I know you work for who you work for but you have a lot experience well I will tell you that we are looking at a new performance evaluation system as well as the new pay plan which will call for a lot of changes over the next couple of years and that and we're trying to incorporate the best practices of both performance evaluation and a pay structures so the old system worked well at the one you're describing when people got the sponsor the bill lacks some flexibility currently opium or the executive branch does not have the ability to authorize the colon so that's why code cannot be authorized at this particular point in time sign the class and compact and I remember when we had the economic times we didn't give a call is there for your two that's right any but you know it's all seem like under the old system you still had a merit system I mean if you had a massive situation they went from this pay grade to this pay grade or they got bumped up maybe fourteen or four thousand to the line on Maximo see basically a merit system into a merit system with a color. Okay up so these ones that we are approving today. this committees approve in a I guess it goes the council of. If that doesn't happen then what is going to happen with that money that was allocated to them. Well it doesn't happen that would be detrimental to the employees on this list well certainly yeah and it's basically that money would not be spent to we can get this list approved okay do you know the figure amount that it is with these of the. The ones that are in this approval process and the total amount that is in the total five thousand I guess it's two different questions yes Sir okay. There are The total amount of looking for my notes because I did have that written before okay the total of the total amount is around sixteen million dollars for all employees all five fifty seven hundred employees sixteen million for the five thousand something that's all for all sources the general revenue cost of that is around six million dollars okay because it's federal funds in the rest of it correct. One of four point eight is for over Max right now that's how much four point eight is four over Max it is in this approval process of that four point eight how much is better how much as general revenues Well according to of our plan if you looked at it was about one point four seven percent that of people that are employing and getting RES and generally like I said that was one right six million dollars and we usually use that was the general revenue cost side for this group four percent of that would be like one point forty percent be about one point two one point three general revenue dollars of this approval process and this is yes general revenue so if I remember correctly back years ago and it's been a few years and what's happened since then but so to give a one percent Colo was seem like five million it was four million but anyone over five I remember in of that may be two point five maybe roughly half maybe over a little bit half was general revenue is about forty percent general revenue forty percent general revenue so the total overall one percent Cola back in those days was five million so but if he says million today I don't know it's still running about five million dollars right now for the if we gave a one percent coal to enroll in across the board would be around five million dollars so looking at this approval process for this amount employees is sixteen million. If we gave a one percent Cola that would be around five or six million yes Sir if you gave a two percent Colette mmhm you know be eleven million and then you could do the bonuses on top of that whatever you want to do would be the same amount of money and yet it would be the janitor versus everybody and you could still have a mix of both systems but you could also just two one percent goal everybody in and actually spend less state money you can be under nine or ten million and have five million extra to do whatever you want to yes so you're correct if we had the ability to for award to call up we don't have that out there I understand that so you but you're absolutely right on okay so I'm yeah I and that's just to be clear about like we're trying to figure this whole thing out is for spending which nobody worries about spending anymore but I mean just look at the whole picture of like what we can do as far as the state and then you know Mr Roberson used to be a tell me so it in maybe you can't if you look at a hundred thousand dollar your job it used to be that twenty eight percent was was kind of the general figure for salaries and benefits you get is that still correct I mean is it more or less than that or is it about the steel ball park the way we calculated it's around twenty four percent plus six thousand for the insurance that that the employees are we will help twenty eight would be exhilarated figure two years okay all right well I was just trying to look it like this so system about how it used to be and so and then of its force open positions the field authorized field positions or not authorized feel position positions that are not feel that we're paying benefits on what's roughly the figure back on those again. I know that's a separate question I'm just looking I would have to check on that okay and I can I can check on that I just don't know the number off the top of my head okay but just to be clear sixteen million for the total amount of the names five thousand something names. It is seven hundred nine sixteen million all source and in I forgot to figure what you say six million or something like that again were general revenue for general revenues and sixty percent roughly of that is federal versus general revenues are fees federal other sources just any other source I bank departments cash fees and that type of okay thank you as always for being. Accurate in good answer questions thank you thank you Senator Hammer you're recognized thank you madam chair the first first question is when. When were when were the instructions sent out not to use the bill curve. A senator Hammer they were sent and like may. Chosen late may that they were told not to use the bill curve okay and then on the fourteen hundred that are going to receive Raises are increases merit increases how many of those were already at five. I can't I don't have that information but we can get that information okay I'm I'm asking I'm not sure I can provide that to you because what's in the system now is their current rating so that there were changes to those categories. I can't track it okay and then the. So what we've got is we've got an old system that we're going to get away from based on everybody working together governor doesn't like it we're going to in the hopefully before next year's evaluations come out you think that's an achievable goal that we would have a fair system yes. Okay then then what I wanna know is was there ever a conversation. Where and I know those questions asked twice but I'm asking is because I want to hear was was there ever a conversation that took place with those that were in the position to determine. Moving anyone from a three up to four or that was at a four or five and had to be moved down was that conversation or was that directive ever given to anybody that was not given by a PM this year at all that was made happened at the departmental level or the agency level but We did not get that direction this year OPM did not give that direction why why would that direction be given at all then why would we not if somebody deserves a three. Moving up to four. And we're not to use the bell curve anymore why would why would those threes not have been moved up and I'm just trying to get a. Probably because people didn't know they can make the changes we tried to alert people but how that trickles down as a whole nother issue a reading here I'm sorry I said we we sent the memo to the chief of staff's I believe of every department and if that went to every supervisor I can guarantee that T. the springtime. And senator Hammer the reason that that has been done is because that was the instruction previously before this administration which was only a certain number of people could have force or fives so they had a Peck and so that has been the practice in the past but a memo was sent out as and this formula said that to no longer great do a bell curve and that anyone who is a four five truly should get that rating okay but my question is what if you're three and you truly should have been a for that's that's what I try to give my mom an appeal process at the departmental level I'm sure we're age at the employee can disagree with their valuation and that would generally go up the ladder. Within the department so should we tell these threes. You need to appeal. Well the decision was made based on the current number thirty threes fours and fives I mean the decision was made on that of you know we would have to talk if we've got a considerable number of appeals I don't think that would it's being done because of the way that a paid strategy was established and I think that would work Senate. Okay thank you and center hamper up part of the problem was the forms of valuation process was just about finished by the time that letter went out. So all these directors that have been making decisions in the performance evaluations were basing those decisions on past practice and those appraisal evaluations had been submitted. to that letter coming out. So they were still working under the old guidelines and I guess we just dance because if under the old system somebody missiles before but they got moved back to three because there were no force I'm trying to understand the fairness in it maybe maybe that's the whole discussion is you gotta unfair system but we are where we are we're stuck with what we got to we get change but in meantime you got a block of threes that. Probably a maybe some maybe not all of them you know deserted before but they're being blocked out from it absolutely and from experience a state employee is probably not going to appeal and evaluation is that correct Mr Barnhill Department sexually a process to set up the most employees do not appeal thank you and they don't because what. I mean. Because I can't really answer that except they don't feel comfortable possibly make an appeal I mean I don't know why you wouldn't if you truly believe Drayton was another level okay all right thank you. Thank you and Senator hammer out I also want to send to the governor and herself and her staff of and not minced words about how flawed that this current system is and so I know they're working aggressively to have a new and simply play put pay plan I know that takes time and so and it's clear that it it is clear that it's at that it's flawed and they're working pretty aggressively to get it corrected and I will let you follow up yes and I wanna make sure the governor's been handed a bad deal and the state employees are the recipients of that and I wouldn't when laid off on the governor at all but do can we and this is a question of a process if you get the new plan if we get a new proposed plan governor work legislation to come back and say gets done in a couple months what prohibits us from coming back other than the time it takes to evaluate somebody and maybe that would just be limited to the threes can you can Tony or maybe cages talk about process or do we have to wait to the end of next year because it would have a negative impact on the budget. Okay the way the current administration I mean the way the current class and compact works evaluations are always conducted at the end of the fiscal year so there would be that's I think that ten percent remained code I think that is. That was a process that was established and improved by personal committee previously by rule by code. Well Bob. Policies and procedures so what would okay go ahead I'm sorry okay no we presented the original plan original system personnel committee several years ago and two thousand eighteen actually this one that that program was up presented and it had to be approved at that time now. Making changes to that without making changes to the class and compact I'm not sure how that would impact what you're looking for. Who may that come up in discussion as we work toward a solution thank you. Thank you senator Chesterfield you're recognized for it. Thank you I thank you madam chair we have we are at the end of the fiscal year now. And. My greatest fear is. The camaraderie. The department's. And I think it's something that we're going to have to dress addressed sooner rather than later. Because you have individuals who are not going to get this raise I don't know anything about a bill or accepting colleagues when we were graded on the current. And I assume then that everybody knew but me and that's my fault if I did not know. But we are in a time when employees. Have the liberty of moving right. Much more than they had in the past. This state can ill afford to lose large numbers of its employees. Because they are understaffed agencies right now. And what I would like to know because I know we had a J. normais turnover in DHS. How. Can you give me then the next time we meet. How many vacancies we have in these agencies. Because I think it's going to be critical to us to address this so that we are able to maintain those employees that we currently have. A that's a statement my question is. Are they getting any kind of race predicated on experience or increased education are there other ways for them to get increases and sour. There. Well grins example or another way people have gotten raises and what is now a grant us our Greg which is if you have the market value and per trade at a certain level we do surveys all the time to keep up with Dennis lot of surveying right now based on the new pay plan proposal we're trying to get so if you live in a particular area you can get a raise well that's the geographic different as the geographic apart explain the rest of the greed and I'll be done with this okay if you recall a couple years ago we established a grant for all our one through five this is because we weren't able to compete with even Burger King or McDonalds as some of those like that time so now on the pay scale you're one through five don't start at minimum all of them eligible to start at mid point is one way we did add that addresses on responding to some pay issues. I said. In just to clarify people can follow can file grievances but they seldom do is that right. I think now grievances can only be from gtech timer nation are suspension that's it they cannot grieve the fact that they did not receive a three or four so what recourse do they have to say that I did everything you asked me to do. And yet you didn't didn't think any meritorious enough well how does one appeal that. I think that discussion must go along with their supervisor who rate them and they have to be able to respond to the employee and that's where it ends with the supervisor. Yes I can go up further and some departments they have formal procedures and others they do not all right thank you. Thank you representative Cavenaugh you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair I just wanna make sure I understand this list only covers those that are going to bump up against the Max correct and if we don't approve this list. They don't get the raise act but the people that did not made up to their Max will automatically get their merit raise come July. If this list is not approved we will have to look at how we implement a system wide that becomes a problem if we don't do a if we exclude this group that takes a lot of work at this point in time not say can't be done but Employees that don't are not the mac should be able to see their rates were not allowed to automatically get their rights because they're not on the Max that if we don't approve this the only people that it's getting harder those that are already at their Max and they can't get this mare raise is that correct right okay thank you. Thank you Spieker shepherd you're recognized. Thank you five just a couple questions this list and the increases associated with that are personal to that specific employee in that position yes Sir and so I think you responded to represent Wardlaw questions that at the point in time if we were to approve this and as you implement these races if that employee is no longer on pay roll or is no longer in that position then that raise will not actually take effect if they've not been in the position for year as one of the first graduate hi Terry that we look at them will take them you know they will not receive the race if they've terminated or not on the payroll of the time a term that at the time of the warding and increases they do not receive the right what about if they move if they move position within state government and it depends how you define state government if they have moved from executive department another executive department they would be eligible to receive the race but if they move out from a constitutional judicial position they would probably not be able to receive okay but ultimately with regard to this list which that list in eligibility could change day to day because right this turnover turnover every single day but if we approve this at the point that you implement it the the you will verify that each person receiving it is is actually entitled to okay yes I have a motion at the proper time. Thank you a representative Eads you're recognized. The manager just a quick question you may have answered this I apologize if you did but when is the last time the state employees received a cost of living allowance. That was last February one governor Hutchinson award is two percent hello. So twenty twenty to twenty twenty two was the last okay yes. Thank you senator king you're recognized. Thank you madam chair just to two questions of. One is like when you gave races like on the federal employees that they're getting a program a grant or something like that so many give a raise you're actually it comes out of that so you can actually at least say something maybe you're getting less services I mean out of that because there's always limited amounts of you raising the salary then there may be at least incrementally a little less money going towards those programs were something else right. I have to think about that for a little while for making I see the question mark a long time ago but anyway but so anyway I think I know the answer to that still the other question is since I've been out you know hearing the stories and it's like it's crazy to even hear it but and I I wanna construed so there's supervisor positions out there were people working under them are making more money than supervise positions is that correct yes Sir but that has always been as long as I've been in state government that possibility exists has existed. But because you're. You have a wide range within so somebody who may have been here twenty five years they have gone progress along their range in the lower position while the supervisor may have only been here two years. If that makes sense to the Max. All right thank you I see no more questions oh I'm sorry representative very has a comment on the make a comment I think everybody's in agreement that the the process needs to be changed not only are performance evaluations but the way that we incentivize our employees there's other ways than just a merit raise that that will be discussing but it's important that those individuals one of the primary Jobs of management is to make sure that we take care of our most valuable asset and that's our employees we can't do without those G. ones two threes or fours but we we need to make sure whatever we do that we come up with the process to be able to reward those individuals at the lower level because if you think about it you want to water the flowers that you want to grow we cannot. Disregard them we have to make sure that those lower levels are rewarded for outstanding accomplishments in contributing to the team so going into all this we're starts having conversations about changes we need to keep that in mind that we have supervisors have tools in our tool box that they can pull out in reward these these lower graded positions for their contributions that's all I have thank you. Thank you representative berry and I think this is hopefully been good for a lot of us who have been getting hundreds of emails and an understanding that what we're dealing with today is specific to overages and on Max outs for employee pay that receive merit pay so and an understanding that this is an executive branch decision and the governor was doing what she could with what she has said is a flawed system and working to correct it working very aggressively to correct it but still rewarding employees who did get a four or five and who are outstanding employees and role models within their districts and divisions and so I appreciate her effort on that to reward those employees and and I know that we've got a ways to get it to work on and revamping the system and I know that heard and her team are are working hard on that so I appreciate that effort and and at this time we have a proper motion from Speaker Shepherd and to approve I've got a second is there any discussion. Seeing none all those in favor please say aye. Opposed no. Motion carries thank you all that is all the business we have the date meeting is adjourned.