Education Committee - Senate

Okay. Representa Senator Elliott made second okay members we we heard house bill fourteen fifty one Senator Clarke Tucker you're recognized to present the amendment for house bill fourteen fifty one this is the bill that we have heard in committee and we caught the fact that it needed and amendments we've already heard the bill so just explain the amendment so we can proceed quickly thank you madam chair this is the do or merging bill and there just when there's a quick clarification to we want this to be applicable to all public schools so the language we thought the language in the bill covered charter schools but just to be doubly sure we're going to amend the bill said it says that public school districts and open enrollment charter schools can sponsor dual immersion programs that's what it does it also adds Senator Irvin and it re adds Senator Davis as a cosponsor nothing technically we have to expunge the vote by which the amendment was adopted that added senator David. We okay we did that already okay. Right so that's it that's the amendment all right any questions on the amendment all right motion to adopt the amendment so moved to second all those in favor say aye. And oppose ayes have it members adopted now year to present house bill fourteen fifty one as amended are there any questions is there a motion motion and a second all those in favor say aye and oppose ayes have it congratulations house bill fourteen fifty one is adopted as amended thank you thank you manager's senator Elliots if you will take the chair I'm going to quickly do Senate bill eighty nine. We recognized thank you and Senator Missy Irvin district eighteen I'm gonna run this bill on behalf of Senator Hester this is Basically at an. A bill of for the department of education as it relates to the succeed scholarship program and some changes that they needed to make it's pretty straightforward and we have folks from the Department if you have questions. Are there any questions from the members of the committee. Anybody in there I just wanna speak for or against the bill. All right there are no questions no testimony you may close for your bill I'll close to make a motion to pass. Senate. All those in favor I. Those opposed no the Bill pass this. All right if I can have representive Hollowell and center Caldwell center Caldwell if you will state your name for the record you're recognized proceed with House Bill sixteen ninety four. It's been a long day committee her manager appreciate very much this bill is pretty simple you concerns some land in my district in St Francis County where the universe of Arkansas division of agriculture selling sixty three hundred acres of of ground of you may have handed out did you give the handout. Yes here's the handout. Is a document in the deed restriction to do this land was accumulated during the depression error back in the nineteen thirties by the U. S. Forest Service whose version report to we know about Johnny Cash is really moving off of land they could make a living on and moving to an area where they could make a living in this land was purchased in a by the division yes part of our culture in US for service with the understanding that this plan would be kept for public use Senate was sold in nineteen seventy eight to the University of Arkansas division of agriculture in in in that deed states very clearly that all the land and everything the voter subject further to the condition that the above described land shall be used for public purposes and if at any time said land ceases to be so use this state conveyed shall immediately report to become resistant to the rental and grant awards the US for service and what we want to do is an presently. This is the universe has a contract to sell to a private company and we want to stop that sale and the allow them and encourage them to sell it to a a a public entity that would keep this land open for public use and that's the extent of the bill. All right are there any questions for members of the committee. Right now questions from members of the committee thank you and I have a four individuals here to speak for the bill and so if they will come forwards James Brandenburg. Stacey say first the brown and Tim Fisher. And we can do to at a time if the two of you will sit there at the table and introduce yourself for the record and you can speak for this bill. My name's James Brandenburg on the chair of the Arkansas chapter of backcountry hunters and anglers. Arkansas VHA is involved in the effort to keep Pinetree public because the hunting and fishing access that it affords to every day outdoors men and women from every walk of life. Is a part of the state or finding a place to go is already tough if you don't own land or having the income needed to afford a lease. We're not alone in this effort over twenty one hundred people have signed our petition to keep Pinetree public mayors county judges and city council members from the surrounding area wanted to stay public and contrary to the university's own fact sheet and testimony they have given to the General Assembly there are several state agencies and nonprofit groups who also want to see Pinetree remain public. We're working with a number of them now to engage university honestly and in good faith to develop an alternate arrangement that keeps Pinetree public and also solves their funding needs. Senator Caldwell gave a great explanation of how the land became public through the bank had Jones from tendon Act. The ice language list several public purposes. For the for these types of properties including developing a protecting recreational facilities it also expressly states with the land may not be used for which are private industrial or commercial enterprises. The university agreed to these terms when purchased the land in nineteen sixty the current deed reflects these terms on every acre of the land. And nobody not the university and certainly not their private out of state buyers as provided any evidence that their deal requires the buyers to use a property all of it for public purposes. Arkansas citizens already benefit from Pine trade pine tree the way it is and we are asking you now to stand up for what's right for all the people of this state to confirm what was promised to the people who sold their land with the understanding that it would be used to benefit the public all of the public forever thank. Thank you go ahead and push a button and state your name for the record then proceed with your statement. Yes ma'am my name is Stacy Schafer I am a United States Marine Corps disabled veteran. Of. A lot of people. Did not realize that the universe of Arkansas pine trees one of the very few places in the state where you can use a mobility impaired license to four Wheeler back to where you hunt or fish or whatever without places like this there's a lot of people like myself that can't walk for a very long distance that would not be able to be able to have the outdoors at our disposal there is a lot of educational purposes that the university is used for a lot of people don't realize that they just think of the hunting in the fishing well all five of my children have both collections that they submitted in high school and leaf collections that they submitted in biology that came from the University of Arkansas I've used that land to teach my kids gun safety I've used that land to spend quality time there's a lot of quality time that my family is done and I'm not the only one there's a lot of people and a lot of people try to make you believe that that lands are not used very much but that is not true there's not a weekend that goes by where the temperatures are not in the hundreds due to the temperature in the musky does in that area but other than that there is a lot of people that use that land don't let anyone tell you that they don't thank you very much thank you we appreciate both being here thank you for your comments as I've been to the leaf project for times I had I know the pain behind the leak profits. All right to other individuals that are here to speak for the bill Mr Steve brown and Mister Tim Fischer you will come to the table and state your name for the record you're recognized to make your comments. Push that button on there. Yes my name is Steve Braynon of my Daddy took me hot no work at pantry in nineteen seventy nine. The first ten. I have been there regular scene scene I built my house two miles from there to an a. And it's a day fund. The. I was up there this morning a little after six o'clock. Looking for turkeys a child S. Meeks taking Turkey. Only use part of the game fishing down where whale I'm handicapped and I have trouble. What is right I'm I'm I'm hot university the weight said of. but the kids that will lose dozens I've took down at that level. They go to and go home eight they don't crowd the streets on Michael's I'm going to get a burning bill. You don't know what it means to the kids. That will miss out this is so. If the people that's mine has got kids let them hunt there don't send it to them and do away with all the rest the kids. The kids is my heart. And they're walking on. Thank you thank you thank you for your statement. My name is Tim Fisher I would born and raised grant co op farm where an on a business there. I'm one of four generation it's been there raised they were what was always code. One of our land was given up are required however you want to put it that would have public coming there. We've got a lot of low income folks there that needs to place if it's got to be sold I understand it but let some of the state forestry commission the game we face that somebody like that by this spring. So the people can uses ground like we've used it for eighty years and my family around it it's it don't need to be took away. Thank you. Thank you I that I know when with you please go ahead. It is if they take back Gates at least. Thirty thirty five miles from where that community believes that somebody has got public on the commercial last night and use all of your it's the law everything is posted unless you have written permission. Okay it wasn't when I started you could hunt anywhere. But thanks has changed but if they take that is going to be the greatest loss of anything I have ever had at. Thank you we appreciate you both being here and and for your statements and know that and it's so important for us to hear from the public and from the citizens on these issues that matter to them yes you will you take a question. Okay all right thank you thank you for being here all right is there anyone else to speak for against this bill just a note the University of Arkansas is not going to be here but they wanted me to share their opposed to the bill that they're not going to be here to speak against the bill Senator Caldwell you're recognized to close for your bill. Again thank you military in committee this. Rarely do we have a opportunity for a bill can be passed that both can come out winners university wants to sell the land for they can do certain things I want to do we're going allow them to do that encourage him to do that help them do that and and then we can still keep it open for the public and I would appreciate a good vote. Thank you. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized. Motion do pass as their seconds second all those in favor say aye. And oppose ayes have it congratulations you passed your bill thank you gentlemen for coming in and speaking on behalf of the bill thank you. Senator Hickey you are up. We have an amendment. Yep. Okay a motion to adopt the amendment as their second second all those in favor say aye opposed amendment is adopted you may present a state your name for the record and then you you can present Senate bill five eighty four as amended Jimmy Hickey Arkansas Senate members a I appreciate it this is the premises bills basically straightforward in kind of common sense however. Whenever you try to reduce it to riding as you can see it gets long and complicated. I like to refer to this is the this bill is our essay for the lottery. We'll give you all some history What to when we started the lottery. What we probably should've allowed was lottery to get up and running parked operating proceeds in an account and see how much money we had in that account after a year. At past and then started paying out scholarships based on that amount that would would have been in that account we do not do that is most of you know. And we had to perform some drastic restructuring of the scholarships and do some additional things within the lottery over the years to help it maintain its solvency. We've never been able or willing to correct this ongoing financial issue because we would have to stop paying scholarships for a year. Which is not a viable option since we have students in the pipeline depending upon this money. Or we would have had to take a massive amount of state general revenue to fund all the scholarships for a year which is also not feasible. However a one time opportunity exists to correct is only going financial concern to help maintain that the amount of watery money. That's available matches the the amount of scholarship money that we pay out each and every year. We are projected to have round numbers of approximately a hundred million in a trust account which we set up a few years back when we were attempting to create to correct the cash flow issues which we were having within the watery at that time. What this bill does is it allows for those funds to be used to fully fund but what I'm talking about is the the funds that are currently sitting in that trust account what we're going to do is we will fully will use those funds to fully fund our current lottery scholarships between July first of twenty twenty one in June thirtieth of twenty twenty two. While we're using those trust fund proceeds which are sitting in the account of course the lottery will be making revenue and what we'll do is park that money in an account. In an account what we're using those funds are basically in our savings account. We will then will then park those an account and then They're allowed to know how much is available for the scholarships beginning in the fall of twenty twenty two. Of course we all hope the funds are always available to fully fund over scholarships with the General Assembly allows however Page forty of the bill. Provides if funds are not available the academic challenge we funded first and all other scholarships we funding going to pro rate a pro rata basis the bill also provides that if we do not have funds available to fully fund all scholarships that either A. L. C. or Joint Budget before in session will be notified immediately. To look into the issue and possibly allow boring through the short shortfall reserve account which we do have currently set up that also has twenty million dollars in it right now. We also currently have another issue. In that all General Assembly so as you all know we come down here and we file scholarship bills which affects the amount of money required from watery operations to fully fund the scholarships. That one that we want to put in place without regards to what the yearly cash flow is that the lottery is bringing in. This bill establishes a procedure for all proposed scholarship amending legislation will be introduced within the first thirty one days of a regular session. We will also be proposing joint house and Senate rules along with this legislation to call awareness to all future general assemblies in regards to this requirement. After this thirty one days the house and Senate education committees will meet jointly to decide what to refer out to the General Assembly this will be done by separate vote also during this meeting analysis of whether the scholarships can be a full can be afforded will be calculated by using the form which begins on page thirty three of this bill. The legislation also says that new scholarships will not take effect until it will at least one year has passed that way we can always run everything when you're in arrears. Members I'll try to answer questions and just to kind of help you with this forty four page bill pages one through twenty nine is clean up language when I say cleanup language I'm referring to items within the codes which are duplicated language which we just don't need or have not used and some of it was not even at the correct locations. The meat of the new bill begins on page twenty nine however if you have any questions I should be able to answer from throughout the whole bill. All right are there any questions. Senator Elliot you're recognized for a question. Senator Hickey when you said that any new scholarships would be funded did you say and twenty twenty two beginning in the school year twenty twenty twenty twenty two and buy new scholarships what did you mean. What new or amended all if I said new it would be the. But this just take Senator Eads like that I know that he has a new scholarship then he's looking to do so in other words if after we after we pass this legislation what what will happen is we will all or you you in the house Education Committee will meet jointly and they'll say well we lack that proposal so then you all will pass that out. After we do a financial analysis which again is located backed your on page thirty five I believe it is If if we pass that that out that scholarship will not start immediately as it normally would we would wait a year for that for that to begin to be to be implemented. That way again we would know how much money was in that account because will use those trust fund accounts the the scholarships that we currently have we'll be using that savings account trust fund account to pay for that. The lottery operations that it's doing will be parking that money into that account then on June thirtieth of twenty twenty two. Of course it'll be July first of twenty twenty two that into that the school year started fiscal year will know how much is in there higher ed at that time. We'll be getting applications in so that they know they'll know what how much money that we're going to need to make sure that there's enough and that count to fully fund the. So I think you also said. You're that includes amendments like if I intend to amend the criteria for eligibility and it were to pass it would not go into effect until twenty twenty two is that still am I still on the right yes ma'am all right and I'm mandated rodeos attention to page thirty five with the or excuse me it's a. It begins on thirty three is thirty three thirty four thirty five It just I probably do need to go over this because I you know I had or we had to come up with a a formula that we thought you know would would be conservative so that. So that we would know that there was enough money in there so the way that we're going to do that if you say on page thirty three what we would do is we would take the net proceeds from the from the lottery for the past four. For proceeding preceding years. And then what we would do is we would take any additional revenue that's available that's available that we used to fund scholarships which we is currently twenty million dollars we take twenty million dollars out of general revenue every year to put with what the lottery makes. To fund scholarships so that would be in number two. And then what we would do is we would figure the net proceeds that is taken to fund the following. Scholarships that we have on the books which of course is academic challenge scholarships. We also currently have the concurrent challenge scholarship. We have the workforce challenge scholarship. And then any other scholarships and Senator Elliot this is where. Whenever we would amend of managers we would have to put in what the cash effective that would be so so we'd have to you know at that add that in there to place. We also fund some nursing scholarships but is kinda odd the way that that was set up somebody had run a bill at one time We're we don't actually use the watery proceeds to fund those we're using the money that's coming out of the twenty million dollar general revenue although people think that we're using lottery proceeds or not we're actually just using that portion of the twenty of the twenty million. All this kind of gets kind of complicated after a while. yeah and well just one second did you have any other questions I'll come back okay we'll come back all right senator Chesterfield you're recognized. Senator Hickey you know that a species Kashif near and dear to my heart so with that be a part of this that would be a part of that review will look at company general revenue rather than from the lot that would be G. or G. G. R. separate from the G. R. that I'm talking about here. Yes so I mean I think it's number one I was saying this was a huge amount of work and it's probably one of the most critical policies that I think that we could actually implements which is excellent policy in my opinion and there was a lot of work and down on this but I would say. If you can I think it's important to talk through what will happen once this passes and because we do have Senator Eads has a bill and I'm not sure I think there may be at others so that we can if you don't mind Senator Hickey just sure my question would be. Once we do this the moving forward you have a timeline that people would have to follow bill within the first thirty one days and then we would meet jointly but we are going to do that this session as well correct that is correct and actually if you'll look at that amendment I was reading through this another time yesterday and I appreciate the bureau getting this amendment what I've noticed we did have an Avenue for this year that people could of the scholarships because there's there's actually I know that Senator Elliot is looking to amend some stuff I know that Senator Eads is possibly Senator Davis and seems like another member to are all going to have either a new scholarship for some change to scholarship so what what I did with the amendment the amendments going to allow that we will have to comply with the thirty one days of course since we're passing this bill once this bill gets passed. What what again what we would do is the house and Senate education. They'll set up a time to meet and then again Senator Eads what he'll do is he'll he'll go in start on page thirty three and higher it will help them they're already going to have all the calculations for how much we're paying on the academic challenge scholarships adult the Director Markle. the nursing scholarships the concurrent everything that we have there already going to have that in place that what they'll have to do is they're going to have to have to calculate and try to come up with a number of what we believe that the that scholarship is going to cost so in other words Ms go grab a number out there do you have any that skews me do you have any idea how much it's going to cost. Okay well you know if if that scholarship because four million dollars a year then of course what we will do is we'll go through this formula with that particular scholarship. And make sure that that based on the calculations that there's not enough money from the lottery. That there's enough money in the watery that we will be able to fund that once you all figure that out then it'll be your turn to make a recommendation on whether or not that you'll refer that out to the body in the then that'll get referred out to the house and the Senate. So that's kind of the way so after that particular one is passed of course that's going to create an additional financial financial impact and so that in my example which is just an estimate of course if that if that was four million dollars then of course we'll have to add four million dollars on to the next one to make sure that they're still enough money available. Because the way that the way that I'd set this up is again that what we will use is the lowest net proceeds that we had from the water in the last four years to use the law was there and then all all over scholarships to use the highest in the last four years so that you know we could have at least have some Christian you know. To account for the variances and the problems in the. Pilsen Bally's whatever you wanna call. In. Okay Senate testability haven't follow up questions. You know he always brings this is forty and fifty paise. Yeah I always bring as and when we're ready to go home and then and I think it's all very delivered which is I saw. It's really not up the personally members what I'd like to do is get out of a watery business because truthfully what what is happening to me and it's a you know not that I want to be in this but but. Everybody every year whatever we start we start session everybody says you know Jimmy work where we at with the lottery can we afford this so I have to go try to go through this. You know in my head to make sure and say yes we have these funds I don't know this and that by doing this and put it there is going to create a it's going to create a path for us in the future and after we're all grown that people can follow up to make sure that we didn't get in the same situation that we were in about five years ago because you all know. As you all know at that time we had some had some major issues were that you know that we had to correct and I do want to say this just specially for Some of the ones that haven't been around as long if we ever if we ever do get into a situation where we're having to borrow from short from the a shortfall reserve trust fund that's where everybody needs to start paying attention because. That was all that was really where we had we had almost got in trouble with the lottery before because what we were doing as we were pouring from that shortfall trust account and we had language in the bill which was good language or well intended it said that what we would do is at the start of the fiscal year that any money that we are in that we would use the first funds to take that back up to the twenty million which that sounds like good fiscal policy and it is and that's still in here the problem is is that starts happening somebody referred or the legislature really needs to monitor it to make sure that we're not bar in quicker and quicker and quicker every year because that's what we were doing and it was getting closer and closer and we were basically going to have a have a class course. With what you you all all done we've got that that corrected from our fiscal standpoint and this should put us in a situation that hopefully we'll never have those issues you will thank you thank you Mr thank you are there any other questions Senator Elliot. Senator Hickey in the in I'm speaking about what my intentions are in so if. The bill that I am proposing that were to pass read change the. Eligibility to two point five four nineteen. are we to understand that if I were to pass and then I'm not creating a new scholarship but so people would understand what that would need there is a possibility number one based on what it will cost we could end up not even doing it R. would we do it and figure out a way to reconfigure the how we're funding the scholarship. If you're the way the way that we written language in here and I I just call it a new scholarship but the way the the way it is here the way it's written into the bill is it's a. It's any it is any action basically that has a fiscal impact on what re so although what you're doing would not be would not be a new scholarship it would be an action which which causes that fiscal impact impact with their so that being said. We would we would calculate what that it when what you're wanting to do of course is it like you say change the grade point grade point average backs. You know we're probably gonna have some historical data that we can use for that from the past whatever it was there so that you know we can we can come up with an approximation of that fiscal impact and what we'll do is we'll put that that impact in in the spot right there were just like it would be a new scholarship so that we'll be able to see as low you know that he can be cash flow you know that it will cash flow the whole lottery and then it just be a policy decision you know whether the members think that you know they want to leave it with the ACT score if they want to go back to the GPA. Okay but it would not have any kind of because we're going to fund the challenge that the scholarships first we're going to look at that first yes it in that amendment would not have synced apart would be a part of the challenge that wouldn't have any standing to get funded over anything else it would just be in the lineup of we have not my guess because it would be an amendment that would cause of and a financial impact. And the reason being because everything we're doing is trying is trying to get how much how much money. Parked into an account that we have and then no no all the expenses that are going to be coming out of it and that would be creating expense so what we have to do is we have to move we're having been moved any expenses which would be the new scholarships amended scholarships out out into the future whenever we have that that year in net proceeds of the of the lottery plus the twenty million from the general revenues so in in essence. In order for us to to be assured that. When we if we were to pass this today we're not insuring. Anybody anything about getting a scholarship because they have a two point five zero right. This is this has nothing to do other than setting up of of a way to stabilize lottery you and just from the physical aspect this has nothing to do with anything like that. Well if it if it's not if if it would if we were to say that. You get a scholarship if you have this or this That would say to somebody you gonna get a scholarship that we have two point five what I'm saying about the legislation you have right now. Just because we might I'm trying to be sure people understand what we're what we're doing and and not get all excited about something. Is a good possibility we could pass a two point five and. And this is it still might not get funded depending on what we do about trying to be solvent I wanna be sure people understand that. We if we don't want to be that way. We would we would have to not pass that because it's going to have to run through the form in this what you presented here which is clear and I understand. Which is good job. It will. Not necessarily because you know the first the first thing the first thing that and that's going to be up to up to you all to find the property in the order of how you're going to do if we have five or six of these I've we have five or six either new scholarships are amendments for You know the expense related items such as what you're wanting to do you all are going to have to figure out what order to do that will be the something that you're gonna have to come up with. So you know the first thing you're going to do is is whenever you're in line and let's just say that your number two after Senator Eads. The whatever we whatever we do your fiscal impact statement is light will that is positive so you know there were still going to have a a positive cash flow so at that point right there the Division it would be just like we are regular committee you would just have to go through and and like I say it comes a policy decision on whether those members wanted to or not basically what this bill does is just requires a At least the a look to make sure that cash flow is available before we proceed with anything I thank you thank you senator yes ma'am center back on. In the in a situation similar to what Senator Elliot was referring to. You have an amendment to the academic challenge scholarships. This year we meet Joint Committee we approve the amendment and we approve the new scholarship Senator Eads. After that passes through going into the next legislative session the next caller skip session when those are actually starting to pay out for the academic tools Allen would take priority over anything else correct. The only. Yes yes Sir as amended. The well actually in the bill the yeah well in the bill itself this this bill that we have here right academic challenge always takes always takes priority if women and yes and the only thing is there's really never all of there's never a case where we have prioritized in list we were short of money to fund all or scholarships so in other words let's just say that we wound up you know with ninety ninety million dollars and net available revenue and ninety one million in expenses from all the scholarships that we have what we would do is that million dollars we would still pay our exact amount that we're paying on the academic and like you said if the amendment was on the academic that would be included in that that would be included in that and what we would do is we would take that million dollars on a pro rata basis away from the concurrent the work force. nursing. What you say the nursing. Under a nursing will be nursing's a little sentiment permission and I just wanted to bring it up to the committee is. Ninety six and whether or not that should have been done that way it was in the it's just it's the situation we're in. So that it can and and the new act and the academic challenge close because it would be actually listed as a as under other scholarships although he's calling it academic challenge is not the original academic challenge it was passed through the cost you know constitutional amendment right. All right the questions so we vote for this it's more work for us the Committee that's okay no with I mean so that's what we would be prepared to do as well so probably expedites the bill as much as we can right now we and I mean if you will if you all want me now I'll help of course of the bureau they're going to help hire it'll have to be after be involved again. As I've already said Dr mark on them already getting all the numbers so we're gonna be set to go it's just if you have a you don't Senator Elliot like to what you're wanting to do. I would probably go ahead and get with the higher ed and just have them to be figuring out what the what they believe the fiscal impact that's going to be so we just have to fill in that blank right all right any other questions I do wanna thank the people that worked on this bill because it was a lot of work Taylor Lloyd a Courtney south ward and Dr Markham remarkable and others with the Department of ed and the pure of legislative research did a phenomenal job I mean working with all of us on it so that they did and also we also even had the water itself work on which we're glad we did they sing some things that up which is kind of odd within the bill also there's one section in there that doesn't start to into the next fiscal year that are emergency clause would of the. We had a mistake on it we would have to put on our audited financial statements for mail so actually we worked with them and they call that so it was kind of an all round to Work to get this up and going Preciado does work on it and I would appreciate a good vote yes. Is there anyone here to speak for against the bill all right C. N. nine motion do pass and second all those in favor say aye and oppose ayes have it congratulations thank you pastor bill thank you and members if you'll stick around real quick after the session and after committee imminent. Smidgen seventy real quick and is there any other business to come before the committee. To see if you'll just stick around I just have a question for you. Any other business come before the committee. Suffer will we pick saying let's go Razorbacks this Wednesday