Education Committee- House
Video
Transcript
1 document
Bills discussed (47)
| Bill | Title | Sponsor | Status |
|---|---|---|---|
|
HB1903
Act 911
· 5 mentions in chapter, transcript
Matched: “HB1903 Walker TO AMEND PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE TO PROVIDE…”
|
TO AMEND PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE TO PROVIDE SCHOOL DISTRICTS WITH FLEXIBILITY REGARDING ALTERNATIVE … | Walker | Notification that HB1903 is now Act 911 |
|
HB1825
· 4 mentions in chapter, agenda, transcript
Matched: “HB1825 Wooldridge TO ALLOW A PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL TO REQUIRE AN ENRO…”
|
TO ALLOW A PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL TO REQUIRE AN ENROLLED STUDENT TO EARN ONE UNIT … | Wooldridge | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
HB1020
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…SCHOOL IN ORDER TO BE ELIGIBLE TO ENROLL IN A HOME SCHOOL. HB1020 A. Collins TO REPEAL THE ARKANSAS CHILDREN'S EDUCATIONAL FR…”
|
TO REPEAL THE ARKANSAS CHILDREN'S EDUCATIONAL FREEDOM ACCOUNT PROGRAM; TO CREATE A NEW EDUCATION FUNDING … | A. Collins | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1023
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…PUBLIC SCHOOLS AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS. HB1023 A. Collins TO AMEND THE STATE TEACHER EDUCATION PROGRAM; AN…”
|
TO AMEND THE STATE TEACHER EDUCATION PROGRAM; AND TO AMEND THE ELIGIBILITY REQUIREMENTS FOR LOAN … | A. Collins | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1025
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…EPAYMENT AMOUNTS UNDER THE STATE TEACHER EDUCATION PROGRAM. HB1025 McGruder TO CREATE THE TEACHER FAIR DISMISSAL ACT OF 2025.…”
|
TO CREATE THE TEACHER FAIR DISMISSAL ACT OF 2025. | McGruder | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1027
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…LIC CHARTER SCHOOLS. DEFERRED BILLS Number Sponsor Subtitle HB1027 D. Garner TO CREATE THE BRIGHTER START ACT OF 2025; AND TO…”
|
TO CREATE THE BRIGHTER START ACT OF 2025; AND TO REQUIRE THE TREASURER OF STATE … | D. Garner | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1030
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1030 T. Shephard TO REQUIRE A SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICER OR LAW ENF…”
|
TO REQUIRE A SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICER OR LAW ENFORCEMENT PERSONNEL TO OBTAIN CERTIFICATION IN YOUTH … | T. Shephard | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1031
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…OUNSELOR TO RECEIVE YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH FIRST AID TRAINING. HB1031 D. Garner TO CREATE THE ARKANSAS HEALTHY LIFESTYLE EDUCATIO…”
|
TO CREATE THE ARKANSAS HEALTHY LIFESTYLE EDUCATION ACT OF 2025; AND TO ENSURE THE HEALTH … | D. Garner | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1081
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…Irvin TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS FINANCIAL EDUCATION COMMISSION. HB1081 B. McKenzie TO REPEAL ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR THE DEVELOPMEN…”
|
TO REPEAL ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR THE DEVELOPMENT AND ADMINISTRATION OF PROFESSIONAL LEARNING COMMUNITIES. | B. McKenzie | WITHDRAWN BY AUTHOR |
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HB1139
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1139 B. McKenzie TO CREATE THE RELEASED TIME EDUCATION ACT.”
|
TO CREATE THE RELEASED TIME EDUCATION ACT. | B. McKenzie | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
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HB1144
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…McGruder TO CREATE THE TEACHER FAIR DISMISSAL ACT OF 2025. HB1144 Wooten TO REQUIRE A PARTICIPATING SCHOOL UNDER THE ARKANSAS…”
|
TO REQUIRE A PARTICIPATING SCHOOL UNDER THE ARKANSAS CHILDREN'S EDUCATIONAL FREEDOM ACCOUNT PROGRAM TO COMPLY … | Wooten | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1197
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1197 S. Meeks TO PROHIBIT SCHEDULING, HOSTING, OR REQUIRING AN O…”
|
TO PROHIBIT SCHEDULING, HOSTING, OR REQUIRING AN OUTDOOR PRACTICE, SCRIMMAGE, GAME, OR ACTIVITY FOR AN … | S. Meeks | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1239
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…IC SCHOOLS ADDRESSES CERTAIN HEALTH ISSUES FACING STUDENTS. HB1239 A. Collins TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003;…”
|
TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003; AND TO ADD AN ADDITIONAL CATEGORY … | A. Collins | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1482
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1482 Gramlich TO CREATE AN EXCEPTION TO THE SCHOOL ATTENDANCE RE…”
|
TO CREATE AN EXCEPTION TO THE SCHOOL ATTENDANCE REQUIREMENTS FOR A STUDENT WHO TAKES A … | Gramlich | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1490
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…TIONAL EDUCATION CATEGORY OF FUNDING FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION. HB1490 Wardlaw TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A PUBLIC SCHOOL STUD…”
|
TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A PUBLIC SCHOOL STUDENT RETURN TEMPORARILY ISSUED ITEMS, RESOURCES, MATERIALS, … | Wardlaw | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1492
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1492 Gramlich TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND OPEN-EN…”
|
TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL TO IMPLEMENT A MOBILE … | Gramlich | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
HB1528
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1528 McGruder TO REQUIRE A REPORT CARD TO INCLUDE A STUDENT'S CU…”
|
TO REQUIRE A REPORT CARD TO INCLUDE A STUDENT'S CURRENT READING GRADE LEVEL. | McGruder | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1539
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1539 A. Collins TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003;…”
|
TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003; AND TO ADD AN ADDITIONAL EDUCATION … | A. Collins | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1541
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…THE HOURS WHEN AN EXCESSIVE HEAT WARNING HAS BEEN DECLARED. HB1541 Wooten TO REQUIRE A PRIVATE SCHOOL THAT ACCEPTS STATE FUNDI…”
|
TO REQUIRE A PRIVATE SCHOOL THAT ACCEPTS STATE FUNDING OF ANY TYPE TO PROVIDE TRANSPORTATION … | Wooten | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
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HB1542
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1542 Wooten TO REQUIRE PRIVATE SCHOOLS TO ADMINISTER AN ANNUAL S…”
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TO REQUIRE PRIVATE SCHOOLS TO ADMINISTER AN ANNUAL STATEWIDE STUDENT ASSESSMENT; AND TO REQUIRE PRIVATE … | Wooten | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1709
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1709 Steele TO AMEND THE HUMAN SERVICES WORKERS IN THE SCHOOLS P…”
|
TO AMEND THE HUMAN SERVICES WORKERS IN THE SCHOOLS PROGRAM; AND TO INCLUDE MENTAL HEALTH … | Steele | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1727
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…THE SCHOOLS PROGRAM. REGULAR AGENDA Number Sponsor Subtitle HB1727 L. Johnson TO AMEND THE FUNDING AVAILABLE TO ADULT EDUCATIO…”
|
TO AMEND THE FUNDING AVAILABLE TO ADULT EDUCATION CHARTER SCHOOLS. | L. Johnson | WITHDRAWN BY AUTHOR |
|
HB1755
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1755 T. Shephard TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL TO PARTICIPATE IN…”
|
TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL TO PARTICIPATE IN THE ARKANSAS PREVENTION NEEDS ASSESSMENT SURVEY. | T. Shephard | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1761
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…RENTS TO BRING THEIR INFANTS SIX MONTHS OR YOUNGER TO WORK. HB1761 D. Garner TO INCREASE FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY THROUGH THE EST…”
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TO INCREASE FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY THROUGH THE ESTABLISHMENT OF INCOME LIMITS FOR STUDENTS ELIGIBLE FOR EDUCATIONAL … | D. Garner | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1924
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1924 Puryear TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE STATE BOARD OF E…”
|
TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION ESTABLISH RULES REGARDING THE IMPLEMENTATION … | Puryear | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1933
Act 912
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…TH FLEXIBILITY REGARDING ALTERNATIVE LEARNING ENVIRONMENTS. HB1933 McCollum TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOAR…”
|
TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF DIRECTORS; AND TO CREATE A … | McCollum | Notification that HB1933 is now Act 912 |
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HB1940
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1940 Walker TO ESTABLISH THE REQUIREMENTS FOR A PUBLIC SCHOOL DI…”
|
TO ESTABLISH THE REQUIREMENTS FOR A PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT THAT INITIATES AND MAINTAINS A FOUR-DAY … | Walker | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1962
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…ULES REGARDING THE IMPLEMENTATION OF FOUR-DAY SCHOOL WEEKS. HB1962 Vaught TO PROHIBIT A SCHOOL FROM SERVING OR SELLING ULTRA-P…”
|
TO PROHIBIT A SCHOOL FROM SERVING OR SELLING ULTRA-PROCESSED FOOD ON THE SCHOOL CAMPUS DURING … | Vaught | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
HB1977
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1977 Bentley TO CREATE THE PROTECTING CHILDHOOD INNOCENCE IN LIB…”
|
TO CREATE THE PROTECTING CHILDHOOD INNOCENCE IN LIBRARIES ACT. | Bentley | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1990
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “HB1990 McAlindon TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING HIGHER EDUCATION.”
|
TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING HIGHER EDUCATION. | McAlindon | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
HB1999
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…TO STUDENTS. PENDING FISCAL IMPACT Number Sponsor Subtitle HB1999 D. Garner TO REQUIRE THE SECRETARY OF THE DEPARTMENT OF EDU…”
|
TO REQUIRE THE SECRETARY OF THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION TO PROVIDE INFORMATION REGARDING THE SUPPLEMENTAL … | D. Garner | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB2000
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…PLEMENTAL NUTRITION ASSISTANCE PROGRAM TO CERTAIN STUDENTS. HB2000 Wardlaw TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING EDUCATION SERVICE COOPE…”
|
TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING EDUCATION SERVICE COOPERATIVES, PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICTS, AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER … | Wardlaw | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
SB183
Act 724
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…AMEND THE MECHANISM BY WHICH SCHOOL NURSES ARE COMPENSATED. SB183 J. Dotson TO AMEND THE UNIVERSAL ACT ASSESSMENT PROGRAM ACT…”
|
TO AMEND THE UNIVERSAL ACT ASSESSMENT PROGRAM ACT; AND TO AMEND THE TYPES OF ASSESSMENTS … | J. Dotson | Notification that SB183 is now Act 724 |
|
SB352
Act 721
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…EEDOM ACCOUNTS IN THE 2025-2026 SCHOOL YEAR AND THEREAFTER. SB352 Stone TO PROHIBIT ANTISEMITISM IN PUBLIC ELEMENTARY AND SEC…”
|
TO PROHIBIT ANTISEMITISM IN PUBLIC ELEMENTARY AND SECONDARY SCHOOLS; AND TO PROHIBIT ANTISEMITISM IN STATE-SUPPORTED … | Stone | Notification that SB352 is now Act 721 |
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SB373
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “SB373 Irvin TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS FINANCIAL EDUCATION COMMISSION.”
|
TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS FINANCIAL EDUCATION COMMISSION. | Irvin | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
SB402
Act 725
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “SB402 C. Penzo TO PROHIBIT A PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND AN EDUCAT…”
|
TO PROHIBIT A PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND AN EDUCATIONAL SERVICE COOPERATIVE FROM REQUIRING OR TAKING … | C. Penzo | Notification that SB402 is now Act 725 |
|
SB425
Act 722
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…estrictions designating areas as 'Members and Staff Only'. SB425 J. English TO AMEND VARIOUS PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE…”
|
TO AMEND VARIOUS PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE CONCERNING ENHANCED TRANSPORTATION; AND TO DECLARE AN … | J. English | Notification that SB425 is now Act 722 |
|
SB450
Act 915
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “SB450 B. Davis TO REQUIRE THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION TO INCLUDE…”
|
TO REQUIRE THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION TO INCLUDE A HUMAN FETAL GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION … | B. Davis | Notification that SB450 is now Act 915 |
|
SB484
Act 726
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “SB484 Irvin TO ESTABLISH A PROCESS WHEREBY A VACANCY IS FILLED ON…”
|
TO ESTABLISH A PROCESS WHEREBY A VACANCY IS FILLED ON A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF … | Irvin | Notification that SB484 is now Act 726 |
|
SB504
Act 727
· 2 mentions in chapter, agenda
Matched: “SB504 Irvin TO ESTABLISH THE ARKANSAS RURAL PRECEPTORSHIP PROGRAM…”
|
TO ESTABLISH THE ARKANSAS RURAL PRECEPTORSHIP PROGRAM ACT. | Irvin | Notification that SB504 is now Act 727 |
|
SB547
Act 728
· 2 mentions in agenda, chapter
Matched: “…RNING ENHANCED TRANSPORTATION; AND TO DECLARE AN EMERGENCY. SB547 D. Sullivan TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A HOMESCHOOLED S…”
|
TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A HOMESCHOOLED STUDENT LIVE WITHIN A CERTAIN RADIUS OF A … | D. Sullivan | Notification that SB547 is now Act 728 |
|
HB1022
· 1 mention in chapter
Matched: “HB1022 A. Collins TO REPEAL PERFORMANCE-BASED INCENTIVE AWARDS FOR…”
|
TO REPEAL PERFORMANCE-BASED INCENTIVE AWARDS FOR PUBLIC SCHOOLS AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS. | A. Collins | Died in House Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1242
· 1 mention in chapter
Matched: “HB1242 J. Mayberry TO AMEND THE MECHANISM BY WHICH SCHOOL NURSES A…”
|
TO AMEND THE MECHANISM BY WHICH SCHOOL NURSES ARE COMPENSATED. | J. Mayberry | Died in Senate Committee at Sine Die adjournment. |
|
HB1710
· 1 mention in agenda
Matched: “AGENDA (Revised 4/8/25 @ 1:30PM) Removed HB1710 & HB1864 from Regular Agenda House Committee on Education T…”
|
TO PROHIBIT A SCHOOL FROM USING OR REFERENCING A PUBLIC SCHOOL RATING IN ANY ADVERTISING, … | Vaught | WITHDRAWN BY AUTHOR |
|
HB1747
· 1 mention in chapter
Matched: “HB1747 Vaught TO CREATE THE BABIES AT SCHOOL ACT; AND TO ALLOW SCH…”
|
TO CREATE THE BABIES AT SCHOOL ACT; AND TO ALLOW SCHOOLS TO PERMIT EMPLOYEES WHO … | Vaught | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
HB1864
· 1 mention in agenda
Matched: “AGENDA (Revised 4/8/25 @ 1:30PM) Removed HB1710 & HB1864 from Regular Agenda House Committee on Education Tuesday, A…”
|
TO AMEND PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE TO IMPROVE EFFICIENCY IN STUDENT INSTRUCTION; AND TO … | Andrews | Recommended for study in the Interim by the … |
|
SB559
Act 729
· 1 mention in chapter
Matched: “SB559 J. English TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS MILITARY CHILD SCHOOL TRAN…”
|
TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS MILITARY CHILD SCHOOL TRANSITIONS ACT OF 2021. | J. English | Notification that SB559 is now Act 729 |
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So as I have said a couple of times, the goal of us meeting this afternoon is to finish
out any house bills because when we look at the calendar, uh, the Finishing session and Senate calendar and all that, frankly, it's, it's gonna have to get out of this committee today if uh if it's gonna be heard in the process because at, at best today in committee tomorrow on the floor, Senate on Monday, Senate floor at some point next week, but we're done on Wednesday, so, uh, that's the goal here is to make sure that
House members have a chance to get their bills through should they want to do that. So first up, without objection, we're gonna move around on the agenda. We're gonna hear from
Representative Walker and This is House Bill 1903. Reson Walker, if you would please introduce yourself and you're recognized. Stephen Walker, House District 27,
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
0:52
if it's OK with the chair and committee, I'd like to bring Miss Alice Ford up here. What if it's not OK. She's like, that's fine with me. Miss Osport, if
you would please introduce yourself for the record, and you are recognized.
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
1:09
Courtney Sala for Department of Education. So we have a House Bill 1903, um, to me, it's a pretty straightforward bill we're just taking the requirement for our schools to do the alternative learning environment and changing it more to where it's a May, um, given schools the option that want to do it, um, it's, this bill is not going to impact any type of funding. I, I think the schools out there that are doing the alternative learning environment. If they do
it well, it is a great program for. for our school or for our students to really help fill in the gaps, but at the same time, I know whenever you require schools to do something, it's not always done to the best, so the ones that want to do it are the ones that are going to have a good program, so we don't need to be requiring schools to, to do it going forward. So this just gives um a little bit more to that local control at our school districts decide if this is a program that helps, if it is, they continue with it. They keep the funding, nothing changes there. And if Miss
Salifod wants to give anything further or she can just sit here and help answer questions I'll just answer questions. I think I think
Speaker 14
2:18
you addressed it perfectly. Are the questions from the committee? This is
1903. Represent McGruder, you're recognized for a question.
Chair
Unverified
2:34
Uh Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, thank you for the bill, but,
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
2:41
but I do have some concerns in regards
to, uh, what will happen with students who aren't disciplined and uh a school. In the ALD environment, do we, will we eliminate that or? What are the options for students who are, um, so first students should not be put
Speaker 26
2:57
in ALE for discipline reasons. That, that's not the purpose of an alternative learning environment. They might be put there in lieu of discipline. So if you have a student who's not being successful in the traditional classroom setting, they might be put in an alternative learning
environment, um, where they can get more targeted assistance, more, uh, direct instruction. They can get some wraparound services, mental health counseling, etc. um, which is great, and that's the antenna. it. Unfortunately, what we have seen sometimes is districts want to do different programs. So instead of pulling a student out of the classroom, they push in with those services, but because they're required to have an ALE. Sometimes they almost end up just putting students in there to fulfill that purpose, or because they have got, uh,
joined into a consortium with other school districts for an AOE and so they're just trying to make sure that they fill those seats. But this does not remove the responsibility of a school district to address student, uh, behaviors to provide them the support and services that they need to address behavior issues. This just gives them the flexibility and option to do it in the setting that they feel is most appropriate for the. student. OK, I have a follow up, Mr.
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
4:10
Chair. Uh I have a school that in my
district has just built a new alternative learning environment, uh, would that affect the
their funding or anything and we actually had a diamond award winner, uh, for the ALE, and she was presented here a couple weeks ago. Would that affect anything? No, not at all. They can still continue to have that program. The funding does not change. Nothing at all changes.
Speaker 26
4:30
OK. Thank you Mr. Chair. Other additional questions about the committee? See no additional questions. We do not have anyone sign up to speak
Speaker 33
4:36
for or against the bill. Would anyone like speak for or
against the bill, say none. Representative. Uh, Walker would like goreville. Just basically the way
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
4:54
I opened, um, this is just giving schools the option. It's not going to take anything away. It's not going to force anybody out funding stays in place, um, with that, I'm closed for the bill and make a motion to pass. Prison Walker is closed for his bill made a motion
due passes a discussion on that motion, so no discussion on say aye, all opposed. Congratulations reference Walker. You've passed your bill.
Next up we will hear uh HB 1825 representative Wooldridge. If you would please introduce yourself for the record, you're recognized. Thank
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
5:25
you, Mr. Chair. Thank you committee. Jeremy Wooldridge, District one. Courtney Sas
Speaker 40
5:29
for Department of Education. Do we have an amendment on this? Alright and grow, OK,
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
5:47
recognize. We, so we did adopt the amendment already, so do we need to go through that process again or is it adopted? No, you just adopt the bill is omitted. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you committee, and thank you for allowing me to present this again. I have visited with a couple of additional committee members, uh, and just wanted to put this back out in front of you one more time to answer any additional questions that you may have. I definitely don't want to belabor the point. I'll give a brief overview and then I'll allow the Department of Ed to have some additional comment towards um what we're trying to accomplish. This is a bill that's
constituent driven for me. This is a bill that comes out of the legislative district that I represent. I've had a lot of, um, my schools, teachers from my schools, administrators from my school asked me to make this, um, at least attempt, uh, one more time for you guys. So what I'm ultimately trying to accomplish. is making the computer science course um optional outside of the CTE pathway track. So what we're trying to do, if you'll remember the amendment that was presented and you all graciously adopted during the committee,
uh, required the, the computer science program to be embedded into the CTE pathways. It will be embedded into every CT pathway. It'll specifically, um, outline what that pathway is focused on, so it'll give a computer science class that I believe is better than just the generic class that's being offered right now as a graduation requirement. I think that it will reach students in a way that they are more apt to engage in the process. I think that they're more apt to
implement the process as they move forward, um, and I think that it will, it will be better suited in the long run in advance what we're trying to accomplish with the computer science, uh, graduation requirement. Right now, currently, and I know we had a lot of debate on IEPs 504s and other plans, um, there are students in Arkansas that because of this graduation requirement are not getting diplomas. They're getting certificates of completion, uh, that's what I'm trying to solve, that's what I'm trying to fix. I'm trying to give local control
back to school districts. I told you about, um, my two little boys, they're both in public school in Marmaduke, and I believe in my public school, that's why they're there. I believe that my school has the ability to decide what is best for my students, uh, and for my kids, and this allows them to have that option. It's not making computer science go away. It's just making it an option for those students that are not choosing a CTE pathway, and with that, I'll recognize the department for some additional comments.
Speaker 26
8:21
Thank you, Representative Wooldridge. Um, so I just wanted to kind of, now that I have data in front of me, address some of the questions that were asked yesterday, um, and I think not to speak for Representative Wooldridge, but to say that the, the purpose of his bill is to offer that flexibility and to not restrict certain students who may not be able to meet the requirement, but also it's about, um, the lack of teachers that are certified to teach in computer science and the difficulty that some school districts are having. Um, so we pulled the data on.
the number of teachers that are certified to teach computer science and the number that had to go through like a, a technical permit or some other alternative way to be able to teach it because they couldn't pass the praxis or because they had another licensure already and just added it on to an endorsement. Um, so there are 456 teachers who had it through a traditional pathway, um, there are over 1000 schools in our state. Not every school is able to hire or keep. A computer science teacher,
because of that, many of them are having to use a virtual option. So last year we had, um, 37,000 students take a computer science class. 4200 of those had to take it through a virtual option because their school district didn't offer it with a, with a teacher in place. We feel in support of of Representative Wooldridge that by embedding those computer science standards into those CTE courses where there are CTE certified teachers who can teach
those classes and where students are interested, that those students are going to get more out of that than they are taking a virtual computer science course that they're probably not interested in and probably taking only because it's a requirement. One of the other points that was brought up yesterday was students with disabilities or students the IEPs. Under federal law. Students with an IEP or a 504 plan cannot have different standards and receive a high
school diploma. We are monitored on that. We are checked on that every year and we have to sign assurances with the US Department of Education. If a student has an IEP and has severe cognitive disabilities, and we are limited to 1% of our student population, they can meet alternate standards and receive a certificate of completion. They might graduate from high school, but they cannot receive a high school diploma. So you heard yesterday about
some alternative standards that were developed for students with disabilities. Those standards do exist for that 1% of the most severely cognitive disabled, but of the 72,000 students with an IEP in school districts, only 1% can meet those, can use those alternative standards, and again, to receive a certificate of completion, not a high school diploma. So, while teachers and other IEP teams will try to make the accommodations then
modifications that they can, they still have to be held to the same standards as other students or school districts cannot issue them a diploma because it is a graduation requirement. I still don't feel truly as passionate as I am about special education, that that's the reason for this bill though. I just wanted you all to have accurate information. Well, I do feel is the reason for the bill is that flexibility for school districts. We talk in here a lot about we set minimum standards and then we let superintendents
make decisions that's best for their areas. If they are unable to find a certified computer science teacher. Why not let them be able to use the CTE courses to meet the interest. needs of their students. We do not feel that computer science is going to go away. It is extremely important. That's why we want to embed it into many of these other courses so that students know how to apply it. Computer science honestly is pretty much ingrained into most of it, uh, most courses these
days because everything is done online in a lot of classes, especially in high school, um. We feel like this bill just gives those districts the flexibility to meet the needs of their students and address the needs, um, of their areas in case they can't find a high school certified computer science high school teacher, um, and so we just want support Representative Wooldridge in granting that flexibility to school districts.
Chair
Unverified
12:49
Mr. Chairman, committee, you know, I, again, I come to you just asking you to consider this
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
12:59
bill. I know that we heard it, uh, we debated this topic, uh, at length the other day. I, I want to be forthcoming with you. I want to be transparent. I reached out to the opposition of this bill to allow them to to know that I was going to run it again today. I reached out to the lobbying firm that they've employed to try to protect the computer science graduation requirement to allow them to know that we're gonna run it again today. I'm not trying to hide anything. I'm really trying to do. what I believe in my heart is the right thing to do for Arkansas students. Uh, I'm happy to answer any questions. I know
the department will be happy to answer any questions and then we'll, uh, get out of the way for testimony. Represent Mayberry, you recognize her
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
13:41
question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I was not here for any of the debate before our conversation or whatever and um, you know, I've listened to several, um, folks come and talk about the importance of the computer science. I've, I've listened to you. I'm, I'm truly I'm in the middle here because I, I really see both sides, but, um, one point and I don't know if this was, um.
Something that was discussed before and so that's why I bring it up. I, I had my oldest daughter actually, um, was going off to college to become a business teacher in high school. That's what her goal was, and one of the classes that she would have been teaching would have been the computer science classes, the coding classes, and all that, and um once it was. noted that it was going to be a required class. She kind of took some steps back from wanting. To take that on as her major and
she's actually not even a teacher now. um, but the reason why is the reason why she was choosing business as the class she wanted to teach was she knew that the students who were choosing those classes were choosing to be in those classes and so you have kids who, who want to be there and want to learn that topic and you can, um, do a higher level of learning. She said she didn't want to do math and science and all that because the kids are Forced to do those things and
so, um, you have to simplify things and she wanted to have a deeper dive. Um, so I, I say all that to say is that is that what you're seeing? I, I, I mean, I, I, I believe in the computer science stuff. I think that we absolutely need to be on top of it, um, but are we seeing that there are some students who now are taking the classes and really have no interest in it, and it's making it harder for the teacher. to, um, To really dig deeper.
Has that been an experience that you're aware of or? Absolutely. So I've
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
15:42
heard from teachers in my district. I've heard from teachers out of my district and basically they're making the point that you're making my original bill and, and I'll just tell you too, education is not my forte. I didn't, uh, select to be on this committee because I don't pretend to understand all the things that there are to know about education, but my intentions are pure with this bill when I brought this bill originally, I met with Code.org. I met with the group that, that worked for them. Uh, I met with
the Department of Ed and I asked them truly help me make this a better. So I've made multiple amendments to this bill to get us to where we are today. I wasn't able to make an amendment that satisfied code.org because it's graduation requirement or nothing. There was no amendment that we could come to that would, that would allow us to be on common ground, but where we're at today is a better bill, and I thank them for that. So what we are doing and my attempt with this bill is again to embedded into the CTE programs when you find those students that are selecting by
choice different programs that they think they may want to make a career. you're out of a, a, a computer science program or class that's applied to them specific into specific to a field of interest, I think it's something that they can get excited about. I think it's something that they'll get engaged in and learn and implement and use for years to come, making every 9th grader take it right out of the gate. I say, I, my guess would be, and I don't know for a fact, but my guess would be you turn more folks away with that approach
than you do endure them. Into the field The school district
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
17:12
still have to offer. All these classes. Yes, so all school district, tell
Speaker 62
17:18
me what those are, yeah, so all school districts have to offer 3, CTE pathways, at
Speaker 26
17:25
a minimum. Most of your school districts do offer more. And so there will be computer science options available to students under our new course choice program. If
there's a course that a student wants to take specific to computer science at their school district doesn't offer and another school district does or a private provider does, then they can take it through course Choice and it's covered under, you know, the state funding. So we do not want to take computer science away from any student who's interested in that and he wants to take it and there will still be options available for them out there. Represent Painter, you recognize her question. Thank you, Mister Chair. Um,
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
18:07
The department or represents, you can probably answer this. How hard is it probably to recruit uh computer science folks to Marmaduke School or Viola. In some of the rural parts or even further into the delta. And don't you think maybe giving schools a flexibility that that would help them. Absolutely. I mean, it is extremely difficult when you get
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
18:29
into the rural parts of the state, and again, implementing this through the CTE program, every school is going to have the option to to have this class
talk through the virtual platform, so to me, to your point, I don't know if this is the point you're trying to make, and I've not thought about it till just now, but you increase consistency with the class because they're going to be learning that basically through the same platform, potentially, a school can still employ a teacher if they choose to, but flexibility. It gives them flex It gives the district flexibility, and they're still access out there. And I think that it's more finely tuned to something that can be beneficial down the road. So yes, thank you and Mr. Chair, motion at the proper time.
Chair
Unverified
19:11
Don't get ahead of yourself some meeks you recognized. Well, thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair, uh, and colleagues, I think
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
19:17
you all know where I stand on the technology stuff, and we appreciate your support. Thank you, sir. Um, we'll see, so I, I, I think you're getting me there, so maybe you can get me over the line here. Um, so, uh, uh, since the department's at the end of the table, I'm assuming you, you guys are supportive of this and, you know, I I support trying to get flexibility. And, and I think, uh, with the bills representative Mayberry just passed on the
digital literacy piece hopefully we'll finish getting that through. It'll give me a little bit more comfort here. Um, The, the question that I have is, or the concern that I have is the Current computer classes that are in place now that we're requiring every student to cover. Can you give us a brief synopsis of what we're actually requiring now. That if we take this out, that we will no longer be requiring.
What, what, what, what could we potentially be losing, I guess is maybe my maybe
Speaker 25
20:21
my concern. Might be exceeding my knowledge, but, um, there are, because again, all school districts have
Speaker 26
20:26
to offer 3, career technical education pathways and high wage, high demand areas. Again, most districts offer more than that, 3 is the minimum. Um, they, they can choose from, I mean, there's things like artificial intelligence and machine learning, I'm sorry to interrupt, but the,
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
20:44
the current computer class that we are requiring them to learn now. So the is for a course
Speaker 26
20:49
that meets the computer science credit. So there's, I think, you know, like 55 different courses that can meet that credit. What we're saying is by taking away this requirement as a graduation requirement is that if computer science is not something you want to take, you don't have to take it, but if you're interested, it will be embedded
into these career and technical education pathways. I cannot say for sure that if this is not a requirement that school districts will still offer the, the very basic level intro to computer science. Some of them may, some of them may not. But what we do see is that a large majority of students are taking that basic class because they're not interested because they don't want to take computer science. And so instead of requiring school districts to teach. That course for those students, if we embedded into the CTE courses then all of the students
who are interested can still take it through one of those
Chair
Unverified
21:49
pathways that is more applicable to what they intend to do later on. OK. And, and, and that's I
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
21:54
totally support that. So I guess, If we, if we were to implement it, is it possible that we will have students that will go through high school in this case, that would leave with no basic computer knowledge whatsoever because that, that's, that's the ultimately the concern and, you know, and I don't care if you're, you know, gonna be welding or if you're
gonna be farming, uh, you still, there's some of these skills are still You know, Of course, in today's culture, I found it difficult that anybody would even make it to middle school without having basic computer skills, but, um, So Representative, I'm gonna try to
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
22:33
answer that question the best I can and, and I can't speak specifically to what the course is called and there are teachers in the room that probably can, but I mean, I can tell you my kindergartner is testing on a computer right now. I'm in no way trying to take the use of
computers or anything around in that surrounding that out of schools, I think that they're gonna be various opportunities through elementary, junior high and high school where they're taking some business classes and other classes that are going to be computer-based classes, my, my concern with the computer science classes when you look at those 55, the basic or the entry level to that. So what I would assume would be the, the easiest class, uh, in that slate of classes has to do with specifically coding and some other things is my understanding
of that, and that's where I think that if this were a Microsoft Excel, Word, all of the things that, that people are using on a daily basis. That, that's not what this class is. They're gonna be doing those. classes and some other
business classes, uh, I believe during their school career. And, and I guess that's kind of the heart that
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
23:37
I was getting into is that that basic, uh, uh, class if it's, you know, focused on computer coding. Well, with AI the way it's coming, computer coding is actually starting to become obsolete because the AI will actually do the coding for
you. Um, you, you know, obviously if you're gonna make a career of it, you need to know how to do it, but the average person doesn't need
to have that skill set anymore, so, um, all right, I appreciate it
Speaker 26
24:02
thank you. Thank you, sir. Please. Well, and I just wanted to add if I could, I think that brings up a good point about that's a common misnomer about computer science courses and what they are actually teaching. It's not how to use a computer. It's not how to log into a computer. Um, you're talking about application development, programming, um, networking, cybersecurity,
robotics. So again, very important skills if you're interested in those, but the basic computing skills that students need to be successful in high school
Speaker 14
24:30
and beyond. Those are taught much earlier. Those are built into usually your middle school classes, not high school
Chair
Unverified
24:41
classes. Reson Gonzalezor you recognize? Yes, um, you were, um, Um You were mentioning the
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
24:46
pathways, the minimum. The minimum requirements for
high schools they have to have 3 specific, at least 3 pathways. Can you, uh, they can have more than that, but those would be the 3. OK. Can you describe what those are? Right. So a pathway is essentially like
Speaker 26
25:05
a series of 4, sometimes more courses that a student can take. Usually the goal being that at the end, they're certified or have, um, sort sort of license or or endorsement at the end of that. And so instead of, you know, kids just taking random courses,
um, if they choose one of these pathways that school districts have to make available, you know, whether it's in, if it was in database applications, there's a series of courses that they take, you know, freshman, sophomore junior senior year, so that at the end, they are certified in, in, and I am not a computer person, but it's certified in whatever that, that database application is. If it's digital electronics, if it's business intelligence, precision agriculture, so that by the end of there, they have a search
again a certificate certificate or some sort of technical permit or something that they can then use, um, when they go into the
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
26:07
workforce. A follow up Um, OK, so those are
the pathways are basically, um, pathways where students can earn um a certificate after um taking. For specific courses that fit that pathway, OK, so. Um
What? OK, so I've, I've got a, I'm not exactly sure how to ask this question, but I'm, I'm just thinking out loud here. I'm thinking K8 right now, so I was. What, what type of computer, um. Computer. Skills standards. Are we doing starting in kindergarten all the way through 8. Um, where that student now would
be ready for a more concentrated or maybe just a level one basic computer class. I'm, I'm just wondering because I'm thinking that there are some standards computer standards already being built in, kind of setting our students up preparing them for um. That next level, right? So, and, and unfortunately, I don't have those standards in front of me. I
Speaker 26
27:17
can get that for you, but, um, back to what we were saying earlier is that students are, are taught to use a computer or an electronic device as early as
kindergarten. Our, our state assessments are given through computers, um, you know, my son has had it and I've had issued by the school district since he was in kindergarten. They're taught how to use those and computer usability skills and standards are built into most of our courses, um, as go through, but I would have to get that information for you on the specifics. OK. And 11 more follow up, um, and
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
27:50
that is, um. I, I, I know that there are, it's been mentioned that there's 55 different.
Courses and but they're all different courses. Some of them are maybe the basic level, maybe intermediate, advanced, is that correct? That is correct. Yeah, there's even AP courses, and there's even AP courses, so. So how many of those and what type of classes would those be for the basic level one classes because I don't think those require any prerequisites, but just like a basic. Basic Level class that that would count towards that computer
Speaker 26
28:32
science. I'm just curious. Yeah, so some of them are computer science and mathematics, um, essentials of computer programming, Java 1 and Java 2, intro to object-oriented programming, computer science and software engineering, um, That one's an advanced one, intro to mobile application development, um, AP computer science principles. AP computer science IB.
Computer science internship, um, and then there's some other
Chair
Unverified
29:06
concurrent credit computer science. So those are kind of your basic level one courses the
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
29:19
have one more question. OK. Um, you mentioned, um. Representative Wooldridge about the. Teachers not having enough teachers. I know that there's been an, uh, there's been an increase in the number of
computer science teachers across the state, you know, when, when Arkansas had that computer science, um, graduation requirement. And so, um, So I'm just kind of wondering about that, you know. So, so some of the districts are still struggling to have. A teacher that could teach a computer science class. Is that That's my understanding, yes, ma'am. So then who would be teaching these pathway classes. It can be taught through the
virtual platform. OK, so then there wouldn't be a teacher. On at this so there there are schools that do not have. a live teacher to teach the classes face to face. That, I
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
30:20
mean, there are, I think currently some situations like that, but, you know, for rural Arkansas, that's not an uncommon thing. We have the cooperatives where we share teachers for lots of different things now that are specialty type classes, so I mean, I'll use Marmadic, for instance, there, there are some courses at Marmadic that are
offered that are taught in partnership with the cooperative um in that same teacher will go around to different schools, so I think that's not an uncommon thing and. rural parts of the state. I'm not certain that
that that you guys maybe faced that, but that's something we live with every day. OK thank you. Brown, you're recognized for question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. um. I have, I mean, I
Chair
Unverified
30:58
really like to be able to support your bill. We'd love to have you.
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
31:07
I have, I have some serious concerns, um. Just considering that Arkansas would be the only state in our area that would not be having a required. Um I think computer science classes that is the basic computer science class, the coding class, is that what it is? That's my understanding. Yeah, so there's an intro to computer
Chair
Unverified
31:30
science, that the primary focus is coding. So are there other options on that there are other options.
Do we have students failing these courses. I,
Speaker 26
31:45
I don't have that information, like, specifically, I've heard anecdotally from even other legislators, you know, calling, is there something that we can't do because particular students cannot pass, um, that are struggling and maybe it is because they have a learning disability, but again, unless they are that severely cognitively disabled, they can't have alternate standards. And so, Again, I don't have factual data
Chair
Unverified
32:11
on that. I just have anecdotal evidence and stories from other people. And
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
32:15
to address the the teacher shortage, so there are virtual options. Yes, so we can, they can. find instruction. Um, I I just don't want to hurt Arkansas. I don't want to hurt our. Opportunities Nor do I. I mean, and I know you don't, and. Um,
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
32:42
I guess I don't have any more questions. Thank you. back to recognize. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My my First, I guess question concern maybe is you mentioned earlier the shortage of computer science teachers. So In the bill it says uh identify career technical education courses that meet computer science credits, uh, a computer
science credit, so. Um Who's teaching those classes? I mean, what, what, and what,
what would be the, it could be taught through the virtual platform. Well, and so
Speaker 26
33:26
like, you don't have to have a computer science license to teach an engineering course. You might be an engineer and you know everything about how to address computer science standards, but if you are teaching a computer science course, you have to have a computer science license. If you're teaching a CTE course,
such as engineering that has computer science embedded into it, then you might be licensed in, in math or or licensed in some other area, um. And that's how it addresses the shortage area because you can have an ag certified teacher teaching an agriculture class with computer science standards, and they don't have
Chair
Unverified
34:02
to have that computer science license. OK so just to follow up on that, and
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
34:08
so, so it, uh, my screen went away from me. Thank computers, you can't trust these things.
So, uh, maybe you should have taken a course. I should have taken a course.
I just, there you go, um. So Make Ma, you know, I, I still kind of hung up, OK, who's, who's the king or or whoever, who's in charge says this meets the computer science credit requirement. So, um, we have,
Speaker 26
34:42
uh, we, people in our unit that will then get like groups of stakeholders, and we've talked
about this several times before. If something is required as a standard, um, people in our division will pull educators, teachers. lic ens ed in that area to come together and set the standards and then and work on how those are taught and embedded into courses and then they will designate which courses meet a requirement, um, and everything is kept in this super fancy database course catalog, and so when school districts are choosing what to teach, what to address, so that they have the
right, um, course numbering. They go and basically pick which courses are we going to offer and they have to meet the standards for that. course. And again, it's all tied
Chair
Unverified
35:29
back to the stakeholder groups that have made that determination. So I think I
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
35:34
get it now. So this is very similar, uh, or maybe identical actually to cause we were working uh with our community college to get Students to be able to take classes there that would then,
and then there was just I was just monitoring the situation. I wasn't ready to, but they were actually saying, OK, this could apply towards this high school credit in this, so that's it's kind of, it's the same process I'm assuming. So that's all right, OK, so, so, uh, now I understand how you're fixing the, the shortage. Thank you. Orson Walker, you recognize her question. Thank
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
36:15
you, Mr. Chair. Um, so Representative Brown kind of touched on this, so you
probably won't have the data to answer this question, but I'll just check anyway, um, in your opening statement, you mentioned that I kids with IEPs and 504s are having trouble meeting this requirement and that's why we're wanting to change it from shall to May, um, is there any chance that we collect data on how many kids specifically in the 504 IEP programs, um, that have not been able to meet this requirement. No. Again, we, we're restricted
Chair
Unverified
36:52
by a federal law that only 1% of students with disabilities can graduate off those alternate standards.
Speaker 26
36:57
And that's not with a diploma. And so, uh, if an individual student is not passing a class, we wouldn't know that. We would only know if a student is not graduating, um. But no, we, we
Chair
Unverified
37:07
don't have that information and we would not know. We just, we
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
37:12
would just know that a kid wasn't graduating, but we wouldn't know why. OK, thank you, Mr. Chair.
Chair
Unverified
37:22
Are there additional questions about the committee? McGregor, very
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
37:29
nice. So I'm getting a better understanding of this because I received uh several emails from uh computer science teachers who were not, not in support of this, uh, I think, I thank you for the work that you've done and, and actually clarifying it. So from my understanding, from K through 8. Uh, teachers still have computers in their rooms and students will still be engaging in computers because I go back to when they were
teaching. Typing on a computer in, in class. So we still will have that. OK. So Then you get to 9th grade and it's uh. CTE option. Uh, that's offered and it's more of the coding class, so you still have those computer science teachers embedded. OK. Yeah, school districts can still offer all the computer science courses that
Speaker 14
38:16
they want. But for school districts who are having trouble having, uh,
Speaker 26
38:24
getting a licensed teacher or honestly, who just don't have the student population interested in courses that require a computer science licensed teacher, they can offer that same computer science through the CTE classes again, because those require different licenses and still make sure that students have those opportunities. OK, so this does not eliminate the need for
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
38:43
computer science teachers. No. OK. And any school that that wants to double down and make
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
38:49
this a priority and have a computer science teacher
that's offering that to students more power to them. I'm, I trust our school districts to make the right decision. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Representative
Speaker 156
39:03
Brown, you reckon this for question. Well So
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
39:13
what if we, um, What if we made a graduation requirement, um. Or changed our graduation requirements to, uh, they may take English or they may take history.
You know, what if we, what if we didn't make that a
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
39:30
requirement? I think that's an excellent question, and Anthony and I actually had that conversation and uh I don't want
to put words in his mouth, but I think that, uh, he had told you all that he was going back to get a superintendent license and he make you get on board with that in the future, uh, depending on the curriculum at the school level, but I, I don't think that I don't, I understand why you're asking that question. Um, I think that again, we're gonna see value in our local school districts, as I told you
earlier, I know Representative Walker and others. Our teachers that are on this committee. I'm not a teacher. I, I have to trust my local district. um, there's a private school in my district and there are public schools in my district. I chose to put my boys in a public school because I know the administrators at that school, and I trust them to provide a quality education for my kids. I, I don't. I don't Proclaimed to have the knowledge to set curriculum, so I don't want to do that here.
I will say we've had a big focus on literacy and some other things that we've not done uh specifically a great job in in the past, um, and I think that having this computer science class as a requirement may take away some of the time where we could become more proficient in some of those standards that are required. Um, I think there's an argument to be had from multiple sides. And one other question, um,
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
40:50
like the you're saying that the alternative would be to take a CTE track and get your computer
science that way, but what if um what if you student upon graduation wants to enter college to study to be a teacher or, or, um. Or Art uh critic or, you know, what if they want the The college education that that doesn't take them into engineering or into the sciences, you know, they don't need, they don't need computer science. They don't need any kind of background. In that If you're asking me my personal
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
41:29
opinion, then I would say no if that's not something that they're interested in and to your point they choose a field that they would not use it then. No, I took Spanish and, and I don't, I don't utilize it. But I had to. I
Chair
Unverified
41:47
do um poquito. Thank you. Representative Garner recognized her question. You, Mr. Chair, and I know
Representative Denise Garner
Unverified
41:56
we've talked about this a little bit. My concern is for the kids.
Amen. Not for the, for the district so much. Sure. You know, I, I do think there are opportunities for multiple classes, multiple choices, virtual options, there's a lot of that. But Say what you will if you don't mandate. There are places that are not going to have the opportunity. There are kids that are not gonna have the opportunity and every one of these kids that we spent time with in robotics to every one of them agreed that they wouldn't have
Chosen the things that they've done if they hadn't had that opportunity. So what can we do to make sure that those kids have the opportunity, even if they don't know they want it necessarily that they have that opportunity and that potential that's my whether we're talking about AP or we're talking about computer science. It's easy if we don't mandate it to say. We don't, we can't do it, so we're not going to and so it's the kids that. That
Suffer because they don't have that opportunity to to learn if they to know whether they do or
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
43:16
don't. I completely understand where you're coming from. I agree with you. I don't think that that's an exhaustive list that ends with computer science. I think there are all kinds of other options out there that would probably be great for students and that they may would explore and do if the state of Arkansas forced or mandated them to do that, unfortunately, we don't have the ability or the time to mandate all of those things into
our curriculum. So again, that, that could be a possibility with computer science, but I think there are other examples that can be equally important to where if you mandated a child to do it, it may spark an interest that they
never knew they had, but how many more things can we mandate into the curriculum? And if I could just add, I think
Speaker 14
43:58
you actually make a good point though of robotics is not required. There's a school districts
Speaker 26
44:02
are not required to have special interest clubs, but they do it because student interest is there and because
students want to participate. We trust our superintendents to make decisions every day about things like AOL about school calendars. We want them to make the right choices because they're responsible for preparing kids for college career for life after, and we trust them with those. decisions every day. There is a foreign language requirement, but they choose which foreign languages they teach. Thanks to many of the decisions that you all have made if a school district, if a student or if a student, if their parents
are not happy with the choices that their superintendent is make, they can go to the next school district. They can do a course choice and get it from a private provider. We don't want to limit kids' options. We want them to have as many options as they possibly can. So can we guarantee that no superintendent's going to make a bad decision and eliminate everything. No, we can't guarantee that, but we can guarantee that. we're going to be aware of that school district that we're going to be, um, offering support to that school district and that parents in that school district
who want their kids to have other opportunities are going to look at other school districts that are, um, uh, no one's here from the school for the math science and the arts, so hopefully they don't kill me for this, but they have talked to us about offering computer science courses. That's one of the most prestigious schools in the state. They want to make their computer science courses available to every student in the state through virtual options. And so if a student wants that, they're going to be able to get that and we're going to help make sure that kids have those options. And just to follow up on that, I think that
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
45:41
a component of learns that makes school choice across the board open to a lot of different schools may force the hand of some of these schools that otherwise to Mr. Owen's example that he gave yesterday, as superintendent said that his kids are going to pick tomatoes. They don't need computer science. First of all, I hope that superintendent was reported, and second of all, I hope that all schools, all students as we move forward, parents have the option to take a school out of that environment where they're not getting the skills that they need and put them into a school that is preparing them to compete globally if there is
value in the program to, uh, Courtney's point with robotics, if there's value in the program, people will migrate to the program. I'm just saying that a one size fits all for every school district, all 1000 and I think 60 districts in the state that this is what you have to do is not the right approach. It's not a one size fits all. There are 55 options. I
Representative Denise Garner
Unverified
46:33
don't think 55 sizes fit all. and vault you recognized for a question.
Speaker 12
46:50
That's the Lord representative. How funny. OK, so we've talked. Um, I have a daughter that definitely would
Representative DeAnn Vaught
Unverified
47:01
have never thought that she would enjoy teaching anything in computer paragraph. Had she not went and got, um, certified to do it. A couple of things that I've spoke with you, uh, about, so this is, I'm not like catching him off guard if anybody thinks I'm not, I am, I'm not, because
we have spoke about this in depth. We've got 30 states about to pass legislation that we have in the state of Arkansas right now. We're actually number one in the nation in something in education. Wow, what a miracle that would be, right? Um I worry about. What several people have said, I worry that we are going backwards. I don't want to go backwards. And I even asked this
question to you the other day, Why didn't we do something for remediation? Why didn't we just take that and carve that piece out. And it sounds like that would pass out of this committee. Federal law wouldn't allow it if we carved out something that said they did not have to have uh computer science for the IEP, the
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
48:13
IEP students, only that 1% can have an alternate course. The rest cannot be treated differently. You cannot establish different graduation requirements and
Speaker 26
48:22
still give them the same diploma. OK. But they do take different
Representative DeAnn Vaught
Unverified
48:31
classes at some point in time, right? I mean, it has to be. I mean, I've seen them take a different math than other students take to graduate. I've seen them take. But they
Speaker 26
48:42
have to be teaching the same standards in those courses. You might have 3 different math classes, but if they're not teaching the same standards, then they are violating state and federal law. You might be
teaching the standards differently, you might be providing those students with more one on one support, additional, uh, interventions and resources, but they still have to meet the same standards. Yeah, I'll let Wade go and I'll come back. Ha Representative
Speaker 180
49:11
Gonzalez more than you recognize for question. Um I,
I guess I keep going back and
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
49:23
I I I'm, I too, um, worry about our students not being prepared in this area, especially, you know, we were, we're at the top, we were one of the first states to, to do this, to offer computer science as a graduation requirement. And we'll be the first. To remove it, you know, so the first to start and the first to remove it, um, but one of the things that keeps coming up is the, you mentioned the standards and I'm just wondering, I'm a
I'm a, I'm a teacher, but I'm also a teacher educator and oftentimes teachers do have difficulty. I mean, my, myself included, there are components in what we teach that are difficult to teach. However, There are professional development. Opportunities, coaching to teach a particular. unit of instruction that is just hard. So how do you make it relevant to the student? How do you make it where it makes sense to the student, and that takes
extra time in terms of coaching, etc. where you are not watering down the standards you're keeping the standard there, but you, your approach to teaching that student is gonna be quite different. This one over here doesn't need it. They get it just like that, OK, but this one over here, you may need to try 3 or 4 or 5 different things. As the parents. what works for them at home, uh, no two children learn the same way, um, and so. Really delving into that, so that's one thing that keeps
coming back to me and then the other is the shortage of computer science teachers as well. So what I'm wondering is it, is it possible that we're maybe looking um at some I'm not, I'm not sure how this would be done, but just some ways in which we could help school districts that are having difficulty with those shortages in this area and additional training if if for teaching the
standards, that's what I keep coming back to. I don't know, just asking what opportunities there would be is because to me it sounds like there's a teacher shortage, um, since we're having to use uh virtual teachers or sharing those resources maybe we have a different concern here. So
I can tell you that some of the things we did, um, even
Speaker 26
51:48
back when, when Mr. Owen was at the department is offered stipends to teachers to go back and get
the license offered, um, the professional development, um, we did a lot of things to try to recruit and the number of teachers did increase a lot, um, but you can only do so much without forcing people to, to become licensed and um, as an example, so when the legislation was first passed, it was also requirement that every school district have a computer science licensed teacher, um, and because school districts couldn't meet that. This body took away that requirement. And
that's why many students are now accessing and getting that graduation requirement, um, virtually because we took off the requirement that school districts have a teacher, but we didn't take away the requirement from the students. And so now they're having to get it through those virtual means. So we, could we do more? Probably. What we do make efforts every day to recruit more. teachers. We have entire staff of people, um, that try to recruit more people into the education profession. That's why we helped increase teacher salaries. We offer professional
development and different scholarships for teachers for individuals to go to school to become teachers, um, so we have made. Lots of efforts
Chair
Unverified
53:05
and and those efforts have been, uh, somewhat fruitful, but still not able to meet the need of every district. Andrews
Representative Wade Andrews
Unverified
53:17
you recognized. Mr. Um, I, I guess I have a question for Ms. Ford, um, talking about the ISPs and all that. Has there been any conversation
with our federal partners about trying to get a waiver and exemption. I know we're about to have a big possible big shakeup with the department of ed and then, you know, in the coming months, years, however, all that shakes out with them just block granting money and giving us. Us and y'all the ability to make these decisions. Have you communicated with them saying, why don't we make an exemption for that this one segment of the population that needs the exemption and let's leave the rest of this alone for everyone else. I specifically have not had any
Speaker 14
53:59
of those conversations. Um, I can tell you that I've done special education law
Speaker 26
54:03
for 15 years, and they've been talking about redoing federal IDEA law for about 14 of those years. Can we I mean, I mean Can, can I
Representative Wade Andrews
Unverified
54:13
request that y'all. Look at that. We can certainly broach that conversation. OK, thank you.
Chair
Unverified
54:20
Seeing no additional questions by the committee. We do have
several people who would like to speak on the
bill. Uh, first, Mr. Anthony Owen. You're recognized Thank
Speaker 191
54:49
you, Chairman Brooks, committee members Anthony Owen, senior, um, director of state government affairs for co.org, also president
Speaker 192
54:55
of National Advocacy Coalition, uh, it's Groundhog Day again. We're back talking
about this bill, um, hopefully we can end this tonight. um, first, I do have some prepared statements again, but I have a list of things I wanna address based on what was just said. And first is department's own guidance that is the first link. On their alternative pathways, uh, website. This is commissioner's memo memo LS 19069. And I will read verbatim. This pathway talking about the alternative pathway for grad uh
to graduation for students with significant cognitive disabilities. This pathway will be available to incoming freshmen for the 2019, 2020 school year and beginning with this 9th grade cohort, a student must meet either the requirements for the core pathway or the alternate pathway in order to graduate with a regular diploma. Verbatim from the DOE website. So this argument that they do not get a regular diploma is countered by this commissioner's memo.
Uh, and that is active on their site. Um, I also would just like to, uh, address some other things. One, there was a statement about my flippant joke about as a superintendent, come back and repealing all graduation requirements. Uh, I hope this body realizes that I would never be in support of that. Uh, we have minimum expectations as adults. Uh, that we expect of children. If we, if we went to every uh whim of what children want to do
and what children don't want to do or what they don't think is as important at a particular point in their life. I can tell you I wouldn't have never had a student in my algebra I geometry or algebra 2 classes or there would have been 2 or 3 maybe in each class, but we as a state said those are skills that are required for every student and their needed skills for every student. That's what we said about. the CS in 2021. That's what we said about it again in 2023. Uh, Representative Meeks brought up
a, um, uh, question about what skills are taught in this, and he knows computer science probably better than I do, uh, but I will say that the issue with the high school computer science class is not about just learning to use technology, OK? It is not about just learning to use the technology, um, you know, kids know we see years, uh, 5 year olds walking around with phones and they can use them. We agree with that. It is about understanding how this technology works, how the, how
the systems feed information sometimes to the older kids that maybe we don't want them in echo chambers. And more importantly, how can they become producers with this vast technology. This phone has more power in it than what we sent men to the moon with. Think about it. If we redirect, Um, students, activities toward away from being just strictly consumers to being producers with technology of what entrepreneurs we can have out of Arkansas.
So, I agree, Representative Meeks, with your statement on that. I also want to say there was a statement made right that, um, I wrote it down. Right now there are students getting certificates of graduation because of this requirement. I don't know how that's possible because it applies to this year's current 11th grade class. So I'll just leave that there. I also want to address some issues that were statement stated about the number of teachers certified. Yes, there
are roughly 450 teachers who have passed the CS praxis, but there are additional 450 to 500 teachers who have received an alternative, um, certification pathway, and I want to read, I brought this today. This is the engrossed version of the 2023 bill. Senate Bill 470 was the one that was passed by Senator Dodson, and if you flip to, um, the Um To the, I'm trying to find it here where it says, uh, but
basically the bill stated that the department would look for flexibility in teacher certification included alternative ways to certification. So what we did in our, uh, in my office was we developed training that would train these high school teachers if they went through that training, then they got a temporary approval code or an approval code to teach the high school CS courses. That's where that additional 450 or so, that equals that 900. So they are certified, they are approved to
teach, they have received training. There are over 900 teachers certified to teach high school CS in Arkansas. They're not 1000 high schools in Arkansas. There are 1000 schools in Arkansas. Right? So, um, we have over 900 teachers to teach and how many of our high schools there are were roughly 365 districts if I remember the number count, it's probably changed since I last knew. Um This is a step back.
OK, that's, that will, it will be a step back for Arkansas. It'll be a step back for Arkansas educationally, economically, um, and just honestly for the what we're doing that is right for our students when they graduate. There will be access removed, um, for students. We see that over and over again in states that don't have the grad requirement. There was a lot made about these three CTE pathways, but what was never asked and never stated was do one of those 3 CT pathways have to have. S in it?
The other thing I want to point to is this legislation again from 2023. This bill is a CS grad, uh, grad requirement repeal bill. All the other language in it, all the talk about CTE in fusion and wanting to build up CT is, is just superfluous because this 2023 legislation already did that. In fact, I will mention that the department might want to go back and look at their 2025 courses
that they just approved because within this legislation, Uh, one particular provision that y'all approved and adopted was that there has to be at least 4 courses identified that a student can take to meet the CS requirement in 8th grade. I don't know that the new 2025 courses that come online next year, do that. We definitely did that before I left with the 27 state design courses that we developed. This seems to me, um, And I can, I'm happy to take a lot of questions uh take
questions, uh, on this, uh, on any of this, um, but this seems to me that there has been a conscientious effort to try to roll back. What was done in the, the previous administration. The, uh, reduction in course availability for students with the 2025, the removal, y'all heard it from the department yourselves that this body in 2023, they fought for the removal that every student or every school has to have a certified CS teacher. We
understood that. We didn't fight it because we made sure there were virtual Arkansas, but virtual Arkansas, but now, that's being used as an argument to repeal. this graduation requirement that we don't have teachers. So, I just, I want to just emphasize over and over again this is a step back. Uh, there was a statement made about ASMSA and congratulating them on how, how wonderful they are and they're offering teachers are offering to train teachers and offering their courses to students. Do y'all know what the first
school in Arkansas to require CS was? ASMSA, they've required it since they opened. Every student to take computer science since they opened. At least one course. OK, so if we're going to hold them up as the gold standard, then that is the gold standard. Um, I've got a lot more notes, but I think at this point we've got some other testifiers, Barnes, who was in the department also and wrote the alternative pathway standards will be testifying, um, my wife
came with me. She's actually a certified CS teacher. She, she teaches at the elementary school, but she's certified at a high school level, um, and
Speaker 191
1:03:30
I believe there are some other testifiers that I think we'll be able to answer a lot of good questions for y'all also. Are you going to take questions,
Mr. Owen? I am happy to take questions Meeks I believe you have a question recognize. Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman. So,
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:03:45
uh, I, I guess my, my question for you is, and of course, I was part of the legislation to, to support this, to help make this,
make this happen, and, uh, I've been a supporter of it ever since. Um, but I also believe in the importance of making education practical, practical application. My Oh, maybe concerned like I'd mentioned it before, if we're making it a student who, you know, maybe they're gonna be a diesel mechanic or gonna be a farmer, uh, is it? Productive for them to spend, you know, half a year learning how to code computers. Now I'm
not saying they shouldn't learn, you know, and understand, OK, some, some coding. But, uh, is it, is it worth it to spend half a year or whatever it is, when that time could be maybe better sent using or learning computer, um, skills that would be conducive to what they are going to do, uh, you know, I, I, I was in college. They, they made me take, uh, I don't know, a drafting class in
technology. I have never used it before. I don't know that I gained anything from it. I had cul us courses in high school, so there wasn't any critical thinking skills. It, it was almost worthless for me to, for me to take it, whereas if I could have done something different, it could have been more beneficial to me. And so I guess that's where I'm kind of struggling with it because I, I definitely see the, the issue that, uh, Representative Wool to bring up. I've heard the concern from my own school district that
by, uh, forcing this that it's creating problems, uh, so I do want to create flexibility. Like I said, I think with Representative uh Mayberry's bill requiring the digital literacy that helps me get a little more comfortable with it. Uh, and I'm just wondering what kind of response you might have to kind of the, the, the points I've brought up. Sure, thank you. And, and I, I
Speaker 192
1:05:51
greatly appreciate the question. I agree wholeheartedly with you, um, diesel mechanics, uh, I
invite you to go to diesel mechanics and see if they're not using, uh, computers and computer systems that actually require some interfacing with them in a way to create outcomes that they need, which is what computer science is. This is already built into CT based on that 2023 legislation. What was added was a computer science or a computer science. This is the added part. Or computer science related career and technical education course. And then further down it said under subsection 4, the
division of career and technical education within the Department of Education shall work with the Arkansas Computer Science Initiative within the Department of Education to establish by rule the minimum criteria which a career and technical education course may be approved as a computer science related career and technical education course. So, It is already allowed to be infused in CTE and, and if you go to the department's website right now that has the courses on it and you look at the top, they have the list of their new courses that come online in July, including the introduction
to computer science course that's been talked about. Those are all branded under the CTE brand. So this idea that CS is not infused in CTE. I don't even know where that's coming from because on their own website everyone their new courses that come online in July are already branded under. CT. The idea that this is coding only is a misnomer. This is not just coding. These are so many more skills that go along with using technology in a way that
is safe, but productive, not just technology from a consumer standpoint. OK, so, so it's
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:07:34
your testimony that the CTE aspect a student could go down the CTE pathway and meet the the computer science credit without actually being in an intro to computer class because of the being emb ed d ed in those CTE courses. That is what y'all required in 2023 legislation. OK, um, and
Speaker 196
1:07:49
then I had another question and I just spaced it off.
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:07:52
Um, well, I'll, I'll see if anybody else has any questions in the
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
1:08:00
queue and then if I remember it, I'll jump back in. Representative Painter, you recognize. Mr. Chair, I'd like to make a motion due to the late hour of the day and many more bills still on the calendar. I like to make a motion to limiting 10 minutes for both sides for and against, uh, we, you know, we have already hashed some of this out before, and it's getting late in the day, colleagues, and we still got plenty of ills to go through. So, I would respectfully make that motion and ask for a good vote. So let me clarify your motion.
Is it 10 minutes remaining on both sides total 10, correct. OK, uh, that's a non-debatable motion. All on paper, say I, I all opposed. Congratulations your motion carries. Uh, so members, uh, I guess we are currently in the 4 side of the motion. Let me, let me clarify with staff here. Sorry, we, we only have against, I apologize, so, um. We will go ahead and start the timer and we've got 3 more
people signed up, uh, if Mr. Owen, if you'd like to take additional questions then uh we will do that, however, we've got 3 more people signed up the way that I understand the motion, I believe that the, the clock's about to start ticking, uh, so, um, we will uh go ahead and take 10 additional minutes if you'd like to take questions and I'm happy to ask answer a question or how do you answer questions, but we also have 3 other people signed up. Description of Garner. Thank you. um questions
Representative Denise Garner
Unverified
1:09:27
don't count in the timing. Are we counting questions in the time limit. That's a good question.
Let me clarify. So we will go ahead and, and include those questions in the timing, uh, because I, I agree with Represent Painter that we've, uh, have, uh, certainly
seen all sides of this, I think pretty passionately, so, uh, we'll go and allow 10 more minutes of of discussion on the side if there's any on the four side that we would certainly allow that as well. Represent, if you'd like to ask questions if Mr. Owen would like to answer then I certainly recognize. Uh, next up we have Mr. Randy
Zook. I'm sorry, we do have a question. I
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
1:10:08
apologize. You recognize. OK, I just wanted to make sure that I'm understanding this correctly. You mentioned. In the bill of 2023. related to the computer science requirement. That If a student takes A CTE. course The bill, the bill language that changed the graduation
Speaker 192
1:10:36
requirement in 2023 specifically stated, uh, that was what was required was a computer science. The addition was, or a computer science related career and technical education course. So this provision for CTE is already allowed. OK, so, OK, so
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
1:10:52
that, that means that if. Um I, I could, I could take any of the CTE pathways. That the department has determined is a CT CS related
course CS that would meet my interest level. Correct. I could take that and fulfill my graduation requirement. That's why this
Speaker 207
1:11:15
is just a repeal bill. Uh, all the CTE stuff is just added uh to try to hide the that that clarifies things for me.
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
1:11:22
Thank you. Thank y'all. Next up is Randy Zook. Mr. Zuck, if
you would please introduce yourself, who you're with and you're recognized.
Speaker 208
1:11:52
Uh, Randy Zook, Arkansas State Chamber of Commerce. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the committee. My brief,
Speaker 209
1:11:58
my comments will be really brief. On behalf of our members, businesses, employers across the state. Who have Unmet needs for talent and workforce. Standards are, are kids that are prepared to do work that's available today. This is 2 steps backwards.
Reading, writing, arithmetic, and computer science, numeracy and literacy and computer science along with a clearly defined set of durable skills. Like communication ability, understanding how to Present yourself how to, how to cooperate, how to communicate with other kids and other people. Those are the things that, that the workforce demands today and Arkansas has been blazing a path of leadership.
For several years now in this field of computer science. I know it's probably tough. Acquiring skills for any new technology, any fundamental technology is tough. We've got generative artificial intelligence coming at us like a freight train, and we are not We have no idea what it's going to demand of kids 5 years from now, much less 10 or 20 years from now. If these kids, every,
every kid in every working role is going to be required to be competent and to understand how to use this technology and to back up because it's tough, is just really discouraging. I urge you to, to let this bill go and and stick to the stick to the course and stick to preparing. kids for a future that's just about an hour and a half in front of them. It's not down the road by 5 years. It's here and we've got to get these kids
ready to do it. I'm, you know, I'm in a pilot language, I've got a lot more runway behind me than I do in front of me. So this is, this is not about me. This is about my grandkids. So, Need you to do that. Hope you do urge you to. Other questions for Mr. Zuck Representative Walker, do you have a question?
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
1:14:15
Yes, I'll make it quick and hopefully this hasn't already been um asked and answered if it if it has, I've missed it, um, but it's our state is from my understanding, leading and
computer science, and we've been doing computer science, I don't know, was it 2014? It's been a long time since we've been doing it and and making it a requirement, um. So we should know the answer by now. So whether it's you or the bill sponsoring closing, I would like to know, um, how many kids percentage wise, graduate each year, go into a computer science field and make an impact out there in the industry. Do we have any of that kind of data? I
don't have a clue because I think the
Speaker 209
1:15:00
kids going into the field as a specialty would be going probably from a college program. OK. Um, the kids coming out of high school, every one of them is going to be using this technology. Not, not a few. If you're, if you're, if you're in a McDonald's, you're gonna be cooperating with a robot and you're going to be operating with artificial intelligence controlled machines. You need a sense of understanding how all
that operates. You don't have to be able to code it, I don't think, uh, but that's just an old guy, but you, you better well know. How these things relate to each other and how they function. I thank you, Mr. Chair. Our additional question, Mr. Zook.
Thank you, Mr. Zuck. Appreciate your time. Thank you. Next up we have Mr. Mark Barnes. Mr. Barnes, if you would please
introduce yourself for the record. You're recognized we're down to 4 minutes and 12 seconds. Thank you committee. My name is
Mark Barnes
Unverified
1:15:59
Mark Barnes. I'm a software engineer at Code.org, and I'm also the co-founder and vice chair of CS Access, which is a national organization dedicated to improving accessibility in computer science education. Um, I have a few prepared statements I'd like to read. Uh, first of all, I want to address the concern that maintaining Arkansas's current computer science graduation requirement would be bad for students with disabilities who may be unable to meet the requirement. Um, first we need to clarify that disability is a broad category that encompasses a range of physical, mental, and
emotional differences. Any blanket statement about students with disabilities will be inherently inaccurate. Uh, let's talk about some specifics. So first of all, we've heard about the uh alternative standards. That is something that I helped to write along with a team of experts we had classroom, special education teachers. Uh, we had a special education consultant and an assistive technology specialist from Easter Seals, and we did this also in consultation with the special education department within the Department of
Education. These standards were adopted in 2022. Uh, they are part of the alternate pathways, and as you've heard, students who fall under the category of having severe cognitive disabilities are allowed to use those standards instead of the current computer science standards in order to graduate with a diploma. Um, now, as for the other students, uh, any other student who is who has a disability as defined by the ADA
will have an IEP that defines the accommodations and the support that they will receive from their school, uh, and I will say from my experience, I worked very closely and I continue to work. In a personal capacity with Arkansas School for the Blind and visually impaired and with Arkansas School for the Deaf right down the road. You guys want to see some students with disabilities who are doing computer science, I would invite you to go visit those schools. Laurie Cole, who's the current principal at Arkansas Law School for the Blind and Visually
Impaired is a fantastic advocate for computer science. She built their program, um, and that program has inspired students. It has empowered students. There's one student in particular. named Bryson, who is a junior now. I started working with him when he when he was in 8th grade. He is going into cybersecurity. He would not have been able to do this if it wasn't for our computer science initiative and the mandate. His school wouldn't have, wouldn't have adopted this. They had to be pushed in order to do this.
When they got that push, their superintendents were able to get people in place, get teachers in place who are able to teach them and as we've heard before already from other people, if we don't have this. mandate, there are schools that either for for multiple reasons won't do this. I grew up in a place that, uh, where I did not have the opportunity until I was an adult to pursue computer science. I wonder sometimes how my life would be different if I had had that opportunity when I was younger. Um, I think that this is a an important
opportunity. I think that uh any student regardless of their ability is going to have opportunities and they are going to be empowered if they continue to have access to computer science education. Uh, the way that we have it now in our state. 45 seconds left. Other questions for Mr. Barnes? Say no questions. Thank you for
your time. Thank you. We do not have anyone signed, uh, anyone else sign up to speak against, uh, would anyone like to speak for the bill? For 10 minutes.
I That's the motion that Herbs and Painter made, so we're gonna honor the motion, uh, seeing no one signed up to speak for the bill, uh, Represent Wooldridge,
Speaker 145
1:19:44
you're recognizedlo for your bill. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
1:19:52
committee. Um, I, I do appreciate you hearing this out. This is an important bill to my district. It's important to me, um, you know, I, I appreciate, I think that, uh, Mr. Owens and I are friends, Mr. Zook and I are
friends. We can just agree to disagree civilly and, and see things differently on this issue. We both come from different parts of the state, we don't have a McDonald's in Marmaduke, and it sure doesn't have a robot, uh, but I understand the point that he's trying to make, and I'm in no way trying to diminish the need for these type of programs as we move forward. What I'm asking you to do is what we have historically done since I've been in this body and that's allowed local school districts, local communities,
uh, folks that are closest to the students to make the decision that's right for them. We entrust the Department of Ed to make these decisions on what's a graduation standard, what's a graduation requirement. The Department of Ed supports this bill. Uh, we passed a robust education reform led by the governor's office, the governor's office supports this bill, uh, you've heard enough from me. I do want to read a little bit of what I received the other day on this, and I think that it kind of makes the point that I'm trying to make,
and it just says, um, I'm gonna paraphrase a little bit to the point. I want to read too, but it's from a computer science teacher that's been teaching for 19 years, who obtained their credentialing in computer science courses before it was required by the state of Arkansas teaching computer science as an elective course was was a rewarding experience. I enjoyed challenging my students, myself and the content. I saw significant growth in the students who chose to enroll in this course. Many students went on to pursue degrees and careers in various fields of computer science. For
the 1st 5 years, I taught computer. science at a school that required all students to take as a graduation requirement under this system, students who have developed an interest in the course had students who could have developed an interest in the course had they been given the option, now view it as a requirement that they begrudge. As a teacher with experience in both elective and mandated computer science courses, I strongly support the efforts of this bill. I recognize the value of the content and what it provides to many students.
and firmly believe it should remain an option in every high school in Arkansas. However, the mandate and graduation requirement both locally and at the state level has significantly diminished student interest and performance to accommodate the disinterest and unmotivated students. I've been forced to find ways or try to find ways to simplify the curriculum, which has a detrimental impact on the students who, who have an eager and deep desire and drive for the material. Ladies and gentlemen.
all I'm asking you to do is allow your school districts to make a decision that that comes from a computer science teacher. Again, I'm not an educator. I have two little boys that are enrolled in the public school system and will graduate from the public school system. I in no way want to set it or the state of Arkansas back. I ran for the legislature to make sure that those two boys had the ability to live here, to raise a family here, get a good paying job here. I don't want them to have to choose to live in a different state. I'm not here to try to this backwards, we could we
could require some other thing as a graduation requirement that no other state in the nation has, and we would be leading in that area. But if it's not producing the outcomes that originally we thought that it would, we've had now multiple attempts to walk this back to some extent. I think that speaks for itself multiple legislators have brought this issue before you because we're hearing from our school districts that changes need to be made. All I'm asking you to do is embed this where it's tailored and fairly focused into CTE pathways. We amended that to
make it to where it is required to be specifically embedded into every pathway and the rest of those students would have it as an option, so maybe we can re-spark some of that interest and desire with that, Mr. Chairman, I'm closed and I would appreciate a good motion and good vote. Russian olger has closed for his bill. What's the will of the committee?
We have a motion to pass as amended. Is there a discussion on that motion? Uh, represent painter you recognized for discussion on the motion. Colleagues, I, I get the
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
1:24:13
heartburn over this. I, I'm, you know, I'm not surprised. I'm, I'm for this bill allowing my
Rural school districts to have the flexibility, you know, some of us have complained about mandating certain things in this in this committee. About we need to have our schools to have the flexibility to do this and that. This is exactly what this bill does. So just reminding we we had gripes about different bills that have come through the committee about mandating these things and saying, you know what, our schools need to be able to do this.
That's what we're doing in this bill. I appreciate a good vote and thank you, Representative
Woolridge for the bill. Representative Andrews you're
Representative Wade Andrews
Unverified
1:24:59
recognized for discussion. Thank you Mr. Chair. Colleagues, we live in a world where.
Arkansas students are competing not only with. Their their neighbors in the south, the north, east, the west, but with. Different states, different countries. Technology isn't ever evolving
thing and we need students that are well rounded and taking away computer science classes I think would hinder their success in their future. Um, to quote a former late president, President Kennedy once said in a speech when he was talking about sending. Um, Astronauts and technology to the moon, he said, we do these things not because they're easy, but because they are hard. If we stop doing the things that
are challenging and give up on the things that are difficult. How are we ever going to grow and, and become better as people in society, um. I see this as taking a step backwards and and I mean this is no disrespect to you, Representative Wooldridge. I, I do respect you and, uh, I, I, I admired you for sanding up for your community, but, but I'm a no on this bill because I believe that. This is a very important topic to teach.
Because computer science is in every aspect. It is in our culture. It is in science. It it is in every part of business, um. I, I, you know, I have a small part-time auction business and 90% of my auction business I run for my cell phone. And I think we need as a society to be better able to understand technology and work with it. And change it and fix it when it
addresses our needs and so for that reason I'm against this bill. Represent Beck you recognized
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
1:27:00
for discussion. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Again, problem with technology, what is this about? I,
I, I have some concerns because we, we, we say computer science, computer science is everywhere and, and, and I agree with that statement, but if you,
there's computer science is not one thing, it's not, this is computer science and all the rest of it's not. There's a lot of different aspects of computer science and computer science, you know, if, if, if I'm going to do data processing, computer science is a whole different thing thing as it is, then it would be if I was. Trying to crunch numbers with a with some type of a program that they have there it there's, it's different types of appearances if I'm an electrician, I would probably use computer science in a slightly different way than a machinist might possibly do on a
CNC machine. There's a lot of different computer science things that could apply for computer science, so I, I think we can get trapped into that. I do believe that computer science, if you use the broader term is because there's. That in every avenue that you go into, however, A student Uh I feel that students have a natural bent towards what they want to do. Electricians,
plumbers, some people want to be their own, operate their own businesses. All of these are important things, but the, the way they would interface with computers would be different. It would be a different program. It would be a, a totally different thing. So my emphasis is this I don't, I, I think we're taking the harder path if we don't do this because what's what's gonna happen is we're we're going to be trying to get more and more of these. computer science classes that are related to the fields that these students would possibly use later on. The fact of the
matter is, is true that, you know, most students are not going to end up in a 4 year degree program. Most of them are gonna end up in, in, in leaving you the, the high school and going into some type of profession. So why wouldn't we, while we have them there, teach them the computer that relates to the interests that they have, whatever that interest may be and I think that's, that's hard. It's gonna be really hard to do. But that's the right thing to do. That's the, that's the right thing to do. And, and, and as opposed to sticking someone in
front of a computer and saying, you know, I, I, I remember when I was in computer science, uh, a major and, and, and they came out with this teachers had to have a computer science class. All right? And I can tell you exactly what it was. It was 10 pieces of data that you strung together and you put them in alphabetical order and, and, and if you're really good, you, you, you could do it by alphabetical or by the last name or the first name or or their address or something like that and then you printed it out. That was it.
Alright. Now, as a computer science major, there was no shortage of teachers that came up to the computer science majors in the university and said, you know, you know how to write this little program? It's like, yeah, it's pretty easy, right? And and and that was a good case of where you were pushing computer science onto someone and it was having total different effect. It was, it was just something that they weren't going to apply with what they were doing, right, so why wouldn't we push computer science. Our offer, I shouldn't say push, but offer computer science. On a basis where the where the
the the the student already has a natural interest towards that thing and then show him how computer science is gonna to help show them how computer science is going to help them. So I'm a big yes on this because I really feel that's very important that we prepare our students, uh, for their next step in the majority of them are going to go into a career and we need to offer them a computer science class that matches their interest into that new career. Thank you. Represent me you recognize for discussion on the motion.
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:30:59
Thank you, uh, Mr. Chairman, and, and, and I've struggled on both sides of this because I think there's good points on both sides. There's great arguments to be made on both sides of this issue. Um, And, uh, and so I don't know, maybe depending on how Representative Beck looks at me may, may determine how I vote here. Uh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But, but I, but I do want to address something that, uh, Mr. Zuck said, and I don't always agree with the, with the chamber, but We're on the verge of a fundamental shift in society,
and I don't think most people realize the shift that we're looking at, um, as I, you know, mentioned in committee, kind of jokingly with Representative Cozart running his construction business. In 20 years, he's probably not going to be running a crew of humans. It's gonna be a, a crew of robots that are going to be doing, doing that work. Uh, all, all the studies that I have seen have indicated that 50% or more of today's jobs are going to be gone. In the next 10 to 15 years because of humanoid robots and
artificial intelligence, um, a lot of the trades, manufacturing, all that stuff's gonna be, gonna a lot of it's gonna be gone. And so, I see the need for the flexibility, but I also understand if we don't prepare our students in Arkansas. For this. Probably one of the most fundamental shifts in the history of humanity. I don't, I don't know if I'd want to be a legislator trying to deal with those issues when, when that occurs.
Um So, I guess all that to say, I do think we need some flexibility. Uh, I don't disagree with that. I My concern is this is maybe too much too soon. Um, I mean, if we went the opposite way, I mean,
if we went the opposite way, and we were trying to outlaw all computers in schools. There is no way, even if we outlawed it, that we would be outlawing all
the computers are in schools are gonna be in schools. I have no doubt that that's gonna, gonna take place. I, I just, my, my concern is, is
that This may be too big of an ass too soon. Maybe it's the best way to, maybe the best way to, to. To, to put it. So, uh, I'll listen to the other discussion. Maybe someone will sway me one way or the other going forward, but I,
I, I appreciate it. Representative Gonzalez worthily recognized for discussion the motion. Yes,
um, I think a couple of things that stood
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
1:33:28
out in all of the discussion, and first of all, Representative Woolridge, thank you, thank you
for bringing this bill. I think this is the most discussion since I've been here as a new legislator that we've had, um, thank you, um. And that is the flexibility, the the options and it seems to me that. It, it has in the 2023, uh, law, um. The CTE embedded courses that there's computer science already embedded in those CTE courses, so, so that meets that computer
science requirement, you know, so long as the department has approved it and there are um 55 different types of courses one can take, uh, so I think that flexibility, it's already there, so that's number one and then #2, I think Mr. Zook, when he mentioned that this would, this would take us two steps backwards. That's, that's tough. OK, that's tough and, and I, and I just cannot, I cannot see that, especially looking to the future, um, and so I, I'm gonna
be a no on this, um, and those are my two reasons. Thank you. script ion Garner, did you have discussion?
Is there additional discussion by the committee on the motion. So, notice your no additional discussion. We have a motion on the table of DuP pass
HB 1825 as amended all in favor say aye. All opposed say no, no habit sorry represent Wolter, your bill's failed. Committee, we will now move on
without objection to. House Bill 1977. I'm sorry, no, 1933. I apologize. I got my numbers wrong. We do have an amendment on this one. Represent McCollum uh staff will pass the amendment out. What 1933. Wow. he was here.
Yeah, would you say on microphones so the
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:35:58
public can hear that? Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Committee. The bill that we're discussing today, hopefully voting on is HB 1933, you'll
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:36:04
see an amendment being passed out. Um, I'll go ahead and make a motion, um, to adopt the
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:36:10
amendment, please. We have a motion to adopt the
amendment as your question or is there a discussion on the motion? See no discussion all on paper,
say aye. All opposed. Congratulations you've adopted the amendment. Now
Speaker 140
1:36:21
you recognize the HP 1933 as Thank you committee, um, so, you know, just In case
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:36:25
you're wanting enough, and you can see it in front of you a few of the amendments or um errors on my part, so I wanted to make that clear and then Um, For those that haven't looked at it in its entirety.
We're talking about school board recalls. today.
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:36:45
Um For me and You know, why I wanted to take a look at this more and obviously these are important positions that get to vote over large numbers that impact our communities, um, as well as our students, um. I'm coming I'm coming at it from a standpoint of consistency. When I think about, you know, other local elections that take place, uh.
Maybe mayors, city council members, other local officials, they can all be recalled, um, I'm not entirely sure about, you know, the history of when that happened or why some have been able to be recalled and, and not school board members, but I believe they should be held to the same standard. Across the board. Um, so the recall process, you know, itself and kind of what the bill does, it's a mechanism to attempt to hold folks accountable, um, maybe one way of looking at it is I don't know
how often y'all since y'all have been legislators here, you know, conversations about term limits and then we had some stuff on the floor on the issue on that. I mean, to me this is. This is a way to engage on that issue without a true term limit. It just gives the ability to your constituents to hold folks accountable. So maybe a few other notes to make, uh, kind of like the safeguards in place that are in here. The bill would require a higher threshold, 35% of eligible voters signing a petition.
Before recall election could even take place. So the idea there is to prevent abuse, have a significant threshold. It limits the recall petitions to one per elected term. The idea there being balancing the stability and leadership with voter accountability. Finally, the recall election aligns with the next school board election, so. The idea there is preventing unnecessary special elections or costs. Um
I would go ahead and, you know, ask any questions, but I think there's probably some valuable perspective that could be brought with your permission, Chair, I might ask Gary Newton if he's interested. Coming up here, having value you want a perspective you
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:39:04
think I didn't hit on on this? missionary, if you would. Yeah. Mr. Newton, if you would
please, introduced Jeff for the record, and you recognize you speak on any
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:39:15
way that you'd like to speak what I think would be valuable for the committee to hear is maybe from your observation, um,
over the years compared to um You know, other, other local. Um elected positions, their ability to recall and maybe the need for this on specifically with school boards. Gary Newton with Arkansas learns um our
Speaker 238
1:39:38
friends at our Opportunity Arkansas we're also involved with this bill. Uh, ironically, uh, the first time
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:39:43
I ever said at the end of this table was. About 15 years ago on a recall bill for school board elections.
It It was the notion was not to recall, not, not the, the notion of removing people from boards but rather to elevate these positions to the importance that they have in communities. I was 1724 that passed the Senate today. We're finally holding school board elections when people actually vote. And these are the largest. And richest local governments in Arkansas and that the most important
Uh, local officials when it comes to the the future of respective communities, so the idea is to treat these like uh to elevate these these positions, uh, in the same way that we have other local officials. So it's, it sounds punitive on the front end, it's a way to remove elected officials, but I, I also subscribe to what Representative McCollum said, uh, it, it does take away the need for term limits. The term the people. And the people's decisions should determine terms.
And how they are to be represented, so with that, I,
Speaker 242
1:41:00
I offered very little of their perspective than what you have, but it, um. Thank you for the opportunity. Representative makes you recognize for a question for
Ribson McCul. Thank you. So 22 questions. First one is a
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:41:16
logistics one. I think we just passed a bill through here that would
move the school board elections to every other year, and I think that's the one you are, you're
referencing, uh, and so under this legislation, if a recall takes place, uh, they, that, that slot would not be filled until the next election, so we could potentially be going a year, year and a half without that school board position being filled. I got that correct or am I missing something? You're missing the appointment. There's, there
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:41:48
are provisions in the code for filling vacancies and it would be appointed position to serve until the next election, but, uh, just because
the actual election for recall would have to take place in a school board election. OK, who, who, who does
Speaker 245
1:42:04
the vacancy, the board, uh, the board and if
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:42:07
the board doesn't act by a certain period of time, and this isn't new, this is currently, uh, then. it falls to the quorum court. OK, so the other school board members would choose their, the remaining members,
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:42:18
the remaining members if they don't do it, then the Court would do it, which is currently the way of doing, OK, OK, um, and so I, I,
I guess my overall concern here with, with, with the bill is, is this, and, and you know this from being a lawmaker. Our, our, our school boards, they deal with some pretty tough issues, right? And kind of the one that I'm kind of springs to the front of my mind was the bathroom. issue and Conway where they were trying to keep, you know, uh, girls and girls bathrooms, boys and boys' bathrooms, and one of the provisions in here that would allow for a recall would be a moral.
about failing, uh, or the loss of a public trust. So, uh, you know, a school board member could be put in one of these, you know, they're making a real tough decision. And now if they, they're, they're, they're, they could potentially be put in a place where if I make the tough call, which we've got to do that sometimes in our positions. The unpopular call then, which is the right one, then I'm putting my position in jeopardy. Because if I make that tough
call, that's not always popular, then all of a sudden I might get recalled. And do we want our school board members to Be in fear of making that tough call and not have the strength
to make that tough call because we've put this provision in here. I think my answer is
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:43:49
no, no, I don't want anyone to be in fear. I, I would like them to act on their convictions. I mean, of course, any elected individual. I would want to pay attention to the feelings of whatever constituency that they That they represent, I guess my hope would be.
We would elect people who have convictions are able to communicate that back, but I mean, I think I do see your point and maybe you're, so you're talking about in real time having the threat of uh or I guess the. Uh, perception of, hey, you know, any given vote could You know, cause a recall, you think that would affect maybe the behavior of the individual that's in that position, I guess I would feel I don't necessarily see that any different than what is currently the case with individuals that, I mean, maybe
the sense of urgency behind a potential recall, but I do think that's why we put those thresholds. It would have to be a pretty high percentage, a significant percentage enough. For this to happen. So it'd have to be something that the public is really seriously interested to even be eligible to get this going in the first place, and then there would have to be the election, so it's important to point out
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:44:58
as well with the moving to the preferential primary for these elections. It's no longer dozens of people deciding school board races.
It's going to be thousands. It's going to set records. In it already has by having even your elections, uh, the other thing is with the advent of uh uniform 4 and 6 year terms and the prescription that it only one. time could somebody feel that threat. And And In that time. Um, and I'd also said that was kind
Speaker 248
1:45:30
of my point. I'm pointing back to the consistency like I,
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:45:36
I do get that it's a change from the status quo, but What it would go to if you know the body decides this is a good idea, that is the current way of thinking for these other local elected officials. So to play out, I guess your logic, I guess that would invite the fact. to say that, you know, mayors and other individuals would be voting just because they're afraid of maybe taking a hard issue, which I don't think that's necessarily the case. OK, and then final,
Speaker 252
1:46:01
just as a, uh, is the verification so the petitions have all been signed.
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
1:46:07
Uh, is that the county clerk center responsible for verifying all the petition, make, make sure that they've actually met that threshold for the recall up to county clerk, is that your question? Right, right. Who's who's responsible for making sure that everyone signed the petitions according to rules, county clerk clerk's
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:46:25
office, OK. Yes, sir, and that, that language including the, the language you referenced before was taken from other. The other part
Speaker 238
1:46:31
of the code about with those other elected offices, so was it original language, it was mirroring following that mirror. OK. All
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:46:37
right, thank you. Repin Barnett, you're recognized for a question. Yes, I am. I had a question and I, I think I've somewhat found the answer to it, but I'm still gonna. Fs just because of Representative Meeks, uh, last question on page 2. Lines 4 and 5. It lists the following reasons that a school board member, um, could be subject to recall.
Um, and I know you mentioned the fact that mayors and other government positions are subject to recall if I'm not mistaken, I don't think it lists that there has to be a reason when those other officials are Um, subject to recall. And so kind of wonder About this language being included in this bill.
Even though it does says including without limitation, but it implies that there has to be. I guess quote unquote official. Reason that is put out there, um, and the mayoral, um, recalls that I have seen take place. It, it's not necessarily that they've communicated uh a reason. Um It's, of course, the meeting
that threshold with the required number of petition signers for it. That's always been a thing that those officials that have been recalled was have argued is, oh well, there's no they haven't listed or said a reason behind it, but it's my understanding that those laws does not, do not require for that and so I just don't know if by putting this in here, you might be, um, Putting yourself at a, you know.
In a box, um, I know that Representative Meek's question. Asked about a moral failing, but in here it says a moral failing leading to pending criminal charges, so, school board member may have some other moral failing that is a disgrace to the school district, but it doesn't necessarily dictate lead to criminal charges, um, and community members may be upset enough to want to have that person removed with this.
Language limit them from being able to do that if those that moral feeling doesn't. Result to pending charges. Yeah, I, I mean,
I think you maybe even mentioned part of the, my answer in your question. I think the key there is that including without limitation part, uh, that being permissive in its nature I mean what I think I heard you say maybe in your first part of your question was maybe comparing it to um some of the other elections and you
Speaker 259
1:49:44
know, is there any difference between this type
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:49:49
of I'm sorry. I just wondered whether or not by having that language in there, would you? Somewhat be limiting yourself, and I get the words, you know, including without limitation is in there, but it also, the way it is written implies that there has to be a. stated, you know, reason. Yeah, I don't, I don't read it that
way. I do, I do think it's permissive in nature, you know, in terms of like the moral
failing leading to pending criminal charges and the loss of public trust. I mean, I, I viewed that as more boilerplate language, but I mean, I don't have the language in front of me compared
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:50:23
to. You know Some of the other positions that
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:50:28
we mentioned and why there would be a recall. additional questions by the committee. Person McGruder, you recognize?
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
1:50:47
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for the work that you all have done in regards to this bill, uh, my. Concern, uh, is in regards to the Uh, elected officials that you previously deigned as far as uh quote unquote, uh. Mayors and all those elected officials are Uh, compensated for their services. And uh school board. members are not compensated and uh I can understand recalling those others.
Because they are paid positions, but in this position it's not, so I, I do think there's got to be a special place for school board members, uh, where it is, I don't know. But uh The reasoning behind uh Recalling people who aren't paid for the position cause it's basically volunteer work. Yeah, I hear you and, uh, you know, comparing unpaid versus
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:51:42
unpaid, so maybe it's not. You know, apples to apples in, in that regard when I mentioned
some of the other elected positions, I guess my comparison is more on the type of issues that we're voting on and how they impact the taxpayer and just the The true volume in dollars. That these individuals get to vote on and the impact on students' lives. I mean, I, I see the pay issue is completely separate and like. I'm just bringing it back to the important decisions and why we would want public trust and so that's why I was trying to compare it, but. I do see your point on some differences there.
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
1:52:22
Christian Walker you recognize for question. So with the recall process and it kind of goes to representative piggybacking off of Representative Meeks. Um, the loss of public trust. I, I mean, it's very vague, and when you have a recall election, usually a cost falls upon the district and. Possibly the county to cover the cost of a new election and everything along that line, um,
do we know what this will cost? Our districts, let's just say there's a group out there that gets mad because their kid didn't start for the basketball team and we lose the public trust and file a petition and go around and we bring it to a ballot, um, what are, what, what will the cost be to our school districts or counties whoever has to bear it, um, each time that a recall happens. I guess on the first part on the um On
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:53:19
the think What you, what were you still on
page 2, line 4 and 5 before I get to the cost. We you reference over the loss of public trust, I guess on that point in itself again, I wanted like the words on the paper do have meaning and that is permissive language. It doesn't have to be. Specific to that, but I think your point in bringing that up is comparing it to. Um Potential costs, so. One of the safeguards we attempted to put in the bill on that is that aligns with the next school board election. So the idea would be that it would prevent that unnecessary special
election in costs associated with that. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Description Beck you recognize. Thank
Chair
Unverified
1:54:08
you, Mr. Chair. I, I. I, I do like this.
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
1:54:19
I, I, I'm one of these people who thinks that that if You know, our school boards are,
are probably one of the most. Much more important than people think they are, uh, if there are nonfunctioning or rubber stamp school board then the, the school uh suffers from that, so I think that this will do a good job of doing that. My concern though with it is this, uh, of keeping people kind of do a good job of keeping people accountable when they on the school board. My concern is, you know, there's Maybe that goes away, but I see it maybe as going the opposite
direction that we want. There's not a long line of people who sign up for school board elections. And Now they're
going to be with the other elections, which is going to make it a little bit more difficult. Yeah, I, I just worry about, you know,
we, we end up having vacancies on school boards, um, I'm on a sport to bell, but I, I just, I want to bring that point forward is that, that it,
it, you know, it's not like there's a long line of people signing up for this. Uh, as it is right now in, in,
in the election processes that we're working on right now is making it harder, uh, uh, it's gonna be a harder election, so, so. I, uh, no, I,
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:55:35
I appreciate the concern. I'd say. I appreciate where you're coming from and how thoughtful you're being on the issue and what the impacts would be, um. If I just kind of play the play the logic out, let's say this becomes, becomes law and to your point, maybe in some areas it's difficult to find folks that, um, may wanna step up and serve.
I don't know that this would change that maybe the hope would be is. If the constituent constituency sees that there's a place for them to pay attention more because they can have. Potentially the opportunity to get more buy in from their school board member or maybe the school board member said, well, now I need to communicate even more about the decisions I'm making to make sure they know what it is that I'm doing. Hopefully. If it's a good actor, that brings more confidence in that
person and more community buy-in, but yeah, I mean, if it's a bad actor, um. I think the hope is that actually it would motivate. People who are that much more interested in public service to be running. You have
Speaker 242
1:56:44
anything else? On a Yes, the idea of elevating these there in Representative MacGruder
Gary Newton
Unverified
1:56:49
didn't say this, but it, it is volunteer service. But it's not community service. These are elected official, officials of the largest and
richest local governments in the state. And it's time we considered them at that level, and that doesn't mean again that we're. I doubt that this will be used very often. Quite frankly, because the process would be an election during a school board election to have a recall and then. You couldn't have the election to fill that spot until later. So it wouldn't be concurrent. It would be, it's a, it's a high threshold for everybody, but it
really elevates these positions to the importance that they have and uh he raised an issue of not being paid, that is. Something that should be contemplated. I don't disagree with you I
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
1:57:41
wasn't trying to brush off your concern agreement earlier when I said it's separate. I was basically saying, noted, maybe that needs to be considered as well, um, so anyways, kind of back to uh You know, the concerns brought up one thing I thought about as I was presenting, I don't know if I referenced it enough, but one of the reasons for part of
the amendment and in here was thinking about the impact of Representative McKenzie's or the bill that has not, I think it is now passed over in the Senate and just the truth, the, the change that's gonna come along with that with maybe the way the public thinks about these elections, the part, the fact that it's going to be at the same time, um, the school board elections as some of our other races, I think is going to bring more attention. Hopefully, um, I don't want to say. More valued candidates, but I'd say I do, I don't think it'll be as difficult to find candidates
running because it's going to be more in sync with the way we do some of our other elections. You follow And
Speaker 271
1:58:47
this is gonna be, wouldn't you agree type of deal.
Speaker 272
1:58:49
I just say, I do believe though that, that Having candidates run
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
1:58:54
in the regular election where there's multiple votes and it is important that you get out and talk with people and find out what they
want and everything. I think it will take the position
that, that some may see is not that important of a position and kind of raise it up and say, hey, this, this person ran for this position or I or I ran for this position. I'm, I'm gonna try to do a good job and more people are
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
1:59:16
just. By nature of when the elections, they're going to see that name more. It will
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
1:59:21
be elevated and, and wouldn't you agree that currently, uh, probably people couldn't tell you who's on their school boards. I would agree that unfortunately that is the case.
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
1:59:34
Prison Brown, you recognized for question. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, This is purely speculation, but Uh, it's gonna be kind of wouldn't you agree question that because it's a non-paid position and because people don't pay attention much or have not paid much attention in the past, you end up with some people on that board that are wielding authority and making major
decisions, um, and not. And not, you know, not very, uh, Performing well and not. Not behaving well on the board and Um, And they get by with it. I would say, you know, Representative Brown, I have
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
2:00:23
seen examples of that, but I really would not want to tag folks that that I don't think you are intending to do that. I just want to be clear in my answer
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
2:00:35
I'm saying that those things do occur.
They do occur and I think since COVID, It really woke up a lot of parents to realize that they need to pay closer attention to what. To the decisions that the school board makes regarding curriculum and and and behavior issues and and lots and lots and lots of things. So, I think that we're seeing, I haven't really done any study on
this, but I did campaign with a school someone who won their school board seat and I'm seeing parents stepping up. From my experience, stepping up and running for school board because they care about these issues and I think that, you know, sometimes you get stuck with the school board member that it's really not. Really doing anything to really benefit the kids. I have seen it. I don't think that's their intent. I think they're doing maybe a different job than they're doing, but I have seen
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
2:01:40
some examples of that and uh I do agree overall that like this aligned with having this. The new law on what our elections are going to be these positions are going to be elevated even more hopefully to the public and the type of interest maybe that you're
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
2:01:56
referencing, I think the school board has gotten, I think
school boards, in my opinion, wouldn't you agree that people are paying closer attention to their school boards these days. Thank you. um.
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
2:02:11
I will make a motion to pass as amended at the proper time, Mister Chair, so we do not have anyone sign up
to speak for or against the bill. I will ask if anyone likes to speak before against the bill. See none. Representative, we
like to close for your bill? Uh, we've been
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
2:02:27
here a while. I just appreciate all all y'all's time and um. I am closed. Thank you. Urson McCollum is closed first bill and we have a motion
of do pass as amended. Is there a discussion on that motion?
See no discussion. I'll say aye. I'll say no. Congratulations ResonCollum, your bill is passed as amended. Uh, members, we, we have 2 more bills to hear, um, we have one that we've already heard, uh, which should be representative uh Mayberry's
nurse's bill, so we'll just be voting on that, uh, so I'll take the last bill that we need to hear, which is representing Bentley, which is House Bill 1977, uh, and I believe that will clear our house bills off, uh, that are going to be run, so
Representative Bentley, you are recognized, uh, if you would please introduce yourself
for the record and you recognize you present House bills in 1977. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you committee. State Representative Bentley District 54.
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:03:22
Thank you all. It's almost 7 o'clock at night and I know it's been a very long day. We're all a little bit weary, so I just want to thank you all for staying, uh, and in your committee, I really appreciate it. I will be brief on this. This is a library bill. I have been, um, Hospital 1977. My homeschool mom's, um, and my school board members have just begged me not to give up on library. He says, you know, my kids were little, we could bring
them to the library. They run through there and there's so much enjoy picking up books and bringing books home and unfortunately, our parents just can't do that anymore because there are books in the library that are offensive. Unfortunately, things that are sexually explicit. I never believed it myself till school board members brought me those books and showed me them, so if you guys look at this book is very, very narrowly written. I think I want you to look, um. Let's see, and we're all
tired, so bear with me, uh. I think it will look on page 3, I think it's listed twice for
schools and for public libraries, but look at page 3 and lines 2. Uh, through 15, and you'll see this is very, very narrowly defined, not trying to go a
long way, just actually showing acts of sexual intercourse is what we're looking at here. So if you look on there in those lines, we're trying to be very, very specific and very narrow. I want my grandchildren to be able to go to the public library and pick out a book and enjoy it and not have to worry about, um, Their parents knowing this is there and unfortunately it's, it
is in our libraries and I want to, again, I'm just out being safe for our kids and we're just trying to stop those books from being in the library, they'll be pulled out and it's just a civil cause of action if this, um, um, those materials are left on the open shelves, I think, you know, this day and age, our kids deserve to be saved just when we were as our kids were little, so, um, I'm not gonna be very long because I know that we're all very tired. This is a very simple bill, and this isn't a public library. We're not gonna have, well, if you read that definition on page, uh.
3, there we'll see that's actually describing intercourse actions that we've seen in the book, and unfortunately those are in our library and I don't think they should be there, and I don't think most of our librarians would want them there, but unfortunately, they are, so I want my homeschool kids to be able to go to the library and run and play and enjoy and not have those books on the shelves and the kids at school the same and so, uh, against a very narrowly written bill in that specific area, not trying to be broad, be very narrow and our definition, because I do the AG's office has looked at this, felt good with it far as constitution, that's
good to go and not have have not have any opposition to this bill, but I've actually had some emails from librarians in support of the bill and wanted to work on it with me. So, um, With that, I'll be happy to take questions on this bill because I know that we're all tired. It's been a
long day. Are the questions from the committee? Represent Bentley, I, I would ask a couple questions, uh, if you're willing to entertain them, so looking at page 3 and first I'll just clarify, would
you agree that certainly I don't believe that we
want any of our kids reading sexually explicit material, I think the intent behind this is, is very good. Wouldn't you agree? um yes sir I I wouldn't bring it otherwise. Thank you. I
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:06:31
will say that I really want to dive into page. The
end of page 3 and page 4, which is the civil cause of action portion of it. Yes,
sir. So as we're thinking about what a potential civil cause of action would be, is that civil cause of action against the librarian, or is it against the
public school itself. The librarian. Again the librarian themselves. I'm sorry I didn't bring the lawyer to help me
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:06:56
write. It was Stephanie Nichols with Family counsel helped him write this bill, so to clarify the, the civil cause of action would
be against the librarian. as an individual. Excuse me, can I reread this again? I'm sorry, I read it this morning.
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:07:32
Well, I will Readdress that. It does look like it's the library, the public library. Yes, I would say
it's the public library, so this would be the public
school library. Yes, sir, and the public library and and the the municipality talking about like a county
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:07:52
library, library look on page 4. At the end there it describes a taxpayer funded library means library receives tax funds from local taxes including Laimage
County Library or municipal library. So it clarifies that, um,
I believe there's another section here where it talks about public school library as well. And so the cause of
action is not against the individual, it's against the library itself you are correct, the library. Um here. So what, what would be our, our Our standard that we're trying to set relative to Should someone And again, I have no issues with, I believe that the protection of kids, you heard
me, um, describe that very passionately today on the floor. I believe the protection of, of kids should be our primary objective should, should whatever one of these books might be, um, Should they be left out um Accidentally or placed somewhere incorrectly, uh, does that, does that meet the bar of the two years of the civil cause of action. It says that the text that I think we look here at cause of actions
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:08:57
again, I'm looking on page 3. That they're going to take reasonable steps to ensure That they're not located in the
open shelving areas, so, um. Or be able to be accessible. So I, I think if the
if when that child went to check out that book, and they said this should not have been here and they don't let the child check it out because if we look at their, uh, on lines 24 to 26. I think that the child check it out without, without the parents' consent, then that would be an issue, but I think if they did not, that they would prevent it at that point.
Is that, am I making sense to you on that? And I'm sorry I didn't have the lawyer here today. She'll be here tomorrow, but
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:09:47
We're trying to hear house bills today. So, you, I appreciate
the answer, I guess. As an extension of that question, as we, uh, Potentially proceed forward in that process or parent or grandparent or someone who stands in local apprentices for the, the child brings a civil cause of action, then that would be against potentially against the public school and so with
the public school then be responsible for the costs associated with that. And I, I believe that's specified reasonable attorney fees, costs, what would costs be? So I'm trying, I'm trying to help us establish what potential costs could be for a public school system. Chairman Burks, I I'm not a lawyer, and I didn't, but to me I
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:10:30
would say whatever court cost might be to maybe to file the lawsuit, uh, so I would
say court costs, the reason I ask this question I think it does cost to have their court fees involved, right, in a lawsuit, so
I asked those questions is because obviously within this committee we deal a lot with with costs for public schools. That's that's part of our responsibility. We deal with a lot with with costs, um, perceived costs, um, um, costs that that aren't known. I Unintended consequences, all those things and so that's why I, I wanna make sure that we have clarity on this relative to our, our fiduciary duty to public schools as well. So I'll
jump out and let, I think there's another question or two I'll just say I'll clarify it is against
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:11:14
the library. It is would be against the public school library, you're correct. Um, it would be reasonable attorney fees and I think cost to me would be court costs, so I don't see this's gonna be um. I don't see any pain suffering with or something like that listed here, right, that's not listed here. You know, as I'm thinking of somebody gets injured, then they have a pain and suffering, not none of that's listed here. It's attorney fees and costs, so I would say court costs, but again, I don't have an attorney
here to verify that, and I apologize. Thank you, Representative Beck.
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:11:43
You're recognized for a question. I thought
you had me. Later Um, now, I, I I
do like the intent of the bill, but there's something I, I, I, it's on page 3. Line 27 Aar in our garden whose child has been exposed to sexually explicit material. In the children's section. OK, so maybe that makes me feel better
about it. I, I just need to read it out loud, but the, the concern
I would have, it would be that They're there seems there's got to be some. Level, you know, OK, somebody wants to, to make a big deal
out of this. So someone wants to make some money from the public school. They take a book, they stick it in the children's library section. The kid picks it up. They go out and say, you've exposed my kid to this.
Now let's talk about court. And civil faith and, and that's, you know, you would. That that's could happen. I mean, I mean, it's almost like it needs one of those legal and this is what I'm saying, I think you can do it. It needs one of those legal, you know, and I don't know all the legal words, but it needs one of those. You know, that, that neglect or I don't know what the right word is there, but, you know, that,
that the, the, the librarian was forewarned that it was in that section, did nothing about it. Now, it, it would, it would, you know, I, I, I, I'm not a lawyer. I don't know what these, but all those things like this is wide open, like, you know, someone could say, Their child was exposed to sexually explicit material in the children's section of the library and, and now we're going off to civil court for. Chairman, can I make a motion quick?
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:13:45
I, I appreciate this committee, and it, and I, I love what you guys are bringing forth. I think I, I like to pull this into interim study, um, because it's late in the session, it's really not a chance for us to To get this through both sides, um, at this point you brought some great points, but that's why I like bringing it to committee because I have had great bills at the end of it. So, um, if there's anybody that wants to make my comments, but I think I'm going to pull it at this point and you've brought some great things for me to bring forth to the Lord, uh, to step in that broader force. So if anybody says
anything else, but I think I will, um, yeah, I
can hear some other comments so I do have
a couple of members who'd like to make comments, so I'll recognize those members represent painter you're recognized Representative Bentley, uh, um, I think when you do that, I, I would reach
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
2:14:24
out. To represent a McGrew because he did pass, we did pass a bill that on the public school side, they have to put this stuff in a lockbox area and so I just want to make sure we're, if we've already taken care of that problem, if you're trying to do maybe the public library and maybe go that narrow route.
Speaker 302
2:14:39
That's what I'm thinking we should be able to pull out the whole school part and just make
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:14:45
it, um, public libraries because that's the point of just a bunch of homeschool moms that
I know and my daughter's in the homeschool co op and they would love to just drop their let their kids run around the library and enjoy it, not to be concerned about that. Um, so I think we could just pull it out and do public libraries because I do like representative Cruz and I get it and, and I just don't want us to
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
2:15:06
reinvent the wheel. Thank you, sir. Representative Meeks's comment. Yeah, just, I, I
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:15:09
appreciate you bringing this bill. It's definitely been a problem, especially in my, my community, uh, I'm ready to make a due pass motion on this, but, uh, it
sounds like you want to pull it down and study it further and, uh, so obviously we will respect your wishes there, but, uh, well, I wish I could get you to change your mind. But, but, but I understand. I appreciate that. I think as I read it more
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
2:15:29
I thought about Representative McGrew's bill, we should have just made it for public libraries, uh. Representative Meeks and I will not forget what happened at
your library. We'll see if we can't move forward, OK? Brown for comment. Thank you, Mr. Chair. uh, Representative Painter, uh,
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
2:15:47
covered what I wanted to say, you know, if you think Representative McGrew's
bill covers it for schools then maybe we could just look at the public libraries. Thank you all. Thank you. I appreciate Garner,
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:15:57
do you have a comment or you good? OK, so
representative, uh, mainly just to clarify you're gonna pull down HB 1977 and in earn study. Thank you. Uh, committee, we have one more bill to hear and this is a bill we've already heard, uh, and so we're, uh, to the point, I believe, of closing for the bill and uh motion, um.
From the committee that would be representing Mayberry and House Bill 1242, uh, I will allow additional questions should there be them, uh, as, as a part of the close, so I guess a in Mayberry if you've got any, uh, anything to say prior to closing I would allow additional questions from the committee. OK. Thank you, members, State Representative Julie Mayberry. Um, so there were some questions that we
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:16:41
said we would get back and try to answer for you, and I wanna do that, um, I don't want, I, I. I know everyone's tired and we
want to get out, but I think this is a really important information for you to know. So when we concluded our meeting, we got together with some of our school nurses and began talking and I actually filed another bill, um, that got sent instead of here, got sent to the health committee. And it's sitting there. I'm not going to run it. Because what that bill did is it started a conversation with DHS and with the Department of
Education and what that bill is doing is we realized that there are other states based on some information that was shared with me after this meeting, some other, um, Studies, national studies, and what other states are doing, um, there are other states that allow their school nurses to build for more Medicaid services. And as you may have heard, our nurses are doing. Incredible things in their office, and
This would have no fiscal impact to our school districts. I want to repeat that. It would have no fiscal impact all we would be doing is reaching out and grabbing federal dollars that are potentially there and bringing them back to our school district to be able to provide nursing services because the school district does the match. The school district is not gonna have a problem doing the match. Because they're getting 70% back
into their school district. So, um, I, I, I would love, first of all, um, I'm gonna let Jackie just kind of share a, a quick minute about that because she did bring some of this information to me and I'd also would love for Courtney Solace Ford to please come up and confirm that this conversation is actually taking place, so you're not just hearing it from me, but Jackie, share, share what we've learned. If you would please introduce. yourself and I'll go ahead and recognize Ms. Saliford to
you almost made it up there. I'll just let you keep going the rest
of the way to introduce yourself as well to, to provide clarity here.
Speaker 310
2:19:01
Good evening, Mr. Chair and Representatives. My name is Jacqueline McEwan. I'm a director of health services
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:19:06
for one of the districts in our great state of Arkansas and I'm also a board member of ARNA, the Arkansas, um, Nurses Association and a member at large for the National Association of School Nurses and a member at large for the Arkansas School Nurses Association. I know we're on a time, uh, restraint this evening, and you all have had a really long day, um, but I would like to thank
you for stepping into a leadership role in our state, um, you all have to make tough decisions each day, you're in session, um, and HB 1242 is a bill that I hope you can support tonight. We have gone back to review more data and information, and I will be sharing that info in a little bit, um, and I promise that I'm not gonna read the long monologue that I had last time that I think it was about 5 or 6 pages I was trying to share. the importance of school nurses, um, this evening, but I need your help supporting school nurse pay so that we can provide
the necessary services to our students in this great state. Um, I believe last time, uh, Representative Beck said you got to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges, and so we went back, um, and got some further further data um related to uh state nurse pay. So state nurse pay currently, if you go on to their website and look at their pay, it is currently 63,380 to 96,864 a year, but that's based off of 260 days. I
know school nurses do not work 260 days. We work anywhere from 185 to 190 school days, so I've broken down a comparison to each region that we have, um, so with that pay, um, without talking about the pay that was just passed through the Senate for the state nurses. Northwest Arkansas, their low end, it, there is a difference between state. Pay of $7.77 currently, the, the top salary, there's a difference
of $51.10. Southeast Arkansas, there is currently a difference of $14.77 the high end being $100.55. Northeast Arkansas, there's, uh, the low end is $41.77 per day difference and the high end is $63.05 per day, uh, North Central Arkansas. uh they are low in difference is $53.77 a day and the high end is $90.11. Southwest Arkansas, the low end
is 64, 77, high end, 7689 Central Arkansas, 42, 41 a day, 2269 a day for the high end, um, with the law that was passed for the Senate, the state nurse RN range is gonna be going anywhere from 75,245 to 111, 363. Um, dollars
Speaker 310
2:21:48
a year. I just want to repeat that. So on our end, if you're working for
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:21:56
the state of Arkansas, you're gonna start
out, start at $75,000. I, I just want to make that really clear.
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:22:08
I'm sorry. Yeah, you're good. And that is based off of the 260 days, um, so I had broken it down into the 190 day, 185 day increments, um, for the Northwest region, um, the low end of the salary is gonna be a difference of $53.40 a day, the high end of $106.87. Southeast Arkansas, and I can run through this, but the low end of all of these regions, um,
the lowest is $53 a day for the low end salary all the way up to $110 a day for the low-end salary difference a day and then the high-end salary for all of these regions, the lowest for the high end was $78. 46 cents a day difference to $1056.32 a day. So there is a big pay difference for school nurses compared to the state nurses, um, we could talk about hospital pay as well, but I
think this is the most comparable to compare to school nurses based off of the, the days that we work and us still being kind of we're under the Arkansas Department of Education, so that is a state run organization, um. I also want to share that it was shared with me, um, that For a state. Hospital nurse, a state nurse working. They have one RN to 24 to 30 patients.
On top of that, they have an LPN. On top of that, they have 2 to 3 CNAs on that one unit for 25 to 30 patients. I want to remind you, the last time that I spoke. We have 100s and thousands of people that we are taking care of each and every day, and we have one nurse. Up to 2 nurses, um, at some of our larger campuses, so that's, um, our comparison, um, that you were asking for.
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:24:07
OK, and then, as I mentioned, I filed it's House Bill 1890. Um, if you all wanted to
take a look at it because it kind of will show you the, the information that we shared with DHS and that's where Courtney comes in and can confirm that you have received, um, there is an email exchange confirming that DHS is promising to look into this and help us. find more money, right?
Speaker 26
2:24:38
Yes, I can confirm we received an email, um, to our school health services staff, um, from DHS that they are committed to working with us on setting up reimbursable nursing services for children on Medicaid, so, and we obviously commit as well to work with DHS on
Speaker 14
2:24:52
that. Um, the other part of that that is
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:24:55
um something that we'll just have to make sure when they are able to dip into this federal money
more that, um, because several of the school nurses were concerned, OK, if this money comes back, we need to make sure it stays within the
nursing department, and that was actually in this bill, but we want to make sure because I've, I've been told that some of the other Medicaid money that comes in that nurses are currently doing vision exams and what have you actually go and fund other areas of the school. Um, pair of pros and special ed, which that's all wonderful, but if money is coming in because of the work that the school nurse is doing, it needs to stay in the school nurse office and hopefully that will allow that local school district to
Help find the money to pay for that school nurse, so therefore, um, That leads me to the bill that I have in front of you today. Um, I want to point out that the bill that I have filed for you to hopefully pass. It does not go into effect until 2728 school year. So therefore, The next 2 years, we have time for DHS to figure out how to
make use of those federal dollars. Our school districts will know that this is coming and it will allow us when we are having discussions of adequacy and how much money does it, you know, take to fund our school nurses and all that, we'll have, we'll have updated numbers. Because if I don't, if we don't pass this, then what's going to happen is we're going to come up with the average, um, nursing salary, and that's what's gonna be used in our figures, and that's not enough. That's not
enough. We are going to lose our nurses because they're going to see, they can go work for their county health department and start out at $75,000. That's just the starting point. It goes up to, uh, an RN can make 1 11,000, 75,000 to 111,000. We're gonna lose them. So There, there's my pitch. This puts it out 2 years from now.
It gives us lots of time to find that extra funding. And I asked for a good vote or I'll take whatever questions you might have. Representative Mayberry says has explained the
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:27:26
bill, so, uh, since I've got the big chair now, I'm gonna ask the first question and actually, I was on, I was first on the list committee, so just let you know, I'm not cutting in line. Um, so, uh, yeah, I was listening to the discussion on the getting the Medicaid money to help cover the cost of this and, and first off, let me just say, I appreciate your work on this. I know you've
been working on this for a very long time, so hopefully, maybe this will be the one to get you over the finish line. Uh, but you, you said, uh, talking about trying to get some of those federal funds through the, through the Medicaid. I was looking at the um cost analysis, the green sheet that we got, and there's a comment on there that says that something to the effect of can't bill for Medicaid during school hours. So, oh, you can't. OK, so that was, uh, OK.
Speaker 81
2:28:10
All right. So that was my question. All right. uh
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:28:15
I'll be happy to forward these packets to all of you as
committee members to learn more about it, but other states are billing for more services than what we're.
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:28:26
Here. OK. Uh, first, uh, on the list, uh, uh, Representative Gonzalez Worthen, you're recognized. Yes, um, you
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
2:28:33
mentioned, um, in I guess in a hospital, in a hospital setting, you have your nurse and then you have a LVN and then you have. Um, and then there's so many patients, you know, so.
It, I'm just wondering we passed, we passed a bill in the House. I don't know where it is right now, but related to CHW's and I just wondered like for additional support for school nurses. Um, if that might be, I mean, I, I'm not sure, but I just wondered about that if you've thought about. It may not be something relevant, but I'm just thinking in terms of someone who can be, um, I think Medicaid does cover what they do to help the school
nurse as someone who, you know, can make that phone call, can get kids ready, can, I mean, there's a lot that's involved, I know, with being a school nurse. So I just wondered if, if you've. would that be something to consider when you're looking at, I know we need to look at the pay, but I'm also looking at support because you do a lot. Thank you
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:29:41
for that question. So we do have, we have looked into that, um, a lot of our schools also have UAPs which are unlicensed assistive personnel and we call them nurse aids in
our district or health aides, um, but we, um, the problem is, is that those individuals cannot do all nursing tasks. So that's where we run into an issue of safety for the students on campus is that we have to provide that that necessary registered nurse. At our schools to be able to provide that care, but we're having trouble keeping registered nurses and having people apply due to the salary of the school nurses, so that's
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:30:25
why we're running into a, a big problem. You all set representative. OK, uh, Representative back you up next, sir, and then representative painter. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yeah I appreciate the work
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:30:43
that you guys have done. And I know you're thinking, uh, he's talking, but
The, the apples are apples and all those. I, I appreciate you going out and and you look at that, you're comparing it to it and I, I got
a little, I have to admit I didn't have the data in front of me. I got a little bit lost in the numbers with the 265 days versus 165 and all that. So I, I did get a little lost in your numbers when you're comparing salaries
and so on and so forth. So I, I Probably need a little bit better information on that. But, uh, the, the problem is here is like.
I, I think you captured part of
the problem, right? Some of the money that's going to the nurses, I should be going to the nurses. It's going somewhere else. But that's a local school board issue. That's, that's not a
state issue. Uh, we, you know, that, that it's the same situation that we've had, you know, a teacher salaries in the matrix are, I don't, are they 70, somebody help me out 70 with benefits and
everything, $7600 and stuff and that's not, that doesn't include the loans money. So, my, my point is that the money's not going there. So I, I, here's my concern with this you're
saying, OK, well, we're gonna get this money from Medicaid, so it's gonna be kind of free, not, you know, it's. out there, we can, we can pull it, but then you, you stop just short of putting that in here because if the money's not there, you're committing the schools to this money. If we, if we push this far and say this is what you will pay
your, your nurses, then we're, we're committing the schools with that money. So if that money, it's a DH and I, I, I heard what
you said with the DHS and all that, but that money is not there, then what happens? Well, first of all,
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:32:47
it does not go into effect until 22 years from now. It doesn't matter when it goes, but whenever it goes into effect,
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:32:54
if the money's not there, so first of all, I
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:32:56
believe that the money will be there because we have control of that when we start talking
adequacy and we can certainly, um, make sure that the money is there, just like we make sure that the money
is there for teachers, um, so I, I, I guess I'm having a hard time
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:33:17
understanding. We, we pay the money for teachers. You're talking about going out and I might have misunderstood you.
I'm sorry. You said go out and there's gonna be money that we could pull in from, from, uh, the, uh Medicaid and, and, and say, and say this would help the schools
supplement for the salaries. That's what you said. So were you talking about, oh, maybe I misunderstood. You're talking about that the state would go out and get the money from Medicaid and then somehow fund it through the matrix to the school, or would the school directly
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:33:53
go. No, I'm, I'm, I'm sorry. There are lots of issues, so. Money would be going to the school district for that. For the services of that nurse. directly
not, not through the state, the state. OK, so that's one component. Of all of this. That's not the only component. The other component is us as legislators over the next 2 years when we are talking about, um, adequacy and what do we need? How much money do we need to be sending to school districts to cover our needs, uh, the school district's needs, that would also be part of discussion. If we don't pass
this, then the school nurses are, their average salary is going to be what that average salary is now. And we're not. We're, we're never gonna. put more money in there for them. OK, so there, there's a mixture of two things that I believe will be happening over the next years. And you know what, if it all falls apart, Because of the date of this, we can fix it in the next session. If, if all this just does not work out at all, we can always
come back because of the way that it's written and because it would be 2, Let me make sure I
get my ears right here because it's late. It would be the 27, 28 school
year, um, which means we would have another legislative session before that would go into effect. I I I do understand that and I, and I, I, I apologize because
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:35:31
I misunderstood you initially. I thought you were saying, OK,
this money's out there, we can just pull this money in
and that and I, and I, oh, I like that, uh, and, but now you're saying that yeah, there's some money out there and we can pull it in and DHS is going to help us with this somewhat, and I believe they will, uh, but you're saying that's not gonna cover this, but there will be additional funds that the state will have to come up with. We don't know I, I, I mean, I'm just being as honest as
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:36:04
I, as I can with you. That's what the next two years
will show. Um, I don't think we're far off from it. And I think we have every opportunity in the next 2 years to find this, and if we don't, there's another legislative session that could. Fix it before it would actually go into effect. Yeah, but we're kind of committing to, to this if we
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:36:29
pass this, that we're going to do it and, and it kind of says, OK, we're gonna put the money out there, and I'm not saying we shouldn't, maybe, you know, we,
we should, but it again we're not. and I'll, I'll shut up. All right, sorry, but we're we're committing to this money and we can't just the next section, oh yeah, well, that didn't work out, we're pulling that money back. I've, I've
been here while we came in together and I've never seen us do that. But if we don't ever make this step
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:37:02
forward. This will never happen. It just won't. And can I add something? OK,
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:37:12
help me out. I appreciate your honesty, Representative Beck, and I feel like he challenged me a little bit and I like that. um, but I do wanna say and kind of echo what Representative Mayberry is stating that Nurses are a valuable resource to schools. They save time. They help those students that are in need. We are able to help serve every child. Every child has a right to an education. How I understand the legislative
process is that you wonderful people in this room would be able to help us get to the next point of the house making a decision or the Senate making a decision. So what I'm asking you tonight is to give us a chance. Give us a chance to go before the house to present this to them and let them know how important school nurses are and how much we do for the students in our state. There are untapped resources that we are not using right now. Do we know exactly
how much resource we're talking about. We don't at this point in time, but that's our conversation with the Arkansas Department of Education and with DHS. So that's what I'm asking for you all tonight is to help us get to that point to where we can have those conversations, but also. These school nurses, everything that they do, they need a pay raise. If we are comparing those apples to apples, and then I am truly breaking it down for hourly or daily pay, we still, we're the
lowest paid nurses in the state. And I, I, I'm not really
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:38:48
challenging those, those points. I'm not, and I'm certainly not challenging the importance of having a, the school nurses, an
adequate school nurses at our school. I'm not challenging either one of those points. I, but I'll ask one
more question, then I'll, I'll get back into the queue. Why do you need us to do
anything to go out and seek more money for for teachers. I'm good.
Sorry, for school nurses. I mean, everything you're saying we can go out, we don't know how much money that is
available with the with, with all this, the Medicaid and, and the possible DHS stuff. We don't know how big that pool is, and I, I, I have no idea how big that pool is, uh, but why do you need us to do anything to allow the schools to start doing that right now. This motivates those schools to
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:39:37
actually do it. Well then, why don't we do a bill
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:39:40
to ask the school district. to, to look into alternative
funding for the school nurses that's what the bill
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:39:47
was in the department are over in the health committee, DHS asked me to
not run that. Allow them to work through the process. This holds our school districts accountable because sometimes the school districts, you know, right now they can bill for some Medicaid services. In some school districts don't spend the time to do it. If they know that they have to spend more. to pay those school nurses, they're going to be a little bit
more motivated to fill out that paperwork and, and, and do it. This holds them accountable to actually being a part of this process and I'll, I'll be quiet at this point and
Speaker 325
2:40:26
let someone else ask a question. One more thing
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:40:29
to um to answer you with that is we can't compare nurses to teachers. We can't. We do two totally separate jobs. However, It was agreed upon by the state of Arkansas that teachers do need a pay raise. And that's what I'm asking for
Speaker 310
2:40:46
you all to help us with for school nurses. This may have been answered
when I was out of the room for a moment. Do we have any
school districts that that we know are doing it well in terms of the additional billing, is there anybody that we can can set up and say hey, this is a great example of uh them taking advantage of the opportunities that are out there and then compensating the nurses in correlation to that. So currently the only things that
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:41:16
school nurses can bill for is vision and hearing. And personal care. That's the only thing that we're allowed to do. There are about 10 to 12 other states that are actually able to bill for nursing services for our diabetics, um, for students that have um peritoneal dialysis that for nursing procedures, there are states that can bill for that, and that's what we are hoping that the state will be able to allow us to do and again apologies if if we covered this. Um, is it just
because we, we choose not to bill for those
codes or is it because we prohibit billing for those codes. I don't think
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:41:53
they knew that they could. There was an actual, um, and I was trying to get DHS here, but there was actually a change, a free care policy reversal. And again, I'd be happy to send everybody this information. I know y'all are tired, but there was a policy change that has made it easier for the states now to bill for these services, and that did not exist before. um, and that's what we're trying to. You know, and, and there's some
complications that, that DHS has just said, please let us just work it out on our end, um, the nurse can't build directly. They're not a doctor. You gotta work on, it has to be in there, um, health services plan. Again, this gets really, really detailed, and I don't think y'all want all these details, but, um, that, that is what our hope is, is that we could find more federal dollars that would come to the school district, does not affect our general
revenue budget does not affect our general revenue budget at all, does not affect our educational budget. This is money that's out there that our school districts currently right now don't have a way to bill for. I'll recognize some painter in a
moment, so I guess I'll finish with the would you agree, um, so would
you agree it sounds like we have Pretty good education opportunities for us to, to, to find additional dollars that may be significant, uh, it sounds
like, um, but, but perhaps there's an opportunity for us to uh educate the system about how we find those dollars. Would you agree?
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
2:43:30
Absolutely. Representen, you recognized for a question. OK, and I, and I'll be very short, 2 questions, yes or no would be
satisfactory to me, um, districts technically right now still have the option to. pay their nurses more if they wanted to, correct? OK. Second is, Are those Medicaid options that are out there that we're not, whether we're trying to seek for
waiting on the health department to get off their tail and help us figure that out. Um, is it enough to cover the 5 to $7 million that's on this fiscal impact that that's going to cost our school districts. I, I can't tell you one way or
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:44:07
the other. It, it is, I, I, I'm being as honest as I can. We don't know and to me that's a little scary.
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
2:44:14
I, I support probably the intent, but I'm scared of playing with an imaginary number that we don't know and then I'm leaving, especially my smaller districts on the hook for something. So I appreciate that.
Speaker 255
2:44:27
Representative Nazarenko, you recognize her question. Uh, thank you, Mr.
Representative Jason Nazarenko
Unverified
2:44:31
Chairman. First of all, thank, thank you both, um. I really appreciate it and I remember the last time we, we met
here, you know, and there's no argument that, uh, school nurses from what, you know, was completed by a school nurse years ago to what's completed by a school nurse now, it's incredibly different. uh, what you're expected to, to provide and with the resources that you have, it's just, it's, it's a huge miss compare, uh, so
believe me, I, I empathize completely and I see uh all the time and I've got nurses in my, in my district. That Definitely deserve more, you know, they definitely do. When we start looking at like I know you guys mentioned numbers. I think you said 75,000 for county jobs is what you were talking about, uh, my local hospital, you know, anywhere from 28 to $35 an hour for, for a, a nurse. So what that equates to is about 58,000 to 40 for, uh, the low end and, and 728. So
close to that, that county job. So I mean, that kind of brings me back to, um, and then again, everything I have to say, it's definitely not derogatory because it's, it is, you know, I, I know that you guys are working hard. But it goes back to what uh Representative Beck had mentioned. Before it was like, could they be, could they be overpaid in some places, you know, and, and would we end up putting them overpaid, um, And then I, I, I look at like, I think it's a great that we're coming up with a, with an option
of could we get money from somewhere else. But to my
knowledge, and I'm not an expert. Uh, I work at a hospital, so I reached out to some of the
folks that, that I work with. And What I'm being told, Medicaid for, for, for you to bill for Medicaid, you've got to have a PCP referral. The nurse has got to have a PCP referral, primary care provider referral. In order to Gain that. Is that, is that what you?
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:46:31
Understand as well. So any nurse in the state of Arkansas can apply for an NPI number. The MPI number allows them to be able to bill, um, in our district, we have a consulting physician and that consulting physician could probably help us out with that, but those are the details that we're trying to iron out, um, with regards to that, but we, any nurse in the state of Arkansas has the ability to bill and the nurses that are at your hospital, um, they're all
Speaker 310
2:46:57
the services that they provide. are billable. Right now they're
Representative Jason Nazarenko
Unverified
2:47:02
underneath the hospital and I appreciate that we're looking at Options. What I'm concerned about is that, you know, back to Representative Painters is that we're looking at Possibly making a decision on something that we don't know and then to, to the point we just had a discussion the other day. What's the next couple of years? So if we look at like if we're approving this right now, 27 to 28 school years, he said there, and there is another session in between, but prior to that, we have a lot of unknown. And, and so we're just saying, OK. We're going to make this happen
and boy I wish some of the projects that, that I've done, I wish I could say. I, I'm going to do this and, and my lenders we're gonna Give me the money because I'd be able to get a whole lot more done. Or I'd fail in the process. What I'm concerned, I have a I have a huge concern that that Medicaid. Payments are going to fall into that where we're not gonna be able to bill or the, the nurse is not gonna be able to bill because they're not gonna have the things set up that PCP referrals but that's exactly what DHS
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:48:01
is working on, and that's why they wanted me to
just drop the bill for right now in the session, and they have promised me that they're gonna immediately start working on this after and I think that's a
Representative Jason Nazarenko
Unverified
2:48:13
great idea. Would you, would you agree then, maybe it would be better to pull this and do an ISP and say let's look at the numbers. Let's, let's look at what is true requirement to get that Medicaid, you know, payment, and then once we know, can we get it? How much is it gonna be? Because then we could see there's gonna be a delta. I
mean, we all know there's gonna be a delta, but maybe that delta is workable and then we could say, hey, we can do this, we can make a raise it this much or whatever that, whatever that number is because now we have the the data. Now we have the knowledge, uh, that's my concern, uh. Um Would you agree that it could be, could be a better idea to pull it down and go to an ISP so we have the data. I do understand the reason why I think the bill
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:48:59
is still important is because we want to hold those school districts accountable and we want to make
sure that they. are Going to Bill and see the need and, and again, when we start talking adequacy, we need to know what those salaries are, and we would be basing it on the old salary, you know, the current salary is not an updated salary, and that's all I'm trying to do if if this committee wants to vote it down, you, you do what you feel that you need to do. OK? If it's voted down, yes, I
would like to send it to an ISP, but I still would like to give a motion and see where we are. If it fails, we'll just send it to an ISP, but I think this is absolutely, uh, in my opinion, a way to make sure and guarantee to our school nurses also who might be sitting here saying, I I'm just gonna quit. I, I can go, I can go work for my county health department. Right now, and, and maybe if they know, oh, if I just hang in
two more years, I know it'll, it'll, it'll improve. That kind of gives them the security of it's gonna be there 2 years from now. I'm gonna hang in 2 more years, and that's why to me, this is so very important. I true. I'm sorry. I was just gonna say I, I follow a
Speaker 310
2:50:26
Dave Ramsey's budget. I don't know if you've ever heard of Dave Ramsey, but
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:50:30
I mean, I understand salaries. I understand budget. I understand that there is a financial risk
that you may see with this. However, We have been asking for school nurse salary to be raised year after year, and we're getting nowhere. Certain districts I know, and will say, well, what are the other school districts doing, and that's what they base it off of. They don't base it off of what nurses actually do. They don't base it off of the acuity when we're talking about I have over 11,000 medical alerts in my district alone. That means anybody that has
anything from asthma, food allergies, all the way up to one on one nursing care, I am losing staff. This is critical. I am losing staff. Who's going to take care of those kids? I can't cover 40+ schools. I can't. Or make you recognize your question. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and, and
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:51:30
I appreciate you not putting this in here in a study, uh, from our freshman colleague. She's been working on this for year after year after
year, and what happens is we get to this point in session, this exact thing happens and everyone says, let's put it in your study, let's look at it, and nothing ever happens. Putting this in the grand scheme of things, we spent what, $300 million last year to take care of our teachers, right? This, if we, if we, if we took the entire amount out of general revenue, I am fully on board with that because we're talking about a grand total of $6 million. According to this fiscal fiscal
impact to make sure our teachers are, are make sure our nurses are taken care of because if we don't take care of our nurses and our kids aren't healthy, then that's going to impact, gonna impact learning. I, I mean, if your bill said we were gonna do this today, I would be fully supportive of doing this today because I know how hard you've worked on it. I've had bills I've been passionate on and uh so I, I know the struggle you've been through and, and, and, and don't understand why this has been such a huge problem given the small amount of money we're we're talking. about here compared to the grand scheme of things. So now to my question.
Since this is evidently the very last House bill we're going to hear this session. I didn't want, yes, the grand finale. Let's hope so. I, I didn't want it to get by without having our secretary come come and being able to, uh, to speak to us at one last time. So Mrs. Check, if you're willing, Mr. Secretary. You almost ran out of the room. That's right, almost, almost scared him out. And by the way, colleagues, I was here at the 10:30 last night with the state agencies committee. So if we finish up
sometime in the next 2.5 hours. I, I, I'm still getting home earlier than I did last night. This is, this is, this is important. So, uh, you know, Mr. Secretary, I mean, you've heard the discussion, you understand the importance here. Obviously, I know you're, you're supportive of our, of our, our, our school nurses and, and what they do. Uh, I just wanted to give you the opportunity, um, to weigh in on this, uh, as far as, uh, you know, trying to make sure that we can. Get the money to the schools, hold school, you know, Just would love your input on
Speaker 356
2:53:40
this. Sure, Jacob Oliva, Department of Education. So first and foremost, I, I want to make a
Speaker 358
2:53:46
public statement that nurses do go way above and beyond what you think a school nurse does. And in fact, when we're dealing with um mental health supports and the people that are help driving this conversations and all the complications that students come to us each and every single day. They're integral part of that administrative team. In the day to day function of making sure we're keeping kids
safe, which we always say is our number one priority, and I can tell you as a former um elementary school principal and a high school principal regardless of the grade levels that nurses serve, they are, they can truly make a difference in the impact in school. So I, I, I would always say anything we can do to publicly support our school nurses. I'm always gonna be an advocate for raising salaries, right? So when we talked about like we get asked questions about learns and setting that minimum teacher salary. One of the questions
I've been asked about from not even just school nurses, but we have a shortage of bus drivers, right? So if we don't have enough bus drivers to go pick up kids, and they're not gonna have anybody in school. What about our paraprofessionals? They're, they're working side by side. with some of our most fragile students. Same conversation with school nurses. How come we didn't do anything to help support our classified staff or what I would call our educational family. Well, one, the salary schedule for teachers was written into law, right? So
the salary schedules for all the support staff is not written into law, and that's where the districts are coming together to determine what's the competitive way, what's the competitive rate. My conversation with superintendents had asked me or stakeholders say, how do we get more money for Paros? I can't get in a pair of pros. They're, they're not coming to the classroom. How do I get more money for nurses. We can't get enough money for nurses. I think what we're advocating for is making sure districts have more unrestricted dollars so that they can work locally with their boards and look at salary
schedules that work best for the needs that they're trying to prioritize and fit at the time. In some districts it may be nurses, some districts it may be IT technicians, right? Some district that may be, um, diesel mechanics. I don't know, so I, I, I would go back to, I'm always gonna advocate to make sure we're taking care of our, our educators and um giving districts the the dollars they need. I do believe that Medicaid billing is an untapped or underutilized resource that
needs to be explored and figured out because districts, I feel like would embrace an opportunity to increase revenue so that they can take care of their employees. I don't think there's a district. In the state that's not going to say they don't want more money for their employees, but they, they need to balance all all of the, the challenges that they face as well. So, so, so do
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:56:35
you have a position on this, uh, bill. It's all for you I'm staying neutral
Speaker 358
2:56:39
on this, I think, uh, however, the Legislative delegation decides that I get both sides of the
argument. I, I think that's why you you guys are gonna make an informed decision, do its best, and we're happy to support continuing support nurses working with the, the division of Human Services to make sure we're allocating as much resources as we can. OK, thank you. And then, and then one and, and I don't know
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
2:57:01
if this is for you, Mr. Secretary, or if it's for the ladies. So let's say we, we do this billing, this Medicaid, we start bringing in some of this extra Medicaid funding. Is there any way to guarantee that that goes to actually to the nurses themselves or could the school district just absorb that money
and use it for new playground equipment. Well, like I said, in the
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
2:57:25
bill that I put out there, um, 1890, um, I specifically said it needed to be used for that, um, in what DHS is now doing, there's nothing in there because you know when money goes to a school district, we don't tell them how to use that money and, and all that, so I do think that next session, we might need to wrap that up, but I can't do that
right now. I can't, but that is something I'm, I'm putting out there to make sure that.
Chair
Unverified
2:57:54
It's heard. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Cha. Sinbeck you recognized.
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
2:58:03
I I think everyone here is seeing from the same psalm book concerning the importance of the nurses. The, the, the, the, the, the problem that we have right now is,
I, I, I, I'll just, my concern is this if we put $5
million or $6 million whatever it is that there's no, there's nothing that says that there's no way that we can control that that money would go to nurses. We can't do that. We just like we couldn't do it with teachers' salaries. We can say this is what it was for, but when it gets to the school districts, it goes to spending the way they want to spend it. I, I was wanting to say, I, I would feel much better about it if we had some kind of commitment from the Department of Ed that would say that if we do allocate this money, two
things will happen. Number 1 is, we will look at the other avenues that, that to get this money, that the Medicaid and all that. We're gonna work with that to try to get the maximum amount of money is that. As we could out of that pool and we would say that any money that we allocate into this pool, we would make up the difference then to the 6000 if that's the number I'm just gonna, I was just 6, excuse me, that, that, that the 6 million that that money would then somehow with the Department of Ed would somehow put a collar on and
says, hey, that money goes to the, to the nurses, but without it, we're just saying, here's some money, hopefully some of it goes to the nurses. Uh, but I can't really guarantee that. I, I couldn't, right now, if I said, if I voted and said $6 million goes to the nurses in the budget, in the, in the matrix, just like it is now, couldn't guarantee that. Can I ask you a question? Sure, with you mentioned that teachers
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
2:59:51
and that it wasn't guaranteed for the teachers in the districts, but did the teachers get an increased salary? And even if it was $1 or $2. Did, did they get one? Yeah, they did. OK, so,
Speaker 342
3:00:02
so my point is, what do we do to make
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
3:00:05
that happen? You put it in a no. Why
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
3:00:10
do we do that and learn to make that happen. We said that, that if you take a certain percent of the money that we've already allocated towards teachers' salaries and pay that 2 poor teachers' salaries, then we'll make up the difference.
So there was a there was a catch there,
and, and so that that was the avenue
Speaker 264
3:00:31
that we took there. That wouldn't necessarily work with this, I don't believe.
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
3:00:40
um, and I think that we need to try. We need to try for our school nurses. I'm gonna reiterate again. This is a critical protocol need. We can't have one nurse for 20,000 students.
With 11,000 healthcare needs. We can't. You wouldn't want your kid going to that school district, you wouldn't want that happening. We are reaching that point. Are there additional questions about the committee? See no additional questions. We do not have anyone signed
up to speak for against this bill. Would anyone like to speak for or against the bill. No one would like to speak for or against Reson Mayberry, would you like to close for your bill?
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
3:01:27
Members, I, I, I understand the position. I've just, I'm putting you in, um, if you vote it down. I'm gonna love you, OK? I understand, I understand your concerns. I will put it in an ISP and we'll continue this discussion. But we've been here. As represented Thank you. Here.
Speaker 366
3:01:59
Session after session after session, and I've heard
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
3:02:02
many members say, oh, we'll fix it. We'll help you find a source next time. We'll help you fix it next time. Here we
are again. And so by doing this, it's kind of like we're all in agreement. We know we have 2 years to figure this out, and we're gonna work together to find that. This holds everybody accountable. It holds us accountable, it holds DHS accountable. It holds ADE accountable. It holds our school districts accountable, because
now, if this gets all the way through, we know this is what we're going to do. When In my life I have to set a goal, right? You wanna lose 50 pounds. You set that goal. We've now set this goal. I make a motion for due pass and see
where it lays. Represent Mayberry has presented a house 1242. She's closed forward and we
have a motion to pass on the table. There's discussion of that motion.
Representative Gonzalezor and. Recognized for discussion on the
ocean. Oh sorry, no discussion reference makes you recognized for discussion on the motion. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, of
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
3:03:12
course, I'm the senior guy here on the panel as the representative said, she has been doing this year after year after year after year, uh, I, I understand that the, the concern, uh, you know, Representative Beck had raised about, are we sure this money is going to go? Well, this, this sets a floor to make sure that money does go to the nurses
where it needs to go. We've got a $3 billion annual budget that we send to our public schools, um, for, for the Like I said, for the teachers, we spent over $300 million on top of the hundreds of millions of dollars we already send to the teachers and, and we needed to do that. We needed to get that done. Well, this is the next thing that we need to do. And so I'm fully supportive of this, uh, I appreciate, uh, Representative uh bringing this and happy to vote for it one last time and hopefully this is the time.
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
3:04:06
Represent Painter, you recognize some discussion. I, I am just concerned that we're relying on Medicaid. to come back and pay when, when it's in the crosshairs of the federal government. When they're looking at trying to cut that. And so, I mean, I'm not going to lie, I'm between a rock and a hard spot right now because I, I think we should do something, but relying on the federal government for Medicaid dollars when it has been clearly said that they're going to cut that. And we're just gonna
You know, see what we get and then go on there and fund the rest. That, that, that leaves me heartburn. I like to plan and see figures and not just hoping, you know, and just guess what we're gonna get. So, I'll just leave it at
that. initial discussion on the motion in Brown, you're recognized for
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
3:05:00
discussion. Um, I don't want to be foolish. I've been called a Pollyanna too many times. Um
But we need our nurses in our schools. And, um, $6 million is a drop in the bucket compared to a lot of our other expenditures. So, um, I here representative Meeks and um. He's been around here a while. And I'm going to go with him and I'm gonna support this bill. Represent Beck you recognized for discussion. I'm um.
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
3:05:41
I want, I want to vote yes for this bill. All right, but I'm on, I'm going to say that The path that you've Chosen will end up with us paying the full $6 million because it's not going to happen the way you guys see it. And, and I, I, it, I. And I say that because I hope I'm wrong. I hope that you guys are diligent and that you hold DHS's feet to the fire and say, get this other funding for it,
but if not, it's like I said, we can afford $6 million but it's $6 million more, you know, when I first decided to run down here to, to run for office. I went and talked to some legislators and they, and they told me, they said, you know, it's very rare that someone brings you an ideal down here that doesn't have some. This certainly has merit to it, but they said that you, your responsibility as a legislator to understand the pie is this big. The bigger slice you, you thought of this person, means that everyone else gets a little bit less so, so it's not like
there's just this infinite amount of money out there that we can just jump down. This is taxpayers' monies that we're spending here and it'll there'll be other areas
that we'll have to find the $6 million so I'm going to vote for it, and I hope that, uh, uh, you guys Do due diligence in trying
to find alternative funding things and not just. sit and wait for $6 million. Thank you.
Representative Denise Garner
Unverified
3:07:14
Or garner you recognized for discussion. I just wanna say thank you, um, as a former school nurse. Thank you for what you do, um. We've talked a lot about safety over and over again. We've talked about kids' safety and In hearing that we can't afford this, we can't afford not to. We've got too many kids with too many problems that are not being helped and they it. By no fault of your own.
So I, I don't think we can afford not to take care of the nurses because if we don't do that, we're not taking care of our kids and that's part of the safety issue, so. I fully support the bill and we'll be glad to do whatever I can do to help with that gravy, but even if we pay the $6 million. We can't afford not to do that. In my opinion. Thank you. Seeing no additional discussion. We have a motion
on the table of do pass from Represent Mayberry on HB 1242. All in favor say aye.
say no. Congratulations Reverend Bay. You have passed your bill. Members see no additional business, uh, we will meet on Thursday morning. We'll meet at 9:30 on Thursday morning, uh, represent Painter, are you ready to go, obviously? Uh, we'll meet at 9:30 on Thursday morning. Uh, we will try to knock out all of our Senate bills as much as is possible on on Thursday, so we leave ourselves a little bit of breathing room, uh, relative to the session next week, so we'll
Agenda
RE-REFERRED TO COMMITTEE
Number Sponsor Subtitle
HB1709 Steele TO AMEND THE HUMAN SERVICES WORKERS IN THE SCHOOLS PROGRAM; AND TO INCLUDE MENTAL HEALTH COUNSELORS IN THE HUMAN SERVICES WORKERS IN THE SCHOOLS PROGRAM.
REGULAR AGENDA
Number Sponsor Subtitle
HB1727 L. Johnson TO AMEND THE FUNDING AVAILABLE TO ADULT EDUCATION CHARTER SCHOOLS.
SB402 C. Penzo TO PROHIBIT A PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND AN EDUCATIONAL SERVICE COOPERATIVE FROM REQUIRING OR TAKING CERTAIN ACTIONS RELATED TO EMPLOYEE ORGANIZATIONS AND PROFESSIONAL ASSOCIATIONS.
SB373 Irvin TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS FINANCIAL EDUCATION COMMISSION.
HB1081 B. McKenzie TO REPEAL ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR THE DEVELOPMENT AND ADMINISTRATION OF PROFESSIONAL LEARNING COMMUNITIES.
HB1139 B. McKenzie TO CREATE THE RELEASED TIME EDUCATION ACT.
HB1747 Vaught TO CREATE THE BABIES AT SCHOOL ACT; AND TO ALLOW SCHOOLS TO PERMIT EMPLOYEES WHO ARE PARENTS TO BRING THEIR INFANTS SIX MONTHS OR YOUNGER TO WORK.
HB1761 D. Garner TO INCREASE FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY THROUGH THE ESTABLISHMENT OF INCOME LIMITS FOR STUDENTS ELIGIBLE FOR EDUCATIONAL FREEDOM ACCOUNTS IN THE 2025-2026 SCHOOL YEAR AND THEREAFTER.
SB352 Stone TO PROHIBIT ANTISEMITISM IN PUBLIC ELEMENTARY AND SECONDARY SCHOOLS; AND TO PROHIBIT ANTISEMITISM IN STATE-SUPPORTED INSTITUTIONS OF HIGHER EDUCATION.
HB1482 Gramlich TO CREATE AN EXCEPTION TO THE SCHOOL ATTENDANCE REQUIREMENTS FOR A STUDENT WHO TAKES A GED TEST AND RECEIVES A GED.
HB1492 Gramlich TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL TO IMPLEMENT A MOBILE PANIC ALERT SYSTEM.
SB425 J. English TO AMEND VARIOUS PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE CONCERNING ENHANCED TRANSPORTATION; AND TO DECLARE AN EMERGENCY.
SB547 D. Sullivan TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A HOMESCHOOLED STUDENT LIVE WITHIN A CERTAIN RADIUS OF A PRIVATE SCHOOL FOR PURPOSES OF PARTICIPATING IN AN EXTRACURRICULAR ACTIVITY.
HB1903 Walker TO AMEND PROVISIONS OF THE ARKANSAS CODE TO PROVIDE SCHOOL DISTRICTS WITH FLEXIBILITY REGARDING ALTERNATIVE LEARNING ENVIRONMENTS.
HB1933 McCollum TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF DIRECTORS; AND TO CREATE A RECALL ELECTION AND PETITION FOR REMOVAL FOR A MEMBER OF A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
HB1940 Walker TO ESTABLISH THE REQUIREMENTS FOR A PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT THAT INITIATES AND MAINTAINS A FOUR-DAY SCHOOL WEEK; AND TO DECLARE AN EMERGENCY.
SB484 Irvin TO ESTABLISH A PROCESS WHEREBY A VACANCY IS FILLED ON A SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
SB504 Irvin TO ESTABLISH THE ARKANSAS RURAL PRECEPTORSHIP PROGRAM ACT.
SB559 J. English TO AMEND THE ARKANSAS MILITARY CHILD SCHOOL TRANSITIONS ACT OF 2021.
HB1825 Wooldridge TO ALLOW A PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL TO REQUIRE AN ENROLLED STUDENT TO EARN ONE UNIT OF CREDIT IN A COMPUTER SCIENCE OR COMPUTER SCIENCE-RELATED CAREER AND TECHNICAL EDUCATION COURSE IN ORDER TO GRADUATE.
SB450 B. Davis TO REQUIRE THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION TO INCLUDE A HUMAN FETAL GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION IN THE RELEVANT STANDARDS DURING THE ARKANSAS ACADEMIC STANDARDS REVISION CYCLE.
HB1977 Bentley TO CREATE THE PROTECTING CHILDHOOD INNOCENCE IN LIBRARIES ACT.
HB1242 J. Mayberry TO AMEND THE MECHANISM BY WHICH SCHOOL NURSES ARE COMPENSATED.
SB183 J. Dotson TO AMEND THE UNIVERSAL ACT ASSESSMENT PROGRAM ACT; AND TO AMEND THE TYPES OF ASSESSMENTS PUBLIC SCHOOLS MAY PROVIDE TO STUDENTS.
PENDING FISCAL IMPACT
Number Sponsor Subtitle
HB1999 D. Garner TO REQUIRE THE SECRETARY OF THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION TO PROVIDE INFORMATION REGARDING THE SUPPLEMENTAL NUTRITION ASSISTANCE PROGRAM TO CERTAIN STUDENTS.
HB2000 Wardlaw TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING EDUCATION SERVICE COOPERATIVES, PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICTS, AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS.
DEFERRED BILLS
Number Sponsor Subtitle
HB1027 D. Garner TO CREATE THE BRIGHTER START ACT OF 2025; AND TO REQUIRE THE TREASURER OF STATE TO MAKE A ONE-TIME CONTRIBUTION TO EACH EXISTING AND FUTURE ARKANSAS BRIGHTER FUTURE FUND PLAN ACCOUNT.
HB1030 T. Shephard TO REQUIRE A SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICER OR LAW ENFORCEMENT PERSONNEL TO OBTAIN CERTIFICATION IN YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH FIRST AID AND TO REQUIRE A SCHOOL COUNSELOR TO RECEIVE YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH FIRST AID TRAINING.
HB1031 D. Garner TO CREATE THE ARKANSAS HEALTHY LIFESTYLE EDUCATION ACT OF 2025; AND TO ENSURE THE HEALTH CURRICULUM IN ARKANSAS PUBLIC SCHOOLS ADDRESSES CERTAIN HEALTH ISSUES FACING STUDENTS.
HB1239 A. Collins TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003; AND TO ADD AN ADDITIONAL CATEGORY OF FUNDING FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION FUNDING.
HB1528 McGruder TO REQUIRE A REPORT CARD TO INCLUDE A STUDENT'S CURRENT READING GRADE LEVEL.
HB1539 A. Collins TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SCHOOL FUNDING ACT OF 2003; AND TO ADD AN ADDITIONAL EDUCATION CATEGORY OF FUNDING FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION.
HB1490 Wardlaw TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT A PUBLIC SCHOOL STUDENT RETURN TEMPORARILY ISSUED ITEMS, RESOURCES, MATERIALS, AND PROPERTY BELONGING TO A PUBLIC SCHOOL IN ORDER TO BE ELIGIBLE TO ENROLL IN A HOME SCHOOL.
HB1020 A. Collins TO REPEAL THE ARKANSAS CHILDREN'S EDUCATIONAL FREEDOM ACCOUNT PROGRAM; TO CREATE A NEW EDUCATION FUNDING CATEGORY FOR STUDENTS WHO RECEIVE SPECIAL EDUCATION AND RELATED SERVICES; AND TO CREATE THE COMMUNITY SCHOOLS ACT FUND.
HB1022 A. Collins TO REPEAL PERFORMANCE-BASED INCENTIVE AWARDS FOR PUBLIC SCHOOLS AND OPEN-ENROLLMENT PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOLS.
HB1023 A. Collins TO AMEND THE STATE TEACHER EDUCATION PROGRAM; AND TO AMEND THE ELIGIBILITY REQUIREMENTS FOR LOAN FORGIVENESS AND THE LOAN REPAYMENT AMOUNTS UNDER THE STATE TEACHER EDUCATION PROGRAM.
HB1025 McGruder TO CREATE THE TEACHER FAIR DISMISSAL ACT OF 2025.
HB1144 Wooten TO REQUIRE A PARTICIPATING SCHOOL UNDER THE ARKANSAS CHILDREN'S EDUCATIONAL FREEDOM ACCOUNT PROGRAM TO COMPLY WITH THE SAME STATUTORY AND DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION REPORTING REQUIREMENTS TO WHICH PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE SUBJECT.
HB1197 S. Meeks TO PROHIBIT SCHEDULING, HOSTING, OR REQUIRING AN OUTDOOR PRACTICE, SCRIMMAGE, GAME, OR ACTIVITY FOR AN EXTRACURRICULAR ACTIVITY DURING THE HOURS WHEN AN EXCESSIVE HEAT WARNING HAS BEEN DECLARED.
HB1541 Wooten TO REQUIRE A PRIVATE SCHOOL THAT ACCEPTS STATE FUNDING OF ANY TYPE TO PROVIDE TRANSPORTATION TO CERTAIN STUDENTS ENROLLED IN THE SCHOOL.
HB1542 Wooten TO REQUIRE PRIVATE SCHOOLS TO ADMINISTER AN ANNUAL STATEWIDE
STUDENT ASSESSMENT; AND TO REQUIRE PRIVATE SCHOOLS TO ADMIT EACH STUDENT WHO APPLIES FOR ADMISSION AND INTENDS TO COVER PRIVATE SCHOOL COSTS WITH STATE FUNDING.
HB1755 T. Shephard TO REQUIRE EACH PUBLIC SCHOOL TO PARTICIPATE IN THE ARKANSAS PREVENTION NEEDS ASSESSMENT SURVEY.
HB1924 Puryear TO REPEAL THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION ESTABLISH RULES REGARDING THE IMPLEMENTATION OF FOUR-DAY SCHOOL WEEKS.
HB1962 Vaught TO PROHIBIT A SCHOOL FROM SERVING OR SELLING ULTRA-PROCESSED FOOD ON THE SCHOOL CAMPUS DURING THE NORMAL SCHOOL DAY.
HB1990 McAlindon TO AMEND THE LAW CONCERNING HIGHER EDUCATION.
Documents
| Title | Type | Pages | Source |
|---|---|---|---|
| Agenda — EDUCATION COMMITTEE- HOUSE, Apr 8, 2025 | Agenda | 3 | Official source ↗ |
Speakers
Representative Keith Brooks Chair
Unverified
Representative Steven Walker
Unverified
Speaker 14
Chair
Unverified
Representative Jessie McGruder
Unverified
Speaker 26
Speaker 33
Representative Rick Beck
Unverified
Speaker 40
Representative Jeremy Wooldridge
Unverified
Representative Julie Mayberry
Unverified
Speaker 62
Representative Stetson Painter
Unverified
Representative Stephen Meeks
Unverified
Speaker 25
Representative Justin Gonzales
Unverified
Speaker 108
Representative Matt Brown
Unverified
Speaker 156
Representative Denise Garner
Unverified
Speaker 12
Representative DeAnn Vaught
Unverified
Speaker 180
Representative Wade Andrews
Unverified
Speaker 191
Speaker 192
Speaker 196
Speaker 207
Speaker 208
Speaker 209
Mark Barnes
Unverified
Speaker 145
Representative Austin McCollum
Unverified
Representative Lincoln Barnett
Unverified
Speaker 140
Speaker 238
Gary Newton
Unverified
Speaker 242
Speaker 245
Speaker 248
Speaker 252
Speaker 259
Speaker 271
Speaker 272
Representative Mary Bentley
Unverified
Speaker 302
Speaker 310
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
Speaker 81
Speaker 325
Speaker 255
Representative Jason Nazarenko
Unverified
Speaker 356
Speaker 358
Speaker 342
Speaker 264
Speaker 364
Speaker 366