Agriculture, Forestry & Economic Development - Senate

Some questions on that we'd like to have her here to answer it that's S. B. two two six. We'll skip over SP five twenty three Senator Caldwell's bill. Is there anyone here for representative Bentley H. B. fourteen forty two. Senator Clark looks like he's to you then. Raspy three eighty five. The. Please state your name for the record. Brown. For this bill. And I'm not gonna tell you that this bill is the answer. Or what the answer is. But there needs to be an answer. The. As a. No fifth generation or cans and. And the guy who grew up in timber country. My dad started a lumber yard when I was twelve. So I've been in the construction lumber business all my life. You know. When I was in elementary school we got the weekly reader for anybody that goes back that far. And they had me convinced by the time I got out of school that. All the trees were gonna be gone. And then I as I got older. And in the lumber industry. and as much as I love the woods we love the haunt to hide just being that are. The and the beauty of it all. We have more trees in the United States now than we had in seventeen seventy six very few people realize that. Of and right now we have a glut of trees in south Arkansas we need more industry of because these trees are going to die they're maturing they're gonna die they're gonna be wasted. because that's what happens the the although the these crops last more than our lifetimes so that doesn't register with people that still that's still what they are except for those areas that we use for other things. The. It's also interesting that. Six years ago almost purchased a house and and had. I've never wanted to live in a gated community. I'll be also a separate this committee the hope I don't offend anybody that we would sit most of us would say if we're just trying to each other I want to place where I could be off my back porch. And that's what I have. Of and so. You know my neighbor in fact I have land in front of my neighbor and behind my neighbor a north south and west of my neighbor. And he does Clerk at a hundred twenty acres I don't see it. I will probably end up buying it because I have the best access to an almost surrounded Board of probably pay more for it of with the timber on it then and certainly with that selective cut rather than clear cut but that was his prerogative and it's my prerogative of to do what I want to do and to and to cut and clear cut we're timber state. Of and. The but this House look at diamond head I I came across it accidentally and had a little bit it had octagon front porch and I have a Victorian house low Victorian. And it was it during the recession and the process was rocked and I thought well maybe I'll buy this and. And remodeling and flip it live there for a few years and flip it will ultimately decided not to do it I had to committee aren't in the far we live close to. Of my parents and Janice parents before they passed away and we decided that stand there was more important what surprised me. About this particular home was is on a one and a half to to make up probably I don't exaggerate but I think it was probably at least a two acre lot small front yard with this huge backyard it was all wooded and shaded and the next door the home next to it was the same it was on the seventeenth fairway never want to live on a golf course Max Moore played golf about six times a year so but it was beautiful and then the the lot on the other side was completely wooded and again I'm in the construction industry I knew that somebody might by that lot and build a house. What I would have never expected but what I can expect out for I all of its for my neighbor to cut all the trees. Or do anything else they want to do. What I never would've expected had I bought a house and dominant. Bought a home and and had to be more correct. Is for the lot next to me to be clear cut. The band information from the main drags throughout the community to be clear cut that I can't imagine. one of our colleagues of. Bought a house in my district and again in a much smaller gated community on the river many of you have been there. Of beautiful wooded lot of if you've been there timber all around I know that he can't and next time you go there you can't imagine. That all that would be clear cut like set out for I will yes out of all the vast acreage yes but inside a gated community could not imagine. But when they call me they don't. Always for represent my cut constituents and I thought okay we got environmentalists nuts okay but I'm gonna go out and be nice. Then and see what's what's out here and you know in trying to Whittle down easily. I was shocked. I was I was really shocked and the pictures they have are not the pictures I would have taken. Of their more shocked about what happened next door and so on and you can see some of the things that would happen on the woods Senator go more. Would be a big deal. But it's in a gated community. It's right next door. But I which I have pictures of the places where you drive down the streets and there were trees and now you drive down the streets and there's nothing. And it makes no sense to me. Because the rates were it's going to supposedly being. We're doing this we're learning to build. Senator call will was here. He and I met because we both have lumber yards. And he would agree with me. That of never seen clearing like this to build up you know you're gonna build condos you know you you make go clear to three. Four acres. You know if if the card if you've got that big a complex of but what I'm going to give you for a law to sprint clear cut if I'm if I'm coming into a community to build a to to build a home on the retirement state versus what will give you for a home without a treat give you for a lot without a tree on it. Makes no sense. And I have no reason to antagonize. The other people because there are my constituents to but I was shocked and you would've been shocked every time I talk to some of the people Joe fox only those I said have you been there have you seen it. Of so. Again I share the same concerns I share. When it comes to. Any kind of permitting. For logging because they're afraid of going down a slippery slope in us becoming California. Of and you know whichever come they talk about the wildfires and talk about global warming I get angry because there may be global warming but we those in our business told them. What was gonna happen in California when they when they left sale logging practice center practices and started doing what they were doing leaving the leaving those dead trees out in the woods of just you just got fuel just building up of so. For me to be paying a bill. Of that says. We need to do something. Before everything that's been said this bill does not affect anything outside a gated community and somebody came said will this reading says maybe it could we amended it. To make sure because I'm the one you know I had a bill Ryder to you know what can we do and this is what they came up with that I said well let's go with that but I'm the one that added that if it had to be three acres or more I mean if you're clearing for. Of if you're clearing firm building three acres. Is a big area of I'm the one that said if your two thousand foot from home you're fine because I thought of the vast tracts of timber at hot springs village and I thought about when they build a golf course of the bill lake. You know all those legitimate things you know I want to do everything I could to stay all the way and then would be perfectly willing to amend that to do anything else that the that the leave normal things along. But logging in and you know I don't know what our reason is to want to continue to law I had a lawyer called me and said you know I went and somebody wanted their view improved and and had an eight you know what I would want to wait for a permit and and I said how many acres was it by so was it more than three no. Of my said okay then then this wouldn't have applied. The so. The basis of the bill is because of people coming said we'll the property owners can do what they want to do and you should have known what I can tell you I'm not. Of. May not be the sharpest knife in the drawer but I'm not the bill is neither. I would have not asked if I bought that home in diamond head. If you were allowed to clear cut. And I don't know anybody that would have been like buying COVID insurance two years ago of it's just something that you would never expect and so for those reasons we have started here with the idea that if you're going to log in a gated residential community. And the again it I said. Of. Over sixty cutting over ten trees over six inches of dower per acre. Located on three more acres located within two thousand feet. No we put twenty trees I don't care again we can but the really the three acre should say although should say or. And I don't know what the proper languages always go back to the bill riders but the idea is to make it as least restrictive as possible but you can't log. If you're really clear in property for construction great if you're. if you've got. Trees to cut to trim or cut on your property great. if you've got a vast area out there that it within the gated community that you want to develop this half a mile from from everything else great you don't you would have to do anything just like now but if you're actually going to log. In a gated community there should be expectations beyond. What there are four I live where I can peel off my back porch because I bought my property for a reason they bought their property for a reason. And while I don't want to affect the logging industry and I don't want her to logging industry we are also a retirement state. And we don't want to getting out. Barbie where. Thank you can come down here and you can take your your million dollar will. Of the twelve hundred square foot Chicago come down here and build a mansion. And there ain't no tellin even in a gated community what may happen next door that you don't want getting out you can talk about that about what what the dangers are on one side but there's dangers on the other side to I'll be happy to take any questions. We have any questions Senator Clark. Senate. Thank you one one concern that I have with this and it's been expressed to me is. Specifically on page two lines five through eight were sets the the. The reasons that you need a logging permit as as you know my. Wife works for power company on vegetation maintenance. And if they're clearing for a power line. It had to get a permit or if there's a beetle infestation on the bonds or whatever they have to cut down on this substantial number trees that have to get a permit and that would. So really delay the reaction time and center Beckham. As I pointed out in a Committee of staying. I have. A water bill that's taken for. Sessions to do that the. Of municipal league now backs the water providers now back I've got an education bill that the governor's office and Department cation rewrote I got a civil asset forfeiture bill that the prosecutors rewrote I'm really easy to work with of those again I expected to hear about more exceptions that I've been so yes an exception you're clearing power lines exception if you've got the top of things that you're talking about I wanted limited to one thing. And I need help with that but limited to one thing and that is you can't come in and log and clear cut in a gated community if you're if you're if you're cutting if you're you're coding for development in your in your in your fix in the bill of infection doesn't mean five years from now For thirty years from now the or. Of. If you're going to develop best tracks for again if if you want to cope clean up your property as often do take a chain saw and so you know you know we need to clear this up we need to clear that up just always always careful because my wife's dogwoods. that's a capital offense so. Of the the but if anything we need to do along that line. I expected that would be that plea that there's no way that I would catch everything of but. So thank you for bringing up the those problems and like Senator somebody had come to me with those before. That already being here. Any other questions from the committee. Senator Sturch. Mr I had a question the Department being minded secretary what was to come to the table yeah what we'll get him just a second okay we'll let everyone finish with thank you senator Clark. Anyone else have a question Senator Clark. I've got one for you Senator yes Sir okay. As far as gated communities go or. Subdivisions as a whole majority a time there's a bill to share it with. In the the owner can put in that bill Richards what he wants in that subdivision. Did did the owner of the seven referring to have a bill Richards. No. Because that was my Senator Hill the Mister chair that was my first question. Was surely it's got to be you know in the foundation of this community the it's got it's got to be there but like I said I would have asked either because the and I don't I think you can go to two hundred people in the village and a hundred people in diamond head and a hundred people Bellavista OR in holiday island or horseshoe bend and not one of them would have thought of that looking in the bill churches for whether you could you could log or not within the community and if you've been to any of those places of the imagine them well as we are now with trees and imagine them again without trees. Try that all. But not X. follow up on this same issue one of what the owner of the subdivision about a bulldozer in. And just this cleared and burned. We'll be here with the same issue at that point. Again that would it was my intention was it have to be over three acres. And and normally when you bring in a does or to do those type of things you're you you're fixin to your your begin at the beginning so construction you're you're getting ready to do something that's what I'm trying to keep from affecting is all those things that people would normally do of this that would be construction that would be clearing on their property of and things that we miss like power lines or or beetle investments or or whatever what we and even I figured it's people would come to me with the we need to better define what a gated community was and that's to help me to find because of I have no doubt that it needs to be better defined but again my purpose is noble. and if you if you live there or your your mother lived there. you would feel the same way. Thank you Senator any other questions for the senator. In that case the Secretary ward is going to bring it up since you can ask for Mr do you want me to stay here you stay right there we're gonna be calling you back or Senator Clark. More German west for from the Arkansas department of agriculture but may I would like to answer our state for St Joe fox to join us here and just wanna make a comment about zero Joe's currently serving as president of the national association of state foresters maybe a little bit by us but I don't think amount of lines and we've we've got the best State Forster and the state of Arkansas that's the the best a portion of the country and does our subs of my direct expert inside if I'm if I may I'll defer most of these questions to him yes are you might. Okay Joe fox on the State Farm center which makes me the Director of the forestry division of the Arkansas department of agriculture and I'm happy to answer questions or I'm and I do have some materials there's enough of our being P. manual or civil cultural for water quality abeam best management practices manual here the to pass rounded committee have got three copies each of a the southern group of state far stirs reporter you Sir can we can get the staff to pass that up please. Before going to do everything I want Senator Sturch bill passed this question to secretary ward then we'll we'll go into that. This is not enough. Yes thank. Thank you Mr and this may be directed towards your to the Secretary I I did I didn't know which one of the best I just kinda want to get an idea of what currently is done as far as the permitting process goes if we're under senator Clark still if we're adding another permit with that require any additional staff on your part I know it's got a hundred dollar fee assuming that will go into the operations of actually doing it but if you could visit that first time I have a follow up after that the the first thing I need to say this would be the first permit that we've ever had for Arkansas for any reason in the forest industry whether it was for landowners to permit them to be able to sell their trees are to do logging or Department log everything we've done with best management practices for loggers and landowners on a voluntary basis backed up by the far stewardship council sustainable forestry institute in the tree farm system a committee mills I'd say seventy five to eighty percent of all lawyers are trained by the ATP eighty Arkansas timber producers association and that that's a requirement that they be trained in these best management practices before the law so proud to say that on the voluntary basis no permits we are now implementing these best management practices according to at two thousand eighteen survey at ninety three percent implementation right that's very good that's a solid day. So this would be the first permit ever for anything like this in Arkansas. Okay Sir. Okay so that's good no so then let me go a little bit further if it's all voluntary does the department under the forestry division you're going to inspect sites at all throughout the year yes whenever we're called we we help train loggers and landowners and BMPs we do a complimentary inspections of logging jobs quite often to help lawyers learn in the woods how to apply and implement these of best management practices so that's done quite a bit we'll we'll get normally. Twenty five to thirty five complaints in a year and there might be five of those that are valid and those loggers are offered the chance to mitigate what it is they've done maybe they've left tops in a creek and long as they pull them out and take care of things we don't write him up or cite them through the clean water act we have an email you with the division of environmental quality the Arkansas division of environmental quality to do all of the inspections on logging or forestry complaints we've had that imho you since I think nineteen ninety seven so we've done this for quite some time and by the way for free to the to the public in this case in this particular one diamond head we were there at least five times looking for the longer correcting any that think they had some very minor things that were corrected but as far as those BMPs that I just passed out I think there were three different loggers they were doing what they were supposed to do for forestry civil cultural BMPs. I'm sorry Mr that right of one thirty okay so if according to this this pictorial record was over the years time you saying then that over a year's time you had five different site visits to that I guess my question is to make sure that like these pictures here was this the way it's been all this time or is this over time to where it's been cleaned up and they'd it doesn't look like this right now I have not visited the site so I I can't answer that question but as far as logging BMPs it's not unusual for a longer to leave the tops and and the wood waste raw material to write down and comes it helps get not route will return nitrogen and other things into the sole so we we do ask lawyers to spread their limbs and other logging residue out amongst the places that they have cut that's a regular thing in rule Arkansas thank you thank you Mr. Any other questions for the secretary Mr Gilmour. in your experience. Does the does eighty Q. often cite loggers you said you had imho you with them to they often cite loggers FOR you know inappropriate practices leaving slash and write in creeks and streams and things of that nature center and working you take your mask off and ask questions sure my apologies. In your experience this department of environmental quality often cite lawyers and and and those companies for leaving slash and streams and things of that nature. I know of no instance when that is has come to that in every instance that we have worked with eighty Q. when a longer was a little resistant or had left the the tract needed to come back we've been able to get the the flogger back but eighty Q. through us through our investigation has the right to issue penalties and that threat has gotten the the very few bloggers back out but I only know of like two cases in my time as state forester or that was necessary and frankly I've been in the Logan and lumbering business I'm I'm third generation lumberman myself fifth generation our cans and I claim that as well and I know of no time in my career that any longer has been prosecuted by eighty Q. four leaving trash slash tops in a creek or any other infraction of our BMPs or the clean water act. Please enter your. Well that was my follow up so thank you for dressing that. Any other questions for the secretary before I'm allowed to allow them to go ahead and make whatever comments they have to make. Go ahead if we have questions at the finish will continue forward. I've made most of my comments I just want to say that south wide we work with other states so that are BMPs or like there's I think all those other states except maybe Kentucky and Virginia or non regulatory states and industry looks at that when they come here with the regulatory or non regulatory we have wonderful not not as wonderful as I'd like infrastructure for our industry to use I would to utilize our would resource and we have a dynamic farce that grows again so even when we make mistakes uh the good lord covers that up through nature over time with a little bit of patience many many places that are hugely chamber today or cotton farms in the civil war year we've never seen them as farms they've always been far as to us but far as come back after they're cooked washed all National Forest is a great example so remember that far Sir a dynamic place but it does take years to replace and there's no no question about that Arkansas is doing a very good job of implementing BMPs and installing BMPs on our logging sites this particular bill would make it mandatory inside those those gated communities and gated community is is not defined at all in the in the bill if this bill had been in place as low for the diamond head instance. Nothing would have been changed. Because we we did check those lawyers for these BMPs and have they been mandatory they followed the BMPs nothing would have changed if this bill had been law when when the the lots common areas were logged over diamond head you know I'm I have to say I've never seen a pretty logging job there's no such thing as a pretty logging job but give it time give it time and it can become pretty the other thing I've got to say is because of the lack of logging in Gatlinburg Tennessee some gated communities some not when you got dry over there a few years ago and so Marchioness start of fire on the national park it ran all for the National Park and on the Gatlinburg I think there were like twenty some odd fatalities there was a fire storm and if you don't log in gated communities sometimes that's the worst thing that can happen because you do have to much fuel in other dry times I don't know if that would have been the case ever a diamond and I'm not saying that I'm just saying we don't want to restrict logging anywhere we want to stay on a voluntary basis. You have any comments secretary work you don't any other questions for them. That being said won't will move on. We have several people here signed up to speak for and against the bill is we'll we'll start out with Act raffle from the forestry association. Razzle please enter several record. Is this a chair and members of the committee can you hear me. There we go green that's good green is good. I'm express lane the executive vice president of the Arkansas forestry association been before you before and so you probably familiar that a if they represents the entire forestry spectrum in the state of Arkansas we have eleven hundred members who range from private non industrial landowners it would have a concern about this bill to loggers to force products manufacturers I can honestly say that I don't know of a single a if a member who would support this bill and so I'll make my main point first despite Senator clocks will intention and we we enjoy our relationship he's spoken to our board members before we understand the background in the angst over what happened on that property but there is no portion of this bill that the Arkansas forestry association can support and you have a letter combined letter from the Arkansas forestry association the Arkansas timber producers and the Arkansas forced in paper council expressing our collaborative concerns then we all are unanimous in opposing this bill I think it would send a chilling message to the entire forestry sector in the state of Arkansas for us to move to any portion of a mandated BNP program I'll reiterate that you've heard already that this program is well established every remedy for a forestry related BMP is in place it is effective it's based on science and so every remedy is there for a forced BMP in the conversations that we've had so far this morning we've talked about clear cutting but never one time if we heard that the the mentioned that forestry BMPs. Were at fault here in this situation so I think this bill also is dangerous in that it conflicts sort makes confusing what is clearing for residential construction and what is forestry and we don't want to go there as well it also is razor close to dramatically infringing on private property rights and with the knowledge that private property owners should have and want to have the opportunity to make the decisions based on what they would like to do with their property and a if a is a staunch supporter of private property rights and I can't re emphasize this enough voluntary best management practices are voluntary for a reason because we've proven as a community that we can affected lease implement them we also have third party certification programs as Joe mentioned the sustainable forestry initiative the American tree farm program that we implemented at AFA and the force to stewardship council who have rigorous guidelines with force BMPs as a foundation of those guidelines so that's a second layer of protection out there and win when you see these large companies in these large land owners become third party certified. Those BMPs are not voluntary any longer they are critical to them maintaining their third party certification we also have implemented our own smoke management guidelines forestry has school has levels of self imposed guidelines that are rigorous no other sector of the agriculture industry has even within the Arkansas forestry association through our force practices committee that looks at on the ground force practices we have a BMP task force that specifically looks at how we are operating from a BMP perspective and when we see problems we try to tackle those and make sure that again we're creating solutions and not part of the problem I don't want to belabor these points but I would point out that on just at the bottom in section two We certainly do not want to gated permit at all but it says certify in the application he or she will follow Arkansas forestry commission's best management practices for water quality protection. That's where we see this moving towards and in this basically defines a regulated BMP program again and in a in an instance that rarely happens and so what we're doing here is we're taking an issue that actually is a residential development area and we're using a very very successful forestry BMP program as a as the solution and that's not the solution we we started this conversation with this is probably not the solution this is definitely not the solution please don't take a historically successful voluntary forestry best management practices program make any part of that mandate mandated or regulatory any use it to try to solve a problem that that was not in existence there's an article that was it was in the hot springs paper it speaks to the issues around the the the problem perhaps the practices from a residential construction of perspective but it also makes clear that there were no issues with forestry BMPs. And and I live it up in a nice community and I worry about whether they're going to clear the land next to me as well and so I I empathize with folks who have this concern but this is not the solution and as Joe mentioned you could regulate it but from a forestry BMP perspective. It wouldn't solve the problem and I can I can I can almost guarantee you. That the emotion around this that if if the the BMP work was perfect in a situation like this people would still have been upset that their trees had been removed but you can't utilize that to to basically punish a sector that is performing at a level it just doesn't make sense to take that particular approach and again I'll make one more point again this could have a lot of unintended consequences we're not going to ask residents in a gated community to follow forestry best management practices that they make a decision to clear their land and so we may be asking someone to leave a thirty five foot streamside management zones buffer on their property now when they never thought they would have to do something along those lines on their lights in their residential communities but that's what forestry BMP folks have to do so this is This is convoluted and we think an issue that simply is not a forestry BMP issue. And so with that I would be happy to take any questions that you have. Thank you Sir do we have any questions. Senator Sturch. Thank you Mr thank you Max I. I don't know how to ask this and I don't know even if I should ask my wife tells me I'm too honest to be in politics. So I'm going to ask grace from the chair that. If you had to pick. Between the first permit and a weight limit increase which one are you gonna pick. If you want but I can't give you both give me one educate give me both while that is an incredible incredible question. And. As chair of this committee let's let's stay with the with the case in front of us. Are you at you don't have a base that Max. I. Other I was taking the direction of of of the chair or anyone else I that I would I would hate to answer that question if I don't have to I won't if I do I will give you my best radio television media trained response says that Mister chair what what would you wish me at any other questions for Max. Thank you members of the committee for a listening to our concerns. Thank you we have another one against with Arkansas timber producers. Larry please state your name and everything for the record. Mister chairman a member of the committee my name is Larry Bock roles on the executive director of the Arkansas timber producers association and and our socio Haitian works close at hand with the Arkansas for fiscal situation but our primary membership is the independent logging contractors and timber producing of members in Arkansas and I want to go over what's already been said by Joe or a Max because we support every issue that they mention and supported just to reiterate that permit a be a first time issue with that a four time concerned with that and though it also would would want to talk about the BNP's a little bit in that we do have the voluntary BMP program has been and and and effect as Joe said that in the last of the studies with the ninety three percent success rate we've been heavily involved with the MP trying to get my associations nineteen ninety five and we do BMP training in conjunction with the forestry commission that's one of our primary modules a one of our overall for model training program the timber companies in the State of yes Sausalito state implementation committee which is part of the sustainable forestry initiative requires that training of had called at four o'clock in the afternoon for a longer could not get on the log saw it on the on the yard because he did have a certificate to show he completed the training so that BNP is it is it strongly emphasize in the industry and has been it's gotten stronger ever since we've had for complete support and cooperative effort in the industry and is Max said I think we're talking about different BMPs in a construction area versus BMPs for water quality and of those the streamside management zones how to construct water Barstow taught those types of things are part of the educational program in our in our training program for the employees. So just like to close by saying that did not beat a dead horse because we would complete to support all the other issues here we just thank because of a the permit issue not known if it can spread further than that and strictly the voluntary program that we've had through BMPs been successful and we we would hate to see anything even though it's not here sometimes the door can be opened work could lead to something that the unintended so with that Mister chairman I'll close and try to answer the questions that the committee might. Thank you Sir you have any questions for for Larry. Seeing no questions thank you Sir thank you. We have three to speak for the start with Mr being Sanders. Hey Mister Sanders please introduce yourself a record. Thank you Mr chairman my name is Ben Sanders and I am a resident of the dominated community. And I wish to thank the chair and senator Clark for bringing this before this committee. Thank you Sir go right ahead. It sounds like the forestry commissions against this in her sale that were not against the forestry commission at all I can about is sale. Jean in a. It is important to realize we're talking about a gated communities not host all practices across the state of Arkansas like down south Fordyce area new and very. From the land. Totally different and actually the clear cutting when we talk about best management practice the clear cutting of forty acres hundred acres recently seen looks far far better than what's been left and then hit I would invite anyone in here to drive up to. What was left. And I heard de eighty you can mention and I will get into it because it's actually before the eighty queue at this time uh someone mentioned that they had been out five. Inspecting the wreckage that's my terminology is a disastrous destruction. and and and. In nineteen. It is based. Against the logging practices indictment. It has not been settled. But right next to my house and and it was one of the lawsuits. I can not clear cutting it was more destruction. In our would be quiet and all the folks. All the small tree. And the pops in its you know from what I've seen in the forestry practices down south the. Read more logs off of. the tremendous size pops away all over them in it in creeks and drainage areas. The stop. Many colleagues into lake Catherine. There's no rhyme or reason. Hi all the data all the property in Diamondhead. Five years I'm not sure some of the practices that I've heard here today. I'll be honest with that pop into the lockers. Anyone in here. About in Lucknow. Property for house that's one thing. One. Isn't this messages just in high. Amended. On. This. Hello read. Incident. This. In district collectors. I'm sorry For. We're talking about. Change in practices in Arkansas we're just trying to serve. At. I would. Right now. Everything starts blooming. Destruction. It. Correct that. Thank you Sir do we have any questions for Mr Sanders. Thank you Mister senator. miss Nora. Please take your your name and. All pertinent information for the record. My name is Nora Cole and I'm a resident in Diamondhead. My husband and I purchased our home at one hundred Patel Mick which is just off the spring break drive approximately eleven years ago. Diamondhead became a permanent resident residents in twenty fifteen Diamondhead as you know is an established gated community it is fifty years old. When my husband and I purchased our home he liked the amenities of Diamondhead I love the woodland setting it was a perfect compromise for us I am speaking in support of this bill because what has happened to my community over the last two years. I'd love to coming down spring creek Dr as you come around the final bend in spring creek there is our house tucked away among tall trees we work hard in landscaping or yard and the contrast of our house tucked away inside of woodland settings striking not only had we found our forever home we have found R. for ever community. When I became aware of the locking I talked to many people including forestry Garland County environment and AD EQ I obtained a copy of the Arkansas forestry commission best management practices it soon became apparent that the MPs were not being strictly followed in a residential community bordering a state park and lake Catherine this is had devastating effects. This bill will ensure BMPs are followed correctly and in a timely manner. It will ensure the stability and protection of a gated community if BMPs are not followed it will insurer personal property value it will ensure the environment will not be harmed it will ensure that a community can grow without being devastated. I have a deep abiding love for the state I am a native our cans and my family has lived in this area of Arkansas since the early eighteen hundreds my grandfather logged around I wouldn't mean area I am not opposed to walking I fully realized this is an important industry in Arkansas and provides jobs for many people which in turn allows them to support their families I've met many of the lawyers when they ring diamond head the majority of them we're kind and polite yet these to last year's had been one of the most emotionally devastating things I have ever gone through. When the walking started in spring Brooke in the spring of twenty twenty the sound of heavy equipment what my husband and me up at six AM every morning day in and day out weekend and week out it was spring time we normally would be out in our yard and have the windows open in our house instead we stayed inside with all the windows closed and tried to shut out what was happening around us the sound of heavy equipment the chain saws the crashing of huge trees as they felt was shaking and the windows in our home when the trees hit the ground our beautiful street Senate came and recognizable. Our yard flooded in places it is not flooded in the previous years we lived there because of the erosion that occurred from the locking the lot directly behind our house was not logged yet we had three big trees fall last summer in that law when the route simply could not hold because of the water erosion caused by the logging. If BNP procedures have been followed in a manner as recommended by this bill many of these issues would have been avoided it is my hope to never again have to injure anything like what has occurred in my community the last two years and to prevent anything like this happening to another gated community. Thank you ma'am we have any questions. Senate. And and this is for anyone really it's a how many acres or a law does anyone. Have a idea on the. We don't know that they log haphazardly. Please come on other changed state your name and everything the record. The original permit was referred to spell I'm sorry my name is Kent reasoner and I'm a resident in Diamondhead and the registry to go and have a Speaker on this next. The original the original permit specified I believe and I have to look it up but I believe it said six hundred and sixty nine acres. Go ahead Senator but it was the what's the total acreage of the community. I don't know. I don't I don't know what the did you know me homes in the community. Prognostics Senator Clark you have a that information bill always bills selected a five. I'm. I don't have the information I was gonna see if I could start looking it up but I don't on the Committee website is showing twenty three hundred acres total so as well yes you know we're looking about. Twenty five percent of the property was sold yes. Thank you. I would like to I would like to just add that The BMPs are good if our issue it my issue in and what happened I mean it is not an issue with the forestry commission I understand that they had inspections out there five times and I talked with John Beasley many times. The bottom line is is that. There were no violations that caused environmental issues which in turn. Got a DQ involved and there are violations that case is now in front of the enforcement committee my understanding is that the lawyers are litigating whatever and. What happened was wrong. However. I show my family or Capri appreciate that very much that they're litigating it everything so strongly that part out of it out of the state with the bill okay so again the issue is not my my statement is that if the BMPs have been followed correctly. They were not followed correctly we do have we do have treetops increase we do still have rights we have compacted soil the bottom line was in and when I read the piece it said you go back and you fix what you broke I'm not saying you bring back the trees but is set to prevent erosion. The compacted soil you feel in the rights thank you you till the dark someone and you put seed down you don't leave tree tops and creeks you you you repair creek beds that have been. Compromise because of the Logi none of this has been done none of it thank you senator Gilmore aye questions for you. Well and I'm not sure. I'm not sure who the question is directed I think it was you that mentions a permit it was not followed can that I may have missed it would have to step out to go run another bill in another committee but could could someone in prep Senator Clark you could speak to a a permit I don't know who who who issued the permit or I just heard there were no permit so that we have no permits in the logging industry so I I have no idea. What could could perhaps you speak to that and it's not that I don't believe that they there's a permit this yeah I don't know if maybe the community issued a permit. Okay. Absolutely. The it was not a forestry permit it was not an AD EQ permit it was not a permit related to diamond head it was a permit it was and I I have to go back and say it was a permit issued by AD EQ to clear these is these six hundred and sixty nine acres disturbance disturbed the soil yes okay thank you you have anything else you wanna add misconduct with comments yes I have a statement to make please make it. If I'm not being trying to rescue one we're getting shorter time for for committee members okay. It's it's short and I'll cut it back a little bit I'm a diamond head resident I've been there for approximately twenty five years I consider diamond head my home I live in house but diamond head is my home when I come through the gates I feel that I'm at home. Diamondhead what is a beautiful wooded forest community that spans both to counties Garland County and Hot Spring County it borders lake Catherine state park and it also is sitting on let Kathryn proper. I was surrounded by beauty I was surrounded by woodland sites I have wildlife we have deer raccoons wolves it not wheels that county's box so it is in every sense a very rural. Community we have we don't have any sidewalks we don't have any curbs we have asphalt roads and when we get potholes then we fill them with asphalt there are some people that live and I would have that don't even live on an asphalt road they live on a on a dirt road so it's a very rural wooded environment if you would see that you would see how would it is. Our home our community has been decimated and devastated by the destruction of logging most people will describe it when they see it they'll say that it looks like like a tornado has gone through and no one has done any clean up the other way it's described it looks like a bomb has gone off and I really applaud senator Clark for coming out looking at it because as he said in his opening statement there are no words there are no pictures that could adequately describe the significant bass nous of what you're looking at in terms of destruction so I hope that each anybody is welcome to come and actually see it for themselves we still have felled trees and degrees and acres and acres of land that continues to look like a tornado went through and no one cleaned it up. I. From the time the logging began and that began in approximately June of two thousand nineteen the forestry commission has been out there several times and done inspections they talk to the lockers we got feedback from the inspector that said that he was trying to educate the lockers and BMPs we became familiar with BMPs I didn't know what to be empty US three years ago now I do. When. As a logging went on for years. we continue to have debris all over the ground the creeks Roshen. we have settlement that's flowing into lake Catherine. the Arkansas department of environmental quality was also aware of this devastation right from the very beginning two years ago and they also sent out numerous inspectors I brought with me today of fifty nine page report from the Arkansas department of environmental quality that was dated April third April third twenty twenty it was at that point in time in April of twenty twenty of the Arkansas department of environmental quality felt the violations were so severe they brought it before the enforcement division of their own agency. The fourth of twenty twenty. Arkansas department of environmental quality. Sent eight consent administrative order to the owner of the land I'm I'm only here we're we're familiar with the eighty cues issues us going back in this state stay with the bill okay that's this coming forward we're running out of time. If and I'm not not the committee but we we don't need to talk about the case with AD EQ that does not involve us. At least reference that. In in regard to. A penalty that AG Q. is issued it wouldn't make any difference if that no ma'am let let's let's move on past eighty Q.. It is Senator Clark wants to do it when it closes a convention that. Okay in favor of the bill. Senate bill three eighty five if we have this bill in place it would have prevented the mass destruction that we're still seeing after two years this is not an anti logging bill far from it it is only a managed blocking bill it requires a permit it requires close monitoring something that was not done in Diamondhead. It provides for timely compliance something that has not been done and it also would stop logging in the event that the best management practices were not followed. I cannot stress enough how important this bill is to individuals such as us that live in these rural residential gated communities and we really need a bill like this to protect us from the kind of destruction that we have seen. I'm done. Do you have any questions for his candor. Thank you very much Senator Clark back to you. And you can make anything you want in your clothes if you want me to make the EQ please feel free to. Thank you Mr. Thank you Committee. I think that you can see. That if these were people in your district. You'd be looking for a solution. This is my industry. These are people are supporting lock. What they told you is what I sometimes hear from my employees not not me. They told about best management practices. In. If in relief position I took that in sales but the position that took is. We should have no restrictions and if we want to if we want to clear cut gate communities in accordance to Senator Beckham's numbers. One quarter. Of the community. And I gotta tell you if they're going to build on that and Mr fox cleared up for me that that was a construction. This is being done under the guise of construction if there to fix in the bill of six hundred sixty nine acres I'm excited. It both for the economic impact on my district and the fact that I so long for I'm just I'm just tell if they're going to if they're gonna bill six hundred and sixty nine acres I live. On a little bit less than that. That's a look at a lot of houses We'll we'll hide Watson to but that happens. The. But the. The position was or will be able to log everywhere and colluding gated communities that was our position. Okay. Let me say. Before I forget what a fan I am of Joe fox Joe called me last night but will text me actually and I called him late last not to let me know he was coming. And just just in our conversation back and forth his knowledge just amaze me I told him that I'd like to go to lunch and visit because as he talked about the forested hot springs village and forced in California force and I would just I learned so much of passing that he dispenses you know it's just. Normal stuff. The. But. My favorite thing to do is not golf it's not hot I like the four wheel. And I have a Christian you know what people can't anymore because everything's getting posted and everything but I have acres where I can for will and I have permission from my neighbors. And you all are Arkansas boys so you have probably but maybe not been out in an area that's been law if you hot there's a good chance of. It looks like a war zone. Right. Please the ones I've been in because when I for will and I'm pretty good. There ain't no straight path. You gotta you gotta you gotta make your way through. Because. It's a mess. Okay and out in the middle of wards when I talk about my neighbor login Hendren twenty acres he's my friend. And his family they inherited land the that's what they do all these trucks land is timberland and and as it matures they log it. So he didn't think anything about that I don't think anything about it. But. But this but if they are going to maintain. That is that we ought to be able to log. Being defeated communities and say that with a straight face. Then they need a new. Paragraph or several paragraphs. For best management practices for what we do in a gated community. Because what we do out in the woods Senator Gilmore center Beckham is not acceptable. You can you can have this mess. Can you imagine. The drive in and to it can you imagine that you know that that you what the the H.. You've got a state in a vacation home all the RBO at hot springs village and you went out and it had been logged. Yeah and there was. No you as opposed to what in the world as I thought this was a I thought this was a vacation place I thought this was a retirement place. Not a place for me to set up a tree stand near the edge of the woods. Max said we see problems we tackle. I think in the past they have. But here's a problem. That needs to be tackled. We need to tackle it. So I'll tell you what I'm gonna do. We purchase some things here that need to be changed in the bill. Without objection. Mr I will pull will them but I'm gonna bring it back. And I'm either gonna bring it back unamended I will bring it back amended. But Senator Gilmore aye they tell you you know you're in timber and center back on the of the this is temporary and you've got to protect us. If I bring it back unamended it's because I wasn't offered anything. Except we ought to be able to go in and slash and burn in gated communities. And if you think that's acceptable. When you have a problem you come see me. With your with your districts and with the things that are happening to to the little guy there because we say big business I don't care if it's timber I don't care with logging I don't care was built in the field we say big business can just walking alone got and it's just property rights in this is it that's okay so be it Senator Clark let's let's stay away from from personal point at issue that's not not proper well of I think you know what I'm saying I will I will take your Thank you admonishment of Mister chair but elected without objection pull this down I will be bringing it back amended or unamended but because back in a minute it's because nobody offered power lines nobody offered all these things you know what to gated community supposed to be ex exactly they just said. Not our problem. Suffer your your. Senator Sturch. Thank Mr since we spent so much time on it I just I kind of wanted to add this just to discussion and I didn't mean my question and yes but you know if if they think that a new permit would be so outrageous or anything like that as far as forestry industry I'd like to know then what is the current process with AT Q. or whatever as far as if there is a issue or if there is a complaint you know what this process is far as a citizen or anybody going to that and if senator Clark address that now or to or later in this bill that's kind of what I'd like to see is if if it's not a new permit what is the solution for a grievance and what you what you get with the for free so text or member or secretary after the and I was meeting after that thank you thank you inflict senator Clark with a welcome involved in that. Thank you Mr All the Three eighty five have been pulled down and without objection that objection. Thank you Mr chair thank you members of the a committee for your patience and hearings today thank you will go to. No the H. H. B. fourteen forty two by Senator Sturch. And senator Wallace can you come up here and preside over the meeting from a place. Senator church Sturch you are recognized. Thank you Mr yes Senator Sturch does go to church that should things Logan. Could I invite Mr Kelly boy from the state land commissioner says Kelly come up thank you. Is your if your dishes self. Thank you Mr chair members the committee I'm Kelly board chief deputy commissioner of state lands Kilis could see again Sir thank you Sir. You make a decision thank you colleagues that this is not my bill this actually Senator Stubblefield spill but of course he's chairing over in city county local but essentially what we're trying to do with the bill is right now on state land a state owned land the royalty payments that come to us whether to be timber gas or whatever they want to make away with those payments can be made online through an online database of state land commission's office so what you'll see throughout the bill is just that new enabling legislation for that process to allow those payments to be made online from these companies that are you know have royalties on state owned lands Alec Kelly explain any further if we need to. Mr chairman he did an excellent job I'll let stand which sits yes Sir questions members do you have any questions. Seeing no questions. Are there any comments from the audience anybody for against this bill. I remember seeing no one I'm asking for. The motion I have a motion the second all in favor say aye. Hi. It by a post. Congratulations Senator Sturch and I'll see you in church. What's the. The members we withdrew the three chairs today but we got through it we are churned. Well that.