Judiciary Committee- House

You get to work we have a couple of special guests this morning I think our committee is unique in that we get to work with directly with some of the branches of government and the head officers of those entities we're very delighted this morning the both of them accepted our invitation to come to house judiciary we look forward to them at this particular time I would like to recognize our Chief Justice of the Arkansas Supreme Court Chief Justice Building camp so Chief Justice you're more than welcome to come to the end to table you'll be recognized in that those of us who are lawyers that so that's a great thing to be able to tell the Chief Justice he has to wait and speak retailing to speak so. We do welcome the Chief Justice we appreciate your time out of your busy schedule in the courts busy schedule and we welcome Marty Sullivan who is the director the administration office of court I think most returning members know Marty pretty well at but at this time Chief Justice will turn the microphone over to you thank you thank you for being here thank you I appreciate the invitation from the chair of a representative of the thank you the representative very present this imitation to come before the committee skews me for my voice I think the weather changes kind of gotten to me here but I'll try to manage with me and hopefully if you can hear what I've I've got to say And in service Chief Justice I've had the opportunity to serve at different levels of their judicial branch started in the municipal courts will serve that an F. years there which is now out of district courts that's a court of limited jurisdiction primarily traffic cases misdemeanors small claims. And then served a thirty years on the circuit court bench as a circuit judge and that's the courts of general jurisdiction we have a right to a jury trial we have the jurisdiction where over a five of subject areas of criminal civil juvenile probate and domestic relations. And the most recently had the opportunity to serve as chief justice now for six years on the appellate level and course on on that level you the appeals primarily from circuit court also from other agencies and and entities I think in some of the most recent levels is given me a unique opportunity to have a greater appreciation for our court system and what we can do for betterment of that court system doing the latter twelve years and has served as a circuit judge I was involved in the drug court a program serves your drug court judge and there's been a very beneficial program for the communities that keep people out of prison that are non violent but do have drug problems or probably need to be addressed in the communities and chair of the especially core programming visor committee we're looking at a possible expansion of our specialty court's was impossible of. Maybe domestic relations type courts. She ballots in that nature so we're kind of looking at what other states are doing and so. Before we do anything you know we look at the committee to look at that see what's gonna be best for Arkansas. As you notice if you look across the road here we're having some construction done on the Justice Building to expand it to expand in the north and south wings. We're adding an additional space so we can have all other I. T. people in one location rather than spread and a couple locations throughout the city. And just last month that we received twenty million dollars to use and updating our case management system is something so long overdue but it's going to be a I think of a great benefit not only for the judicial branch but also with the other branches governing modernizing a case management and the more quickly receive information about your in traffic stops for officer safety thank you to be used for that too so we're excited about that hopefully will build better sales and is that the people of the contract to do that and hopefully have that completed let's see in two years I don't know if we're going to do with that quick but you know gonna push that. But just wanted to and also the other week we're gonna have a civics education center primarily for the judiciary but also to be for the other branches legislative and the executive branches as well we have a safer location to offload students from school buses just right here between the the the capital in the Justice Building which I think a lot safer than put them off on the front of the capitol or some other location so we're looking forward to that will also have more meeting space for a judicial meetings in the lower level in the basement level whereas now we may have to get a hotel conference room this will allow us to have those of meetings and they had Justice Building revenue there so we've got some exciting things going on with the. Suggested that you if you want to see any court in operation or District Court or circuit court feel free to contact Marty and he can arrange an opportunity for you to visit with that court and observe them and this is what the judges the judges and maybe answer any questions that you may have about our court system operates so we'd be glad to respond to you in that way so that you know we try to answer any questions about a particular case but in general about to help us system operates and how our court system works. And of course that you over a was we complete the of the building or a soft opening before we have to actually have a grand opening so that you can see what what we've done what we're doing or plans are. Let me give um Marty and opportunity here so make some comments at this time. Happy to be here termed Dalby thanks for inviting us I think I've met most of the committee and had interactions with all of you I'm a seventh generation or cans and I I think it's one of the the the the greatest honor is probably my life to have been able to work at the agency for the last twenty years I I came there as an intern and never left I kind of moved up within the organization and literally from picking up trash in the parking lot in the hallway to being an IT manager now having keys of the Supreme Court it's humbling to say the least what we've been able to accomplish over the last six years or is fairly significant my wife is a lawyer so I hear the concerns about court connect in our technology in the password resets and others things so we're we're working to to fix all of those we appreciate the Arkema that was given us to help rebuild our case management system I think this really revolutionary were one of five or six states that are doing that removing from a vendor based system to a system that we own and control I think it's really I remember the book reinventing government and reading that college and this is really something that we're we're doing now and taken to heart I think the agency is probably the one of the best public service organizations in the state that most people don't know about we provided all support to every judge and court staff throughout the state so we really fly under the radar unless you're in the judicial branch I brought miss brown some maps because I was thinking if I were you all what would be beneficial and so these are the updated as of last week circuit and district maps so I know many of you may not be familiar with the the court community so that list every circuit and and it lists which judge is in your circuit so if. You don't know those individuals who probably busy bee busy the next four months but maybe this summer if you want to go visit your courts I would encourage you to do that especially the district courts the district courts are basically traffic courts of the those are the ones that everyone's going to have interaction with at some point I think it's remarkable that the state of Arkansas we process over a million two hundred thousand cases a year that's more than all the federal courts combined so our case load is very significant and You being leaders in the the legislation on the legislature I would encourage you to get to know your judges and just go visit them and go see kind of the problems that they're dealing with and really the innovative things that they're doing to mention the specialty court's those are really phenomenal to see individuals that go in that are suffering from addiction and once they come out of those programs they're functioning members of society that's one of the most rewarding things I've get get to do is go to the the drug court graduation so I would encourage you to do those in your community as well Thank all of you have my cell phone number and I want to get it out because we're broadcasting but if you need anything I know representative Dalby knows how to get in touch with me if it's okay I would like to introduce that the key staff for the administrative office of the courts there's four divisions within the A. S. C. one of them is the legal division that is headed by Kristen Clark Kristen Clark is a former district judge really proud to have her on staff and then Brooks dean is the head of the juvenile division and she'll introduce a few of her staff as well but there's legal juvenile the technology division and administration those two are back literally building the case management system right now so I told them to you know keep working but if you need anything call me twenty four seven and I pride myself on being super responsive and I mean that so I appreciate your service the state and call me if you need anything. Christopher thank you Christopher. One Kristen Clarke and the director of the legal services division at the administrative office of the courts I grew up in Polk County I see we've got to our representatives here I live in White County currently and I'm married to a man named Frank had county and we've got at another place in stark county so I'm all over the place intercourse work here but if we can be a resource to you if we can answer any questions or be helpful then please feel free to call on us any time at like Marty said we pride ourselves on being very responsive to the public and to you all is well I'd like to take just a second to introduce three of the staff attorneys that we have here in the legal division one is crystal man crystal if you'd stand up she is primarily responsible for questions related to civil matters or criminal matters we have lower Calhoun. Laura is primarily responsible for questions related to domestic relations or probate matters and then we also have been bottom Indian is primarily responsible for District Court related questions. Hi I'm staying and that director of the juvenile division at the administrative office of the courts and I grew up in fort bend county and live here in Pulaski County now with my family and I graduated law school with representative Gazaway down there and I was in private practice for eleven years and then and it was a staff attorney at the agency for five years before taking on this role and we will assist you with any questions you have regarding dependency neglect cases and juvenile delinquency cases or fans family in need of services questions so if you have any kind of questions on any of those cases just let us know and I won't repeat what they said but we are available whenever you need us and happy to share my cell number we also have a staff attorney in the juvenile division code this is kind of melted he is also available should you have any questions about juvenile cases thank you so much. Thank you thank you for being here. Chief is that everybody you have anything else else you'd like to. Add to it would appreciate it. I just wanna say again thank you this opportunity before the committee and I intend to start up coffee with the chief on Wednesday mornings in that they would drop by you know it's informal don't have any agenda just get to know each other a little bit better did this two sessions ago we were able to do it the last session because a code but hopefully re institute this but if you get the opportunity come about a woodland Avenue which the mortgage or before you start your committee meeting so get up to drive and have coffee and get to know each other a little bit better thank you thank you to thank you so much and thank you staff members of the court for being here we appreciate it we look forward to working with you this session and you've feel free to leave if you've got other things I know Marty probably has a lot thank you so much Chief. Members next is our honor to have tourney General Tim Griffin here in our committee committee this morning we and extended the invitation to his office he graciously accepted and so Attorney General Griffin we're looking forward to hearing from you and your staff and your plans thank you thank you any time U. S. may I will be here every time it's an honor to be here. I've never served on this committee I have served served on the Judiciary Committee and the and the Congress and I certainly understand and respect the role they all play with thank you chair and and vice chair for having me first want to say most of you already have my cell phone number it's on the internet but let me give it to you again I don't want anyone ever saying that they can't get the answer they need they can't get the information they need they can't get a meeting if you have you're not gonna have that problem but if you do just call me or text me directly and we will we will get it working five zero one eight three seven fifty one ninety. Eight three seven fifty one ninety I understand the role they all play respect greatly you have an oversight role also funding role without you could function and I I appreciate all of that Let me just I could talk a lot longer than that I've got because there's a lot to talk about but let me let me just mention a few things First of all we're going to be good stewards of taxpayer dollars we are reviewing all of spending currently and we will we're gonna do everything we can to spend taxpayer dollars wisely and we can talk more about that later after my review that includes a public service announcmenet we're going to be very very careful with that money and and spend it sparingly Also I know that some legislators have been frustrated with the results of of what happens with leg audit reports what doesn't happen with leg audit reports that they get issued then sometimes no action is taken outside these walls and I am working very very closely with prosecutors on that and we're gonna. I think we've got a way of cooperatively without any new laws getting that fixed Currently the the law allows for the agency to address pursue those. Potential that petition misconduct. If a prosecutor decides they're not going to do it and so we are working properly cooperatively I've already met with will Clarke The New prosecutor here Pulaski County and I think everyone changes where we're trying to get just just get my office C. seat on the reports when they go to prosecutors because we don't know we don't know that they're going and if we get one at the same time then we'll be able to pick up the phone and have a conversation with that prosecutor and see who has the best resources or or whatever to get that done I think there are some folks looking at maybe additions legislation on that that would just get a C. seat on the report a very very small change their but I've heard from so many all lego didn't want to mention that federal. I know that representative a berry has a the bill on that I've got some ideas on that and working with prosecutors on the bill and and represented Gazaway on that and be happy to talk more about that later I will say representative Gazaway I certainly don't like him he told me do. He told me that he was the best one to work with on the committee. Remember he's an attorney so we have to watch the guys is hard to dislike it has been on he's been a good friend and partner over the last hello laughter here over the last six months or a year saw I generally run things by him to make sure you all at least in his innocence or or in the loop I will say Rison mention of drug courts I've spoken at those graduations and in the process of scheduling another one to really really good program where they what we have in and it It is helping a lot of people who don't need to be in our in our state president which are a blessing at the same We are. I've heard it from I don't think I heard from representatives but I heard from some senators some frustrations with with phone numbers so if you were to go to the AG website and call those numbers the you get voicemail and it's my understanding I didn't all the numbers but I had someone Dalem anyway we are addressing that I think some of that was technological issue but we have asked for a list of every number that goes into office what happens when you call and we're working with the I. S. on getting all that fix I would just ask that you give me you know give me a few more days and we'll figure all that out but if of course you have my cell phone so it but we want to make sure that up all that stuff working and I'll be sure to Senator to raise that with me that we're addressing that So I have a rockstar that's going to be living over here to Capitol Alex bent and I don't know if you all know Alex she's just been outstanding even in the short time that we work together she worked on boards and commissions before want would you stand up Alex this is Alex Benton she's our system Attorney General and director of intergovernmental affairs so she's handling all government relations federal government Ste a state government with the legislature counties cities she's great more help and we've got some help some help but her cell phone I know we're public but people I'm give to anyway five oh one eight oh four sixteen thirty seven. I've been online I know that a lot of people that we don't have a thousand people watch me I sure. Maybe to and they've already gotten numbers so Ron Cooper long time prosecuting attorney deputy prosecuting attorney and stand up with you Ron Ron senior assistant Attorney General the special prosecutions division eight seven oh three seven eight two oh five eight. and Adam Jackson. System AG criminal division eight seven a eight three eight five seven two seven welcome to my cell phone won't guys Anyway just excited to be here we got a lot of stuff going on I'll come over and hang out with you all when you let me but please just know that we're gonna we respect you and what you do and we want to be helpful we won't one hundred percent cooperation if there's any time that something looks itself. it was something was not done right just assume it wasn't intentional. And I think we show a little grace to each other I think things work better so just call me and we'll fix it whatever it is I promise you subject your questions. Thank you Mr AG any questions. We say nine members up barber will send those cell phone numbers out so if you didn't get him because the Attorney General talks fast you have to write fast we do appreciate it very much for taking out of your busy time to come over here we appreciate it it gives our members an opportunity to put some faces and names together with folks who will be here often members I urge you to reach out to the attorney general's office they are always I've always known him our Attorney General to be very responsive and I would fully expect that he expects the staff to be responsive so that we welcome that and also members in regard to the Supreme Court the Chief Justice means it call Marty Sullivan you can always they can get you to the right people we thank you for your time thank you for being here thank you I'd be remiss if I didn't mention something that's pending and nothing really to announce now but of course I'm working with the governor and legislators on a cool Justice Reform parole prisons like Senator but will be more on that later thank you thank you all right members were now going to turn to our agenda I see some legislators in the room the only bill that we're going to here today is going to be house bill ten eighteen house bill ten eighteen will be the only bill that we're going to here today and with that I'm going to recognize representative makes to come to the table representative makes you introduce your individual that has with you and then you're recognized to present house bill ten eighteen thank you madam chair colleague sites in Arbil present to your very first bill of the session and Glad that this is gonna be a public safety bill that hope you all can help support me on file with me this morning is Todd card and I've known Mr carton since our our high school years so it's been in quite a few years now he's on the Conway bomb squad and he's the one who brought this concern to me Sullivan let him introduce himself and then we've also blocked several other folks with us to help answer your questions and to me and support of the bill so Mr carton ballot you introduce yourself and to seller gas they're better in the room here with us and then we'll proceed to talk about the bill and what we're hoping to accomplish other hang on just one moment and is if you'll give them to quiet down so we can all hear it's been. All right you're recognized thank you ma'am good morning ladies and gentleman like thank you for being here thank you for allowing me to be here thank records representative makes in the audience I have a James Dawson he's these as they say for the Little Rock field office F. B. I.. I have a J. T. Coleman he is our special agent bomb tech for the Little Rock at the The. A. T. state I have my chief winner Mike winner he's here I know. Conway fire department he is a former bomb tech public safety bomb tech I have skip Mathews he's Fort Smith bomb squad commander of the Fort Smith fire department and I have Jason waiver of the Little Rock fire department he's the bomb squad commander bomb tick for that entity. Thank you thank you Donna for for being here so what we're hoping to do with this bill as under current Arkansas law the bomb squads in those two in the state three three in the state so there's currently three bomb squads within the the state and under current Arkansas law they are allowed to carry weapons to be able to defend themselves when they go in the buildings and other areas to conduct searches and they're only allowed to do so under the authority of the local sheriff and the concern is is that to you might have a situation where the local sheriff doesn't want to carry that liability for various reasons and what that does is that leave our heroes heroes the guys that are going into these buildings and everybody else is evacuating going into the situations on on where perpetrator may be still in the building not able to defend themselves and even more importantly not having the means to be able to detain that perpetrator or to be able to stop them if they're in the midst of doing something nefarious so what we're asking under this proposed legislation as the bomb squad technicians who have been properly trained according to law enforcement standards who have no black marks against them so these are going to be guys who know what they're doing at the proper training that on their own cognition they will be able to carry as they go into these situations bill protect themselves if a perpetrator is in the building they will have the ability to affect the rest of that perpetrator and hold them until the police are able to come over and take take over as it is right now they don't have that ability and so if they run into a perpetrator in the building they have no means to attain or stop that person and so what this does is it allows these guys a bill to protect themselves and by doing so. It also allows them to protect the public and to also protect potentially millions of dollars in property damage that could result from one of these devices going off so that I don't know Mr card has anything else to add but if not we will be open to questions from the committee. Members any questions. Representative Richardson you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair of so to date how often has this happened were you were these individuals needed firearm or protection or in a position where they can make an arrest. I can speak for con way we run our own surprisingly thirty five to sixty calls a year suspicious packages improvised explosive devices I've been a bomb tech for eighteen years I have. Come into situations we don't just respond upon a county we respond statewide when called we get in some remote places and sometimes it's often just us and the deputy there I've looked around before and being concerned you know that what if something happens to the deputy I'm not there to protect myself or the Deputy skip Matthews has a has a story that he would probably glad to share with this committee if you allow that pretty much started this ball rolling for us to come under. I will say our own authority but put the put the liability on the fire departments and give us the ability to carry you know right now we fall under Faulkner County sheriff's office we have a great relationship with share files there's no issue for the we fell into them and seven has been no issues with them skip currently. Cannot carry under his under his county sheriff they don't have that relationship this puts it back and allows him to carry and protect himself on these calls now I don't know if that answers your complete question or not Not not not exactly Act I guess I was trying to see you said there was one specific example I guess but. In the eighteen years you've been there I know you said you've been in some. Some of I'm not unfriendly but some worry some decisions but have you in yourself come in contact with somebody as you've gone into any of these situations over the eighteen year period I self personally yes okay yes I have another bomb tech that was with the ATF agent just the other day last year. I don't know the date October November they was on a suspect everyone had left the FBI occurred ATF commented this was cleaning up searching for evidence and other things they found the whiskey flask that black powder in it And a fuse improvised explosive device and the owner pulled up and had a weapon on him my bomb tech was not armed at the time if things went south. You know we've been here for a whole different reasons The county you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair thank you so much for coming today and I'm I've got some questions but before I ask them and you just want to say I really appreciate the work that you all do and I understand your desire to want to keep yourself safe I'm just kind of trying to figure out some of the nuts and bolts I understand and so you mentioned that sheriff's departments may historically have been a little bit hesitant because of liability issues can you explain to me exactly what this bill does with respect to our ability. I thank you personal liability for back on where it belongs the fire departments individual fire departments we've all been through. As a state skip is not able to carry a I can Kerry because I went to the part time deputies class Little Rock they require their their text to go through the full certified law enforcement You're recognized for it. And and and if it if it's okay with the chair maybe skip what you maybe want to come out and join us here at the table and you may be able to help answer some of these these questions. The just like to have that see their name pulled my phone up and reduce yourself and maybe you can help answer. But when it turns green then out record you're recognized to be sure self and then if represent clinic like to repeat a question for the gentleman and then he can respond okay I'm schemidt is unfortunate fire department bomb squad like taught I've been upon to eighteen going on twenty years now. It's your repeat your question and maybe sure and maybe I'll just kind of give you the the overarching reason why I'm asking is you know I think we talk about liability we also have to consider qualified immunity and we'll firefighters who are put in this position be subject to the protections of qualified immunity if something were to happen yes to ensure that we're going to conduct we continue our training is is not like a one and done deal with once you get certify we continue our training for example right I currently can't care right now I have been through the training but I still have an issue firearm but we don't care it but I continue to qualify two three times a year to maintain that training also and then we'll you know it's not like we're just We're just going to the course in a year certify that we have we have to continually trying. And we do this as answer questions and that's to maintain that liability that puts level back on you know we'll have our own SO Jeez in place you know on to protect you know for our liabilities and stuff like that. Okay. I think I might think okay represent Collins you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair so I'm just trying to understand at a basic level so bomb techs can carry now if the sheriff allows but you're saying that we would decide as a legislature that they can regardless partly because of the shipping liability at that's one thing the other thing I'm trying to figure out is is the only reason that issue would not allow bomb tech to carry the liability and by taking this liability often is this something that shares there for support and we we talked with the. Thank you I have spoke with sheriff road actually this morning I spoke with him before but up to this morning and he's in full support of this I did not go before the sheriff's association. But he had no issues with it and I can only speak for share problems by the county sheriff's. Per se makes have you had in body from the sheriff's reach out and oppose this bill now I've not heard of no opposition to this bill. Collins are you finished representative Scott you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair Quick question follow up with that is it Mr. Carton our main. So I had two questions one of them was about the training so did you say that you'll consistently do the training as far as the concealed Kerry yeah we we you know you would go to qualification we have qualified in every twice a year with four right now we're we qualify with the PT department the fire department I mean that the police departments are thanks I was wondering if there is an appropriate and that was the best to maintain that record that we're still qualify okay and my other question is is the municipally in support of this cause I've talked to a couple police officers who said they thought this might create more issues for them and so I was just wondering if that's something that we have not heard anything from municipally down as fast as of right now I've heard have not heard from any of the organizations that you know municipally counties are or have not heard from any of them the only folks upload from obviously the the the bomb folks here and people that are in support of the legislation or trying to do here I'm not like that not relieve any opposition from anybody. Do you need to follow you're recognized for a follow up to three areas that we said that we have bomb I don't think anyone said that I would just try to make note of it. The Fort Smith Conway and Little Rock or the three bomb squads okay and I would say this is a small group of bomb techs were talking about our target staffing levels for the squads or six for Conway in Fort Smith I'm not sure Jason what's also target staffing level is we're talking eighteen people twenty people Max that this affects but it affects us greatly because we're the ones going down range we're on scene with the bad guys we don't get called for good things I understand the brief survey thank you. Represent Richmond you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair. Logistics on this just get a little clarification when you guys show up at a at a potential problem area. The uniform that you worry where are yous partially dressed in your bomb out that already are you do you dress up and then I mean you know. You know I'm calling the the bomb thing that gives you some protect kind of keeps all your parts in one place of the blows up you know are you dressed in that and if you are. How will the concealed carry work. Thank you insert members if you have your microphones on would you make sure your term often team called we're we're getting a little bit of backlash Beckham so if you do that you're recognized to answer the question I'm sorry to impose no problem attach your question no we don't show up on scene in the bomb suit that is after we have considered while we're there what we're there for things like that and know when I'm in the bomb suit I I can't you can't carry a weapon in that it's for our bomb techs that are on scene that are up range for our security at our command post and for us I mean and I guess that I would report to saying in something like this or we have a bomb squad T. shirts this is one of my more formal attire followed manager you're recognized for a follow up the why did you designate concealed carry why not leave that up to the the department your department and each department to make a determination what would best serve them and and caring so this is this is one of the kind of the confusions that that way the bills drafted the way that that Bills drafted and the code sections that it refers to actually allows them to choose between open carry and concealed carry it's just the way the bill drafter and up having to draft it it targets concealed carry more so than open carry. I know it's a little bit confusing but I've been assured by the builder after that is that it allows both and it for them to do either or they've got to meet the qualifications of having the proper training and not being blacklisted and so forth. All right thanks Stephen thank you messages. Represent Crawford you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair thank you for being here thank you I was wondering if you guys were part does a bomb squad go when an officer is in trouble in a rural area as what happened in Johnson County when that police officer got shot read as part of that. We were not we we routinely responded the swat team and on a county and Conway Arkansas swat team that was probably Mike Dawson with the state police I would not I'm not sure but that is Mike Dawson is the commander of the state police bomb squad okay follow up please. So would you say that if you had to enter a situation like that you're familiar with the officer got shot in Johnson County I'm sure if you were called into a situation like that wouldn't it make it more streamlined to where you could actually enter the territory without asking for permission to carry a gun where you could be available to those who needed your help and to protect yourself yes ma'am absolutely thank you. Representative Richardson you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair of the quick follow up so if did you say that this bill allows and I think I saw this allows them to make arrests as well. Just within the scope of their duties so they're not gonna be arresting somebody for shoplifting at the local mall this is only in the situations where we're talking about they have the authority to arrest within the scope of their duties to be able to hold the perpetrator until the police come and take over follows you're recognized and with this training are you guys being trained on how to make arrests. Yes Sir when we go through our initial certification. They do tend to skip on the traffic stops and stuff because that's not where the what we're there for we're due to use of force maintain a Dane detain we are handgun retention we're trained to that. Level more so in response to the bomb squad. On St But. Yeah and the bill specifically states that they have to go through a Study that's approved by the commission on law enforcement standards and training so that part will be part of what they have to do in order to be able to have that authority. See more you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair I'm just curious as to what type of training requirements as a fire department volunteer or full time have to go through to create or have a bomb squad. I think for this question if you don't mind I would rather let to Stacey Dawson speak on that. The representative makes would you like to have Mr Dawson come from yeah yeah Mr Dawson John Myrick will want to have the security committee sure self. You're recognized my name is jim Dawson in the special agent charge of the FBI and the state of Arkansas. So prior to being special agent charge of the FBI here in Arkansas was a special agent in charge of the FBI in the national capital region in the Washington field office prior to that I was the chief of the counter improvised explosive devices section and program for the FBI and the executive branch of the U. S. government as such I had direct oversight over hazardous devices school or all bomb technicians in the United States are trained with other state local or federal in this instance bomb technicians around the United States are trained by the federal bureau of investigation it's facility in Huntsville Alabama in order to be recognized as a bomb technician to be incorporated into a bomb technician team in the United States they must attend training that is delivered by the FBI at that facility the determination on the suitability of those individuals is made by the FBI they must complete the entire course in order to be a certified bomb technician and be incorporated into team in the United States. The representative Nicks you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair. I thank god represent regions. Richmond touched on this and I I do understand I'm all for the situation of of of caring and being protected out there in your situation I guess my concern and I can't find it in here for his arrest power in a rest now it's it's not to me I can't find was closer to that is this just pertain to bomb squad activity all of that scene it's not when you go to the law enforcement training academy New you have all these flowers so it doesn't it doesn't apply to going to the to the scene. S. made. Traffic stops and all those things but I don't see it clearly labeled here. So on Page three section five of the bill it says you know after they've gone through the course of study that they may make arrests for violations of the law related to explosives and and incidents involving explosives on okay so so that's that's the that's a very limited to their scope of practice so except they're not gonna be shoplifting or for anything else other than explosives in incidents involving explosives so they they pull up and there's nothing to do with explosives there they have no respiratory. Thank. Richmond you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair and I apologize Stephen I'm still hung up on this conceal carry thing a little bit in that isn't the language in the bill is not a limiting factor. When you put it in the law that says concealed carry. It doesn't does this make the determination that the only way these guys can carry and again I'm sure a lot of folks don't think it's a big deal but I just think it should be left to the Department right to make decisions so why not just use Kerry that's how the vote the logs I express that same concern to the lawyer as you know under Arkansas law currently open carry is allowed and so and so any individual can open carry and so the way from what I understand the way she's got this drafted the you can you can you can only concealed carry under certain circumstances. And so I think that's why she drafted the bill to be so specific to the concealed carry stuff is to broaden their ability to concealed carry in the circumstances because I think I'm the open carry you can open carry regardless right as my understanding and so that's. I've been assured by the lawyer that yes they can they they have the choice between opening concealed carry I feel so much better that the lawyers should you. I am here and I don't pretend to play one on TV so I I have to trust our folks over the bill no know what they're doing use in the committee appreciate that representative Richmond representative Gazaway you're recognized for a question. Thank you madam chair and I apologize if I'm asking questions been asked numerous times already but. what it appears to me is that this bill does two things one allows a member of a bomb squad the to take a gun into a situation where there is a bomb. Which is inherently dangerous situation. A number to it gives those members the ability to make an arrest in a very specific situation where there's a bomb threat. My concern and I think it's maybe been asked multiple times but I just haven't fully grasped the answer is that if we're allowing someone to take a gun into a situation where there's a bomb. That person needs to be adequately trained on how to handle firearms and how to handle these dangerous situations. Because they could very easily make a very what is already a very dangerous situation worse and so can you tell me very explicitly. What type of firearms training a member of a bomb squad would have. Before they are allowed to go into the situation with the gun I think I'm only that to the gentleman who had the training and they can explain better what training they have an. Maybe answer your question. Thank you as I stated before we do Connolly has went through the part time to that. Have to fill the requirements to share files was Montgomery at the time Required for us to carry see we can carry. Right now we can make. We can detain people right now under share files of thorny so he feels that we have enough training now to do that currently this. This is more about skip you know my relationship was with the father county sheriff's office is great right now I don't see this bill affecting me either way currently but if my Gazaway ever to fall under skip in have skipped problem where the local sheriff didn't support is for whatever reason this gives us the ability to carry. I don't know that I mentioned question I understand what training we've been through it's it's. We qualify twice year without a county we've been through the classes we've we've done everything that I. That a Faulkner County sheriff's deputy does and is required to do for them to carry if that that might ease your mind a little bit we were not going through any lesser of a course because were fire department and I understand we're unique in that the most of your bomb squads in the country our police department we're talking about thirty five in the country their fire department personnel so we want to do everything right we want we're going to get that training or continue the training not get the train continue the training. So these are not just amateurs on the street these are guys who been through police training they've been to that the item into FBI training so these guys who are well vetted and the heroes to our community and anything we can do to support them to make sure they're safe so they can come home to their families that's what we need to do and that's what we're trying to do here with this bill off with your support. Represent Clowney you're recognized for a question thank you madam chair I'd like to come back to representative Richmond questions about the concealed carry if. If what you were told I presented Meeks is correct that. Currently in anybody is free to open carry whatever they want in the state of Arkansas but that what we need to address this concern can I I guess why are we here what is that what is the purpose for this if it's true and I think maybe my concern is that that area of the law is a little bit less settled it may be the way to present it to you I think it is still a bit unclear so if there are any concerns about concealed versus open carry just I mean. Why do we need this if it's true that you can open carry anywhere. So I agree that that the the law still could be clarified some on the on the open carry but even though any civil service of the state can open carry I die I guess the concern is is they can't open carry within the line of their duty without this authorization so at them without this proper training that kind of makes sense hopefully. I don't know if you don't I might have a better answer for that I don't have a better answer than that but it this bill also gives us the ability to make arrest and detain people if we didn't have that power we get on same with these bad guys what is our options you know what what are we sure we've got open carry but I can't detain someone I can't you know I can't arrest That that's just some of our concerns to. Represent more you're recognized for a question. Now it says it thank you madam chair and says of the bottom of the bill that the training would be authorized under cluster Commission on law enforcement standards and training have you spoken with them as to exactly what that training would look like and I've taken personally I'm a part time class to deputy from under a county sheriff in of of taking a hundred twenty hour class and it's fantastic would be similar to that or something entirely different. Thank you for questions yes Sir it be it be exactly like that whatever the requirements are to be the part time or Little Rock mate used it continued to the certified course the certified training That's a six month if I understand if I understood. Jason weaver correctly that's six months that they're doing law enforcement not being a fireman and. But yes at the very minimum it would be the hundred twenty hours and continuing in. You're recognized for a question thank you madam chair could we hear the testimony of what happens when a sheriff does not support you. Thank you well it's it's not that they're not supporting you I've been through four shares since my time as a bomb tech you know in the would all start with the first year when we get dipped as with him and you know it's you we went through his stuff like that but you can you know get a new sheriff the selected where he met no they all the new shares come in they all other new policies and stuff like that and the the current sheriff now you know they're policies is they do not have any part time deputies anymore we were considered a part time deputy so all he has is his full time deputies. So it so. I'm sorry and but anyways it's you know currently he does not recognize the a part time deputy what they what they call part time to and that's what we were considered. So. I can tell you the story for yellowwood time what what started this to go on was an incident and for the Crawford County this was way back in the it took is a several. Several miles ride well in a an offer a vehicle to get to a survivalist bunker that was up in the middle of nowhere so at the time we as Brenda bomb take them for this bomb techs fire form Baltics. We're up there with state police and the FBI and Forster Service and we're clearness survivors Barker out and had thousands of rounds of ammunition what the concern was were I like where we kind of started researching all this is the concern was we were in the middle of nowhere. and are so we had safety concerns there so if if this the perpetrator of the bag I was out there watching us take all his stuff you know was seasonal and stuff you know he he could use started you know opened up fire whatever more we had we had no protection. So that that really raised a lot of concern with me at the time because the bomb commander of the safety of my crew then that's when I went to the share of immediately you know I said Hey what can we do about this you know and. So we started the local level went through his course went through his complete. Our time to deputy course to get certified to carry firearms and then we tried to you know stretch a little further with by going to get with the FBI and and because we were only limited to Sebastian County we also brought responded just special county where the western side of Arkansas so that's kind of awesome response districts so we need to kind expand that a little bit too and got with the FBI and we became render safe task force to to kind of help that out a little bit anyways it was a huge concern with me being a fireman. That we were up in the middle and we what we responding only tell you we respond County rural areas a lot well we're in the middle of nowhere might be just one or two deputies with this that found this ID or whatever the case may be will run in or out there with the. without protection and that's the main concern with this is to have that protection. And we want to do right by going to the training we don't want just you know say Hey I'm open carry you know this Arkansas would we want to go through the proper steps gets proper training continuing and continuing our education too because we have to continue our education on the the bottom side of it the far side of it too so we're continually training with this this is not just a one and done deal will continue that. That answer your question. Any other questions. We have no one who is signed up to speak for against the bill representing nature recognized to close for your bill thank you ma'am chair thank you for committee member selagi questions this morning you know for me that this all boils down to a simple question. Passing this bill allows these guys who've had all the proper training who have been through F. B. I. course who are heroes to be able to defend to protect themselves in these dangerous situations. If we say now that could mean some of them losing their lives simply because we're not allowing these guys who are again our heroes from being able to protect themselves and build protect the ones that we love so with that I would appreciate the committee's support and would to ask for a do pass. Members representative makes his clothes road builder I have a motion represent corporate. I have a motion to do pass on the floor is there any discussion on the motion. Seeing no discussion of the motion all in favor of the motion please say aye. All opposed say no the ayes have it congratulations you've passed your bill thank you Committee. Members at this time we're not going to take up any additional bills today but if you watch the calendar is starting to grow here here is what we have scheduled for Thursday. We will have on thirsty house bill ten ninety eight house bill ten ninety eight. And we'll also have house bill ten OO for. Right now those are the two we have scheduled but I will be working the house floor today and was so watch for your email is here I mean text message anybody on the committee did not did did everyone get their text message anybody not get one okay Sir so I think we have all good phone numbers watch your phones I will be letting you know is our agenda for thirsty grows and with that thank you for your hard work today and look forward