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committee members the chair sees a quorum this meeting is called to order co-chair you
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
1:20
have any comments no just we had such a great meeting at the fish hatchery so um stay through the meeting and we'll have an announcement about an upcoming uh another site
visit uh meeting that we'll have in august sounds
good thank you coach here at this time if you would uh as representatives here with the arkansas crime lab if you would just come forward and have a seat at the table
thank y'all for uh thank y'all for being here today and i really uh my memory serves
me correctly i believe this is the first time we've actually had the uh crime lab appear before this committee unless y'all can think of another time i can't so we're we're really glad to have you appear before this committee today and if you would just identify yourself for the committee and we'll
Speaker 14
2:26
get started i'm sammy williams deputy director of administrative operations at the crime
Speaker 16
2:32
lab and i'm jennifer beatty west i'm the deputy director of scientific operations
Okay, again, thank you for being here. Let's just go ahead and jump into this and get started. I think what probably a good way to start would be, if you would, just kind of give us an overview. I know that we've got a new crime lab that is under construction, so maybe we could start with that. And you could kind of tell us what we're at with that project and what maybe the completion date would be. And I guess while you're on that topic, you could go ahead and just discuss how the new and the additional space there
and the new crime lab, how that's going to assist law enforcement and the different type of support that that will give to law enforcement and what would be available to them that maybe is not available to them now because of us investing in a new crime lab. So from there, just tell us about the new crime lab and how
Speaker 18
3:32
it's going to help law enforcement. great thank you uh we're glad to be here uh this afternoon um so the new crime lab is is well underway we've got about one year left a little over one year left um in the construction of that
so everything's been on schedule and and going well there uh the the completion estimated completion date is the end of july of next year so we look to be begin moving in around august 1st of next year we are planning to do a phased move in so that our services are not hindered while we're getting things up and running over there so you can still expect us to be putting cases out but
just a little background we're in a building right now that's over 40 years old it's originally state police headquarters has been renovated numerous times to try to make it into lab space and then we've just grown drastically over that time in the past about 20 years our caseload has increased a hundred percent so we've gone from around 15,000 cases a year to to around 30,000 cases a year and so we've got people I say I say it this way we've got people crammed into every
closet we possibly can over there as we've had to grow to take on that backlog. We're out of space for any sort of new instrumentation to try to bring online. We've got sections of the laboratory that work together, spread out on different floors and having to transport evidence back and forth between each other. So we're very excited to greatly expand in this new laboratory. This will give us the room to work. I'll give you an example in our DNA section.
There's only so much space, so only so many people can work in these laboratory spaces at a time. They have this very detailed schedule of when people can even go into these lab spaces to work because there's only room for two or three people to be in there at a time. So expanding this laboratory space will allow us to work more efficiently. It will also allow us to bring new technology online. We've got things like 3D microscopes in firearms that we'll be bringing online.
So this is kind of where firearm analysis is heading, is actually taking 3D captures of cartridge cases that give better detail to be able to make comparisons and help search in databases. We're going to be bringing on some new technologies and drugs that will help us with the new and emerging synthetic cannabinoids and being able to better separate those and identify what those are so that we can stay in step or one step ahead of all the garage chemists out there making these new drugs.
And then those sections that work together will be located directly next to each other. So we've planned this out. We've worked with a forensic lab architect group. So they've helped us and worked through with us exactly what our needs are for this new laboratory, the way that we can make things as efficient as possible over there. And, you know, we think we already offer great service, but we think even greater things are to come.
We've also planned for decades into the future so that we will be able to grow if needed, especially as we hope the population of our state keeps growing. We'll be able to handle that for decades to
come. Just to add to that, I know that when this legislative body, when we approved the appropriation for this new crime lab, we also, if I remember correctly, we also approved for two new positions. I believe one of those was a forensic specialist position, and the other one was maybe two forensic technician positions.
So I guess we approved three. So have you been able to fill those positions, or have you had any luck in
Speaker 22
7:54
being able to do that? Yes, and before I say that, I will add
Speaker 18
8:02
and under budget. Well, that's encouraging to this body. That's been our motto so far for that, so we are definitely trying to be good stewards of taxpayer money in that. Yes. So a lot of a lot of those new positions were due to Act 553 of 2023 that required all overdose deaths to come for an autopsy to the crime lab.
So we saw an increase of about 300 autopsies a year coming in, and we have been able to hire positions to handle that increase in autopsies that are coming in. That's also another great thing about our new laboratory. In the morgue, we're very limited on the number of tables that we have there where autopsies can be performed, And we'll be doubling that amount so we can work more efficiently in the new morgue there as well.
I know in the past, in
talking to the director of the crime lab, you know, we were trying to compete with other states as far as they only graduate. And you maybe know the number, like, there's only like 800, what is it, forensic specialists, medical examiners, or however you refer to them, in the country. And there's only just a few that graduate with that expertise in that area every year. And I know, you know, everybody's trying to recruit them or hire them.
How are we doing as far as what is being competitive with other states in regards to being able to recruit those type of specialists in those
Speaker 18
9:43
forensic and medical examiner areas? Yeah, that's definitely been true in the past. We've had vacancies in those positions sometimes for up to two years. And thanks to the work of the legislature and the governor's office, that is no longer the case. Within the past year, year and a half, we've been able to bring in a new deputy chief medical examiner.
We have also, we have two new medical examiners that will be starting in August. They are finishing up their fellowships right now. And so the fact that they want to come work in Arkansas, I think not only shows that we're being very competitive with salary, but I think that's also shows how great Dr. Brown, our current director and chief medical examiner, is that people want to come work with him as well.
I'll also say we started a fellowship program just this last year for the first time. That's another big thing. Only about half of the fellowship positions in the whole country are filled every year because there just aren't enough people going into that field. And we filled our fellow position the first year we ever had the program. he's just finishing up uh this month we've got another one starting next month and we've already
got one coming the next year as well so to be a brand new program and have fellows wanting to come work with us i i think um you know just shows how great our team is and and how great of a job they're doing at recruiting and how how competitive now we are
with the rest of the country good that's that's encouraging because i know that was a really concern we had for uh several years and we attempted to pass legislation that hopefully would draw those individuals and makes arkansas
competitive let's there's another topic i'd like to hear you talk about and where we're at here in arkansas and that's the rapid dna testing can you just tell us share with this committee or Or are we doing what we need to do as far as rapid DNAs, or are we behind, or are we meeting what we need to do to be able to stay ahead of that technology that is advancing so fast? So kind of share with us where we're at.
Speaker 29
12:18
Yes, sir. And again, thank you again for having us here and for all the support that you have provided our lab. We are really excited because we are in the final stages of the rapid DNA program getting started and going live. with both Faulkner and Saline counties. Those were our pilot agencies that have been through the thick and thin of this project with us. Right now, we have been doing network testing between the state crime lab network with those facilities and their networks to ensure communication of that data
can be transferred without any issues. And we are also in the final stages of gaining what is called APO, the authority to operate with the FBI. So every time I give a time frame, we hit a brick wall, but we're still hoping by July, hopefully by end of July, that we will be going live with the Rapid DNA program and booking stations at Faulkner County and Saline County. So we're very excited about that, and we could not have done that without your support for sure.
And we will be the fourth in the nation with going live with Rapid DNA if we're able to get it in
there. So we're ahead. We're definitely ahead. Oh, that's good news. I know that's advancing technology, and I think it's extremely critical, especially as it relates to criminal investigations and bringing individuals to justice. So tell me a little bit about how involved are we with the CODIS? I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. the CODIS data center where all this DNA and all of this is actually entered into that.
Are we good with that? Are we doing what we
Speaker 29
14:03
need to do? Yes, sir, we are. So we have a CODIS section. And for those that aren't aware, CODIS is the Combined DNA Index System, and it is basically a database of DNA profiles from convicted offenders, from arrestees, and from criminal cases. Our DNA section processes homicides, burglary property crimes, sexual assault cases. Those profiles that they obtain from those cases are entered and uploaded into the CODIS database.
And there are, for Arkansas, two levels of CODIS. There is the state level, and then there is the national level. And we participate in both of those. Our DNA section and CODIS sections actually have to go through extensive audits just to participate in that CODIS database program. So they are audited every other year externally and every year internally to participate in that program. With that, the CODIS system searches that database every day at both the state and the national level.
So as profiles are uploaded into that database, they are constantly being searched. A profile is rarely ever deleted from that program. So even if a case is resolved from 2005, it's going to stay in that database and continue searching. And if there's a situation where there's a serial rapist that continues to show up in different cases, the CODIS database will link that perpetrator throughout those cases and throughout
Speaker 33
15:30
those years. Great news. I'm glad to hear that.
I knew the CODIS program was being very effective across the nation. I was hoping in Arkansas we were right where we needed to be, that we were extremely involved with it. Yes, sir. I've got a couple of legislators got a question. We'll stop right here and then before I follow up with additional questions. Senator Rice. Thank you,
Speaker 35
16:01
Mr. Chair. Thank you all for being here
Senator Terry Rice
Unverified
16:07
today. trying to remember when we approved funding for the new crime lab that we did have some money in
there for furnishings but my question is can you give us your opinion of where we're at today with the type scientific equipment that we need maybe compared to surrounding states where are we today and where do we need to be when you get in this this new facility with
more room and able to do
more things i know always the pie is the sky you
know but just really where we need to be to be competitive around we may already be there i'm not saying we're not but can you kind of give us an idea are we at 80 90 percent now and we could move it another few
Speaker 29
17:05
points if we had some stuff yes sir and I think we're going to tag team this response so with that what I can say is one of the things historically working at the crime lab we have done a great job of trying to stay with current technologies and not getting behind on that so
all, I would say that we do have equipment that we will be transferring to the new laboratory, but there's also going to be, because we all have more space, we've been limited in the amount of equipment we can get, which limits capacity. And so, much like what Sammy was saying with the DNA section, additional equipment will be needed to help continue to meet capacity, and that's going be the great thing of having that extra space right now the laboratory space for our DNA section
our toxicology section and our drug chemistry section is very limited and you can only put so much equipment in there and so being able to get additional pieces of equipment so if something goes down you have a backup instead of having to wait two weeks to get it fixed and figure it out it'll
Speaker 18
18:15
be great to have that i'll also say that uh we've we've been very proactive with with grants at our laboratory and uh that has allowed us to to not only stay caught up but stay ahead of the
game um one thing is we don't always want to be too ahead of the game because then no one has tested, you know, these technologies and things, and we don't want to waste any money that we receive. But I will say some of the, we have received some competitive grants recently that will put us in definitely the upper crime labs in the country for being the first to bring online some technologies, one being that 3D microscope technology in firearms. That's not something that
a lot of laboratories are using out there. We've got some new visualization techniques that we'll be getting in for our fingerprint section. And so that will make difficult surfaces that it's been difficult to pull prints off before. We can use fluorescent powder now and specialized camera equipment to take good photos of of that equipment um you know we've been over the years trying
trying to stay caught up but i think um jennifer's right that that one of the biggest things now is we just need to to scale to the amount of work um that we have and through grant funds and um asset forfeiture and then um you know we're we're still trying to be very conservative in our use of these new building funds but we will try to get there where we have exactly what we need to provide the best services that we can good to hear thank you thank you mr. chair you're welcome so if i
understand you correctly we have the capabilities now to do like dna dna analysis toxicology reports ballistics as you refer to through the 3d technology that is there drug analysis digital evidence fingerprints forensic pathology what about if i pronounce this correctly uh genealogy or geology geology or genealogy where they're actually able to take the dna from a skeleton
and be able to tie that into the i don't know if it's dakota's database or whatever i understand that from talking to law enforcement that those tests we have to send off to another state. So what do you foresee in the future that Arkansas would have the capability of actually performing that test here in at our
Speaker 28
21:04
crime lab? Yes, sir. So genetic genealogy has been a fantastic tool. And what it has helped is
Speaker 29
21:10
supplement those cases that are not solved by
CODIS. There are definitely times that the individual either missing or an unidentified person or a perpetrator of a crime their profile is not in the CODIS database and those cases have been identified especially through our cold case investigating teams throughout the state of identifying cases that have a good DNA profile that are in CODIS but they just have not gotten any type of lead they've exhausted all their investigative leads and that's where the success
of genetic genealogy has been fantastic and so with that we do not have like in the next year we're not bringing that on but we are in the talks of what it would take what it would look like to bring that on and what resources we would need at this time we are focused on working the cases that are coming in and getting them into the CODIS database and then seeing from there what we need after that but
you're getting a pretty quick turnaround i think is texas the facility you're
Speaker 31
22:15
having to use now for those yes sir authorum is the main laboratory that we have
Speaker 29
22:23
been utilizing for the genetic genealogy and they've been very successful with the cases that we have sent with to them and that's one thing i will say we are very willing to help coordinate law enforcement's cases and help guide them whatever they need from us if that's calling a laboratory if that's facilitating the transfer of evidence to another private laboratory to do this testing.
Speaker 43
22:42
We're here to help them do whatever they need for that.
Okay, excellent. Switching gears, I don't see any questions this time, but switching gears just a little bit. I know years ago there was quite a bit of controversy concerning around the backlog of these sexual assault kits, and I'd just like for the crime lab for you all to update us where we're at. Have you been able to get that information into the CODIS data file? Is that backlog, has it been taken care of? So just elaborate on that for a few minutes, please.
Speaker 29
23:17
Yes, sir. And I will, just a little background from me. I grew up in the world of DNA testing, and I began supervising the DNA section whenever we got our first big wave of unsubmitted sexual assault kits across the state that got submitted to us. And these kits were not submitted for various reasons, and we had almost 2,000 sexual assault kits submitted to us around 2016. And these kits varied in age.
Some of the kits were almost 10, 15 years old once we got them. And so you can imagine we had quite a backlog of trying to test these kits on top of the kits that were coming in as current kits. And with really due diligence and additional support from the legislators, from the governor's office, we were able to accomplish getting those kits tested and getting to where we are maintaining a 60-day turnaround time as mandated
Speaker 31
24:13
by law on our reported sexual assault kits. So that's where we are with that.
Perfect. And I'm not sure if Arkansas, if we have this or not, and I was going to try to visit with you to see if it's something we need to move forward with. I know some states have it, and we may have it. It's called a tracking system where someone that's been involved in a sexual assault can honestly have an ID, go on to the system, and be able to track the status of their sexual assault kit and kind of keep them up to date. A lot of transparency there.
I think it really helps them that's been sexually assaulted to know the status of that and where that sexual assault kit is at. Yes, sir. So do we have that tracking system
Speaker 29
25:02
here in Arkansas? Yes, sir, we do. So just for everyone's awareness, the Arkansas State Crime Lab provides barcoded sexual assault kits to medical facilities across the state, so emergency rooms or whatever it may be that may be providing the medical legal examination. Every kit is barcoded, and it is tracked in this tracking website that we also maintain.
And so we, when somebody goes in to have a kit collected, they are provided the barcode for their specific kit. And they're able to enter that barcode into the system to see where it is in the process. And that's, you're exactly right. This was created for transparency because too often people would have kits collected or they would have their children's kits collected and they would have no idea of the status of that kit. And so that was a great step of moving to having that required and utilized for the kits that are collected and and i thank you for that answer and i'm not sure
that people really even in the law enforcement community really understand the significance of this of this CODA system and that's what you're talking about with these sexual assault kits and that the kits and that dna being entered into that system because i've talked to law enforcement officers that have told me stories where they uh had entered that it may have been that assault may have taken place 15, 25 years ago, and they had no suspect in the case, but they did have DNA, then they entered into that database, that CODIS base that we're talking about,
and now this individual, and I think you alluded to this a while ago, they commit a crime in another state, and now all at once they have a suspect, this individual's been arrested, they obtain his DNA, they enter into that base, that database, CODIS, and there's a match for this crime that occurred here in Arkansas 20, 25 years ago. Do you see that playing out? Is that
Speaker 29
26:54
actually happening? It's 100% true. So again, my background is in forensic DNA testing, and I would say that CODIS is probably one of the most important investigative tools that our agencies
have, especially when there is no suspect case. It is one of the greatest tools, and we have seen arkansas cases solved cases across the u.s and vice versa cases across the u.s help solve cases here in arkansas about 10 15 years ago there was a serial rapist case in north litter rock they had no idea who the individual was we entered this profile into after numerous processing of different pieces of evidence we finally got a good male dna profile entered it
into the system and it matched to an offender out of Texas. And so again, without that CODIS database, that association between that evidence and that offender would have never been made. So we're very proud of that database and we do everything we can to help protect that database. One of the biggest questions and one of the things that law enforcement also don't realize is they don't have to request us to enter it into the database. Our DNA analysts are trained to look at the case file, look at the DNA profile and assess, does this qualify to go in the system? If it qualifies, it's going.
We are definitely doing that automatically without anybody having to request
that being done. Excellent. You just answered my next question. What kind of cooperation we're getting from law enforcement around the state is making sure that this information was furnished because we have to get it in that CODIS base for us to be successful in solving some of these crimes. All right, Senator Rice.
Senator Terry Rice
Unverified
28:31
Thank you. Back on thinking about the new facility and the needs, I think you mentioned a while ago a couple of positions that would be coming
or may have been filled. Where are you at looking at the new facility? Are we pretty well staffed now that will be needed at that facility or are we going to be needing to broaden that any? Because not all these jobs are $50,000
entry jobs, we know. uh yeah sure uh
Speaker 18
29:06
so we've been very lucky with the crime lab we do not have trouble filling vacancies
um and and we we never have if we have a vacancy it's for some other reason um with the new pay plan also we saw our applications for positions double or triple um so that has certainly we we are certainly much more competitive in the country there so right now for instance a lot of the vacancies we have is due to our training is extremely long for a lot of these positions
and by extremely long I mean nine months up to two years depending on the position because most of the people we do have are coming straight out of college or master's or phd program so we we we are still not seeing many people with prior experience coming in for those analyst positions so usually our vacancies are we've got so many people in training we need to take the time to get them finished up before we can take on new people that's kind of where we're at we do
expect we're kind of just finishing a big batch of training so we hope to be able to bring a few new people online in the next year and if our turnover rate remains low as it has been for about the past year and a half we fully expect to have the number of staff capable for the amount of cases we're receiving
Senator Terry Rice
Unverified
30:45
right now. So the normal turnover is in hand but with the new facility you don't see needing to expand a lot not at
Speaker 18
30:54
this moment i think is certainly the number of positions
that we have appropriated is is appropriate for the amount of cases that we're receiving in yes thank you and i
Speaker 29
31:04
just want to add that's something that we definitely look at are the numbers every year the requests that we're receiving and whether or not we're maintaining the appropriate staffing level to ensure we're getting that backlog knocked down
Speaker 31
31:15
and those cases turned around. Representative Perry, you're recognized. Thank
Representative Mark Perry
Unverified
31:28
you, Chair. Kind of jumping back to the
forensic genealogy, did you say that was a private company in Texas you utilize? Yes,
Speaker 28
31:35
sir. And it's not us, not the crime lab specifically utilizing it.
Speaker 29
31:38
It just tends to be one of the main companies that is selected to be utilized for those cases to be submitted to. Okay.
Speaker 62
31:46
And I think you did mention the name authorum yes thank you yes sir thank you chair
there's also a few of those companies around the country i i know there's
one up i can't remember what state it's in it's bold or bod and i i've really heard great things about them as well as how fast to turn around and and uh you know their their capabilities there So I'm sure you're familiar with them. So we've got, what, three or four around the country that you're able to choose or pick
Speaker 59
32:21
and choose from? Yes, sir. We definitely do. And I'm very familiar with Bodie. We have a great working relationship
Speaker 29
32:28
with that laboratory as well. And DNA Labs International is another one that you might hear from. And, again, that's one thing I'm very proud of is our partnerships and collaboration with the different private laboratories to help ensure our law enforcement agencies get what they need.
Exactly. So if one's a little slow and yeah, and a quick turnaround, you've got
others to choose from and I understand that's what you do So yes, sir. Good for you. Okay Representative Shepard you're recognized
Representative Matthew J. Shepherd
Unverified
33:00
for a question. Thank you. Mr. Chair and thank you all for being here today If I came in a little late, so if you spoke on this already, I apologize The new drug, is it cycloraphane? And I think Arkansas saw its first related overdose death last month.
That's correct, yes. And this is, what, 10 times more potent than fentanyl. If you can speak more about how aggressive this drug is and if we're seeing
Speaker 18
33:28
other counterfeit drugs with this in it as well. Sure. So starting back probably about four or five years ago, we really saw great increase in counterfeit drugs. Um, before that we were seeing a lot of your normal pharmaceutical drugs. And then, um, most of the, the tablets we were getting in
started being counterfeit. And so we really saw that, that big push there. And most are your, your oxycodone oxycontin pills that are being counterfeited and and your xanax type uh type pills um and and they're typically being counterfeited with a drug of the same family but much more potent and not being in you know not being created by a pharmaceutical company so there's no quality control so you know one pill may have a correct amount in it the next one
And we're talking grains of these drugs. So if someone gets a little too heavy handed, you know, one pill may be fine. The next pill is deadly. And that's really where it comes in. And so we were seeing fentanyl and the fentanyl analogs for quite a few years. I think that a lot of great work has been done in educating the public about that. And so for a little while, we saw the regular pharmaceuticals start to come back. You know, I think people were, were scared of what was out there and these, these counterfeit
tablets are starting to look really, really good. Um, they, they fool our drug chemists sometimes. Um, but certainly I think your normal, you know, member of the public would not notice the slight little differences that, that might be there between those and normal pharmaceutical tablets. So to start to see that come back with a different drug and, and, and these are all just people out there trying to cut corners you know they they order a small bag of something that's super potent from from china or something and are able to mix it in with very cheap ingredients and and
make you know millions of dollars worth of these tablets based on you know a few thousand dollars worth of what they had to buy and so to see this is concerning um other states kind of around us had seen at first we are uh you know with us being kind of internally in the country we do usually see things come from the coast or from the north or the south before it reaches here and so you know we had seen bulletins about this drug uh being seen elsewhere but um you know we think it
just goes to show how great our sections uh our different sections of the laboratory working together can put together this information so quickly that we were able to get the counterfeit pill results the toxicology results the autopsy results put those all together and see this is a problem and we need to make sure we're getting information out there as quickly as possible because you know most of these people taking counterfeit tablets they they are not trying to
overdose and die and so that is education is one of the most important things so we're doing a lot of work with the state drug director on trying to get with those educational and preventive services out there so that we can get the information to them as quickly as we possibly can so they can start getting the word out and and looking for areas of the state where uh you know if we start to see a certain area of the state we can really focus our efforts there and so we're doing a lot
of work there with the state drug director to try to help combat that but but yes uh this cycloraphene is is just another of the drugs that you know fentanyl they say is a hundred times more potent than morphine and so the fact that this is even more potent than fentanyl i mean there's just no way for uh you know these these unregulated laboratories to to make
Speaker 72
37:39
these drugs safely at all thank you you just
you just mentioned a bill that uh i think it was one that
i actually sponsored about for the uh toxicology reports would be shared where the drugs are for the state so they could compile data so that we could see what type of drugs were being used in certain areas of the state and be able for law enforcement to focus more in that area. Is that what you were
Speaker 18
38:15
talking about or? Yes, that's exactly it. So we were at the time based on the statutes, our confidentiality statute, we were having to give very, you know,
limited information to the state drug director. So allowing that to be added to our statute allows that information to go straight there we are still developing and we hope to go live with it by the end of this year an overdose dashboard so that would be something that our law enforcement partners preventive and treatment services could use and see in real time where those overdoses are taking place
what areas of the state we're seeing certain drugs in so we're really looking forward to being able to get that, uh, online, we're working with the office of state technology to get that dashboard built. Um, and so, uh, the drug director has been great in helping with that, but through the information we've already given them, they've been able to focus, uh, those preventive and education, you know, components to certain areas of the state where we're seeing the same drugs
pop up over and over again, you know, and those deaths and trying to link those even to, you know, supply chains and things like that I think is very important and we'll be able to do a lot
more of that moving forward. So thank you. We appreciate that. Hey,
and I appreciate y'all. I think that was in 2025 that we passed that bill. So it's just now really having time to really show us some results.
from being able to gather that information. So there was another bill. I can't remember if it was in 2025 or 2023. I sponsored the bill, but it was where we protected the coroner's report from a criminal investigation from the toxicology reports that had to be returned to the coroner once they sent it in from the crime lab. Have you found that that – is that going pretty good or is that something we need to improve on or did that help with the criminal investigations to make sure that, you know, pertinent information
involving those criminal investigations were not released before that investigation was complete? No, I would
Speaker 18
40:39
say that has been a smashing success. I speak with Kevin Cleghorn, the president of the Corn Association, often, and he is very grateful that he gets to tell people no when they ask for things. So he gets to say, we get to follow the crime lab rules now. So, no, that's, that's been great. And as you can imagine, um, we get requests, multiple requests daily for, for records and, and a lot of the records are, you know, things, you know, family members and, and insurance companies and things that people need.
but with, with podcasters and, um, news organizations and, uh, citizen detectives and things like that to, to have that, that statute to stand behind and allow our records to be private and confidential and not, you know, a lot of these autopsies, you know, these are the most difficult things. A lot of these families will ever deal with in their entire lives. And to make sure that people aren't out there just posting this information um all over the place i i think is
is uh a great benefit that that we can offer and a great comfort to a lot of these
people i'm glad i'm glad to hear you say that not to be honest with you i uh i spent 37 years in law enforcement and when i found out that the corners report that was submitted to the crime lab and then your toxicology report and all the information you should refer to when it went back to the corners that was that was foiable for everybody to see and uh i was always thought that would have been protected as part of the criminal investigation but i found out it it wasn't so
we was able thanks to this uh legislative body and their support we was able to pass legislation that protects that it protects the things that you just alluded to which is extremely important to families that are having to deal with those issues. So thank you for sharing that with
Speaker 18
42:45
us. Yeah, we're certainly grateful, and the coroners are definitely certainly grateful. I can
definitely say. Good deal. I can keep you here all day long.
I'm telling you, I love this topic, and I really enjoy learning. This has really been really informative, and I'm looking forward to that new program you've got coming out. What was it, overload dashboard? It's going to
be an overdose dashboard, yes. Overdose dashboard, okay. When do you have an
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
43:21
expectation on when that will be rolled out?
Speaker 18
43:25
I haven't heard an update myself on it. We did just get a report that was necessary in one of the programs that we used to pull the data out.
It just came online at the end of last month. And so now we're working with that info and the Office of State Technology to get that on board. Michigan has a similar dashboard. That's where Director Brown came from. That's where he worked previously. And so they basically gave us the backbone of this dashboard to work with. And so now it's just working with OST to put that information together.
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
44:11
That'd be great. I mean, love to have a demonstration of it when it gets online for the subcommittee.
Speaker 18
44:17
Certainly. And we'll definitely have a big press release and everything for that. Yeah,
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
44:22
press release is great. But come here, navigate through the dashboard with us, and, yeah, I think that would be good. You
got it. Following up on that, yeah. So we've got the CODIS program. We've got the dashboard program that's coming. And it seems like there was four or five sessions ago or a few sessions ago that we ran legislation.
And what was that program? Is it NAMUs, or are you familiar with that? I can't remember. What is it? NamUs. Maybe it was NamUs. sorry yes sorry so that required law enforcement if it was a missing person or a cold case i'm not real sure i'm saying all this correctly but i just vaguely remember it but they were required to submit that information to the crime lab is that is that correct or submit that into that database and it was namus is that what you're saying it is
Speaker 29
45:14
um we do have namus and we have
access to namus that we utilize for our missing and unidentified remains in which there's no idea of, well, on the missing people, you know, we have information that's uploaded for that, and then on the unidentifieds that our medical examiners receive, they will upload information regarding that unidentified remains, such as tattoos or if there's any clothing, just to help in the identification of that. I have very limited information on that, but it is a program that we utilize quite often. Well, you can tell I was
kind of limited on my information concerning it too,
but you made me think of that when
Speaker 18
45:54
I was listening to this other show. And I'll say I actually just looked at this statute today, so this may be part of it. I don't know when this was added, but it does require the coroners to send unidentified remains to the crime lab to have any sort of medical and scientific analysis done on them that's necessary, and then we enter it
Speaker 14
46:15
into that system before we return the remains back to the county that they came from. helped explain i
know there was something i was trying to remember so actually this is where the
genetic genealogy genealogy that you referred to a while ago this kind of ties in with it as far as law enforcement is concerned concerned it definitely
Speaker 31
46:35
does one of the um unidentified remains are a significant portion of the cases that we
Speaker 29
46:41
have sent out and namus actually will fund some of the identification so they will contact us on occasion saying hey we have we have funds that you can utilize to help send this for forensic genetic genealogy and so we have utilized funds
from NamUs to help identify individuals so and I'll let
you go I'll just make this comment and well I know I talked to a law enforcement officer here the last a few weeks ago and he was telling me that he had gotten a call from an investigator in another state and they had found a skeleton in that state and they were able to do this forensic genetic geology test on it and it came back that
they had a relative it traced it back to a relative here in Arkansas so that investigator calls law enforcement here and says hey we've got this skeleton but you've got a relative there you know it's connected from our genetic test here in Arkansas is would you go speak to this individual and see, you know, if they've got a family member that's been missing. I just,
I'm like, golly. It is amazing.
Speaker 29
47:58
It's amazing. It really is. And just for clarification, there is a separate database. So CODIS database is for your standard DNA profile. The database that is used for genetic genealogy is something completely different. Individuals that have utilized the private DNA testing like ancestry for ancestry testing a lot of the data on those databases is contained from that. And so it's completely separate database than what we utilize at the at the crime laboratory perfect.
I see I see no further questions from committee members culture. You have any closing comments. No, I just really
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
48:46
appreciate the information. I'm glad y'all are here and look forward to the follow-up. Thank
you, co-chair. And I really appreciate y'all being here. This is really, I've really enjoyed this personally. It's just so much. And if you can think of something that we need to do that we haven't done, just holler at me or any member of this committee or any legislator as far as future legislation
that we could hopefully introduce and pass that would just make, you know, solving these crimes and bringing these criminals to justice. That's what we want to do. So if we can help you in any way, let us know. And see no further questions.
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
49:25
Can I say, members of the committee, August. In August, we're going to try to, Ben is here with the Game and Fish. Thank you, Ben, for being here. If you have questions for them. But in August, we're going to try to do a tour, site visit, tour of Lake Conway and the dam project there.
As you know, it's a big deal. So
we'll get information out to what to wear. Do not wear what we have on today.
So we will be out in potentially trucks or side-by-sides or whatever, out looking at that big Lake Conway project. So we look forward to doing that in August. Thank you, Coach. Chair, thank you
all again for being here. Committee members, this meeting is adjourned.
Agenda
A. Call to Order
B. Comments by Co-Chairs
C. Overview of Arkansas State Crime Laboratory
D. Other Business
E. Adjournment
Documents
No documents posted.
Speakers
Representative Dwight Tosh Chair
Unverified
Senator Missy Irvin
Unverified
Speaker 14
Speaker 16
Speaker 18
Speaker 22
Speaker 24
Speaker 29
Speaker 33
Speaker 35
Senator Terry Rice
Unverified
Speaker 28
Speaker 31
Speaker 43
Representative Mark Perry
Unverified
Speaker 62
Speaker 59
Representative Matthew J. Shepherd
Unverified
Speaker 72