Education Committee- House

in that help us to have the attitude of Christ and all. So members just to give a quick little rundown of You wanna introduce somebody, you can, you can just, yeah, OK, so let me, uh, let me go ahead and give a quick little rundown of our agenda today, and I'll recognize your representative. Uh, so we have um several bills that we will be skipping over, uh, we're gonna be hearing HB 1189, 1060 1117 and 1027 this morning, uh, a few that were on the agenda, we're gonna be skipping over until next week. Uh, so if, um, if you would, uh, just make a note of that and then Representative McGruder, you are recognized, I assume for a point of personal privilege. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to acknowledge my sister, bring your family to work today. Adriel Wilson, she's here. Can you stand for me? And she had some colleagues. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Ms. Wilson, welcome to the committee. We appreciate you, uh, coming all this way. So we're gonna begin with uh HB 1189 representative Vault, if you would please identify yourself for the record and you're recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair, uh, DMA District 87, could I please ask the secretary of Education to come up with me if he's, I say back there. Secretary Oliva. You know, the song and dance, please recognize yourself or introduce yourself for the record and You're recognized as well. Yeah. Good morning, Jacob Oliva, Department of Education. So, um, the novice program, um. Really needed some tweaks. I think it was intended to really be a good mentoring tool for our teachers, um, but what had happened was teachers that were going through 4 year programs with a year of mentorship we're still having to do a 3-year mentorship at the co op, which is a lot and my daughter was one of the ones that come to me and I was like, Mom, this has got to be fixed. Like I learned everything they're trying to teach me now in the novice program at co ops and I wanna be in my classroom teaching, if there's something that I'm doing wrong, I want them to come teach me in my classroom and it be a true mentorship. Well, Miss Carly Saracini was so uh helpful and helped me get this drafted, um, once she figured out what I was trying to do. She loved my idea and uh I'm very grateful for that. With that, I'll let the secretary speak to it. So, um, thank you, Representative Vo for bringing what I would call common sense to the table. And um if, if you think about traditional teacher preparation programs with, with this program kind of really outlines is this model that we've been moving forward to, especially for a candidate and their senior year to do a year-long residency in a school under the guise of a certified, highly qualified mentor teacher in a classroom getting real world experience. I think everybody here would agree in the research supports learning best happens in the classroom for. Additionally, learning best happens in the classroom with adults. So to be a candidate in a year-long residency program. One, it's got to be approved through the department and it's a partnership with the university where the university makes a commitment to provide on on site coaching and support for that candidate, as well as uh that that candidate being a side, assigned a highly qualified mentor that's gonna work with them side by side to make sure they're doing um the appropriate strategies and working with the students. And in the outcome. That's really flipped the narrative on teacher prep that we may have known from years past. I can tell you I remember when I went through a traditional teacher prep program, my senior year of college, I had to spend the last semester doing an internship in a school and I used to even say, I literally had to pay a full semester of tuition to go to work for free each and every single day. That doesn't make sense. It's an antiquated model. We're moving more to year-long residencies where these candidates can be supported by a master teacher and start. earning a wage their senior year, but it's not something that everybody just automatically qualifies for like you, you have to be an exceptional candidate, meet the university requirements, meet the school district requirements, meet the state requirements. What Representative O is saying. A teacher candidate that did that shouldn't be forced to continue doing more metering. Now there would be nothing to preclude the candidate for saying, I want to do still, even though I'm a, you know, a first-year teacher on my own if I wanna do a mentorship program, that's great. They've done way more in a year than you would get in multiple years of mentoring, and I'm not trying to diminish mentoring because we know that a lot of times teachers may lose the profession within the 1st 3 to 5 years of becoming a teacher. Having access to a strong mentoring program keeps more candidates in the classroom because they're gonna be successful, but to take a common sense approach by saying you've already done a year-long residency, we're gonna require you to do more residency doesn't make sense. Other questions by the committee? Representative Brown, you recognize. I'm just curious, um. So ordinarily when a teacher goes to the 3-year mentoring program. They are teaching and they have a highly qualified teacher that's mentoring them at that time is, is that what the regular pro the the 3 year program is? No, the 3 year they do have teachers that come, but the majority of that 3 years is spent at the co op setting listening to instead of the co op coming to them and mentoring, doing the mentoring in the classroom. And we're not trying to take that away. We know that there's teachers that will not go through a year-long residency because they're gonna do it in alternative route versus a traditional route, those teachers would definitely probably need that 3 year mentorship that took place at the co op in the classroom and a mixture of both in the last of those, uh, that last year, so we're not trying to take that part away. We're just saying if you've done that year long residency. And you don't need mentoring, then we're not gonna make you go through mentoring, but we did leave it up to, I mean, if the principal, um, sees that the teacher needs some mentoring he could suggest, hey, there is this mentoring program out here at the co op. I think it would do you a lot of good. Let's look into getting you a year of that mentorship or 2 years of that mentorship, but it wouldn't be like forced upon every single teacher that's gone through a year-long uh residency so uh. are all, um, When they're going through 3 years of mentoring, they're being paid, are they not? I'm just curious. I don't know they are yeah they are, they're teachers so, but this alternative program that you're talking about, they are not being paid and, and you wanna correct that if they go through the 3 years of college and they're doing the year mentorship. Am I saying that right? The year of residency, they will now get paid for that your residency instead of not getting paid for it. Thank you. Gonzalez worth and you recognized. Um, just looking at currently, um. With The Arkansas code 617 2806. It requires novice teacher mentoring for 3 years. Uh, but the teachers are on campus and they're receiving job embedded instruction. I'm, I'm sorry, I'm just, OK, so here's my question, OK, novice teachers traditionally. It's 3 years. Those 3 years are the most vulnerable, that's the most vulnerable time for a brand new teacher, the 1st 3 years, and those 3 years of mentoring. The reason they're there is to increase teacher retention, establishing norms of the profession and for those 1st 3 years, they're um they're still getting paid as teachers, but this mentoring for novice teachers um is to help support them so that we they do remain in the classroom. They do receive the mentoring. I'm just wondering if, if, um. The definition, you know, is it the definition, because here's the concern for some of the co-ops and we're that we're receiving so if they have 1000 novice teachers that are going through mentoring right now with this change in definition, 700 of them would be eliminated from their mentoring you want to. So let, let me make sure that we're talking about the same candidates, right? so year-long residency. Teacher preparation programs or alternative pathways. A typical candidate that might graduate from college, be an alternative pathway is first time coming to a classroom, they would still be required to have a manner and go through the mentoring program. If you're a candidate that did the year-long residency, that means your senior year in college, you were assigned to be a classroom teacher, you had a roster of students, you did parent-teacher conferences, you issued grades, you served under a qualified mentor teacher, you're basically senior year of college, you are hired to be a teacher in a school. It's very rigorous, it's almost like an apprenticeship. It's a different candidate. That experience far exceeds what you. Get in a 3-year typical mentoring program. I think we had like 5 last year. There's not a lot of people that are doing this pathway because it's very competitive. You have to meet the university standards, you have to meet the school district standards and the state standards. It's a very rigorous, robust pathway for that candidate, which is why we're saying common sense wise, if somebody was able to complete a year-long residency with success, they are more than day one ready. Now they still may say, no, I'd like to do the mentoring program. That's great. We shouldn't force them to do something if it's redundant. Correct. Good. You recognize you don't have to ask for a fault, just so, How Based on the research, those 1st 3 years are very critical and the teachers uh when they're starting to teach. I remember going through those 1st 3 years and, and I was assigned a teacher who was my mentor, um, because there's a lot that goes on even though I felt my preparation was really great and I'm not um discounting the one year traditional residency, not at all, um, however, those years 2 and 3 are also, they're very critical. for when a teacher remains. As a teacher or they decide, you know what, I'm, this is not for me anyway, I guess that's what I'm, I'm concerned about, I'm, I'm just wondering if it's a definition that we're talking about and that's why I wanna make sure we're clear on the candidates because even though you may still be, you've graduated the year-long residency, you're considered a novice teacher. You're in your 1st 3 to 5 years, you should, you can still be assigned a mentor. I agree. We need high quality managers. That's why um We recognize in teacher Meripey, mentor teachers, resident advisors, apprenticeship advisors, people that are going above and beyond the the set up the next generation of teachers for support, but to require you to go through a formal training is redundant. They're not going to get any different experience in the formal training through the mentoring program that they would not have gotten through teacher residency. That school's probably gonna assign somebody a mentor teacher because they need to know how that school works. And if a teacher wants to do. the, the mentoring ship, they can, but to require them to leave their classroom to go to training that they've already experienced. A is less time in front of students, which I think is detrimental. I'm gonna sit here every single day and talk about time on task matters and we got to stop pulling teachers out of classrooms and pushing supports in the classrooms, which is why I like the residency program, and B, it's redundant. that that experience that they're gonna get in their formal training, they've already lived. And they can still say that they want to have a mentor and all of my schools have supporting teachers in their buildings. So if, if that teacher's having trouble with, with a certain subject, they can go to that supporting teacher and get them to help them with whatever issue they have going on. So OK, so the 700 representative, let me, uh, move on if you would please. Let me, there's several people in the queue and so let's move on and if you would please get back in the queue and we'll uh we'll circle back around to that, please, uh, Representative Duke you recognize? Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. um, just a quick question. I think I've kind of answered it as myself listening to you guys, the resonates program is separate from this. I mean, this is going to find novice, but you already have, that's already in place, um, and the funding. If you could just clarify where the funding just because I would like to know that since you've mentioned it, even though it's not part of this bill. I do want to commend you on bringing this bill. I think this is a great bill. Um, and I hope to see that that residency opportunities expand and, um, I will say that some of that for the comments but if you could just at least clarify for me on where the money for the residency, which again I know is not a part of this bill if you know, if you don't know, just get with me offline, that's fine. I'm pretty sure it would be their tuition. Um, OK, they're getting paid? Yes ma'am, from the, so they're just, I did say that wrong. The district would hire them. OK, OK, and their tuition is what paid for their school. Does that make sense for that? For the residency. The residency is paid for by scholars, by their school, by them, and then the school hires them. And that's how they get paid. Does that make sense? I, I got in the queue and then realized that I think this is a different, not on this topic, but thank you for clarification we'll talk more later. Represented Beck, you recognize. Thank you, Mr. Chair. um, I, I like the bill, uh, the only concern I would have, and I might have missed this because I got here a little late and I I apologize if that's the case. Is there any data out there that shows that, you know, uh, That we could be putting a teacher in a situation where they might. Abandoned teaching, you know, uh, you see what I'm saying, you know, I might, it kind of, I, I get it, they're, they're gonna learn faster and that, that's great, but I just wanna make sure that we're not gonna run that they can't still go through the 3 years. Nothing says that a principal can't say, I need you to go in at year 2 and do 2 years, or maybe you're one or them even go to the principal and say, I think I need this mentorship. Can, how do I get, how do I get into this mentorship? And then help them get into it even. Well, and So I think the short answer to your question is that those 1st 3 to 5 years are very pivotal for new teachers, and that's typically when we see if people are going to stay into the profession or say this may or may not be for me, so the amount of support that we give teacher candidates is. Very important We're frustrates new teachers when we're over bureaucratic and force them to do stuff they don't need, which is what Representative is trying to do to say, um, we're not gonna burden you with jumping through hoops even though you've already shown mastery, giving teacher autonomy, especially if they're a master teachers, what keeps them in the profession? Micromanaging their day to day operations and what happens in the classroom burns them out. Alright, thank you. Representative MacGruder, he recognized. First I want to say thank you. I, I do like to be, uh. Compliment Secretary Leon is uh shirt and tie combination. I've been working with him on his attire, uh. 178 days of instruction is what we have in front of students in these programs, how many days are they actually at the co op. I don't have that information with me and I can't remember. I wanna say she would have to go every couple of months though to the co op to do some kind of training instead of them coming to her. Now I wanna say in the last year though it was more of the. Them coming to her than her going to the co op. But I can't remember. I'm sorry, and I didn't look novice is a better way of saying a traditional teacher over non-traditional teacher, am I correct on that? I, I think it's an umbrella that encompasses both. It, it's a, it's a first year first. few year um. Thank you. For the additional questions by the committee. See no additional questions. We have no one signed up to speak for or against the bill. Represent involved would you like to close for your bill? Yes, sir. Um, I just think it's common sense. If we have teachers who are ready to teach. We should not be taking them out of a classroom, sending them to the co op when they should be in front of their students. To me, it makes way more sense for that mentor to come to that classroom if that teacher needs that mentorship, um, I do believe traditional teachers do need to go through this, but I do think that someone who's been through a year-long residency, this is very much redundant and aggravating to them to have to go sit at the co op when they could be in their rooms teaching and with that I close and make a motion to pass. Represent Val has closed her bill HB 1189. We have a motion on the table of do pass. Is there any discussion on the motion? See no discussion what is will of all in favor say aye. All opposed. Congratulations, Representative Vault, your bill is passed. Members moving on just an update to the calendar again we're gonna hear 1060 and 11:17 from Representative Richardson. We'll hear 10:27 from Representative Cozart, and then we'll finish out with SB 142 with uh Representative E Banks and Senator Des representative Richardson, you are recognized on HB 1060 to present your amendment. going out now. Thank you, Mr. Chair and Uh, does, uh, the committee have a copy of the amendment. You recognize to present your amendment. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and committee, good morning. My name is Scott Richardson. I'm in District 13 up in Bentonville Rogers, um, you have before you the amendment to 1060 which came about, uh, based on, uh, this committee's request to address the uh date to provide the uh our our friends over at the Department of Education more time to implement the changes, um, and then also of course address my grammar issue um to take care of that problem, uh, so, uh. I would appreciate a good vote on The amendment, I'm happy to answer any questions, but I think it's kind of straightforward, so. Representative Richardson has explained the amendment, the questions on the amendment. See no questions. We have a motion to adopt. All in favor say aye. All opposed. Congratulations, your amendment has been adopted. Representative, you are now recognized to present HB 1060 as amended. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Committee, I think we've, uh, sort of. beaten this horse a while, so, um, I'll be happy to answer any more questions that you happen to have, uh, and we can kind of start with that. Are there questions from the committee? See, no questions. That's a good thing. So no questions, uh, this time, uh, there's no one signed up to speak for or against. Representative, would you like to close for your bill? I would like to close from Bill. I think that this is, is, is a bill that can provide us with uh a lot of uh opportunity uh with our students and I think it's a great opportunity, uh, to ensure that our students get a great perspective of what our constitutional republic is and how they can be a influence to that and for that I would ask the committee for a good vote. Represented Richardson is closed. We have a motion on the table, do pass as amended. Is there any discussion on the motion? Represent Beck you recognize. I just want to briefly say I do appreciate uh Representative Richardson working with us as I know that we've, we've batted this thing back a few times and, and you've done it a stellar job of bringing us a a good bill. Appreciate you. Mhm See no further discussion, all I ever say aye. All opposed. Congratulations, Representative Richardson, your bill has passed as amended. And I'm gonna recognize you here in just a moment, but real quick, Secretary Oliva has uh come in with a group of amazing young people from uh the Marion School District, and I'm gonna let him introduce them if you'd like to. So, um, thank you for indulging. I have some friends that are 3rd through 6th graders that are actually elected by their peers to represent them at their school, so they're learning. All about the Capitol and I got to meet them and spend some time with them, and I was like, I'm just today, but this is Alana Creighton in 3rd grade, Elena, Elena, Elena Creighton in 3rd grade and she's gonna tell you where they're from and who they are and why this is such a big deal. We're from Harbor Car Global Community Elementary School, and we are leaders and we found that 8 habits and we follow our expectations. Thank you for letting us come in. Miss Alanna, I must certainly say that you did an outstanding job in front of a group of a lot of scary looking people made the most, you have as much time as you'd like, so continue, please. three branches. And so who uh secretary, who is their teacher or who's uh with them come say hi? You guys, please feel free to come recognize yourself. And these people are in my district. day, we're gonna get you. Yeah, uh, my name is Sean Gray. I'm assistant principal, um, at Herbert Carter, um, prior to that, I was a teacher, um, computer science, mathematics in high school, and then I moved down to elementary school where kids still love you for everything you do. So I really enjoy, uh, bringing these kids here, and I appreciate y'all giving us this time. This is a amazing experience for these kids. I'm Courtney Ball, um, I'm a teacher at HCGC and I'm also their lighthouse coordinator, uh, we're a leader in many schools and this is our student lighthouse team. uh, I could not be more proud today. Ah Thank Mr. Gray and Miss Ball, we certainly appreciate you coming and joining us. You've, uh, you've delighted us today, so and to all the students, thank y'all for your serving leadership. It's important to be engaged early on. I'd love to know that uh that you already know the three branches of government, so keep pushing forward, uh, that's probably the more than some adults can say, uh, so, uh, so again, thank you so much for your willingness to come our way. We just loved it and, and God bless you guys the rest of your day. Thanks for being here. Representative Richardson, uh, you're gonna be recognized. Good luck following that, uh, you're recognized 2% HB 1117. Wonderful good morning. Yes, um, Mr. Chairman, that will be difficult to follow, uh, but, uh, again, my name is Scott Richardson. I am, uh, from District 13 up in uh Northwest Arkansas, Bentonville Rogers, a little bit of Cave Springs. I, I, I bring that up, um, because that's very relevant to House bill, uh, 11:17. So a little background on where this came from, um, this bill, uh, I, I live in a subdivision in uh in Southwest Bentonville. I, uh, like a lot of subdivisions. There are lots of uh children, including mine, that run around the neighborhood and roam through places, um, and those children have a tendency to group up, uh, and end up at uh. Whatever home that they happen to be wanting to play at at that particular moment, um, and it uh during that time frame, oftentimes, uh, those of us who are adults will end up spending time sitting outside talking about a variety of things and of course with me oftentimes that uh ends up being political questions or concerns that they have or things that they want to talk about, um, this last summer, uh, early this last summer we were having some conversations around some of the political aspects, uh, and, and, uh, firearms became a conversation, uh, point, um, and, and in discussions with that it became very relevant, uh, that the children end up being at all of these different homes, um, because like a lot of subdivisions in in Northwest Arkansas and other parts of the state, uh, we have a very diverse group of individuals that come from a very diverse background, um, some of those have had, um, guns in their homes, firearms in their homes, their entire life, and they've been taught how to deal with that. situation. A lot have never had exposure to that and so the children's, uh, the children come through those homes and, and haven't. Now normally this wouldn't be a, a, a large concern but in a subdivision like mine where you have children invading a variety of different homes that a variety of different time, you, you very much could have a child who has never been exposed to a firearm, uh, wouldn't know how to um handle that situation being exposed to a firearm in a in a home that is. unsecured. Now, one might suggest that um Safe storage Is the right approach for that. And, and that's hard to argue, yet we are flawed people and people make mistakes and so given that we are flawed and that we could make mistakes, um, there are, there's an obvious gap and it became very aware in those conversations. There is an obvious gap, uh, in, in, uh, between those two pieces, and it's a gap that I feel like that we could uh we could close, um, and that's, uh, what sort of created this House Bill 1117. Uh, I mean, at, at the end of the day, my children discovering an unsecured firearm in one person's home or even in my home, they're very equipped to handle that circumstance, and they don't know how to respond, however, uh, a child who's never been exposed to a firearm may discover that firearm and assume it's a toy or may assume that that firearm is something to be explored and they pick it up, um, and, and I'm not gonna get into all the statistics associated with children and um accidental. firearm discharges and killing and injuring people. There was one of those circumstances that even happened up close to my district they're just outside my district in Rogers, um, uh, about a year and a half ago. These are terrible circumstances, um, and if there's an opportunity for us as a group to do something to save a life. I think it's important that we do so, so House bill, uh, 1117 was drafted um as a simple common sense solution. Um, that, uh, right now is very agreeable to the Department of Education and the uh the commission. Um, to In very basic terms, the bill simply asked the Arkansas Game and Fish in the Department of Education to work together to determine age appropriate firearm safety education. The commission is well suited to provide the firearm training um as they already do that in a number of areas they have the appropriate equipment to create these videos, um, and, and, uh, together with the Department of Education, they're well positioned to be able to provide that education across the spectrum, um, so. This bill, um, will, uh, provide firearm safety education annually, uh, it will be in the form preferred as a as a small video short video, probably less than 30 minutes in that most of the time in the younger grades this is going to be very simple. Don't touch it. Go tell an adult, right? That's a, that's the appropriate response for a small or young student, um, so, uh, along with that we wanted to make sure that. didn't impede other areas. Um, we also have, uh, of course, uh, you're aware shooting sports across the state with uh um a number of our students participating in that, so we of course included the ability for those shooting sports to be a part of or substitute for their annual training, uh, associated with firearm safety, um. We also of course were very careful with that piece to make sure the parent or guardian has to sign off on any, uh, participating participation in in those shooting sports which is already a requirement but we wanted to stipulate that in this bill, um, in the bill we we were also very careful to be um to not allow branding, if you will, um, this is not a political issue to attempt to sway um our students one direction or the other. This is simply a um an opportunity for our state agencies to provide a safety uh education and training, uh, and so the only branding that might happen is Department of Education or, you know, other state departments, but not any third party or outside sources, even if we used those resources as a as a uh uh uh an opportunity to provide this, uh, this training, so, um. With that, um, I'm happy to try to answer any of your questions. OK Represental you recognized for a question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um. I, I Agree with what you're trying to do, so don't take this wrong, but again, we're starting this. Uh, program beginning next school year, we're just a few months away from whenever those rules would have to be completely finished yet again, and if you're gonna do something, I believe we should do it right, uh, whenever we do it. And I do not believe that this will give them enough time, is my first question. Wouldn't you agree? And the second one is, I think I saw where the funding is going to be like up to the school districts. So to me this is an unfunded mandate that we're actually asking. them to do this and not yet giving them um the materials, uh, that they need to do it or the funding to be able to do it. I remember, uh, representative Bentley had a bill last year that was about the swimming, um, which was not. Not as big of a deal because there was no, um, There was no expense to the school. This actually looks like it's gonna be an expense and it looks like we're going to be yet again in that situation of, uh, not being able to get rules done in time. Could you speak to that, please? Thank you. Certainly, I, I. I appreciate that um. I don't agree, uh, by any stretch that that time is of concern. This is something that our friends over at the uh uh commission that Arkansas Game and Fish Commission already have a lot of training on that. I have the facilities available. They have the um the, the video equipment, they have everything that they need to provide that. We've already spoken with them. They have absolutely no challenges with the bill. They're great with it. They feel like this is a really a great opportunity for them to be able to provide that influence and and be able to to. Um, present that we're talking about a, a video that would be a very short order that would be posted probably to the Arkansas Game and Fish. Website and then the students would just hop out and view that during a time frame. So cost would be very low, very, uh, non uh substantial to the to anyone involved in it. So the game and fish are aware of this bill and they support the bill. I won't speak for them. I've just been relayed and I know that the that uh the uh director, associate director of education is here. Vice. Can he come up, Mr. Chair. Yes If you would please introduce yourself for the record and then you're recognized. Good Morning. My name is Spencer Griffith, and I'm the deputy director for Arkansas Game and Fish Commission. I'm over education. Question would be, do you already have the video made ma'am, we do not uh representative, we do not have, um, the, uh, this particular video made, but we do have all of the components. I apologize, uh, we do have all of the components, uh, already created in our huntered um materials and we've actually already conducted an exercise that we're about to release that would take. 100 ed material that's typically uh written for 5th grade level and above and trans uh transition that actually to the elementary classroom. We've already created those 5 lesson plans and we're working with our teacher leader council, um, to make sure that that meets state standards and, and can be well used in the classroom. So what we would likely do is offer those options to be able to um accommodate this at no cost to schools. We would also probably uh look and we're already doing a pilot for this for this year of Huntered virtual opportunity in the. classrooms, uh, ideally done, uh, during testing week so that there's an opportunity to do that for classrooms like the, um, you know, in the afternoon, maybe after testing and then, uh, so we would create a version of that where schools could opt in, maybe not to the Hunter Ed, you know, themed angle and just to this, and I do believe we can accomplish that, uh, with a pilot even this year, um, to be ready for schools for next year if that's helpful. We also bought an LMS system, so that's what schools are used to using. on their own side, so we would actually have an LMS system where this could be stored if they did not want to do it live virtually. Representative Bay you recognize. If, if I'm reading this correctly, it's every year, K through 12. And is that? No, it is every year. Uh, it is not necessarily K through 12, um, I've asked the department to work with the commission and and determine when it's age appropriate and then to determine the age appropriate nature of the of the training. I, I can't say when the right time is, but we specifically state that they would look at, uh, when it's most likely to occur, um, from an age perspective and then start providing that age approved. I guess in, in the way I was interpreting it, that this would They would develop a, a plan that would be appropriate for kindergarten, develop a plan appropriate for first grade, develop a plan for 2nd grade, 3rd, you know, all the way up. And so children would have to watch this video every single year and it just seems very excessive, um, to. Have our kids have to There's very few things that students are taught the exact same thing every year. And that, that's where I kind of have a problem. I would be more likely to say, um, students in 5th grade, like if you, if you came up with, you know, that all students when they get to 5th grade, this is what they're gonna be exposed to and then when they get to maybe 9th grade or something like that, that there might be two different ages, but my fear is that this would be something that they would have to. Learn every single year and that just to me seems excessive with all the things that Teachers and schools are having to teach our kids. I appreciate that and that's part of the, the, the concern that we addressed through making sure these are short videos, but I, I equate it to the same kind of idea as a tornado drill or a fire drill. The reality is the likelihood that either of those is going to happen in a school is very, very, very small, um, yet, um. If it does occur, these students know exactly what they're supposed to do, uh, in that event, uh, same thing with this, this is a life safety issue for our students, um, reinforcing these ideas for 30 minutes once a year isn't a lot to ask for. Um, it's a very short period of time and, and I, I, I'm saying 30 minutes. I don't know how long the videos are gonna be. I doubt they'll even be that long, really, and when we start talking about the entire time that they have to do this, we're talking about a short expert excerpt. I mean, you're talking about children that are maybe kindergarteners, you're saying. Don't touch it. It can be dangerous. This is, this is a, uh, something, this is a shotgun. This is whatever and don't touch these items because these are different types of firearms. Stay away from them versus when you get on up a little further, you may have a different type of of approach to it, but you're still talking about a very small increment that reinforces the idea every single year that these are dangerous. And can be a problem. I will couple that with the challenges in our districts in Northwest Arkansas, we have such an influx of new students every single year, um, that come from these types of environments where They don't have that exposure, um, missing one of those because we only do it every 5th year or every 10th year, whatever it happens to be and and them being exposed to a firearm and not knowing how to handle that circumstance could be. Obviously a huge issue and so for a very small Investment of time, very, very small investment of time we can potentially save a life, and that's where I'm at with this. I, I appreciate you responding. I just think that I would be more likely to vote for the bill if I knew that it was not something that, um, has to be every single year, because I know I'm gonna hear from teachers and from school districts saying one more thing, we got to figure out how to get this into our schedule, and I know you're saying it's only a half hour, but we all come forward. We all do it. So Thank you. And and and I appreciate that. of painter you're recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I agree with the intent of this bill. I am a little concerned with Um, How, how we can get through going with this. So, my questions are maybe for game and fish is number one, did you say, or is it around 5th grade that you normally start teaching Hunter Ed anyways. Uh, uh, yes, Representative, our 100 ed curriculum is written at a 5th grade level, and so, uh, we just feel like that by uh the amount of information that we're trying to translate in uh through Hunter education and the way that we're trying to do it, that that is the most appropriate time, just. Based on general maturity and of course we have uh students that are more mature that take it, uh, you know, much younger, um, but that's why we've tried to um create a program that teachers could use in a classroom that could be self-taught for a younger age group that teaches about 5 fundamental lessons of because we know that uh students are, um, establishing values earlier than 5th grade and so one of the five themed lessons that we have is firearm safety as part of that, but, uh. It, it does not um count as somebody's official hunter education test. It's just knowledge gain, uh, for the earlier piece. Are we going to be able to have those videos, you know, let's just say we started in 5th grade the, the department says, hey, we think it's gonna be a 5th grade. Are we gonna be able to have all that ready to go. Based off this current legislation for ready for August of this year. I believe I mean, or, or maybe even in the summertime for teachers to be able to put it into their calendars to know how they're going to line up their classes. I believe we can certainly do that, um, and depending on uh different will of this body and in education, I think we can work on the ways in which we do it most appropriately. Maybe at the 5th grade version of this is a longer format piece that's that's 30 minutes. Maybe in the LMS tool for other grades. It's loaded with a 2 minute reminder, um, or even some other way that we engage with. students so that it doesn't have to be, you know, a rigorous 30-minute course every year, but there is maybe some kind of uh touch point with them that happens, you know, our engagement that happens in some surrounding grades, but more intensive, you know, pieces at 5th and 9th grade, as you said. So I think there's a way that we can work with the representative and, in this body and, and education to do this and implement it in a way that's not intrusive but reaches the goal of the bill. Thank you, Mr. Chair, at some point, I I think it'd be helpful for the committee to hear from the Department of Ed on the you want to do it now? I can, I can wait, we still have other testimony. Let's just go hear what, what they have to say that might change somebody else so that we can get the department to come up if they want to make a comment about this. Well, it's just say if you're good or not, that'd be good. I'm up and say what you, uh. You, you can give us any kind of answer you want. We'll let uh Representatives. Painter, you want to ask the department a question. I just kind of curious, you know, uh, like a previous bill we had timeline concerns, um, maybe what the department thinks that it's, you know, what maybe grade that we're gonna start teaching, you know, having a gun safety education and how we can fit that into the curriculum. Jacob Oliva, Department of Education, um, I, I think. Timeline wise, we, we stand ready to deliver based on the timelines that were given by the legislative delegation. It does say in the 25, 26 school year. It doesn't say August 1st, so you know, the, the school year goes all the way through the spring, I feel confident before even winter, we would be able to have something and provide training and support to educators, but I will say we, we have a long standing supportive relationship with Game and Fish. And we've been proactive already having different types of conversations, um, not even just specifically on this topic, but where the, the natural state, you know, how do we support conservationism? How do we teach students about the surroundings and um how we get back to the great state that we prosper from, so, um, I feel confident that we'll meet the deliverables as um outlined in this proposed legislation. One more, Mr. Chair, do you have a certain grade that you think would be ideal to start this off. Well, I think it's content specific. I mean, I, I see TV commercials that go to anybody that's watching TV that talks about gun safety and that could be targeted as low as 4 and 5 year olds understanding, don't touch this, you know, don't, don't engage, um, to getting into more specific robust conversations. I think that's why you have to look at something along a continuum, but there's some real experts that we're gonna defer to that are right in that curriculum that. um, we're gonna lean on their, their advising counsel and meet with our teachers and leaders. We, we would follow the same process as we're looking at establishing curriculum and expectations by bringing in the right experts and helping them make those recommend back you recognize. Ah OK, now I can talk my concern is this, uh, it's, it's a little bit related to representative Mulberry, uh, uh. Library, excuse me. I Uh Alright. Apologize now, so here you go, that'll work. Fair play. is along this line. It, it seems like the, you know, the gun safety is perfect. All right. Ah And, and I even understand that maybe we would have to a student that enters a a a a district. At the 5th grade level or something like that would, would say, OK. Uh, we need you to watch these videos because this is what we've taught. In the 3rd grader or something like that to make sure they had that gun safety aspect of it or whatever. But it seems like this thing would almost go into scope, uh uh creep, what we call it's called creep, which is like you, you got 12. Classes you're putting together on gun safety. I mean, I'm, I'm saying once I've taught someone how to identify a pistol. And, and the firearm, various firearms, and so don't, you don't touch. Then where does it go with the next one? And then what's the next one, you know, I mean, I, I don't, I just don't know what you would say different than the previous one. And I think they're there you could start. Maybe, uh, preaching, uh. I'm not preaching. That's the wrong word. But no, not teaching, but, but like what you're, what you're doing is, is, is you, you're needing information to, to fill in, uh, here and, and you can't just keep saying the same thing every year, and you know, you might start crossing over lines to where you're, you're, you're going past the scope of just doing gun safety. You know, and, and, and, and, and if we do that, they'll, we'll, we'll get lots of phone calls, uh, but I mean, I'm. Again, I, I like the gun safety aspect of it. I just don't see how you're going to feel, you know, 30 minutes. Every a video 30 minutes uh using the examples that have been, you know, every class. It, it seems like. I just don't know what you teach unless you're just gonna play the same video again. In case somebody forgot. So that's a concern, and if you can, you know, so, so what is it that, you know, give me an example, if it, if it's this on the, let's just if it's, if you're gonna teach, I think you should teach it in the first grade, uh, or kindergarten. I, I really do. I mean, you know, this is what a gun looks. Don't touch it. I liked it when you said that. I liked that example. OK, so now you're the next year. This is a gun, don't touch it. Now you're the next year. This is a gun. Don't touch it, type of deal. So it seems like. I, I appreciate the sentiment. Uh, a couple of things that I would, I would say to that one, that, um. I can, uh, I. I can tell my child 15 times to, to, uh, wear their shoes, something that's obvious, um, you would think getting out of the getting out of uh out out of a, a house, you put your shoes on and we still end up getting in the vehicle and headed out of the driveway and occasionally to our destinations without that child having shoes on, um, so I, I would start that. The other thing is I would remind the That all that uh there is uh there are other examples that we do this with that is that we find very, very important like drugs we constantly remind with Red Ribbon Day and other, other events constantly remind um our children that these are dangerous things that can have a dangerous impact on their lives and therefore we want to make sure they have the right information, the right knowledge to make good decisions and that's really what this bill is about. It's, it's not. not a significant um yes or no on firearms, that's not the point. The point is, in my district, it is a very, very real possibility that a child could go into a home of someone who's lived in an environment where they've always had firearms and discover by some accident or some fluke that there is a firearm there and available and we see this all the time we have it in Pulaski County, we have it in Little Rock, we have it in uh Northwest Arkansas. All of, all of these areas we have children that discover firearms and end up hurting themselves or a sibling or a friend, and these are, these are things this is a very simple, very low cost, very minor impact thing that we can do as a group. To potentially save a life. There are other fringe benefits and other things that we can look at, um, down the road, um, associated with empowering our kids to be involved in, um, uh, the, the outdoors and the natural state and all of that kind of stuff. But that's not the purpose of this bill. The purpose of this bill is to reinforce on an annual basis the reality that making a mistake with a firearm. That they've discovered could have life threatening. consequences. And I think that's important. And I support the bill, but I, I, I wouldn't you agree that, that there's gonna be a tendency to try to fill that gap and, and, and what you fill that gap with needs to be firearm safety and not and nothing else. I, I absolutely agree with that, and I certainly, uh, I, I believe that the bill is very clear that this time and these videos are dedicated. To firearm safety. Duke, you recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, so Like everybody else, I think pretty much on this committee or many of us, I, I like the bill and I think you've got some good ideas here. I do have a couple of concerns. One, I was thinking about our freshman year as, um, Uh, I do have a question here. As a freshman legislators and having that feeling of the fire hose, and that's often what we do to our teachers down here in Little Rock is we all have good ideas and I think most of the ideas are good ideas, but it's like a fire hose to them whenever we get out of session. And so what concerns me a little bit here, and I hope you can address it is what I keep hearing 30 minutes and That's a lot of time in a school day and really valuable time. And this is a valuable issue. But Do you see concern with a 30 minute video, I mean, is that what you envision a 30 minute video and obviously not in lower grades, you do not, you've spoken to that. But do you see concern in what we're trying to do and as far as reading and writing that I understand value in life, but sometimes we're hitting these teachers over and over and over and over and over again on do this, do this, do this, because it's good and we're slowly we only wait time in the day. So do you think there may be some other ways to incorporate this in. I was spinning around some of these ideas with bus Safety Week and drug-free Week when you said that with um, fire safety week to where maybe it rolled in. would you be, I don't even know if those are in statute or they're just things that school districts do. But maybe rolling that into a piece together and cut down some of the other weeks, and it just all becomes a safety week. Would that might be something, if that's even doable, from my perspective, uh, I, I envision us kind of as, as uh the individuals who set the What we see as priority. How it's implemented. It is not up to me or up to in my opinion, up to this body. It is up to the Department of Education and it is up to those that design define the, the curriculum and roll those things together. I absolutely agree those are great ideas for this 30 minutes, I threw 30 minutes around because I can't imagine that would be even that long. I mean, in most cases, uh, you, you, uh. That would be deferred, of course, um, back to the commission and the department to determine how, what's appropriate, what, what is really up to them. This bill doesn't say any time frame. It doesn't restrict it to one minute or 6 hours. It just says a video to reinforce this idea, I think that we can trust the the Department of Education, uh, and, uh, the commission to follow the, the, the requirements here and to do it in a prudent way, I can't imagine that the commission, excuse me, that the department, given that they have all of the oversight in what is appropriate that they would allow for something that would impede the day or or the function of the of our classrooms, um, I would, I I have faith that they're going to provide the right kinds of time frames, that's appropriate for that age bracket and that they're going to limit that to just what is necessary. I'd come back around to the end of the day. We trust them to do their jobs. We need to do our jobs and give them the right, uh, the, the right priorities that we establish and, and with that, um, trust them to enforce it in a way that makes the most sense, um, they're the experts. I'm not, um, I would stipulate that, um. Yes, it's, it could potentially be a bit of an impact. And The value associated with a life cannot possibly be measured in a few minutes of watching a video and that's what uh that truly is in my opinion what we're looking at here. Well, and to, to kind of follow up along those lines, the, the video in itself, and we, I, I, I believe that you're giving some discretion to the department to not necessarily implement a video because you do not want it to become where they become desensitized to it because that happens a lot with a lot of the programs that we do in schools is that we do it over and over and over again, and whether it's PD or whether it is. These types of requirements, the kids get desensitized to it. And we don't certainly don't want that to have that happen so I I guess I believe there's flexibility where it doesn't have to be a video. It can be something else, which I think would be more useful and I had another question and I lost it in the process of waiting to follow back up. So I will just get back in the queue or get you offline. Well, I'll, I'll add to that couple with that, that if you look in uh section F on page 13, we do give a lot of discretion, uh, for implementation to, to the department. so that they can do this in any of the forms that makes sense obviously for us we want to stipulate that we, we don't want, uh, a game and fish. commission employee go to every school and providing training for every classroom for every purpose, right, that we, that wouldn't be a good use of taxpayer dollars and certainly it wouldn't be a um a good use of the time in the, in the classrooms. So we give a lot of discretion on how they can implement this. And one more, and so in, in your point, to your point there, it's not necessarily the Gen ed classroom teacher that this would have to be taught in. It could also roll this in into one of the other areas within that freedom is in here in this field for Jesse to roll that in wherever. anywhere that the department feels that this would best fit, um, they have that discretion, but it does have to be K through 12. It is not, uh, we are giving them the department, the, the. Absolutely they can do whatever they need to do to make this work right. Represent Nazarenko, you recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair and thank you for uh presenting. I, I agree also with the, uh, the intent of the bill for it being a gun safety. I like that. I do have a couple of questions, um. Cause we had in in my district years ago we had an incident, uh, so my, my question is, did you consider, uh, I know this was game and fish with centric. Did you consider it all involving like ASP, uh, state police or other local law enforcements with it cause it seems like they would have a good uh bit of research from that as well. We give that flexibility in the bill, um, if you look in that section F we have other approved curriculum which would be the opportunity for a local officers to come in and present if possible and talk. about gun safety or other types of uh um approved commission and Department of Education approved presentations that we give them that flexibility and I, I think that the idea here is that part of this we know how to do. And but keeping it fresh, making sure that we're reinforcing it and doing the things that we need to do to continue to ensure that that safety, maybe a little bit of evolving and 20 years from now, obviously, um, firearms are gonna look different than they do today. Um, they're evolving as well, so being able to evolve that curriculum to ensure that we're providing that safe instruction and that safety training across the board is critical so that that flexibility is right there in the bill. OK, great, because I think If we look at like in the uh unfortunate event that something does happen, it's probably gonna be local law enforcement or state police it's going to be there that they're going to see on scene or on site and not gaming fish, so I think that's important to consider. And also to our, to our discussion about the age appropriateness and how, I know you've got that in here. I, I think if we looked at data, we could probably find some data of past incidents, and we can, you know, maybe make that age-appropriate decision instead of just a spitball, we can say the data. shows that this age is when we're starting to see issues uh nationwide. Would you, would you, uh, agree with that? I, I would certainly agree with that, um, and that is also addressed in the first section of the bill be one and and following, um, that they are to make that determination required on data. and risk factors. Excellent. Thank you, Mr. Chair. in Brown, you recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, Representative Richardson, uh, I under I totally agree with the premise of your concern. Um I'm trying to think of some way that's workable to educate children and like. they'll work together to come up with an idea. But, um, and maybe schools don't do this anymore. But we used to have what we called assemblies and we all got, we were tickled to have an assembly because that meant we got out of class and we can sit in the bleachers and it was kind of pretty cool because you'd learned something about something, you know, whether you were listening to music or you were listening to local police department or whatever. Um, and, and I, I know that, uh, a lot of times people use posters to warn children is there. Um, is there any chance that I mean something really more flexible where. Or maybe even instead of having it part of the curriculum as long as. You know, maybe it could be part of a school's safety week. I didn't know they had all these different weeks, you know, I haven't had kids in school in a long time, but, uh, it just seems like. It's just an awful lot being asked to the teachers and you know maybe a video is the right way to go. I am very concerned about children not knowing that they need to just. Don't touch it, just leave it alone, but I also know. Because I have a granddaughter. They get real curious. They get to digging around and stuff where they don't belong and they come across stuff they don't, not at my house, of course, but they come across stuff that they they she likes to get into my hair care products and stuff. I know how she is, she's curious, so, um. Um, I know kids are, are snoopy. I mean they snoop around. They want to know what all those, you know, what are the adults have in their drawer? What do they have in the closet, what's under the bed. They want to look and see what's there, um. So I know that it's important for children who aren't exposed to uh firearms at home whose parents haven't had a chance to teach them, don't touch it. This is dangerous. I know it's important for Curious kids to be have some Education to leave that stuff alone. But I don't know the best way to do it. And I don't know that a 30 minute video every year is the right thing. I'm just, well, I, I, I agree with you completely. Absolutely, I agree with you and Representative Brown, that's, that's the reason that we gave the latitude to determine. Um, how this is implemented to the Department of Education, working with uh in conjunction with the, the, the game and fish commission where we allow them to do a video or any other mechanisms like, uh, I was just speaking about they could have a an assembly and there may be an officer that comes in and and presents that as long as it's approved through the department, um, then, then it's it's an approved uh way for us to present this kind of information, uh, to, to the students, so we give a lot of flexibility in this bill to the department to determine what that right is. I don't, I, I'm not gonna say that I, by any stretch and the expert to to be able to say this is what you have to do, that's why we have those experts over in the department to make those decisions and to be sure that they're connecting with those students at that level. So are you saying that any local law enforcement. person could come into the school and and visit the classrooms and talk to the students. I'm saying that we give the latitude to the department to approve. I Way to present this material to the to the. Students. I'm not saying that anybody can come in off the street and do this. I'm saying that the department has allowed it to to make the decision on how this is implemented. And, and I think that's the that's the right approach from my opinion. I think it's the right approach. It's, it's, uh, they know best, they're the experts. Let's let them, let's let them take the ball and run with it. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. members just to give you an own word of where we're at represent Barnett, I'm coming to you next, and we have Representative Garner, Representative Fat, Representative Gonzalez Worth and it's where we're at and then Representative Duke, you'll be after that. So I only say that to let you know that you are in the queue. Go ahead and, and turn your mics off so that we don't get too many mics on and then not work, uh, but, uh, next, uh, our representative, uh, sorry, recognize representative Barnett. Oh, you're not sorry, my apologies, uh, then Representative Garner, you recognize. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. uh, like the others, I love some of this. I've taught gun safety classes and I'm excited to have them available. I am concerned, um, like every teacher, I think about every minute that's taken out of the classroom because it's already already an issue. Um, I do love the fact that it's age appropriate and data driven, that's wonderful, um. And I, I really like the idea that it's our dey our departments and our this issue. I do have concerns with a couple of things, and I can tell you, um, that. calling some of the requirements neutral is probably a little bit um scary for my constituents, um. Neutral viewpoints, I, I would guess that a lot of my constituents and maybe you and some of yours think very differently about the 2nd Amendment. Think very differently about gun rights and gun violence provision, and does that or does that mean that we would talk about gun violence, which is not mentioned in here, or gun violence prevention, gun control, some of those things. That's not in the scope of this legislation. No, ma'am. So that's what I'm saying the scope, there is scope in this legislation. that is not neutral necessarily. And, and I, I'm sorry, which not by not by not addressing gun violence. No, no, that's what I would like to see. That's not mentioned here, and it, it does say without limitation, so, but it does require. To talk about The 2nd Amendment and, and it's one thing just to read the 2nd Amendment, but where does that and gun rights, where does that end? That's not part of gun safety. It is as approached from the idea that guns are available. Um, uh, we all have the right to own and bear arms, um, and so they are available uh in people's homes and they are there as far as whether you agree with the 2nd Amendment or not isn't relevant to the conversation. It is simply that they are there. I'm saying that people interpret it differently, not that it's not that it's not there, they interpret it differently, so they're very different interpretations and so that is not. necessarily neutral, which is why we direct the the department to be neutral in that. So that they uh develop the training that is neutral from a neutral viewpoint because I don't want this to turn into a political, um, yeah, this is better than that or this is worse than that. This is simply to address that these are available. And therefore if they are out there because we have people that do have that right, then this could be a risk, and you need to be aware of it. And that's again that's why I I default back to the department. They are the experts in how to make sure that these things are presented as a neutral, um, at the end of the day, a teacher in a classroom, if they were teaching this themselves, which I'm not sure the department would necessarily allow, but if they were, they absolutely could provide their own political beliefs outside the scope of this law, which is again. this bill, which may be law at some point, which again is why we empowered the department. I, I don't think it, I don't think political beliefs ought to be in there anywhere, but it seems to me like the 2nd Amendment and some of those kinds of issues could be taught in civics, not in. And and the only reason it's absolutely, and the reason it's relevant to this again is just. Purely for the reality that because of the 2nd Amendment and because of the Arkansas Constitutional protections, there is availability. Not that that that that is right, wrong or indifferent. It's just that that is, that is the reality at the end of the day. I is it right for a person to have a a a a firearm? Is it wrong? That's not relevant to don't touch it if you're a. 5 year old walking through a house and see which is why we, we wanna make sure that we teach relevance but not viewpoints. No indoctrination. But reality. So in the rules we would be making sure that gun prevention or gun control in certain situations or whatever is being taught as well. We will be certainly we can oversee that and that would of course come to ALC for the other question I have is just, I just wanna make sure that when you mention um. When you mentioned live firearm training in schools. that that is it's not part of this, right, and it's not in schools, um they do live training somewhere else and that would count as we have a number of shooting sports that happen at the high school level that, that. The piece of that is just to say, OK, well if they're already having that safety training in in conjunction with that, then the commission, the department can determine, OK, that's already safety training. There's no reason for us to stick them back through and do redundant training someplace else, so, and, and I was very specific to make sure it was off campus because there was some concerns from constituents that this might be interpreted to be an on campus and we do not want shooting ranges on our campuses, certainly not, uh, yes ma'am. Per vault you're recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm sure as you're learning here in education, we are not, uh, we're very particular. We make sure we look at everything and I don't want you to feel like you're the only person that goes through that at the end of the table. I do think you have a great idea here, um, I think you have a good start to a bill. Um, there's several things that do, um, throw up some red flags for me and I'll go to page one, line 33 to 35 where it talks about, uh, empower the Arkansas State Game and Fish commission to work with the division of Elementary and Secondary education to create an approve an age-appropriate fire safety and use. Education courses. So to me, we are truly mandating that you're going to do this during certain course times and it could be during English, it could be during math, it could be, but we are mandating that they do this. My other worry is, again, um, I, I will jump back onto what uh Representative Duke was talking about. It's a fire hydrant. We are always throwing things at teachers to have to do and to incorporate in a classroom and yet we still need you to hit all of these marks. Just like I, I'll use your bill that you had just a minute ago, the communist bill. Now we're saying you've got to hit X Y Z on this. Now you've got to hit X Y Z on this and what if the next one's gonna be? And we're gonna teach. Going to have them do this, that and the other. Again, it's a good idea, but I really, um, would appreciate it maybe if you just pull it down and work with some of us and try to make it a better bill than what it is or a better concept than what it is, um, just for the sure fact that we've all seemed like things that kind of have thrown red flags to us, which worries me that we're doing something. In haste Quickly instead of sitting down and and visiting with everybody. From all all parts of this, teachers in the classroom, principals, superintendents, whatever it might be, have everybody kind of help us with what would make this a great bill for our school district. I'm happy to do whatever the committee wills as as hopefully I've demonstrated. I'm happy to do that. I, I, and again just like previously, I, I, I wanna make sure that I'm doing what you guys ask and then we get the the right steps and, and looking through it, I, I appreciate the use. I don't know how that on the on line 35 on page one. I have no idea how that mandates that they do it in English class. Well, it doesn't, it doesn't. I'm just saying it looks like it would have to be during an education course, meaning not PE, not music, not art, something that is true and educational course. It is a it is a firearm safety education course. OK. Firearm safety and education course. That's all one term associated with firearms. safety and education. So, so there is the uh just like we already spoke, right, we, we already went through that, uh, there are, um, those approved events, shooting sport events that are already out there. We wanna make sure that that's included, yeah, so that, that, that's not mandating it's a. and something that's just saying these are firearm safety course and use courses. I will still say Every piece of legislation we pass has legislative intent, so when they go to do rules, the rules can't go beyond what the legislative intent is of the bill. When those rules come to us in the ALC if it's not the intent of the, of the law written then we ask them to take those rules and go back and rewrite those rules and bring them back to us. So we can say that we're giving them all this leeway, but in reality, they can only go into the, what the bill. is trying to do just so you know. And with that, I, I'll yield to the next person. Thank you. And I appreciate that, which is why I was very clear on the legislative intent that's um. Uh, they're in line 30 and following, including that, that portion that you were there. Ripson Gonzales were then you're recognized. Thank you. I, I do appreciate the spirit of your. of your bill, um. In 2020, Arkansas was ranked 5th in the nation for child teen firearm deaths and so we are still remaining at the top. So gun safety is absolutely important, agree, agree with that, um, there was a survey also that kind of goes along with that in that. 40% of adults, this is a a national survey, OK, a national survey, um, 40% of adults with children have firearms in the home, 36%. Of households Had unlocked firearms in the home, and 30% of households had firearms which were loaded in the homes. And so, 11 of my concerns is, of course, we know that the safest home for a child is one without guns. You, you probably wouldn't have those gun accidents. Are we gonna be addressing, however, some of those areas that are causing this, the, the deaths of our children and teens with firearms, are we gonna address storage, you know, locked and unloaded ammunition, you know, is the ammunition locked is, is it locked up somewhere in the house, not just available, um. Is it gonna are children gonna have access to the keys or combinations of lock boxes or gun safes, um. And then, um, are we gonna say no loaded or unlocked guns in the household. I guess my, my question is we're trying to prevent, you know, the gun safety piece. But also it's one thing for the gun safety, but those accidents are happening in the home and so are we gonna include that, that's my question. Quickly to address that, if you look on page 2, line 32, you'll see, uh, A C, the, the proper handling and safe storage of firearms is to be included in this. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. Representative Duke, you recognized. Just kidding. Are there additional questions by the committee? Represent Beck has a quick question. If I truly think this is needed. But I cannot support a bill. That says that. children will be taught the use of firearms. I'm, I'm a, I'm a gun advocate, but there are people out there who will not do not want their children to be taught the use of firearms and if you would pull it and, and, and work on that to where he said, OK, I understand what you're trying to do. There there's two sections here, right? I agree with you. I just would like to know where in the bill it says that we're gonna teach them the use of firearms. It says it on 35 it says firearms safety and use education courses. That is, that is inclusive, not exclusive, right? So at the end of the day. If we are teaching children. Adult children semi-adult children, older children, older students, however you want to phrase that, if they are already enrolled in a firearm class likes uh trap shooting. That they're already there. They already have to be there for their parents' sake, for their sake, they love it. They're already there, um, that is a use, um, purpose, so we need to be teaching them firearm safety in use in those events. They need to know how to be safe with that firearm in those events. It's not exclusive saying we have to teach every child use. It is only inclusive and in the latter part of the bill where we stipulate for these approved game and fish. circumstances All right, so it's not inclusive. So thank you for that. Are there additional questions about the committee? See no additional questions, uh, is there anyone in the audience who would like to speak for or against the bill, seeing none, Representative Richardson, would you like to close for your bill? I would uh love to close for my bill, um, and I, I'll go ahead and close and then um I, I appreciate, uh, the committee's willingness to talk through these things. Hopefully I've been done a good job of explaining how the bill addresses all of those across the board, and I, I really appreciate the comments, um, and, uh, um, I, I love the, the premise that most of you agree that we have to do something, um, and so therefore, um, I feel like that this is a common sense bill. It approaches everything. that you've asked for and we've addressed all the challenges within the bill that you've asked for already and so therefore I would, I would, uh, I would love a good vote. I feel like that this will be saving lives, and I would appreciate that. Representative Richardson has closed for his bill. We have a motion on the table of do pass. Is there any or any discussion on the motion. Purposes and fault you're recognized for discussion. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Again, I think you have some good stuff in here. I will not be able to support it the way that it's written right now, um, but I appreciate you bringing it to us. Additional discussion by the committee. The motion is do pass on HB 1117 on paper, say I. All opposed. I'm sorry, Representative Richardson, your bill has failed. No worries. Thank you very much, committee. Thank you, uh, Mr. Chairman. Committee moving on, we're going to close out today with SB 142, Representative Eubanks and Senator D's you recognize. If you would please introduce yourself for the record and then you're recognized to present your bill. Representative John Eubanks District 46. Senator Tyler Dees District 35. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Committee, uh. Come in, if you would please give respect to Representative Eubanks for his bill. Uh, this is a bill that Senator Deeds and I have been working on for several months, but I, uh, when the governor gave her state of the state address, I really wasn't expecting her that this was going to be something that was, uh, this important and it was going to be on, on her agenda. And I'm really not sure who came up with the little phrase bell to bell no sell. I didn't, uh. It is a little catchy, but anyway, uh, You know, uh Senator Dees and I worked on social media bill, uh, last session. And I think From the information and and research that we've done as particularly with regard to the book that Jonathan Haidt did, The Anxious Generation. We know the impact that, uh, social media, cell phones are having on our younger generation. And The governor, uh, Gave a copy of that book to all the members, and I hope all of you had the opportunity to take a look at it and maybe read it, and absorb some of the content in there and, and what we're trying to do here with this bill is try to not only address, uh, how well students can learn in school, but also hopefully, to some degree, help protect their mental health. One of the things that I'm really concerned about is the socialization of our young people or the lack thereof. And it seems like everybody, including all of us, always have our phones in front of us and I don't know how often we're paying attention, uh, I know that I have to Pay particularly close attention to instruction in order to learn, and I, I suspect there's a lot of other students that fall into that category. But, uh, the governor offered, had the, uh, The pilot program and there was a good response from the schools that participated and the information that I think the senator will share the response that was not only good, but the results have been good as well, and I'm, I'm gonna go ahead and let him address some of those issues and, uh, he likes to talk more than me anyway, so I'll turn it over to Senator Dees. Thank you, Representative Eubanks. Thank you, members of the committee, Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the opportunity to bring this bill. This is, um, it's a much needed bill, uh. For me personally, I've got school age kids and I know how serious this is. We, we see it, um, every day in our household in our community. But, um, as Representative Eubank said, uh, Jonathan Ha's book on uh anxious, I'm sorry, Jonathan Height's books, excuse me, on anxious generation, really, uh, did a great job of highlighting this and um to set the tone, I think it'd be important to think about some of his words. These are not my words, and these are his and it, it says. If there's two big mistakes we've made over protecting our children in the real world and under protecting our children in the online world is a big issue. He also talks about how the great irony of social media is that the more you immerse yourself in it, the more lonely you become. He also says Generation Z became the first generation in history to go through puberty with a portal in their pockets. That called them away from the people nearby and into an alternate universe. That was exciting, addictive, unstable, and unsuitable. For our children and adolescents. I think that really sets the tone well, um. For why we're here and why this bill is so important. We've got a vast array of studies that are starting to be done on this in in about the last 20 years, 25 years, we started to see that there's been an unintentional. Uh, test going on with our children. And really in our education spaces and so we've seen increase in anxiety and depression and suicidal rates, and we can stem it all back to overre usage to exposure to social media and unfortunately that's happening more easily. In our in our education, in our, in our schools. Um The Manhattan Institute I also want to read some of their studies about this, um, because they've been, uh, great in their work. And they say this smartphone use in schools can harm children in at least 2 major ways. The first is distracting them from the educational experience of, of students. And the second is impeding healthy childhood socialization, which representative Eubanks just mentioned. These two aspects of of the in-person academic experience can be fundamental to a children's development and well functioning and well adjusted adults. Public schools historically operate in loco parentis, meaning that when minor children are entrusted by parents to a school. The school has a duty. To support the learning and safety of its students. But schools' abilities to do this are impeded by smartphone use. Data and anecdotal observation support these connotations. Research using granular data that tracked mobile phone notifications found that teens received 237 notifications a day on average. With about 25% of those notifications happening while they're in school. Other studies showed that 90% of students are sending text messages in class. I'm sorry, 90% are receiving text messages in class, 86% say that they're sending text messages in class. Further studies show that that using Facebook and texting while doing schoolwork can tax cognitive processing capacity and may preclude deeper learning. Smartphone use and addiction has also been associated with poor sleep quality, and we all know poor sleep quality is a major deterrent to academic performance. And so it's these studies. And far more that have started to kind of perk up and say there's, there's a major problem going on here. is a major concern It's actually what started the, the conversations with the governor's office in the last year, year and a half, and where we launched a pilot program. You're all familiar with, and I'm so thankful that the voluntary, the voluntary program. Was um opted in with about 180 school districts, that's 76% of our school districts said, we agree, we see the problem. We want, we wanna address this today. We don't want to wait on anything, we want to go this year. And so fortunately from that pilot program as you makes referenced, we've started to see some great statistics and great results. We've seen school districts report back voluntarily again. How attendance records are improving, how disciplinary issues are going down, drug related offenses are going down. Bullying cases are going down, uh, student engagement is going up. Kids are engaged in the classroom. Anecdotally, we hear that amazing things happen in the hall. It's loud. They're talking. They're engaging with one another. They're looking at each other's eyes. These are the socialization things that we've been talking about that are are are needed. And so that's a very important distinction of of what we're starting to see the data is starting to show. And so specifically on this bill, what this bill does, this is bell to bell, no sell act. It simply states from the start of the day to the end of the day that we're gonna have a restricted phone environment. Um, and, and that's, it's a simple phrase. It also is very intentional about providing exceptions. It's an intentional about um providing for local control. And so as you read through the bill, I encourage folks to make sure they read through the bill because what it does is. Uh, let's take local control for a minute. First we've heard from Superintendents, we've heard from, from teachers, from parents, from students and they've actually they've been asking for help on this. They've been asking for support. Teachers have told us we don't want to be the bad guys. Can you please help us with policy around this. So local control is actually first just us listening. Local control specifically in this bill. Is, is saying that you get to decide the policy around this school district. School districts get to decide if they want to implement a, a pouch system, a locker system, um, a Cubbie system often away in your backpack system. Each school district is going to have the ability to provide the input for the implementation, and that's the right way to do it because they know what's best for their school district. Also they get to provide uh policy implementation around student disciplinary issues around this. They get to decide what's best for them. So that was very intentional that we make sure this was not heavy-handed, that this was a collaboration effort. And then as far as exceptions, we want to make sure that this was a realistic and usable bill. We've got students that need medical documented medical needs that need to be traceable, need to be tracking and using personal electronic devices and so we have exceptions for that. We also have exceptions for 504 plans and for IEP plans to make sure that we are accommodating this to the real world in class. And finally, we have exceptions for emergencies in the rarity of cases of fires or tornadoes, we want to make sure that we have clauses in there that are realistic and easy to follow. So we've been very intentional about this. There's some phrasing on the Senate side of we've tried to find the right balance, right, the right balance of, of threading the needle what this should look like. And that's been our intent um on all of this, uh, there's been further conversations about, um, you know, the scope of this bill, you know, why does it only talk about public schools? Why does it not talk about private schools? And my response to that is it's the same reason that we don't include home schools. It's not our jurisdiction. Our constitutional charge. is to work on public school policy, public school environment. Our, our Constitution does not tell us to go and and regulate home schools, and it shouldn't. When, when the Learns Act was passed, um, It was very intentional that we made sure that we didn't have strings attached. That's an opt-in policy for private schools. It's an opt-in policy for home schools. Not a mandate down to private schools and home schools. We should not be regulating and telling homeschool students and families, what their cell phone policy should be. That's inappropriate. I will say that every, every student, every teacher, every family should. Be looking at this, we would encourage that. But what is our charge? What is our scope? Our scope and our, our, um our focus should be on public school environments. That's, that's our task. Um, so that's what the bill does. Um, I know there's, there's, uh, probably lots of questions and I'm happy to answer those. We're happy to go through those, but I, I hope I've been able to set the tone of for sure the need and for sure the intention behind the legislative intent behind this bill, but I'll end in the summary and that's this, this, this bill aims to do two things help our education environment in a distraction-free environment, the education performance side. And also helps with the emotional and social intelligence, the socialization, the relationship skills that students need to be well-adjusted adults. So that, Mr. Chair, we, we stand ready for any questions. Thank you, Senator and Representative Eubanks, uh, Representative Nazarenko, you're recognized for a question. Thank you, Mr. Chair and thank you, uh, Senator Deess and Representative of Eubanks for bringing this to us. I, I believe it's a great bill. I've got, um, 3, nephews and nieces that are in school right now and I've got a teacher that's over in uh one of the pilot programs, so I spoke with him and I've also spoke with the administrators in other nearby schools just to get their opinion and from what I got from them, this is my question for you, uh, would you agree that the data that we've received from the pilot programs and then the feedback that we're receiving from those schools and those administrators has been great, uh, resounding yes that everybody has uh has found success with it and A high number of folks have had success and that this will be beneficial to our students going forward and set them up for success for the future. Absolutely. Thank you very much. Represent Cozart, you're recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Gentlemen, I, I do appreciate you bringing this. I think it's been well needed. I, I just really have a statement along with a small question, but as you know, I used to sit in this chair about 3 years ago, also a little, little over 2 years ago. That was a big cry back then from the superintendents and the teachers of our schools to do something about cell phones because it was so disturbing for our classrooms and also what you just said communication of our kids walking up and down the hallway. They did not communicate with each other. They, they didn't even know who probably some of the students that the classes with because of that thing they held in their hand, so I wanna thank you for bringing this bill forward and I want to thank the governor also for making that one of her priorities, but don't you believe that, um, somewhere down the road, that this is going to change the lives of many, many kids. Absolutely do. I, I think, you know, it's, it's been said that um. The, uh, really more related to social media, but that's, that's a similar connotation here in this conversation, but that we're gonna look back and, and big tech and social media, how it's impacting our kids is, is, is kind of the, the big tobacco of our generation and we need to be careful with that. I think this sets the tone and and highlights how serious this is our kids and I, I think it's going to positively impact students across our state. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Represent Andrews, you recognize for a question? Thank you, Mr. Chair. um. Senator, um, appreciate the bill, uh, from the uh administrators I talked to in my district they're glad this is happening, um, you, you said there's kind of local control aspect to this. I'm just curious, will this bill allow, say, if the district wanted to let them have pounds out during lunch, would it allow that? Great question. Um, it wouldn't, it would not, so the, the bell to bell, the start of the end of the day is the framework, um, and so and it's an intentional because, you know, there's all different versions across the country, uh, that people are trying to figure this out, but um When I said there's two aspects to this, this bill. The first is the education environment, and so some schools have said, hey, just the education in the classroom. Let's make sure that's cleaned up. Let's let them have it the rest of the day. Well, the intentionality is that second point is that we're trying to create healthy, well-adjusted adults, and we know the statistics show us that they need a break from these, these things. They, they need space away from these things to have interrelationship skills and so it would not allow that. OK, thank you. Grips some painter you recognize for a question. Thank you. I, I, I appreciate the bill, uh, just a couple of questions first. Can you talk about, um, you know, when we read the headline of the bill, it's, it's, it's, you know, with cell phones. Can you talk about smart, uh, devices, you know, like a smartwatch or uh in Representative Hugh Banks's case, a pager that he may still use. Uh, can you talk about those other devices too? I'll let you defend yourself for 3 weeks. I don't need to. You can go ahead and answer the question, Peter, I won't allow the, uh, speaking ill of a sorry. No, it's a great question. You know, cell phones is definitely going to dominate the discussion, um, but it's not the entire scope and so it's, it's personal electronic devices in, in, in the bill we've, we've um uh articulated what that means and it does say cell phones, telephones, paging devices. Reapers, uh, mobile telephones that offer advanced computing and internet, um, accessibility, digital media player players, um, in a range of other things wearable, watch technology. And so we know that, um, you know, technology is always going to continue to advance and, and, uh, but we've tried to gather the scope of personal electronic device. My answer to that question would have been if you'd read the bill, you would have known exactly what we were talking about. Oh, I read it. I just wanted to hear it on the record, um. Kind of going down that point. With like tablets, you know, a lot of students are using those tablets, you know, how are we going to monitor those not the constant notifications on tablets like that and then my last question would be, um, what about, you know, talking about the school day, does that include football practice at 4:30. And so just so that people are aware. So, um I think it, what gets, um, confused on this bill is that this is not an anti-tech bill. So, uh, this, this really just talks. about the personal devices that students may bring to school and so I encourage our school districts to continue to implement technology appropriately into their classroom when needed, um, you know, tablets, uh, Chromebooks, um, etc. uh, we just wanna make sure it's not the students aren't bringing their individual items um into the classroom and so that's where the notifications really are get out of control and, and the usage get out of control as far as your second question, it's started the end of the day. And so we want students to have the ability to communicate about rides home and hey mom and dad, I'm heading to work this time, uh, the, the practices and games, those are typically after school time and so there's still the ability to use your devices at that point. Purpose and fault you're recognized for a question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I've got probably a couple questions for you, but I'll start with, um, I'll, I'll go off of what Representative Andrews said. What about Pepperelli's homecoming, field trips, things such as that, that would be between that 8 and 3 mark. Will they be allowed to use their phones during those times if the principal of the building sees the need for them to be able to take pictures with their friends and so forth and so on with those type of activities, so anything in time in the time of start to end would be prohibited. There are exceptions, right, that, that can be used according to the bill, but anything inside. That timeline would be in scope to be prohibited outside, you know, when, if you're traveling, um, your field trips that are outside of of school day, that, that's different field trips are within that 8 to 3, just so you know, that's why I'm asking, Mom, we're getting back on the bus, Mom, we're headed home. Those things will not be able to be. I might have an issue with that, but my other, I just want to kind of make a statement on something that you did bring up, because I think all kids matter. I don't think it matters if they go to a private school, whether they go to a public school open charter. I don't think it matters, um. Whenever it comes to the use of cell phones. I understood what you were saying. You didn't think it was in, within our scope to be able to say, don't use them, uh, for a private school to say don't use them. But from what I've heard. Most Or mainly all private schools already do this. Would you agree with that statement or would you not agree with that statement? I would agree with that statement when we were uh working and trying to structure this, this bill, the private school, uh, issue came up. So I started contacting either people that have students in private schools or ones that I'm familiar with. And all of them were already had this policy had been in place for years and I've had the question as well, Why aren't we including private schools. Through the information that I have received as, as to what private school policy is already. If there had been an issue, Where that wasn't the case. It would be in the bill. That's not the case. They're ahead of the curve with regard to the public schools. Now we're trying to catch up and do replicate some of the things that they're doing and possibly that's maybe that's part of the reason, uh, they have some of the success that they do. So, I, I don't believe there's any reason for us to Overstep our bounds and try to dictate to a private entity what their policy needs to be. You know, we did say it was a safe and, uh, safety and a health issue, but like I said, I've looked into this and I didn't see that that was the issue at all. And I, I didn't see any reason to include it in the bill. Thank you. I will say though, a lot of kids want to remember their memories of that pepper alley, of that homecoming, of that field trip, that really kind of bothers me that we're now saying that they can't, because I know my kids have photos from every pepper alley they were ever in, and they cheered, all of them did. Or every, uh, field trip they were ever on, they took pictures at the field trip so they would remember. So I, that. And it's minute. And I understand that in the scope of things, that's my. But I also don't want to strip them of those memories. Thank you Or some Andrew Eureka for a question. Thank you, Mr. Chair Um, And Representative Bru called me a boomer yesterday when I said this, but. Maybe the younger ones committee. I was in high school in year 11, senior year was a mere 11 years ago and when I was in high school. We weren't allowed to have phones out if, if we saw teacher saw it. They sent the office, parent had to come pick it up, and that that was the policy that. Um, I think junior senior year they allowed us to have him out at lunch, but at the same time you had teachers who are more lax than others, you know, my teacher. She didn't care if he had found out. English teacher Mm, she dra you up. What does, does this bill have any teeth to the teachers who are gonna, you know, be rebellious and have more, be more relaxed so we don't, we don't care if those people on rock do you, you have your phones out. You know, what about those lax teachers? So at, at the end of the bill, uh, you'll see. Uh, what this does first, the policies have to be sent to the Department of Education for review, but also you'll see a phrasing that um let me get it correct here. Um, it's The citation of accreditation review and so if there's, there's been reported issues where that's, that's happening and then school districts have a citation for review on their, their accreditation. Representative Brown, you recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair. um, Senator Des, um, I may not be seeing it, but in section 3, you define emergency. But I don't see any. Other reference to emergency within the text. Was there supposed to be an exemption for emergencies? Yes, give me one second. I'll, I'll find that here. It does talk about it one second here. Find it. I didn't want to ask this question because I was sure I was just missing it, but. I, I've looked through several times. Yeah. Pardon 3 Syria Exempt exempt the possession or use of a personal electronic device during an emergency. Thank you. Absolutely. OK, thank you. And then, and then describing what an emergency is, is above that. Well, so if If, if If they don't have their phone with them, how can they use it in an emergency? I know I know I've visited one of the private schools that uses those. Little pockets. I, I can't remember, do they carry them around with them or this is what's great is each school district gets to decide what's best for them. And so if that means they want to have a in classroom cubby system. Uh then that, then that would be a situation or if it's in their backpack and off, that's that's their discussion there, we're gonna let the school district decide what's best and they're going to be able to review these, these exemptions and these exceptions and these emergencies to find out what works exactly best for them. Thank you. Representative Duke, you recognized. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I want to thank you both for bringing this bill. I'm a co-sponsor on it. I have been on this train, um. Since before 2017, our school district in Gravitt had looked at that and had tried many different ways to do it, and it is a challenge. And so I I am very much supportive of this for all the reasons that you listed and I could go into more, but I'm not going to do that to everybody. I do have a question because Representative Vau brought something to mind that I had not thought of, and that's one of the beautiful things about how bills work and government works in the discussion works is we sometimes trigger other people's, um, they think it's something that we didn't think of, and it, it, her point, which I know a lot of people seems Minimal And in comparison to the dangers, it probably is, but her point about not having any kind of exemption there for pep rallies and homecoming parades and things like that. I can't speak. I didn't go to a big school. I went to a small school, we still have homecoming parades. We still have, um, you know, the pep rallies and all of those pieces and That is, that does bother me just a little bit because I do think. I mean, we lugged, we loved cameras, date myself, but we loved cameras and we loved video cameras to those things, right? But it, it is a nice piece when my kids went through. I wasn't always able to be at those events. I wasn't, and so they would take a snapshot sometimes or one of their friends would take a picture and send it to me or send and lots of parents fall in those categories where they can't be at those. And so, I, I, I do think sometimes we, I think if we don't fix that now, I think we'll be fixing it in 2 years because that is gonna be something that people are gonna realize is an unintended consequence that wasn't a bad thing, but is an important piece of their kid's life and their school life that they're gonna want, so I would hope, and I know sometimes it's a big ask, but I would hope maybe you guys would entertain doing something to allow for that, so that in those circumstances, not lunch, I'm not, I'm on board with all of that, but when they there's a special event like that at school, that they're able to utilize their phones and take some pictures and do some things like that. So I don't know if you would consider that or not, and I would ask that you would consider that. I don't know how to make that a question. This is a this is a great discussion point, and I, I think it is and a couple, couple of responses from myself is first in the bill, uh, on line 3, page 3 line 3. It does outline on school property. And so, so if there are those events that are off school property, a field trip or whatnot, that, that potentially could be an exception that that could be outlined, um, uh, you know, a, a parade in town, right? That may be at the middle of the day where schools let out or something, um, that could be a situation there, um, but I also wanna, wanna echo to that. We've all described the, yeah, that's just, it's kind of thing we, we would miss. Yeah, we, we might miss that. But what we won't miss is increasing rates of anxiety and depression and abuse and bullying and things that we need to see. And I'll, I'll tell a personal example for myself. There's not many times where I'm away from my cell phone, just like all of us. Right, adults. But I had the privilege to get to go to the masters a few years back, and they have a very strict cell phone policy. And this is an amazing, if you've never been, if you're not a golf fan, I'll try to describe it quickly. It is like the premium most. prestigious golf course in the country. Maybe the world And they make adults check in your cell phone. And they're very strict about it. And I hated it because I wanted to capture those moments. I'm probably never gonna get to go again. And I want as a fan, I want the best golfers in the world. I wanted to be able to capture. I want to get selfies with Tiger Woods. I wanted to be a part of that. But you know what's amazing, looking back, Is those memories that I had. At that event are etched into my mind. It can't be taken away. Right? And so I would, I'd also make a similar argument that for our students, for these core memories, these core times. That It's kind of light through a picture. We want them experiencing it. In person to the fullest. I think that's what we've been missing. We've been missing. We, we've had a portion. Of the, of the memory. We've had it through a lens. We've had it with something in front of us. We've missed it engaging in the fullness and the beauty of what that looks like. And so I understand this, this bill is not perfect. No bill is. And I understand when we're dealing with this, there's gonna be exceptions and issues. There's gonna be conveniences lost because of this. But I promise you it's worth it. It's worth it for the fullness and the beauty of what we're trying to do and what we're charged to do in this atmosphere and environment. So that would be, that would be my request is that we think through it about Not about missing a picture. But missing a fullness of experience. Well, follow up, please. And I, I appreciate that, um, and I still, like I said, some of these bills. This is a different one for me. The good significantly outweighs this concern I have. But I do think it is relevant. Most of these do not occur off campus. Your kids come out, they are at the campus, the parade go by, the obviously the homecoming events happen on campus. And I realized that they may. I get your point with the masters. I'm very, my kid didn't get a cell phone, my youngest, until I think it was 10th grade and very, very limited. I want to live and embrace the moment. Sometimes those are for the parents or for the grandparents because I'm sure we can all think of moments that we don't have those captured again, it's not gonna keep me from supporting the bill. It's not going to keep me from, um, I'm, I'm passionate about needing to do this, but it is something that I think. It is a bit of imperfection on it and I'm sure it's complete oversight. I didn't think about it until she said it, and I've been on this train for a long time, but I do think it. The good outweighs the bad for me. That's a very small thing, but I, I would like to have seen that address. Description maybury, you're recognized. Thank you, Senator Dees. You know, we've had a conversation about this, so I don't think I, I'm taking anything that I'm saying by a surprise to you, um, back in 2019, I actually sat in, in your seat or John Eubank's seat, um, talking about this, um, and, and actually had the phone in my hand and saying, you know, to this education committee we have students who have the power in their hand, you know, so I, I'm in agreement with, with the whole idea that you're talking about here. But there are also, because I've raised kids in this generation, my youngest of 4 daughters just graduated last year, so this is the, the time period that that my family has gone through in the in the school system. And I I have concern that we are also Not only are we talking about cell phones, but I'd like to point out that we're talking about digital cameras and digital video and audio recorders and tablets and notebooks and laptop computers and I'd like to think that every school district out there has all of these tools. To allow our students to use a school sponsored device, but that's not always the case. There may not be enough, and I'm concerned, like, a lot of teachers, they get, they get really clever with how to engage students in, in projects and they don't always just say write a, write a book report on this. They come up with different ideas and they give you, you know, maybe it's a, a, a picture collage or maybe it's a video or something like that and So when we're not allowed, if the school doesn't have that digital camera to borrow, you can't bring your own onto campus, it's gonna make it harder to get those projects done. My daughter competed in a district competition for FBLA and she used her cell phone to interview one of the coaches and several of the teachers during the school day and in various times, um, for this project that that she competed, it's an educational purpose. Um, so, so my, my request is, can there be an amendment? I, I even sent some wording in. It doesn't even have to be this exact wording, but, um, in a situation where an educational objective cannot be reasonably achieved using a public school district owned device. The school district may in writing approve a short-term usage agreement with the teacher and student so that everybody's on board. We know that on this particular day, this student's going to bring in this digital camera because they're doing it for this. They could even have a policy that it has to stay in a teacher's classroom or something. Can we, can we carve out an exception for these, these educational purposes. Um, great, great question. Um, I think, as I said earlier, there's gonna be some inconveniences as we, as we think about this differently. And I don't think the answer is to make more exceptions to make more devices, uh, in the student's hands. I think the, I think the answer is that we think about how we do things differently. Um, in your examples, those projects can be done. At 3:30 whenever the bell's done, they can be done at home with their devices. Uh, we can also say that you can bring you the, the school district can find the technology for them to use and if you say that's too much of an expense, well, I would disagree. Because too much of an expense is allowing our students to be harmed by all these devices that we continue to bring. You know, we, we need more funding and, and I promise you it's, it's cheaper to buy a camera. Than it is to repair the mines that are being damaged, repair the, the drama that's been happened. The, the, the drug deals that are going on because text messages, meet me in the bathroom, the bullying, the cyberbullying. That's the expense. You're worried about the expense of a digital recording device for a classroom. Let's go make that and let's make sacrifices there. Let's not continue to find more exceptions to put devices into our kids' hands. That would be my argument. Well, to say that everything has to be done after 3:30 when you have kids who are involved in lots of extracurricular activities and they have homework and other classes, and they needed, I mean, in this particular example that I said, it was a, a teacher that they were interviewing in specific faculty that's there, they have to do it during the school day. And, you know, now they would not be able to necessarily do that. That's not true. So you just use your own, your own devices from the classroom. You're trying to find more reasons to put devices and it's hands and we just outlined the statistics that show that's the issue. And I understand there may be a minor inconvenience. There's gonna be. We're gonna do things different. Right, and it's exactly what we see, uh, in a lot of things we do here, we have to think about things differently. I I understand you didn't want to think about things differently in the Learns Act, and that's OK, but we're seeing ramifications there and so we've got to make sure that we move in that direction. OK Um, let me, if I can ask another question Um, so then my other concern was just the, the term and, and maybe you can just help me, help me, uh, walk through this, but, but the term actually says restrict the possession. Of a personal electronic device during the school day and, and help me because And, and maybe I just need a better definition for restrict, but the word possession, when I think of that, I think, you know, if someone has a, a gun and they have it in their backpack. Um, or pot or, um, cigarettes or something, and it's in their backpack. That's, that's possession. And I, I wanna make it really clear. Your intention, as you said, and I'm so very thankful that it's OK to be in a backpack. It's OK to be, um, maybe at a shoe tree type thing when you walk in the door. I mean, as long as it's not, they're not using it, and I, and I, I think that's all wonderful, but, um, I guess I'm, I'm trying to find out if we could get another. definition there, or, um, again, I'm just throwing out some words, uh, that I think would mean the same thing, require students to store personal electronic devices and personal electronic accessories in lockers, backpacks, pouches, or other locations that a public school district may specify in the policy during the school day that to me makes it just a little bit more clear. You know, frankly, we tried to allow for the school districts to be able to have some leeway on how they wanted to structure this. Uh, I think the intention is perfectly clear as what we're trying to do restrict means that they're not going to have access to it where they have readily get it out of their pocket. They're not gonna be able to have it out and be able to use it. How the school district chooses to do that is entirely up to them. I guess I just say if it's in their backpack and it's a gun, they're in possession of it. So I'm just trying to make sure that we're, we're using the terminology correctly so that there isn't a question as to whether that's a possession or not. Once again, the school district's going to be able to determine what they think is the best way to do that. If they want to allow a backpack, and it turns out that doesn't work. I suspect they're probably going to change their policy, but that was an example put forth. I, I don't know if you're understanding what I'm saying, but um. I, I just want to be consistent because if they have drugs in their backpack, that's considered possession. That's a crime. Well This is going to be law, and I just want to make sure that we're, we're consistent with what we're saying, that's all. Again, I love this idea. I want to vote for this, but I want to make sure that the words that we have in here that there aren't unintended consequences, so that we're not back here, you know, 2 years later, just trying to, to clean it up. I, I, I praise you for, for what you're trying to do and, and taking this on. I, I was saying this quite a few years ago. As a matter of fact, Hope's daddy and I used to sit right here in an Education Committee and talk about it. You know, cell phones and and all that. I, I agree. Um, I just think that there might A, a few, um, small little amendments in here would, would help me feel a whole lot better and, and I think would make a lot of people just, OK, we get it, so thank you. Thank you. Representative Painter, you're recognized for a question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. um, just looking over the different devices, does this affect Polaroid cameras? Or throwaways, disposable, I'm sorry. Uh, it doesn't appear that that would be um in scope of this because they're not digital, they're not able to connect it to um the internet, so I don't think those would be outlawed. All right, thank you. You found something that you and Representative Eubanks, uh, both have, so that's good. Are there additional questions by members? Represent MacGruder, you recognize. Ah, love the spirit of the bill. I appreciate you bringing it uh to us, uh. Do not, uh, like the fact that Representative Eubanks is involved in this. You didn't communicate with me at all in regards to the bill. But uh my question. It's in regards to lunch. We, we have some schools that have lunch off campus, and I may have missed this because I was out of the meeting, uh, are they allowed if they're off campus for lunch to have their cell phone out cause I know it says bill to bill. Um Uh, we can get clarity on that, but I believe if it's off property and it's approved if students are approved to be off property, then I, I believe you would be allowed to. The additional questions by members see no additional questions. There is no one signed up to speak for or against. We didn't like anyone like to speak for or against the bill. See none Eubanks, would you like to close for your bill? Yes, it would, you know, I think this is something that is overdue. I think we've seen the negative impact that cell phones and devices have had on our youth and, uh, If anything, I think it's imperative that if we do anything that we're we're trying, we have to prepare our young people for adulthood and in order to do that, they have to be educated and they have to be able to socialize with people, uh, all too often I see people that can't even look, look you in the eye and have a conversation. And so, uh, Is it a perfect bill? No. But I've been in, I've been down here for a few years, and some say too many, but I've found that when we passed legislation in the course of the time after we pass it, we find out that there's things that need to be changed, and that's why we come back every 2 years and we're we're able to make those adjustments as needed because we get additional information and I hope we're all are willing to know when, OK, we made a mistake here. It's time to change it. And so with that, I'd appreciate. a good boat. Representative Eubanks is closed for his bill. I'd like to make a motion to do pass. Is there any discussion on the motion? Representative Barker, you recognize. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to go on the record and say, like so many have said, I didn't really have a question, but just want to say thank you for bringing this, um, it's been more than a mere 11 years since I was in high school, but it was a mere 4 years that I was a high school educator and I can't tell you the number of days that it was frustrating to be the English teacher who would write you up, but be surrounded with others who had more lenient policies, even though your school policy said one thing, and for that, thank you, but also on behalf of my grandchildren and children coming up. I thank you for putting their education above their conveniences and I like the way that you said it's not against technology. Uh, I had to use technology in the classroom all the time, but every time we were allowed to use a cell phone in that manner. No matter how much I tried to police it. You can't stop them texting each other and using it and I think one thing we've kind of missed here is the parameters that are already on those educational technology tools. The places they can't go. The things they can't do on it and so um just wanted to say thank you and that's why I'll be voting yes. Thank you, Representative Barker. Any additional discussion on the motion? Represent you our rep sorry represent Mayberry if you recognized. Thank you. I, I'm just going to remind, so. Representative Eubanks just said, You know, we come back in 2 years and fix something. We're right here and we've just talked about some things that I think are legitimate concerns, we agree. And there might just be a few little amendments that that could prevent us from having to come back two years from now and so until some of those are things are are fixed or addressed or considered. I I have to be a no, even though I agree with this. I really, really do. Representative Duke, you recognized for discussion. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I'll make it quick. Um, I raised kids as maybe some of y'all did, on both ends of the spectrum when technology first started coming out with phones, then no smart, then smartphones and my youngest one, we made the decision, um, no, no phone, period. And even when he got it, I think in 10th grade, there was no internet connection for him to have on that, um, and it was one of the best decisions we made, and he would agree with that now, because it wasn't so he didn't like it so much there for a while because he was one of the few. Although a lot of people who raised older kids and then had a younger one that I raised kids with, we're all on the same page and we all do that together and it is I do truly believe it's what's best for kids. I think that there may be some tweaks someday, but this is Without a doubt in my mind, what is best to protect our kids and make them better contributing citizens and to keep them safe. So thank you both, genuinely, thank you both and from the folks at District 12, I feel confident most of them feel the same way. Thank you for bringing this. Representative Painter, you're recognized for discussion. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, I do honestly, I'll, I'll joking aside, I do want to say thank you very much, uh, to Representative Hugh Banks and Senator Dees uh for this bill. Um, I want to say also thank you for the conversations that you two have had with me on some of the concerns that the initial part of this bill. And, and I really do think it's, and as a father of a young six year old girl that can watch the addictions of phones. Um, I think this is great. There's some maybe some stuff later down the road that we'll have to fix. That's what we normally do 90% of the time what we're doing down here is a mending stuff. So, but overall, I think this is a good bill and I'm going to go on record and I will be voting yes. Representative Cozar, you're recognized for discussion. I also think this is a great bill. I think it's a great motion of due pass, and I will be voting for it. Representative Andrews you recognize. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, deck everyone else, of course we're voting yes on this, um. I, I also, I think it's sad to see the degradation of society of why we need this of the fact that people can't socialize, they can't interact with everyone else and uh you're right, we have a mental health crisis in this country that needs to be addressed and hopefully this bill is a first step to fixing that because. You know, Again, so, you know, back in the day, you know. parents took phones away and said you parents realize you know you've had enough of this. Let's take it away and so if parents could parent again and take phones away and maybe whoop their butts more, we could probably get a lot, but you know. Do a lot better, so thank you. Andrews see no additional discussion. Oh, I'm sorry, fault. I apologize. Thank you. I do appreciate the bill. I work in the mental health field. We have a mental health working group. It is something that I go to schools, I talk to kids all the time. I tell them this is the best and worst thing that ever happened to society. It's the best because we can get our hands on information very quickly, but it's the worst because we no longer had to know how to communicate with each other. I mean, I've seen my own kids sit in the same room and text each other rather than just talk out loud to each other. I do agree there's a few things I would like to see changed in the bill to make it a better bill. Uh, but I do bel, and I want to thank you for clarifying because a lot of questions that came to me was, why aren't private schools listed, and I want to thank you for clarifying that private schools have been doing this for years. We're just trying to catch up to what they've been doing, and I appreciate that, um. I'll be voting yes, even though I think we could have made this better if we'd have made a couple of adjustments. Um, I think, I just think there's no reason to go back in 2 years and fix it. I'm kind of like represented Mayberry in that arena and the fact that we're here, we still have several weeks that we could make it an absolute. Great Bill. Right now it's a good bill, but I think it could have been a better bill and I appreciate that. Thank you, sir. Seeing no additional discussion, all in favor say aye. All opposed. Congratulations. Congratulations you Basent days your bill is passed. See no further business in front of the committee. House Education is adjourned.