State Agencies & Govt'l Affairs- House

It's Monday and Committee has sent out emails and emails and emails to people that have filed a constitutional amendment but the we're not getting any responses back so my plans are you know we may have our effort to get people in here to run their constitutional amendments and so we'll probably will do it today and then we'll see how it goes it probably go through Monday and then after that we'll we'll try to close it out so what the The school year started with today's meeting thank all of you for being here. Of the person on the day's agenda is house bill one six five five by representative Penzo bent representative Penzo we. Have a seat at the end of the table. You have anybody you need to bring up this time. I do not okay then you're recognized to present your house bill thank you Mr chair. House Bill sixteen fifty five. Sets a municipal filing fees for office it not to exceed twenty five dollars. It also in section two. Of makes it to where Instead of made changes the words shall That the municipalities request the county party committees of recognized political parties to a. I have primaries. Political primaries. So the result would be the municipal races would be partisan. If. People could still run as an independent do the same manner they do now it just would allow for party primaries one of the biggest of the questions I had for the last election I had a lot of phone calls. Asking me. Hey the candidate for this position this position or they Republican or Democrat this person Republicans this person Democrat they wanted no you know of their policy positions before they get into a. got elected for voted on. Be open any questions if anybody has any. Okay you the catch presentation on the bill representative Penzo you ready for questions that are near you yes okay Representative Representative line you're recognized for a question the famous Speaker. A resident Penzo so what this will do. And this is a battle I fought a to give major back in the eighties when when we were try and in south Arkansas we're. A Republican could get elected to delays quiet a we tried to get these local of those minutes for right race is nonpartisan so some good business people and and people of more conservative persuasion could get elected and so what we would be doing here instead of making it optional for any city. They would they would have to have a primary or or designate that the the candidates are running about party Republican or Democrat is that what we're doing that that is correct usually you still have the opportunity to run as an independent though okay is there would be no there would be a Republican or Democrat would be a nonpartisan election that's what we're trying to do here correct okay thank you. Thank you representative gene representative lab you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chair representative Penzo now. I'm I'm just now reading this bill and you're taking up the committee and so that. Tells me or. News cities they already have the option to actually. DO power primaries right now I don't think that is correct they could run resolution And and make it partisan if they wanted to. Okay so if if they already have the option to do that then. Why would turn into a shower or are are you have in cities come to you saying that. They are preferring no no if the I'm having constituents that would coming to me not municipality amend constituents come to me asking me for transparency in the election process they want to know if the person on the ballot is a conservative or liberal or Republican or Democrat they want some sort of transparency long with a person instead of just some person filing for position they don't know of which which way their policy positions. The so I just would provide transparency for the The voter's. The so could they not already. Ballot petition to get this done if that was if if the elected officials chose to I don't think I don't think the majority constituents realize that all they have to do is ask their you know city council to run the resolution. I mean it's not that it's not common knowledge I I didn't know it does start to get a look at the looking into it and I served on city council if I'd known at the time I probably would run resolution for my municipality to make the races partisan because a lot of times you see you see two two warring factions within a municipality everybody thinks it's just the Hatfields and McCoys they think it's all personal issues but the reality is there's policy differences when you when you get into the middle the situation you realize. Birds of a feather flock together you realize that the conservatives are on one side the liberals on the other side and they're having debates between himself and on the outside if it's not partisan people just think they're just can't get along but there's actually partisan you know issues that are are there it's just people don't realize. Thank you. Thank you representative Cozart you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr so I just let me wrap my head around talk to representative Dotson little bit this morning about it so if I'm going to file to be a mayor of hot springs which I don't live in the district in that area but I live outside the city town or file I have to choose a party to run under you do not you do not know this does not make anybody choose a party it does not it just allows for the parties to put forth a candidate to be on the ballot so liquors although say the Democrat party because site this is by Democratic candidate for mayor the Libertarian Party could put forth their candidate for the Republican Party can perform I can more understand and or will you still run as an independent thank you Mr. A representative Miller you're recognized recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chair of. Represent Penzo I'm. I was late I'm sorry Right now. Let's say we I mean obviously we do have some municipalities in the state. Who are parts of. Right now understood and. But in those who are those that are I think I don't think there's one in my district I think all of the ones my district go independent is there anything currently nail. That prohibits so I I was on city council before I came down here Debated the intelligence of that move sometimes however. Was there anything right now that would have prevented me maybe I'm fixing it in trouble the ethics department I don't know when I ran for council. And I had some flyers and whatever you know identified myself. As a conservative Republican I believe. Was I in the wrong for doing that can candidates currently do that now you you can't be on the ballot as a Republican but I don't know if there would be any issue I mean that be something that had been discussed with the party I don't I don't know if they would. don't know the answer to that Khalfallah Mr yes Sir. So if if this if we pass this out of here. Even a tale to let's say Quitman Arkansas in my district like probably four four six hundred people. Mayor of a city council mayor all not part of their elected based on who they are. People know of. They will be. They will be forced to pay Republican Democrat or independent. Or libertarian or any other recognized party and then they'll say and then they'll be a primary the B. primary for the parties and then the Republicans put their winter Ford and in the winter from the parties will run against the independents in the race. Okay thank you. Representative back you're recognized. Thank you Mr of. Just for. Revocation on. Representative Miller's thank you know those people would they would necessary run on the party that can run independent right correct okay so that would be there would be no party affiliation associate with them the question I have and this may be for you or maybe maybe someone else's here's to speak with the bill granted this I'm curious as to what percentages of the municipalities now run partisan or nonpartisan and I don't know I mentioned somebody that's going to be coming at the table next could answer that question. Okay all right. Question at the time then I guess. Representative Ladyman you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair. In light representative Jean I kind of struggle with this but but I'm a little younger than him it was in the two thousands lane you twenty years before me. But you know at the key at the city level well my experience was you know I I didn't know anything about parties when I ran for the council I just thought a is a good idea they needed some help I thought I could help and I. I didn't know anything so it's it's kind of an entry level position in the politics or that's the way I looked at it now I don't wanna down green your when you served on the council that. But no I mean it is it is an entry level really where people get into that and and I didn't know anything about parties and I don't know what this might be putting some people who are fresh into this business at a disadvantage and it says they may do it now and I know you're saying you were on the Council and you say people didn't know well I I think we need more involvement at the local level to dig into what the council what power they have and they need to be more involvement but. I just feel like they need they need to make the decision at the county level and with your bill they don't make that decision we're making it for them is that correct I mean elections you know the the for the state are usually handled by the state and is not made at the county level it's made at the municipal level but I mean I guess the. There there isn't Transparency bout who's been elected and and I'll and I'll I'll go ahead and tell you a story when I first got on city council you know the way it works was the the mayor presented a budget okay the council has to approve the budget so I get the budget and I'm like its. To what is your read in our state budget single home sit down and go through its a few pages you know you you you go through it and you're looking at everything and so I start going around the department heads and I said. Why do you need a brand new back. And they're like oh I don't need a brand new back I just request a symbol used on work and I said sure I said did anybody talking about this now the mayor didn't come talk to you know he just prepared a budget okay so. Struck it. Estimates it would cost for good use back need tell me so afield in the. Fill in the blank with the price for you use back and I went through every department and asked every department had what they needed and I think I just took out there were hundreds of thousands of dollars pulled out of that budget. Brought it back to the Committee. Presented it. Mayor got mad and quit that's fine. But. That's that's the importance of people put in a conservative in that position. If that's what they want in that position people didn't know what was a conservative they didn't know I was going to going to butcher the budget in in stream line it but I did. If if if people don't know you know in semi Nyssa penalties you know you compare Springdale and Fayetteville. I think the people in fate bill want to know who the the Democrats are there run and I think the people in spring no one knew who the conservatives are that's the beauty of you know. Local elections is that that's the closest to the people but if there's no transparency I know a lot of people hid behind stuff we still have people that hide behind their you know of a label right now that may not represent them but that's that's going to happen but I think that the voters deserve to know. Who they're voting for and and if they want to conservative they need to know who's running who won that conservative Republican primary and if they wanted Democrat they want need need to know who who the Democrats elected to represent them and I think it's just a matter of transparency. McCollum you're recognized for a question. My question was already answered it. Which was it can you read as a independent state on it sounds like you still can I've also heard this is an attempt to make to allow parties to raise more money because you're forcing someone to. Run as a part file with a particular party the. I guess you have anything to say that I'm that's that's one of the the the fees were capped at twenty five dollars we could have put in the whatever we wanted to but we don't want to is it about. This in about make raising money this in about you know keep thresholds low and allow people because it is an entry level political positions so we did one of huge barrier to prohibit people from being able to run for a party if they wanted to. Penzo I'm just I'm just curious and I listened to the testimony you know I mean you know we we really support local control and and people to be able to make those decisions at local control do you thank your bill is taken away from some of that local control to be able to allow them to make their own decisions in regards to. How they decide to run their city or the city council or how they choose to do that. Well like I said earlier it's it's the state's decisions on how how elections are to take place in the state I I am a big fan of local control but you know you you want to get down the local and that's to constituent not think do you know Transparency the constituent probably outweighs the the control of the municipality I'll always will be in favor of the constituent over. Anything else. The representative revenue recognized for a question. Representative Whitaker you're recognized. Thank you Mr. Just in the side before I sexual questions on which how know how we do it for them six sentence such a mystery we got a courthouse of voter file. And if you built in like the last six democratic primary you're probably good. And if otherwise you probably not. Do you recall that what's that you know what they call that taking the voter file that with its called an educated voter yeah. It it's so common fate bill that one time somebody filed to run for city council so we went to pull the voter filing within six hours everybody in town knew this person everybody the election before it was the shortest city council campaign per. That's how it's done but my question is looking here currently at as you probably know municipal. Filing is a small position type thing in most towns even in favor of the loan of a really low number and it's traditionally done in the summer farmers market because usually late July and August when the file from municipal office. Now if we do this they're gonna have to file my correct in assuming that they're going to have that All municipal candidates are going to have to file when we file in when the rest of the state party's final I'll get. Yeah I mean there's there's different timelines for the independence and the the primary I believe even with state level but it would probably be earlier okay Uppala. As. Of. I'm also a little trouble to us as a former democratic county chair Traditionally this this government has not stepped in and set the party filing fees. My fact every time that kind of legislation been attempted the parties basically the parties and their representatives here basically said bye bye get out of here. Why is this an exception where the party won't be able to set their own fees. Like I said I was just trying to keep the center was a municipal race I was trying to keep the barrier. From being too high it's zero nine would say that's probably the lowest we can get it's still zero if you want to file a petition and I had to get twenty signatures to run in mind municipality so I mean that that threshold is very low and zero if you want to run as an independent. I thank you. Thank you of representative Payton you're recognized. Thank you Mr solve our lot about local control in the city's currently can make a decision on whether or not they're gonna be partisan. I mean I don't see your bill is state control it moves it on down to the candidate gets to make the choice that. The Tallassee it I mean you can still run as an independent if you want to or you can choose a to run for a party so you can't get much more local than the candidate making the choice on whether a Republican and I did I just like to say folks I didn't have no wonder you all are all ahead of me I didn't serve on the city council or the quorum court not enough my first foray was drawn for state representative always considered myself independent and I knew very little about the parties and but I decided to run a drug got the platform for both parties not decided which one I supported because I knew there were voters everybody Payton is your question in there yes yes Sir okay we'll just wondering okay well I've heard some other stories okay well I thought I could preface question with the story. But I'll keep it short make a long story short. I took the party label to try to make sure that the constituents that I could not shake hands with the meat knew something about what I was going represent. Don't I mean you said a lot about transparency don't you think it's important that a candidate. Have a means to portray their positions to constituents that they'll never get a chance to meet before the election. I think so that comes back to the inform the voter I mean not everybody I think it's important to be able to explain who you or if if that person does it have the in in you know when you when I ran for state representative you know came from you know as a city council member when I. When I ran for for state representative in I had that are next to my name you wouldn't believe how many my friends were like what your Republican you know just because we've never talked politics we didn't you know they didn't know who I was so thank you I think you know it it's important for people to understand what your platform is would you stand for. Thank you thank you Mr thank you representative gene did you have a question. One more in. Riveted Penzo may have an answer but if anybody follows a can answer this. since I've been a JP Mayer and representative ever filing fee I've ever paid go to a county committee or the state committee I'm not sure we can we can Senate come off of the filing fee for a any either primary Democrat or Republican and somebody knows more about election law can answer that question but that's just a question of that. Okay thank you refugee representative Dotson. Thank you Mr chair representative Penzo I I really appreciate this bill this I know when I ran for city council this was the number one question I was asked campaigning knocking on doors was are you Republican or Democrat trying to explain to somebody that I was independent but. Conservative and it sound like I was dodging the question they're like but wait what are you and it's like well this is not a partisan race and trying to get into explaining all that was was rather difficult but that was the number one question that everyone asks me and this is a. Very often requested thing by my constituents the vast majority of people who talk to me about this want to know. Where somebody stands before they go vote and they want to know that when they get in the ballot box so As I understand this bill and correct me if I'm I'm wrong in understanding this this would. Currently under current law. Municipalities can prohibit candidates from filing for partisan. In the person primary by not passing a resolution this simply allows the opportunity for everyone to file however they see fit whether it's Republican Democrat independent Green Party common ground or other And then also they can file as an independent. That filing would be at a separate time so it's still be the traditional time for filing is independent but it just would disallow if this passes a municipality from prohibiting people candidates from filing with the a party district thank you. Kate. Ladyman you're recognized. Thank you Mr I just noticed something in this bill it says City or town with a mayor council form of government why is the city manager form of government not in here. We've got three cities in the state that have a city manager's point of one part of the current statute I'm not sure. I didn't address the that form of government I don't. I don't know it has the same structure just as a city manager form of government revenue municipally comes up there okay how we live right on that one. Okay no us in a public committee members signed up to speak Page questions on the bill we do have Mr marchesa and up to speak against the bill you Mr age. You would just do it by yourself and. Hello you speak against the bill and The device up for the Committee place yes our markes I'm the executive director with the Arkansas Municipal League I have worked for the league in various capacities for over thirty years they don't let me practice law much anymore but I think I can probably answer most of the questions that have been asked with regard to municipal government and in the functioning of elections there are five hundred cities and towns in this state some of them as small as forty five people this bill would affect two four hundred and ninety two of them. only eight cities have a city manager or city administrator forms of government hot springs being one of them Little Rock barley Fort Smith hope. Hot Springs let that there's there's eight total improv left where asylum springs at the other. so they're all but with the exception of Barling they're all relatively large cities. This would dictate. A methodology that's never occurred for local government for except where local government officials or their citizens wanted a partisan election which is available right now there are about. I don't have a heart count is around ten nine or ten that have done that over the years some have gone independent for a while nonpartisan and gone back to parts some have stayed of partisan through thick and thin no matter circumstances and does some of them have a good twenty probably twenty five year history of park selection all that's available is not just the city council could make that decision if the citizens one to do so they could put it on the ballot and and change. So there really isn't a more transparent form of government and municipal government for those of you who who served in it you know that you see your constituents. All the time you see in that church you see in the grocery store you see in the football games you see them all the time and as a result they know you they know if you're a conservative or if you're a liberal or if you're a fiscal conservative or a social conservative they know all that and if they don't then they're probably not well educated I would I would agree with you thank you so that earlier but more importantly there's nothing that prohibits you from saying those things as a candidate none you get the I. I don't want to speak as far as identifying yourself with a particular party because I don't know that body of law I I so want to be very careful here but there's nothing that would prohibit you from putting for mayor of conservative candidate so on so forth I'm I'm as old as representative Jean and I remember exactly what what he went through and and how we wound up changing that body of law so it's worked well I'll just tell you that I'm not aware of a problem I've yet to hear a single problem raised I know some of you have had constituents ask but I think that's what constituents ought to do are you Republican or you Democrat are you the conservative for you not a conservative that's what that's what you do if you want to understand who your vote for so I don't think you're prohibited from telling them what your philosophies are the fact that you're running nonpartisan doesn't mean that you don't have conservative viewpoints. And I'm certainly happy to take questions Mr. Thank you Mr aid first question we have is represented to or while you're recognized for a question thank you Mr Clark on whale. Yeah when you will mental for you don't need to set the table but would you what would be your definition a local control the way it is today our this bill and when I say that right which way gives the citizens the most choice the way it is right now they have the ability to change the law if they want to they have the ability to put people into office they could change the law if they wanted to so it's it's all within the confines of that particular city or town thank you. Representative Miller you're recognized. Thank you Mr. Of. Can you and I was on city council like represent Penzo I didn't know it was in Heber springs it I don't think this is better issue I think everybody's happy with the way it is up that doesn't mean that's the way it is all over the state I certainly understand that however. What me through the process of changing that loud is just one city council member following ordinance say and we're going to we're going to do this and they get a majority of votes and that's it it's a resolution actually resolution okay Sir ordinance that's it. Simple majority yes Sir. Okay thank you. Thank you representative that you're recognized. Thank you Mr. That discussion I have to admit. The upcoming going back and forth here they. I do recognise representative Dotson's comments about no it does you know people do as they want to know whether you're Republican so my question to you would be this what would you say is a major problem with this bill were to pass. So I think you're taking the local control I thank you for seeing a city to engage in a primary set of elections and somebody's got to pay for that they're not doing that right now. So follow up. I may be wrong about this and there's probably somebody who knows is in the audience but I think the state pays for those elections I will swear to that is that right I am getting. All right you're recognized. This. That doesn't doesn't force a primary election it it it. Mmhm I mean but that would the moral I guess my question would be is it would it would give the ability of someone to. Put Republican or Democrat or their name on the ballot this other name on the ballot. And it would do that. and that doesn't necessarily mean that would be a primary there were no opposition. It within the primary. There's no opposition yes Sir. Use our secure is it it's it's it's an interesting situation thank you but I just don't see the problem the primary problem I guess is a big issue but I think discussions all round which what is local control I guess I think I've heard both sides of that. Thank you Mr. Thank you representative Jett Ladyman you're recognized thank you Mr chair so market for Say I'm a city and and and this passes and we have to have a primary and then we decide is the mayor and city council that we want to not have primaries. How do I do that you don't. What there's what's the pathway to change in the state law change the state law. Right now you have the option. Person or not so what on the question I asked earlier about these ten cities that have a city manager form of government. So they would not be required to do this under this bill not under this statute they have a separate set of statutes that read very similar to this but you would have to get in order to get those to other administrator manager forms you have to have the those statutes amended as well those sections would be included yes are thank you. Representative Jane you're recognized. Thank you Mr Speaker. The trays of the getting back and maybe you know the answer maybe don't of on the filing fees. I mean it have run to run for a quorum court city council parts selection usually used on the local level the county committee of the Democrat Republican Party set the filing fees state level it is the the the party state party center. Okay we can the we set local party filing fees to the state I honestly don't know the answer to that question I eight it would be concert everything I've ever understood but I don't want to tell you something that might be out on a limb okay but it would be caught your what I've always understood what I've always done the bright eyes I don't know the actual landscape thank you thank you Mr chairman. McCollum you have a question. Yeah I guess you know to your point about locally elected officials being night maybe even closer to in the day to day and with people I think you said because then they know the people to go to church with they know who they are. they spent a lot of time and you said whether they're conservative or liberal or you know whatever their affiliation is. I guess if if they already know it. Then what what is the downside to allowing these individuals to. Set to say what they are In terms of a party affiliation. I don't think there's a downside to saying who you are that's not what this bill does though this bill forces cities to have a particular kind of election rather than allowing the local control of either the citizens or counsel to make that decision but in that particular type of election they can also say that they don't belong to a party either is that correct thank you say if they can identify themselves however they wish. Okay. Okay committee members the chaise hopefully no further questions thank you Mr chairman I appreciate you thank you yes Sir. Representative Penzo. Are you ready to ready to close for put your bill. I am Mr The judgment that no one else signed up to speak for against the bill just so I don't overlook anyone there's ninety one room which speak for against to correct. Okay I just wanna make sure you're recognized representative. First of all I'd like to thank Mister Hayes for point out that we missed the eight municipalities will be sharing kitchen another bill if So it was mentioned. It was mentioned that would have to we were forcing municipalities to have a An election a primary election. There's already every two years a primary election held because if there's a candidate in the state that's running for something I mean every two years we already have a primary election so just wanna make sure there's no exhalation costs that would be associated with this because we already have a primary. saying we can't set the fee of twenty five dollars I have a hard time believing that we can't I could be wrong but I thought if the the simple majority of us decided to do something I mean we're lawmakers we might be overstepping something but that's that's the we will look into that a little bit further but I don't I don't think there's a problem with it defected saying everybody in the town that I lived in New my political affiliations or my leanings political leanings is is further from the truth I came in and and trimmed a ton of fat off the budget but yet when I ran for this office. Every conservative group was in opposition to me and then after my first of the legislative session they all gave me awards for being one of most conservative legislators in Little Rock but they were all in opposition to me because they heard I was a Democrat running as a Republican so so to say that. People know who you are politically I don't go around talking religion and politics people I didn't. It's kind of hard not to because I'm on TV right now but but but the thing is. If people don't know who you are they don't know if you're leaning right or left and then you know all the just like to finish up with the local control argument I don't I don't think I think the candidate should be able to run as a Republican or Democrat like representive Dotson said that's about as local as you get the constituent I care but with the constituents one more than I care about how the municipality wants elections to be ranks like I said that's our decision not to municipalities and if I think we need to look out for with the constituents one I think overwhelmingly the people in my district I don't know but jails but in my district they want to know who they're voting for every door I knock on are you Republican or Democrat Hey this last cycle it just happened to be do you believe in science that was the the the question but. Republican or Democrat usually the Usually the question it comes out of people's mouths so I just ask as for good vote. Okay represented Penzo as close with these bill. What's pleasure of the Committee. I have a motion do pass any discussion on the motion. Representative McCollum you're recognized for discussion on the motion of a do pass. Yeah I thanks I guess I just. Like to say I don't really understand the the discussion around like what might be more fair for the individual running for office to me my focus is on the constituent in the voter I guess we we probably all have very different experiences from the districts were from I'm more sympathetic to the experience that represent Dotson shared which is one of the things my voters and constituents often ask me is you know what is the party affiliation and no I have not ran for for local election but individuals that have ran for local election in my area they share that same experience so if my goal is to. Inform voters and that is one of my goals to me this allows voters to be more informed and I guess that's your point about transparency is it is a more transparent process and that it's more information in terms of political and for affiliation to the voter I mean I I suppose I see the you know that the other side of that too but I just try to land on what's my goal okay I want voters to have more information about the candidate and my other goal of this is voter turnout I want more people to turn out I know that more people turned out when they know. The political affiliation of the voter how do I know that when you look at and I can remember what the term is on the ballot when individuals vote on the ticket but they pass over certain elections down the ballot basically yeah. All of the statistics point to that date they don't vote and the ones we don't know if there's a party With that individual and so. In fact in the places that have change that I've seen that the participation goes up for those races whenever they have a party next that night anyway so I guess I just like to say four for the reason of transparency in voter turnout I'm I'm a yes so thank you. Okay representative back you're recognized for a question. For a discussion Sullivan I just want to E. I. see boast that I'll be honest with I can actually see voting either way on this side but the concern that I have right now is I think it's filing fee issue is a bigger thing anything because I don't know of any filing fees are set by the state they're set by the local parties and I think you might pull letter something and say you could put it. I thank you I think you have to address that issue because I I I I don't think that we can set filing fees. Thank you representative Beck corruption derive you're recognized for discussion on the motion thank you Mr well I ran for office in twenty ten I ran a local control and keep in the decisions as close as possible and I understand that the state is here to bring things together to make things more efficient and and that's what we need to do and this bill to me doesn't make anything more efficient at the local level so with that I would ask committee members to vote no and retain that local control at the local level. Representative gene did you have a discussion on the motion correct yes Sir Mr chairman. Brigitte print Penzo I appreciate what you're trying to do here and I have I represent five the city of magnolia and then. For the cities that are thousand dollars thousand population lives everyone of them has this option they can be partisan. they got elected do that locally are they are you can run non partisan and everyone want to keep that in this the this just not keep a city. From being a partisan city if it wants to be the way it is now. This bill will make us dictate that all cities will run. and and have have a partisan election. Thank you can run as an independent that's true but right now party affiliation has nothing to do with the five cities that I represent they want to keep this will also we all voter districts and just because not everyone part of the State of comes to you doesn't mean the whole state believe that way and but but my district as against this the towns I represent against the S. and I will will be voting against it. Thank you representative J. represent the thanks you're recognized for discussion on the motion. Thank you Mr chairman and this may be a new wants file from my colleagues are concerned about the siding of the filing fee with the the bill doesn't set the filing fee the bill sets a maximum for the filing fee of twenty five dollars so it's actually the parties that are still setting the filing fee selected Senate at ten dollars fifteen dollars twenty dollars so I mean the the language that shall be fixed an amount not to exceed twenty five dollars so the parties are actually still setting that fee we're just setting a cap so thanks a new wants there but I think I think it's an important nuance I'm supporting this bill because I think everybody that runs for political office has a bias and that bias determines your governing style and I think for the transparency of the voters it's important for them to understand the governing style of their that individual and so for that reason I'm personally enough support this legislation okay thank you representative makes representing Gonzalez you're recognized thank you Mr chair I just want to touch on something Wardlaw said about proficiencies of this it does have potential to save save cities money because it could possibly eliminate some run off elections when they when things are decided in the primaries they don't have a whole bunch of folks run and that turns and and of and run offs so there could definitely potentially be. Savings in this. Okay thank representative got representative Miller you're recognized production on the motion. Thank you Mr and of. Represent Penzo you know I'm with you like ninety nine point eight percent of the time and nobody in here has said anything that I disagree with literally I'll for my experience. In my town in my area. Which I've heard from most of them and nobody wants it I feel of a duty to represent their wishes I don't have a problem then and matter of fact I fully support. In some areas municipality races being partisan. If that's what those folks one but you know in a in a small town in rural Arkansas. You can have of. You can have somebody get elected who. Might be You know might be a Democrat. I mean in my in my home town. Where I have some or another managed to get elected a few times of I'm about as far right wing is you can get. And I don't have the shock. And and we've also the those same folks have also elected to city council and a quorum court of voter Democrats. Because they they vote based on the job that people are applying for and so I have no. I have no problem with the city's going to partisan elections I just don't want us to. To mandated. and it you know. I think I think the control needs to stay at the city level. and let of letter represent our a a city council member and alderman. Ray resolution to to change it if they want to if they're represent their constituents of anyway I'm going to be not voting for this bill but appreciate the discussion. Okay representative dodging you're recognized for discussion on the motion thank you Mr chair I'll be as brief as possible I mean we've heard a lot about local control and I think that's a buzz word thrown around quite frequently. Here that If you we've discussed it and back and forth local control of government. A local government is still local control over the citizens and the citizens the constituents That I've talked to throughout the years there's overwhelming public support for this if they even knew it was an option it it's a matter of trying to get. That information to folks I served on the city council for four years and I was completely unaware until I started serving in this body that it was as simple as running a resolution. When I have that that that option I've pulled various municipal elected officials throughout the years and none of them have known that they can run a resolution before and so I think this is. Part of its lack of information. But. The only opposition I've heard from this have been from currently elected folks that do not want anything to change they don't want that transparency they don't want that accountability they don't want to have opposition from candidates that might be able to run for a a different I. diligence ideological viewpoint from what they currently have so I think this is a good bill it certainly has my support and I appreciate a good vote. Okay RepresentativeHouse you're recognized for discussion on the motion. Thank you Mr chair I've got two issues with this one of them being the filing fee Being said or even with a Max because you know right now with twenty five dollars and a smile I could be a Republican. And you know I actually have a pretty Republican bonafides you know my office I've got pictures a Reagan of that pictures with me of bush and Cheney and I don't mean to make party politics here but this partisan bill. And and so I think this cheapens it could I mean everybody could say. Yes this is Republican state. Yes this is a democratic state give me twenty five dollars and then we have ten Republicans running for the same state so we might allow the party to set the limit so I B. one and then the other one on local control which is really where I'm at we have to determine as a party and I know that it always comes up we have state directives all the time. But as a party where is that local control come from is it being mandated by the state or does it come up where I believe it should come from from your individual constituents these constituents have the ability now to push their city leaders to do this and if they don't guess what if they really really want it they can vote amount. It's so you know and that's where I come when it comes to local control for the most part is yes we need accountability for the state but on issues like this give the voters the opportunity to push their city of directors or it may years to do this and if they don't both the now. Thank you Mr thank you RepresentativeHouse committee members that's no one else's Signed up to speak representative leading me was page on the motion yeah thank you Mr chair of. Well I Like other people that have spoken you know I've got a lot of feedback you know I've got mayors all over the state that I knew when I was mayor and we serve together and and and everyone of them every mayor that text me then a lot of them are opposed to this but not just in and I got city council members in my district that the talk to me and they were against it but not just officials I've had individuals and I specifically asked them are you in a county or city government and they said no I'm just the constituent and I'm not for this and most of the cities in my district have talked to me and they're not for this so I again I I think we ought to let the local cities make the decision if they had that resolution on the agenda and city councillor in Jonesborough I might go down there and speak for it. Because I'm a citizen to Jones world. But my people back home are against this and I'll be voting no. Okay committee members is no further discussion on the motion we have a motion of a do pass all in favor say aye. All opposed say no. The nose average bills failed. But I say to hand madam Clark call the roll. Representative Meeks. Representative gene. Representive love. Representative love. Representative Deffenbaugh of. Representative Wardlaw. Representative Wardlaw. Representative Cozart. Representive Dotson yes. Representative Miller. Representative Miller. Representative Whitaker. Representative Payton yes. Representative Ladyman. Representative gray. Representative back. Representative back. Representative speaks. Representative Richmond yes. Representative McCollum. Representative Johnson. Representative Hawks no. Representative Gonzalez. It depends your bill is failed thank you Committee thank you thank you. I read okay committee members the next item on today's agenda is Senate bill three eighty. Okay represent Wardlaw who run that for. Senator hammer and I. The representative will he let me some stuff isn't saying that he wanted to. Do you know. Okay then. Okay. I'm good. Mr you of me to go ahead. I'll just check it out thank you senator Warner it is handed out we're going to do it real quick and then what will be an issue with that we'll take but a second thank you. Thank you given this second represent. Okay representative will the W. we had it handed out and you're ready you're recognized president Senate bill three eighty thank you Mr committee your have to bear with me Senator Hammer had to go run a bill in another committee so I agreed to run is bill and I'm to be honest you guys I've never seen this bill to a few minutes ago. But he worked with OPM on this bill and now they've agreed to this amendment and to some. This amendment to the current policy and and and obviously it'll be statute is in lieu of the last year and a corona virus what we found and if you member and council we had this fight about three or four times with correctional employees health department police and DWS employees where they were taken leave are they were being forced to work overtime and what this does increases that time to forty five days on their annual leave we had a bill couple weeks ago the increase their hours this is their days so that if they indeed all across of ours a couple times throughout the year they don't lose their annual leave And that's the purpose of this bill and it defines those essential offices in sexual and one that are qualified for this. State police veteran affairs and so forth is about six or seven of them so with that I'd be happy to take any questions. Well and you may not be able to answer this question is maybe one for the senator but if they're able to carry that time over in the that they've got that extended amount of time can they you can they donate all that to the catastrophic leave bank whether agency or do you it is that something we need to ask him I ask that question while I go to him and he said the agencies have agreed to by that time back so that was his answer to me and I'm guessing that is dancer he would give you now and OPM. Has agreed to that. So there's no there's no fight there thank you correct answer thank you then okay representative Ladyman rag you're recognized. Well when I was reading this it it said that if the exceeded those forty five days that they had more than that. Because they were forced to work like during the pandemic so they ask for time off and they were denied and they could accumulate those hours and and then they would be paid in addition to the forty five days adjuster because it wasn't their fault that they had to work is that that is the but that's not the case today so that's reason this bill has came forth this adds that it adds okay. K. se no further questions from committee members no one signed up to speak for or against the bill represented the Wardlaw you ready to those with your bill hi close Mr chairman and I make a motion to pass okay representative will have close is made a motion to do pass any discussion on the motion saying none all in favor say aye All opposed say no congradulations the bill is passed thank you Mr chairman and committee committee members will go straight now into the constitutional amendments representative calendar years yes actually. Committee members we're going to hear of the House joint resolution resolution one thousand two. H. H. J. R. one zero zero two representative you under yeah you had met before the committee about the we are not doing enough for downvoting maybe you hope you're aware of all all your Constitutional Amendment we're just reviewing and later on we will make a determination with this committee as to how we move forward with what we do so with that in mind that day be before state agencies and you're recognized to present your Constitutional Amendment thank you Mr chair thank you committee members the I will not take up much of your time this is a straightforward a constitutional amendment have you ever wondered why the school millage rate appears on your ballot even though it will not change no matter the results of the election well it's because is required under the Arkansas constitution this currently creates three issues number one it waste election officials time and takes taxpayer resources to place this item on the ballot number two it confuses the voter's because they actually believe they are voting on something and number three it cost public schools taxpayer money to place this item on the ballot money that could be spent on educating students this amendment would change the Arkansas constitution to require a school district to place their millage on the ballot only if there is a change this would save election officials time wouldn't confuse voters and would save thousands of dollars of taxpayer money that would be better used to educate kids I tell you I wouldn't take up much time and with that I will take any questions that you may have. Any questions from committee members represented back you're recognized. When you said it would only appear on the ballot if there were injured used. Is that if it changed. Prior or R. R. we are you trying to say that they're voting for change no thank you it would if there is a change so if it is lowering because of meals are expiring it would appear on the ballot and it would also appear on the ballot if date the the request for increase that would be the only two times thank you. What is if there's a decrease of representative I've got it representative Jane go ahead knowledge my question. Twenty the guess is brought up representive of talent is that Magnolia and Taylor. Immersion Bradley Taylor have a school election right now is in the paper last night two one oppose candidates in these districts and they're listed and the millage which is not increasing your come up the militants underneath and I think it has for and against and it doesn't matter which way you vote so you're talking about eliminating that but but they would still have to put up the candidate. In the paper in advertising even though they they are on opposes that correct yes they would have to put up the candidate but if you have your school election in may then usually those kinds of things in November election but if you have it in may you're paying for both elections instead just one okay thank you they retire I thank you representative to June so we're saying they the the millage when you vote on it even though sometimes like Bridget Eugene said it does really matter I thought that what I thought that both occurred in the school board election which usually hit it held in September and is that not correct it it's November or may. Are the two options that we have friends only to officer okay on any further questions from committee members. She none represent jobs anything you'd like to say that's it all I can say that it's very simple straightforward and and quick did a good job we appreciate you prepared for state agencies thank you Sir thank you Committee okay. Committee members say next item is you join a group correction constitution mandates J. R. one thousand eight three is represented to grow a. Representative Greg you're recognized to present your constitutional amendment thank you Mr chair not much I'll make this as quick as possible to a this issue was actually brought to me by a town in short County. They they have a library currently we also have a county library there in sharp county and they have a the county has a tax levied for that library. So what the city would like today to his have the ability to levy a tax as well or at least get it put on the ballot to see if that something that the constituency would want. I thought this was going to be a fairly easy fix when I started but it's not I have to change the constitution because right now you can only put on the ballot to levy a tax for a library with the town with five thousand people or more so what this constitutional amendment does is change that to one thousand or more and if the population were to fall under one thousand and you were able to get that tax levied even if it falls under a thousand that tax still remains on the books so that's the first part of it we got that written as Senator Sturch and I did and the and we had another issue with Independence County so we decided to kind of throw that in here as well and as I'm reading and I need to make sure that we actually did get the intent of what we were trying to day but essentially I think with a lot of these taxes as their lead B. you can break them into maintenance and operations or into capital expenditures on the ballot and what we want today is allowed like if you're you can still do that but if you're if you've paid off all your bonds then like if you're sitting there with capital money you can use it for maintenance and operations or vice versa so if you've met all the obligations that the tax was originally set out for no matter which category you had put it in you can use it in the other because we have I think it's Independence County that has a lot of capital money that they would like to use for maintenance and operations and they're not able to any maybe the other way if it maybe where they have made it's an operations in excess and they're wanting to think that's the way it is and they're wanting capital improvements but they can't use the money for that so is that's essentially the two things that this resolution does be glad to take any questions. Any questions from committee members saying No representative thank you so much I appreciate you. What. Okay hi read the D. Meeks. The last one on the agenda for today and we appreciate you being here for state age we are constitutional amendment you're recognized present a shale one thousand four thank you colleagues hopefully I'm presenting to you the amendment but And unfortunately I know this is the last one before we we we finish for the day but it's going to be the longest one to explain so my jump right into it so What I'm trying to do here is this constitutional amendment will allow the General Assembly over twenty five years to phase out personal property taxes so personal property tax dollars going to kind of go down a list here it is one of the most disruptive taxes to collect you know we think about income tax and sales tax income tax collection Mostar candles never noticed that collection because it's taken out of your paycheck before you get sales tax occurs at the register again you never notice it but what personal property tax you have to go every you know sprang get your vehicle assessed and then you can go and get your car tax I don't know about y'all but. I face is this this last year I went January to get my car tags renewed because. We're gonna be in session and guess what the first thing they ask me have you got your vehicle says. No so I had to go that that was a wasted trip to the DMV and I had to go get assess to make another trip back to the DMV So again it's the most disruptive tax to collect it's also the most expensive tax to collect because the city or the counties have to employ people keep track of all this and we have to employee tax collectors to collect all the tax so there's a lot of personnel that is involved in collecting this tax which makes the amount of money raised to be less we don't have these issues with the other taxes I think this also has one of the highest impact on our poor citizens you know if you're a single mom whose working to try to make ends meet and you're paying ten dollars a month in income tax that's a little bit easier than once every fall having to come up with a hundred twenty dollars out of your pocket it's a little bit easier to do the monthly that you never see verses we've got to come up with additional hundred twenty dollars to pay this on this one and only vehicle that I haven't of course you don't pay that we all know what eventually happens this also has negative impacts on businesses what actually got me interested in this was the broadband issue which may seem kind of weird but we're exploring the broadband issue one of the things that came up was as the telecom companies put equipment out into the field to expand broadband coverage out across the state they've got to start paying personal property tax on that equipment which raises the cost for them to be able to deploy this equipment which of course then gets passed on to the consumer or makes it more difficult for them to reach these hard to reach areas and so I wouldn't originally had looked at can we create an exemption on the personal property tax on that broadband equipment that can be used to re invest in broadband and the answer to that is now most states that collect personal property taxes the General Assembly for those states have the flexibility to create those exemptions where would be a benefit to the citizen we don't have that flexibility this would give us that flexibility during that twenty five year period to do things like that for the benefit of our our citizens a course you know the governor talked about creating a tax credit for new citizens the state. The if you come here as a new citizen you're not familiar with how the personal property tax issue works it's a very confusing system you go get your driver's side will now you've got to go over here and jump through these hoops with personal property tax before you can get your driver's license renewed so it eliminates that that confusion the last point I'll make on personal property taxes do you really on the property I mean if we're talking about a car I when I lived in Florida I had a car I paid for I owned it and it was free and clear why moved back here in Arkansas and all of a sudden I owe money on it every year to the government and if you owe money on property does that mean you're really truly own it free and clear and if you don't pay that tax that you are aware every year then what we do as a government well first thing we do is we shame yeah we put your name in the paper saying that you're you haven't paid your taxes and then secondly if you don't pay your taxes eventually we just come and take your car and so it begs the question do you on that so how the proposal works isn't it it's a several pages long but the meat of the bill is actually on section the page two and says the General Assembly May enact laws to reduce the rate of taxation on personal property and then that we can also create exemptions to the personal property tax and that on or before January of twenty forty seven so that's twenty five years that personal property tax has to be eliminated the majority of the rest the bill is because taxation on personal and real property is the same we have to amend all the areas of the constitution that requires that uniform taxation and allow for the did the the difference of the two taxes to allow that phase out to occur so that's what's in the rest of the bill and yeah I'm sitting here thinking listening to the other two bills that were presented today I may have to speak with the sponsors of those bills both of those bills also pertain to personal property tax so as a committee what we may be able to do what several staff we may bill actually roles of the two bills over into one complete bill to bill phase that out so maybe some for us to maybe we can collaborate on so that I'll take any questions in the following questions I'll have a few closing comments any questions from committee members representative Deffenbaugh you're recognized for a question thank you Mr I so we will the tax be reduced one twenty fifth every year is that what you said you probably said that you sold but that's up to us if if we have a year we can do it a little bit more than we can if you know if it's a tie year we can't the tax right now generates about five hundred million dollars so it's a it's a fairly large large left but the ten years I've been here we've got a hundred million dollars so if you take the five hundred million divided over twenty five years that's twenty million dollars a year every year I've been down here we've had surpluses hundred two one million dollars so I have no doubt that we can handle twenty million dollars impact now is as you all know the majority of this money goes to fund local school so what we'll have to do then is will have to. His or that twenty million dollars into our state budget to make up that difference to fund our schools so um this won't be an easy left but of course our constituents didn't send us down here to to do easy things okay. Okay representative Payton you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr. Tom I have to. So the five hundred million revenue that it generates that is gross that's not net after the expense of of a partisan and collect an erratic so somewhere between five hundred million and and zero would be the net right and and we don't really know what that is is that correct that that is correct so the the impact of the state budget would probably be less than that okay could I have a follow up. You're recognized actually hold a question but. So this says that over a twenty fiveyear period we're going the legislature can act very broadly you wait till you're twenty five and knock it all out at once right said so assuming that the legislature take steps and reduces it. Is there any mechanism to raise it back up in the in in that twenty five year period so the the it says right here the the actual bill says reduced rates on taxation of personal property tax including without limitation law law I think creating exemption so as the bill as currently written once that reduction has taken place then we wouldn't be able to go back and say what we need to re raise it and go back up what's good cause I would hopefully be fiscally responsible enough to realize there's a headline come in it the twenty five year right okay because I I that's what I didn't want to do I didn't want to create the a trap where or. We get ten year twenty two twenty three and all of a sudden Hey we've got five hundred million dollars we've got to come up with in the next budget and so that's part of that very good point so Mister chair I assume since there's no motions this is our discussion phase exactly right you want to I just I just this is a top three for me. I well we're going to hammer that out later so keep that in my past so we'll do that at the end of it we do not have a few more here right right I've got I've got over a dozen co sponsors so far so if you want to jump on on as a co sponsor it definitely would love to have all right we got some more questions no just second here so represent the representative you speak your recognized. Thank you Mr chair. My question is and maybe you've I just didn't catch on when you're going through this. So you're gonna start reducing every year from the personal property and real estate or not the real property just the purchase proper solar cell Blake vehicle. Okay and so this state every year will reimburse that county. For what they're losing correct that right now and those are the details that will have to work out as you know someone we get this past the we'll have to work those details out about how that would work who would get and so forth. In a as can. Recognized thank you so F. this so at the very end that the county is is going to have to depend upon the state to reimburse them for what they have lost on that so in my view because the the counties and cities are I can get a lot to look at the details on this and some of those are answers will come from future general assemblies because we're talking you know going out twenty five years so it'll be you know long after our time is is is gone but I'm kind of of the mind when it comes to the counties they bear the largest expense when it comes to administering this and if we face it out slowly that we allow them to work to within their budgets to make up that shortfall so that we as a state this so that they don't become dependent on the state to make that out but again that'll be that'll be questions be answered if and when this is this adopted it's not only going to be your county is it's going to be cities correct it's going to be your schools the school bus is the big one right got the school roughly eighty percent of it is schools and it in my mind we as a state need to make up for the schools. So so why so why so when I when I say that we've got twenty million dollars to absorb into the budget every year that I'm saying that that's twenty million dollars we need to add to the about funding matrix for the schools for their foundation funding. Okay thank you thank you representative representative Cozart you're recognized for a question. I'm trying to get my head around what you're saying about the schools and personal property tax money goes to the schools I know the U. R. T. from the property real property tax goes so how much are you saying if there was a let's take a hundred percent of the personal property tax how much that goes to school roughly eighty percent from what I've been told eighty percent of the personal property tax goes to schools right okay thank you identified in Saugus Saugus I did know that amount right or so right yeah I had I had to go in and get that but I don't know this is a good rate run the funding bills rules so that yeah that's that's about it said so four hundred forty million would be a guess on my part what that roughly amounts to. Did you make use an eighty percent of those groups would benefit. I understand you correctly what what you said about the eighty percent now so the the money that's raised to the personal property tax about eighty percent of it goes to school ten percent goes to counties and ten percent goes to cities as is the ratio that that I've been told okay thank you for that answer representative back you're recognized. Thank you Mr it in you may not gotten this far with this but you up I thought I heard you say that. This is a one the more expensive taxes to collect have you have you tried to quantify that I have I have not I I've made an effort to but it's hard to to to get that numbers are seventy five different counties that are you know how all have different methods and ways and trying to get yeah I try to get that from seventy five different entities is gonna be a little bit challenging is it is I guess is there. Sort of a ballpark that would look and say at the click five hundred million dollars cost in this. How may I control ball park out but you know what it in Faulkner county with yeah I mean it and Faulkner County I know on the assessment side when I walk in the office you know there's three or four people and then the tax collector side there's an author for five people so Faulkner County you're looking at eight to ten employees to to collect and administer the tax and so you know you multiply that ten employees over seventy five counties. You know what you're recognized that's the only time I get the papers in front of your eyes. Thank you representative back representative Ladyman you're recognized for discussion. Thank you Mr Stephen it is my understanding that I could put in a factory your your inventory is personal property. Treated as personal protracted right so there's another aspect to this personal property that maybe most people don't know about you know when we want to get back reason to come into the state if they have a high dollar inventory items this is a big issue culture and I'll give you a story I will tell my story time here so but no when I went to work for the German company there in Jonesborough Nordics we had we had these in the sales or worth four million dollars apiece. And the Germans didn't realize that when you take the inventory that's what to pay personal property taxes on we would do a hundred of these units at a time for wind farm. So we would ship them out well they got stuck with like twenty these things on site at four million dollars apiece when we did inventory. And the response that I got from the Germans when we were talking about this they didn't have the money budgeted a civil when we build this factory up in Illinois where they don't have the stacks because that's a lot of money Sir so there is an impact on industry coming in the state on this right yeah and and and that's one of the influx abilities of this is if you're a manufacturer and you've got to have these large ticket items and you want to come to Arkansas you know a lot of times we can you know look at tax credits and and other things but on this we can't we can't regional flexibility so that's a very important point on this to attracting business. Okay thank you representative spoke you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chair I've got a. A bargain for you okay. There is money and that's always been a bar in my saddle that we paying for the home state mmhm and money that we are not giving back to these counties are to the people that are paying it in is left over our state uses that money. In what could not one could we not use that money to help with this That's the kind of thinking it reckless that's perfect. Well there is quite a bit of money left over okay thank you thank you representative speech Committee saying no further questions Representative to make sure you want to have anything your say the committee for you closed out yet colleagues I appreciate the the question the feedback sounds very encouraging I would just say that to you know we've got a lot of good constitutional amendments that are coming before us and and a lot of a lot of were the ones but I think as we consider which ones to send out we need to look at the ones that are going to have a good chance of winning the support of our our citizens last time we sent out to that we we couldn't garner support most every citizen I've talked to and I've said would you support us giving and getting rid of your annual tracked down the us get your vehicles assessed almost universal support for that so I have no doubt that we would get wide support among the citizens of our state also this is a bill or you know some of them not to knock the other bills that were presented today they're they're very good bills and I think they're they're valid bills but they would impact just a very tiny majority of our citizens where is this one would benefit I think all the citizens of the state so with that when time comes I would definitely appreciate your positive consideration and maybe work with representative right represent all and maybe roll those bills into this one because or officer germane issues and we can come up with the a more comprehensive bill that maybe gets all all of these things that were presented today and and the one nice tidy package for something that colleagues I appreciate that and We appreciate positive consideration at the proper time thank you representative makes for a. Payment for the state agencies as good testimony also Committee let me just a reminder that Monday morning we will meet at nine thirty there were a big mac a Monday morning at nine thirty would be a big mac eighteen here a we have a special order of business after that day in regards HR one zero one one by representative Richmond and again as nine thirty Monday morning also also committee members we've been working hard trying to get people to respond to these constitutional amendments and we made several attempts and I believe we've got more scheduled for Monday afternoon Matt is going to keep working hard to try to get to see if we get some more scheduled if not we may just have to shut it down at that point so you know we can only ask so many times so that your plans and This meeting is adjourned.