Public Transportation- House

Forty five going aspen co chair of center watching the future SB two forty five and also will be at the table for SB two forty seven so. Represent Holcomb at your CD than that I ask you just for the record identify yourself in. When you're ready you can. Resent the Bill Sir thank you Mr okay take the masco. Yes thank you will be too hard on me today now go ahead. Well thank you Mr chairman committee of. The first bill I'm gonna run the day is Senate bill two forty five it's an act to amend the uniform commercial driver's license that and disqualified driver convicted of a felony involving a severe form of trafficking in persons pretty commonsense no brainer to me but I think I've got a witness here from the FNA if they'd like to come up in case you you have any have any questions of got a couple of points I'd like to bring out. If I can find my notes. This bill would bring the state. Can you hear me OK okay this bill would bring stating to apply for federal law the federal motor carrier safety administration advisor list of offenses and that probably disqualify individuals required to have a commercial driver's license or commercial learner's permit a driver convicted of using a commercial vehicle commit to commit a felony that involves the fear form of human trafficking would be disqualified from operating a commercial vehicle for life the driver would not be eligible for reinstatement the federal law requires that staged to come into a substantial compliance within three years and there is no revenue impact so be glad take any questions if you have any. Are there any questions by the committee. Representa Brian go ahead Sir you're recognized. As far as The phone is Act is they have to be committed. In the State of Arkansas is a felony let me get the the FNA appeared kind of. Would you introduce yourself. Thank you chairman thank you Representative Holcomb Alicia Austin Smith with the FAM our senior legal counsel you're recognized him and thank you I appreciate that. I do not believe that the offense would have to be committed in the state of Arkansas I believe that once the individual is convicted that we would have a requirement to disqualify their CDL wherever that happens is convicted if that is incorrect I will certainly correct that so is that something that's. Transferred through the L. G. so if somebody is convicted of this state. Ten years ago when he was in a penitentiary in Minnesota any news the state of Arkansas we would know and that would qualify him to to be disqualified from receiving commercial or is only after the effective date my understanding is that it's on an ongoing basis but I will again verify that as well. Representative Paul okay I think all this is in the NCIC you know it's gonna be it's gonna be a national National Bank like it is now or so I I any any state we we should have that information and share state state. Okay a follow up so when when this law passes. Anybody is in the system now would they be precluded of the grandfathered in. Thank you again my understanding is that it was an on going basis from convictions from this point on one Arkansas adopt the law but I want to verify that a make sure. Record I think we're going to check on that because. my understanding is that the if it maintenance if you do it now you don't let you do it before you the are to be included I mean if you if you've got a family record for human trafficking it it did remain remains what had happened before this bill pass or after you are to be included so if there's not included I think I would I would ask for an amendment on that bill if you would like to go ahead run the bill today and and and we will check on and get that answer for you. Thank represent represent Brian are you satisfied with the With the follow up on here. Okay Representative right go head Sir you're recognized thank you thank you Mr chairman of. Representative of limitation is want to person actually was convicted of that they cannot get back into the truck as a commercial driver anymore this current roster is what yesterday. Thank you and thank you Mr chairman. I don't think I had to express to you that you probably all know with the what's going on with human trafficking nation not just here but worldwide and and and we just wanted to R. shares try to minimize as much as possible I don't know the worst thing can happen to someone family and and it's it seems to be on the rise and matter of fact it's a it's an organized crime this this doing that is not just individuals just so it's it's it's an organized or is a someone that picker someone's pick him up someone to take them to so what we're trying to do our share. Thank represented Holcomb also just gonna ages real quickly back in the mid nineties begin trying to know this back in my previous field and unfortunately and in sickening in many ways how this has progressed since the mid nineties and the. I always believe the glass is half full instead of the waste but we need to make sure we get on this and curtail this of this we can applaud the work on here Representative of Christian single his or. Thank you Mr represented Holcomb I cannot stress enough how important I feel healthy strong I feel in favor of this bill I personally took a fifty three year old man out of a semi one night who had carried a thirteen year old girl across seven states this is not only not declined it has accelerated dramatically and so Mr I would make a motion to property on. Thank you have one more question I believe Representative ray is that correct. No okay. The public does was little skewed on that one anymore questions by the committee that I might be missing could I add something Mr yes is you're looking at the bill itself in in a this if a driver operates commercial vehicle and is convicted of using the commercial vehicle in commission of a felony involving a severe form of trafficking in persons defined as effective January one for the job should be disqualified I I disagree that's going to be anybody that's fifty this kind of trafficking felonies gonna be involved in this but I'll find out for sure. Thank represented. No more questions of represent would you like close we build I would and I would ask for do pass okay. We have a motion. The the bill we have a motion known on the bill just a second here. There we go I have a note here represented Christiansen may the motion all in fig all in favor signify I. Those opposed Like sign. Representa hoping you you're a bill has kick is approved is carried go into the next was or you have one thank you chair committee appreciate thank you ma'am. Yes I'd like to all state police don't know what we need him or not but he may will give you an explanation of what we're doing this B. two forty seven to amend the law concerning the penalty times for a violation of the fence of racing a vehicle on a public highway I'll give you a little little background on this I'm a I'm a drag racer myself my son I have four cars we drag race we have five second cars we have six second cars I've been drag racing since I was a teenager but we have to lower our cars up on a trailer we have to travel a minimum of two hours from our house to go to some drag strips in their directorships four five around the state of Arkansas we go to all of its one point or another we have to pay an entry fee when we get there it's controlled environment with fire extinguishers up and down and and if you if you get certain times in your car you're qualified to have a certain safety equipment like real bars in and safety equipment such as that fire extinguishers in your car our qualify our cars are fast enough that we have to have those of this bill is not to target someone that may have been at a red light in the heat of the moment kind of got to took office red light and you know had a little race there little lady that's that's not that's not the reason for this bill reason for this bill some of you may watch some of drag racing the goes on TV District racing goes on will certainly it's it's got to be it's got to be a problem not only for the state of Arkansas but in several surrounding states and what we've got is we've got a a group of say forty cars sometime fifty cars it will meet in a parking lot somewhere they'll gather up there go out somewhere that blocked traffic and they got these cars that run a hundred sixty mile an hour that should have the same the safety features that we've got in our cars and they're out drag racing on the highways US. Been in doughnuts and just causing chaos for a lot of community so that's the reason for this bill the first offense actually is the same is the same charges always be and it is it is a misdemeanor charge however the second offense we've increased to a felony I believe is a Class D. felony my correct on that and that's what we're asking for we're trying to get get get these organized street racers off the street before somebody really gets hurt somebody already got hurt I saw a video the other night you bought a bill pulled up a video of your own and maybe your home town I did what I in my home town they they had a wreck late that night out street racing so that's what this bill for that's what we're asking for we're we're able to unable to give you an impact summary statement because there is not a not a lot of of of tickets wrote for racing on the highway to really tell us what kind of impact we're going to have with the second if it's being being moved to a felony but anyway we've got to do something to curtail this problem at this organize raising problem on the highways and this is what the recommendation is coming from state police so Mr chairman have a trooper with me if you want him to and do some happy as anything that you want to do that now you wanna start with questions or how do you want to do that. Okay here we are back since I've already got questions start with Committee filament can I go ahead and get your to this other way you're the chairman okay we great representantes you're recognized Sir go ahead. Okay thank you Mister of revenge Holcomb. And I appreciate I understand you're talking bout to second offense I guess I'm just curious you what is a statute of limitation in regards to after the first offense up for them to be able to be charged for it with a second offense what is that statute in regards of limitation if before that would they would not be eight you would not be able to charge was sixteen which is in a year after the first two years three years how long does it stay in effect in regards to being charged with the second offense you understand the question all rights that is not that complicated but I can answer it so I'm going to defer to my to do it yourself if you will. Go ahead you're recognized no major duration and with the Arkansas state police. It's not defined in this in our statute as far as a look back rule compared to some submitted to W. as far as I don't know if you look back on statute of limitations for the class A. misdemeanor or would just be from. Each house right now it's going to affect each second offense or subsequent offense would automatically go to a felony. They've been told the first time and they've been given a slap on the hand with a Class C. misdemeanor for a second or subsequent offense were asking in answer to a felony. You're recognized will be sure and I understand what you say but are you saying that once you a charge with the first offense that there's no written up until a limitation on the number of years said that whatever you know like two three four five years before the second offense a curfew Sandidge forever after that that if they committed again to be charged with a felony I thank you fifteen twenty years later I thank I think it'll be up to the prosecutor disclose any other trial due to be played out one way or the other I think it looks at the totality of the circumstances are involved in it that incident but in this statute it does not have does not define a look back rule is not in statute with that notion defined okay no further thank you. Committee member represent a branch you're recognized Sir. Yes are you on Sir yes there has. Yes. I can appreciate the intent of this bill when I saw that came out of Senate commission animus one one down vote. I thought was easy one into a. I kind of dug a little deeper into it start asking questions I appreciate your impact statement to kind of get an idea of credit statement so I called been counties corners been there since the mid nineties and said how many how many deaths or severe injuries have you that led up to death for drag racing have you encountered ninety seven twenty five years he's been there not one. However he's been to dozens countless the Y. offenses that resulted in death yes the U. eyes are three misdemeanors for each offense within five years and only after the fifth year do you get a fourth offense that it becomes a felony so that's my concern with this bill is we're we're taking something that that is kinda steep in tradition you've done it by that is that I did it and as technology increases in cars get faster and it's more streamlined way less. My concern would be is is we ruined a kid's life by giving him a felony record for being just a kid being kind silly so how can we can look at doing something a little a little more the D. U. I. line what were remove the driver's license doing something that would that would economically impact M. and not follow him the rest of his life well I had some of those same concerns when the bill was first brought to me to move bills first brought to myself and of senator Johnson on the we we try to get together on these bills and ensure concerns when we first brought to this the first offense was felony wheat we felt like that was a little rough so we asked for them to reduce the first offense and and there again were not what we're not is targeting at a couple kids it did get in a race I don't highway we're we're actually targeting the organized of the organized the organizer of the of the racers have what's happening is in our our troopers pulling in and and he's trying to catch someone and and their run in all directions and they're fleeing and affectation of me a video the other night now colonel Brian S. Code or Chargers down where they will only run about a hundred and thirty but they use to run about a hundred fifty and we got to walking away from us I mean you know and and those are the those are the dangerous situation anytime a anytime a does it did for me would create the most one of the most dangerous things or is it someone is fully because they're they're just trying to get away they're not worried about the safety of anyone else so that there again that's I understand your point and and and it will take in but this desperately what we're trying to target follow up Mister chair. How will it how do we distinguish that how do how do we how do we will limit a prosecutor's ability to distinguish between you know what this is this is a problem to this is I and I remember you from three years ago. We're going to send you to prison for a year for doing this we're we're is the mechanism that that kind of gets it you know hot shot prosecutor that wants to make a name for himself verses you know see the prosecutor that doesn't want to ruin a kid's life ward where do we draw that distinction well I think you and I both know that we've got those different are prosecutors all across state every case in summer going to look at it and and and deal regardless even even extend beyond the distractor AC we've got some that are going to be a lot more strict some there are some that are going to stand so so was there again. In our art Arthur police officers have to do their job and and and in their reporting they do they do a good job of reporting the incidents have what happened circumstances there again it's up to the prosecutor ultimately what he decides right sized hands so. That that would be my answer the Senate not that nothing in your in your research of pushing this bill Ford came to say maybe a third offense would be more likely because you know first is and now you will get your attention second is we go we can even brought in up to the next and a Class C. misdemeanor is the highest misdemeanor but you know you can go up to the other window first one was thirty days committee service and excellence. Thirty days in jail clean because I missed meeting up to one year in jail good. This is this is a trend has run across the country and right now I'm not sure if Northwest Arkansas I'm not familiar with any sort of these events taking place in northwest Arkansas I know they're turning Jones were on older occurring here in central Arkansas and these are these are large scale events these are bands that recorded on social media whether it's Snapchat of. Apps that are better off the radar that are specific to individual individual or difficult to be monitored or large groups will go out and they will shut down a section of a state highway or U. S. Highway and when I mean shut down I mean line the shoulders is vehicles parked cars across intersections and they overtake a roadway in the in the conduct drag racing on a state highway US highway of. These are large coordinated events this we're not talking about Jimmy and Johnny or on a Friday night get now here and and and one of you know having a good time on a Friday night and in you all know my prosecutors have the ability to do that the plea they play plea almost. I'm not a specific specify the exact percentage but prosecutors plea majority of the cases and they and that ability to play up or play down as it is that's that's part of their job and they do that by the facts are presented to them on that case and so there is some leeway in their you know what the next step up from a Class C. misdemeanor is a Class C. felony and that's what we're asking to enhance it it's a problem taking place it's coming whether I mean it's it's already here and we have had fidelity crashes as a result of it and some of more unsolved because we don't know either of the parties were involved in it as a result of a race is it. Could not be added language words of publicize of an like. I guess said I and my concern is just Johnny an engineer to the in Sally. DO anything on a Friday night and rule Arkansas and and find themselves up against felony charges for second offense for. From being kids Thank you. K. of. Represent the Taglit you're recognized Just out of curiosity what how many I guess. For the state of Arkansas on on a yearly basis or or have gotten a second offense on this I'm on the current law. I can give you an exact number I don't I don't know the exact number of what what I can say I mean I can give you some statistics that we've I got pulled the warnings and citations issued for this event for racing for twenty twenty and these are just these are citations that were issued it doesn't mean they were found guilty or that the disposition of that case but in twenty twenty we issued a hundred forty six I Tatian warnings across the state and that's all uses release out that's just not Arkansas state police what's a hundred forty six of those in twenty nineteen there was only sixty three of them so there's a lot mean it it more than doubled in that one year prior to that it was sixty and twenty seventeen there was fifty one in twenty sixteen there were forty two warnings or citations issued of I can from my experience from you know obviously I think everybody especially for from Central Arkansas you're you're aware of this problem an issue that it's been and I have gone back and looked at a lot of the citations I reviewed this past summer and in the spring and overwhelmingly they've all either been no frost or they've never been to the court yet they were There's not disposition on. And so I means that the the occasion of a second offense is not of a frequent flyer. Follow follow go ahead. Okay so I guess my question is with this law and and I understand where you're coming from and and I've seen things like this on social media and I understand it's a growing problem my question is is just. If this was passed how are you how is this going to be sent out to prosecutors and let him know that this is a problem because I mean you can write all the ticket you won't but if the if the legal counsel behind you is not going to stand up which is a big problem in the state the state of Arkansas. Then it's it's really not going to matter that much and so I I guess what would be the plan to let prosecutors across the state of Arkansas know that Hey this is an issue this is what we're trying to curtail we need you to be strong the as part I mean what would be the next step if this is passed. The prosecutors into Arkansas they are aware of this problem we have spoken to some of them prior to bring bringing that trying to enhance these penalties but also keep in mind that in District Court and even in circuit court we can have the strongest prosecutor in the world but a judge can do what he wants to do. And we can we can get a guilty verdict but the judge can suspend that sentence I'm aiming. So we we can have a support proctor and I really believe we do of the ones we spoke with them they all see that it's a problem and and the dangers of brings with it. I might add to Mr chairman and represent all to let skews me the the the prosecutors would meet regularly they have an organization know that they may they share these these concerns what's going on so there they are with their well informed of of what changes taking place and what issues are are police officer or facing today. I was going to add one more years you're recognized for it sorry at the you know some a trend that we've seen most recently is is will have a trooper or troopers you again you have to understand it even in the the metro little rock area you may not have before five troopers working in Pulaski and saline county that's it that's all you got and then you've got twenty or thirty or forty or how many cars they gather up and decide to overtake a roadway there's only so much report reports can do industry for for for scattered across two counties and so what happens is for a trooper dropped upon this and and begins to take enforcement actions the next thing you know they're in a pursuit and the suspect vehicle crashes out or come to a stop and next thing you know the participants in the race and circle back to the end of this pursuit looking for the driver of the police officer that's involved in it. It's it's a this isn't about billion Johnny I'm here on a Friday or Saturday not having a good time. it's it's trying to. AS abilities on this to the terror that. What makes it goes if there's any questions in the audience first we're going to go to Representative or in it right now the Senate you're recognized. Thank you chair I can't count how many complaints I have received from constituents that represent parts of downtown and highway US highway seventy Broadway I mean so many. Races on that strip my question is Can you give us can you give me a number for how many tickets have been issued to these people they're doing extract races on the strip. instead of a pool a little rock police department. Question. You're recognized. Go ahead in the in the City of Little Rock it would be a little rock police department question if for exit for trooper happened be passing through that area is just not as primary area of control And so I I can answer to that specific downtown area I thank you represent right you're recognized will go to the audience trying to that mysterious so you get all state to begin right of right to take it anywhere in the state you know he's not just some people think he's confined to the and I said see limits where but he's not he's he's he can enforce a law wherever he's at whatever County thanks for the clarification thank you zero okay thank you Mr chairman you know represented my act back in the fifties and sixties as always always drag racing it was a fired back the and and everyone expected back then you know what we're in a different world now and people don't drive like they used to people don't care about other drivers like they used to on the way home you can you can be going fifty seven fifty eight mile are someone will dart to you and around you and then what we twenty five thirty foot difference is a changing worlds are in nine thank you know that and I don't believe these folks will be here today and this is serious business thank you thank you is there anyone in the audience who like to speak for or against the bill. That would end audits anymore committee members. Okay. Reserve Holcomb would you like to close for the bill I would thank you for your questions I have some the same concerns you do but it's it's a it's a growing problem it's going to get worse we need to do what we can to to eliminate problem and so I we close that Astrid do pass. What are the wishes of the committee. Okay we have a motion with the motion to past of the bill all in favor say aye. Those in favor against or those that those against. Okay the eyes have it thank you Sir thank you legislation to builders Mr Preciado. Would you like can I get my notes together as hard for me but not. At. All right the house bill fourteen nine at fourteen ninety five represent Wardlaw you're recognized reduce yourself and you might see. Mr chairman thank you I never thought. Last. I'm sorry this bill has been fun the last few days All this bill does is takes the governor's executive order on log in there was a lot more things in that executive order that expanded out to ninety thousand pounds right now our lawyers have the right to haul eighty five thousand pounds we're only increase in that five thousand pounds and were only increase in that to be permanent from the executive order if you read in the bill on the second page it addresses the bridges and it addresses that were not increase in any way on any of those bridges or any of those lightweight bridges were still be lowered bridges. One of the county judges in the state takes me last week is that he would make his roads seventy three thousand pounds limit all his county roads that's that's the counties right and they can do that what I've heard of them doing in the past is if they have a meal on a county road and I have to route the old open one route for no weight restrictions passes date and no clothes one weight restrictions until they get it fixed and then they swap that out of and and on somebody's mills if you guys have any mails in your area the roads going into those meals a lot of more on county and city streets and they need that ability because that way over time does mess up the roads but we're not talking about ten thousand pounds are we talking about five and I will tell you that is my experience and I've called some of the meals what rate really regulates weight in this state Hey these guys right to tickets okay board really regulates that weight is the meals and a lot of these mills are at ninety thousand which I suspect just wanna governors went to ninety thousand pounds and that is what really regulates this weight so whether we passed this bill or not we're going to see most of these trucks hauling around ninety thousand pounds because that's what the meals will accept we do have some mills and except a hundred thousand pounds and I will say to you we don't we do and that's their prerogative I don't think that's right but that is their prerogative and I hope these guys catch those people to hold that much weight because it's not safe is not safe to stop is not safe to hold down the road but with that Mister chairman I do have a few loggers with me to answer any questions of and I'll be happy to try to do that. Okay committee we are ready to recognize your questions so if anyone has questions. Absented bracket. represented feeling you were first on the list so you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman of represent all of the use on the second of all how long would the government that the order on those time it expired in December for this piece he led a lot of executive orders expire in December and if you remember he gave a speech and he said if the members would like to see these continued their bring forth legislation so that's when I started working on this bill where the and then my follow the problem was that in that problem. With the order from the town as are dark not to my knowledge there except that the center was fine everything was fine thank you. All right. Any other questions I thank represented right did you have a question you had your hand up first so what will get you in line. Wardlaw in your opening statement said mills except ninety thousand pounds so is it a couple draw the conclusion that they've been operating. Since. With important that always ran at ninety thousand pounds so to give you a history you can look at my financial interest you see that passel farms is one of our. Pairs of whatever my family on special forms and we build roads for meat for potlatch and Deltic timber company and I can tell you as long as I can remember it was actually no limit on it for years and they came in about thirty years ago looking it's got to get some advice about thirty years ago they came in and started enforcing a wait at the mill park and I think that was from pressure from our department. So but yes that has been there for a long time and. Those low numbers have been going on are always full for a while. Okay represented car you're next on the list for question. Yes I just had a very simple and quick question obviously if we increase the weight limits by five thousand pounds with that also reduce the number of trucks of potentially would have to be on the road that's exactly true. Represented car you're recognized to be represented right here recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chairman represent Wardlaw on page two there's do not codified language about Act line retroactively to January one that's that was so I could catch it won't matter much because mean obviously not going to all the logs in the retro but I wanted to go into effect as soon as possible because that executive order had expired so we were trying to hit that date point to where it says bill was fought signed into law goes into effect okay and that's standard language on emergency calls when you're trying to achieve that okay. Any other questions from committee. Okay I have I have Representative Park. So I'm just going to ask a very basic maybe dumb question but what caused it to be an emergency during the pandemic for this to be increased five thousand pounds per truck I have the same feeling you have but there the reason was told the paper the toilet paper shortage they put it in and if you read the bill it says for paper rolled products for paper and that was the reason and I I used the same language from the executive order. Represented bright you have another question yes the I'm circling back to little confused. If we've always kind of carried it this way. Ninety thousand pounds the assumption maybe not legal but that's not bill sets. And we increased it to ninety thousand pounds. To get more quality out there you know we always carried ninety thousand pounds. We really didn't do anything with the second order except make it legal to carry nine thousand saying they were doing sitting right here today so my question would be is. His work we're asking to expand this to all Arkansas roadways state highways that carry log trucks that use log trucks is that correct yes Sir but it does not include interstate highways so in the executive order did not to my knowledge as well so the the the roads that state builds yes for the most part counties at a company roads as well okay. Any other questions from committee. Represent to let. I grew up in southwest Arkansas and Where the logging industry is a a big deal and the roads around meals and everything else I've notice they have the nice little right center Marcus you caller are slow some of both sides or whatever from trucks that have been hall and for four years but under this the county still have the right to regulate. Every single or the weight limits in their counties so if you're a logging community in your county then your county judge has the right to regulate. all those weight limits correct that's correct this does not change that so it is basically a county by county decision whether they want this or not local control. Thank you yes Sir last year represented Watson you're you're recognized for a question yes of his or dot. Representatives for she to represent of Wardlaw and they've done a compact a cost impact analysis what it would cost in terms of additional damage to the pavements and bridges if log trucks are allowed the ninety thousand pounds are you are you aware if they had I haven't I'm not aware but I am aware that they're not for the bill okay and. The Representative running presenter you to represent right you're recognized thank you Mr chairman representa Wardlaw as you so eloquently pointed out Bardot has concerns about the bill damaging the roadways since I'm sure that objection is gonna be verbalized here shortly could you could you give your rebuttal to that or or explain why you think that concern I was not probably do that in my closing I'll just a second item all across the wrong way away away for that then thank you Sir. Any other questions committee representantes you're recognized. Davis Speaker represent your lobbyist I've been listed I'm just curious if if your bill doesn't allow vehicles to To travel over bridges that have a weight limit I believe that was what I heard in your testimony it also doesn't allow of. The ninety thousand pound of vehicles if this bill were to pass it doesn't allow them to travel alone are basically are secondary roads and other roads which normally have a weight limit of about to about eighty thousand. Now. You will for you in my area of most of our bridges of. They have a weight restriction element of course we have a lot of secondary roads with the eighty thousand pounds with the and and so I'm just curious if we allow ninety thousand pounds where the vehicle is going to do it I mean they can't get on an eighty thousand pound road they can't cross a bridge with the weight limit so that is going to load him up and said in a drive by where they're going no Sir you're you've misunderstood that they can they can drop the secondary roads I'm saying this bill does not change those weight restrictions on those bridges Sorvillo weighbridge they're gonna stay low a bridge it's a criminal offense to cross over a bridge with an overweight truck we give log trucks today eighty five thousand on all those secondary roads that you referenced that are eighty so you're only adding five thousand pounds to that which is exactly what the executive order did that's what brings us to that magic number of ninety so you're not you're not restricted on from those roads but if your county wanted to say that they wanted a weight limit of just to say one of my County said seventy three thousand and he's using that number from that's an interstate number for gravel trucks for certain links but if your county want to do that they could do that and they wouldn't have an exception above like this bill allows for love drugs it would be seventy three thousand but that would be a move is represented to all it said that they would have to take on locally and for logging community. That's probably not a politically good issued to be tackling of which was what represent of tall it was saying so but this bill gives on that lead way on those A. roads if you're talking about but if I had a little weight bridge on that road station be on that road. Did you have following the admission chair and you know I guess what one of the funds it concerns me a Representative is that you know it just seems like there's so much you know as I study these laws and look at all men and looked at him for many many years hi what concerns me sometimes is it is. Bills like this state continue to provide a further disparity among what vehicles can travel or highways with a certain weight limit and what vehicles came out and Israel office we I think we're creating a level playing field and I'll give you my example of that is and it'll be in the form of a question at some point but anyways if you take an asphalt truck. Only when they leave when they leave the planet they can load out at seventy three thousand two hundred eighty pounds you want to get to the job site and they will retire to the plant to load about eighty thousand and you know I mean. Who can understand that and now we're going even like the disparity further by allowing log trucks to run ninety thousand panels or highways or roads and the but we're still regulating other other industries I mean it just seems like it's so unfair to me and to me it just we just need to hold the line and and the what are your thoughts on that. Right now depending on your links between your axles coming from somebody that owns strokes and move stuff daily and and from a produce standpoint where we load reefer trailers we we moved those axles forwards and backwards for that very reason you just brought up because every road we get all has a different axle management as a different axle weight regulation so we already do everything that you're saying you didn't want this bill to do we do it anyway because when you get on the interstate there's a different bridge law there's a different measurement it when you get onto a state highway there's there's also deferments for gravel trucking all eighty thousand pounds every day of the week with a twenty two trailer twenty two foot trailer on any state highway when he pulls off that exit ramp on interstate he's got we seventy three to eighty because he's not got enough links between the pool and axles on the trailer axles so we already do all those things log truck same way they're they're links between pull an axle trailers is already too short to meet that bridge laws on the interstate so they're pulling seventy three thousand as well once they hit so we already have all the different weights for the different trucks and different measurements the reason we've always gave log trucks disparity is because they're loading in the mud and a lot of these log trucks when the meals went to this regulation ninety thousand went to scales effect trucks not on hard surface level go skills don't mean anything out there in the woods so intently pulls up on asphalt he gets level and get straightening it but either way he then gets away. And most of the time what you find is their way in anywhere from about eighty four eighty eight thousand and that's what we seen even through this emergency they're not hall and ninety they're still staying right there under nine because they're still trying to stay around eighty five because they don't want that heavy weight on their trucks anyway because it tears up their trucks break Springs bust air bags there's there's a whole list of things happen once you start getting into the over ninety thousand pounds not only is it there how it tears of trucks so. But they they're making about two tons after a load off of this which about four thousand pounds you get five thousand extra room they're mostly all in eighty eight eighty nine thousand that's pure profit to these folks are already heard and heard and for multiple reasons one equipment costs as winter roof diesel costs went up we raised diesel taxes to help with highways I was part of that we asked sponsor the bill to gave sales tax and highways myself all those costs which straight to these guys and they got a break for the last year. With this two thousand year this two tone look Exter. And there's no reason we don't make this permanent we haven't saw amount of mass amount of damage over the last year that justifies not making this permit I've been told in the back or in the hallways today that if I just made a bill to sit while the merge you went on how would you have opposition I mean we don't know how long this March is going to go. I mean it's just it's crazy so anyway I I think we ought to do it permanently and that's one to stand here this bill to do it Parmalee for the log or something like said their income it part of Arkansas's economy. Any committee my committee represent farming you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chair a reserve Wardlaw do logging trucks have a good pre route planned before they drive off like they know the route know what bridges are gonna encounter of I think most of them try to do that yes so the the possibility of coming up like on a low a bridge by surprise would you say is pretty minimal I would say okay. I resent Tosh you've recognized for a follow up. I believe we are just want to follow up with something that nine brand sales I I just want to clear this up in the asphalt trucks of represent for all it is is not based on their weight limit is not based on the the difference between the axles if that was the case if you if you remember what I said when they leave the query they they have to load amount of seventy three thousand two hundred eighty pounds but if they go to the job site and then they want to load him up with debris or whatever else they will a load on with then they can load him up to eighty thousand pounds to return to the plant my point here is what I'm talking about disparity or singling out one industry and we're letting them go to ninety thousand pounds but we're holding what we're looking at an industry like the asphalt interest which is big in my part of the world and there still is seventy three thousand two hundred eighty pounds is not based on actual which based on because they're all in the judgment or based on all of the unfinished projects part of what they call an unfinished product which I really got trouble with all that because in we're talking about you know I highways in our bridges and and keep in the on board or not just totally destroyed by the weight limits I'm a what difference does it make what a vehicle is hauling eighty thousand pounds is eighty thousand pounds and the at least it was four I went to school Senator representing wise that's all I gotta say about us to to clear that up I have three trucks personally the whole asphalt every day we can all eighty thousand pounds all day long as long as we do not touch an interstate and that's your trucks are probably touch and an interstate highway at some point and that's reason or seventy three to eighty which we do the same thing we have to go to seventy three to eighty at that point as well. Okay any other questions from committee. Present brass. So you you to the trucks that you own he said you you gotta move axles you gotta configure more appropriately for the the Roger honor what you're holding any reason why try to. Axle configuration and change the law to accept tried and to go up to. Hundred thousand based on the cells wouldn't solve this problem for we still protected degree the roads is what was what were the structure our trailer trucks they're not Bob trucks. So they they have a trailer bond so that tandem axle truck. I mean I guess you could add another axles you wanted to by law but that that shouldn't help with this. Any other questions from committee. Okay we're going to we've got some sense signed up to testify. We have the bread makayla. To testify against do you wanna go first or do you want lower to to go first. All right of. Look if you would introduce yourself and you can do your presentation and will let's take a few questions. Speak boldly. Thank you for this opportunity on Laurie tutor with the Arkansas department of transportation and today I have with me major Bickerstaff he's or he is are acting chief of Arkansas highway police and he knows all things wait laws and what's going on there did you come over the case we have any questions this and she going to speak and then if you ask any questions you can introduce yourself and. The question is I will say that Representative Wardlaw has a lot of you know experience out in the field with tracks and those types of things and I do not so I'm just here to speak for the roads in for the regular traveling public on those roads that's my purpose today also have bred makayla with me and I'll bring him up if you have technical questions about pavement deterioration and things like that he's over he's our engineer over our pavement management section so and we're here to say that we're opposed to house bill fourteen ninety five I am Marie were opposed because of negative impacts to the infrastructure some significant safety concerns and then mostly because of the precedent that it'll set. So each of you have been given a folder we made you a folder with the materials in it is actually listed would you get your mac a little closer please. Thank you has this is better better okay anyway I email the two entities send materials and that's all this is with the addition of a couple of slides that talk about the pavement deterioration and so You know at the beginning of Kobe nineteen the nation we were reeling of course we didn't know what was going on it was really a time of. I've never experienced anything like it and there was a shortage in personal protective equipment your PPVs and the mask and things like that in other paper products including toilet paper we're all familiar with that and so to aid in relief efforts as they are there was a temporary increase allowing ninety thousand pounds for log trucks in anything they had to do with paper products. And this this increase began in April and it was a it was a why it went into place it was the governor's emergency order and the federal government he got involved. And of course this temporary increase expired in December of twenty twenty. Now we agree to this increase our dot did in any agree to waive that allow ninety thousand pounds as a temporary measure to help out and mean we were facing a completely unknown in unprecedented situation a global pandemic with a critical shorter critical shortage in many supplies across the nation and that we had no idea how long code was gonna last and actually we had no idea about anything we just knew we wanted to be a team player and help out any way we could so we agreed to those weight limits for log tricks for eight you know in in the idea that this was a brief period of time for the greater good well as everyone knows no good deed goes unpunished right so that's where we're at today and we agreed to that but not for a permanent thing it was just for temporary during this unprecedented time so of course is Representative Wardlaw said this will increase the legal weight limit on log trucks for may five thousand to ninety thousand pounds and it's only it's they can't get on the interstate and they can't get on weight restricted roads or bridges it's in the bill that way so let me just talk to you a little bit today about my concern for the infrastructure in for the safety of our traveling public based on an engineering analysis and and you know we're full of engineers that and we get you know we have all these publications and we we have all kinds of data we live data and so based on an engineering analysis each log truck in the hat think about one log track if you let that one log trick increase their weight by five thousand pounds. So it just let's just pretend they're all honest in they do eighty five thousand pounds but I know that was a discussion led earlier but let's just pretend like they do eighty five thousand pounds if we allow them to have tens more weight that will cause a twenty seven percent increase in the deterioration on the roads and that's to the that the formula is involved with calculating the life of the pavement are exponential so that what that means and just plain everyday language is payment that is designed to last twenty years well now only last ten years because of that additional you you know pressure any use of that road that all that different additional way on the road a pavement that has a remaining life of eight years so all of our payments don't have twenty years out there you know they're in different stages of what what where their life is so a payment that just says had has eight years left would have four years left if if this you know it's just in the big generalities now this isn't going to happen with one log track but if all the log tricks are start carry ninety thousand pounds this is what we're kind of looking at. You know one of the forms of pavement failure is ready and that reading is it is of any issue especially in law country and I was talking to some of our friends in Louisiana and you know they call it the wood basket his ever anyone ever heard that is the wood basket in southern Arkansas I mean it's huge for the economy and I understand that I really do but anyway there there's ready and so that's because of the weight on the pavement and as everyone knows those threats when is your rainy Viet they can collect water in your ladder passenger vehicles can hydroplane and I know everyone of the scene here has hydroplane before it's very very terrifying very dangerous and it is the probable cause of many wet weather accidents in the state especially where there's a lot of reading in this additional weight would contribute to that and other concerns are bridges now and represented Wardlaw said that the the loggers they mapped out their their Read out and they determine whether or not there's a weight restricted bridge on that route and hopefully that's true but M. if it's you know it's not always true then that's going to cause some additional damage to our already fragile bridges and the you know the fact that they might. Follow in just is increased. Or collapse let's just talk a minute about stopping distance and a five thousand pound increase in your weight results in an email maybe twenty feet more stopping distance is needed now I know if you get hit by an eighty five thousand pound truck or ninety thousand versus ninety thousand pound truck that's not really going to make a big difference right we we're we're not in good shape if we get hit by that much weight but what what I do want to think about is twenty feet. Might just be the difference between a crash in a near miss. NO eighty five thousand pounds is a lot of weight and so you know it's like where do you stop is is an eighty five thousand pounds quite a bit of a weight out there on our secondary roads and bridges. And let me just say my biggest concern my most the biggest concern that I have isn't really about log trucks it's about the precedent that you all will be setting if you allow ninety thousand pounds because if you aren't allow log trucks ninety thousand pounds let me tell you it won't be long two they're knocking on your door and there's other commodities other industries that are going to want that ninety thousand pounds as well because it's money it means more money for those industries this is a Pandora's box and as so I want you to think about not just log tricks today think about what what you're gonna say when they all come one that ninety thousand pounds. And the other thing is the proof will of this legislation will definitely curtail the progress we hope to make with issue one it'll be more of our bridges and more of our pavements needed for repairing so instead of where we thought we would be when we went out to the public and we said look if you pass issue one if you give us this additional money will be able to do all this additional work for highway system. Well it'll be one step forward two steps back because we're going to increase we have an increased going to accelerate the duration of our roads and I can tell you to be with certainty. That when our voters we are Kansans went to the polls. And they said you know I don't know whether to vote for issue one or not that's a half cent sales tax and I'm gonna continue taxing my cell phone but you know what I want good roads I bet you not one of them said you know what let's do a half cent sales tax continue taxing ourselves and let's let let's let the logging industry in whoever D. ninety thousand pounds to accelerate to steer Asian I don't think that was in their mind one bit and that's why today I'm here to speak because I'm speaking on behalf of the voters the people that I went down and talked to at least to tell them issue one is going to be a great thing for this state it's going to take care of our rates can do wonders in taking care of our roads and bridges but that was at the point in time based on the needs study that we did with the weight limits in place that would and so I just want everyone to realize that and I'm gonna stop right there I've got the if you have any questions about the way in a way enforcement I would like to turn that over to them to our major Speaker staff because he knows that very well okay Mister I think we have some questions first represent Tosh you think your first on the list so you may begin with your questions. Thank you Mr Speaker of director I I just curious you said that five thousand additional pounds of added that in addition to twenty feet of stopping distance so I mean that's just a skating distance once the court is actually contacted breaking does include any type of reaction time I would assume that safety is extremely important way what what what what speed did you base the additional twenty three dollars and thirty forty fifty sixty miles back and may I add consult with Bradley Caleb he put those numbers together right budget. Purging senators who over at. Where. In addition cell phone. Local the maximum. Not on. Thank you look at the close to three hearing all right my name is Brenda Caleb on the division engineer for systems information research division that are not. in response to the the question the study that was conducted this bike was based on was done at sixty five miles per hour. Thanks for your follow up we are there Mr do you know the Six five miles per hour you know the Total braking distance at that speed it provided the log truck has a good braking system and everything's in order do you know what that is off the top of the securities safety is really concerned may obviously and this. Just kind or make sure we're looking at two years of. Through the through the lenses of of. You know action damage in the contribution you know the contributing factors as they relate to those action and so do you have that total of not stopping digital issue factored in the reaction time but the braking distance. This the the difference in that stopping distance is due to the braking distance. Okay the the information that we provided that nineteen twenty foot additional distances due to a ranking distance not perception reaction break lag anything else my question was what was the total braking distances Sir I and and I'm unfortunately I don't remember off the top of my head of a sum are understand that only there is somewhere between four hundred and and ninety feet and then the difference the divisional nineteen to twenty feet so five hundred and something other than a football field yes Sir okay thank you represent's Springer you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mister Mister chair I have two questions if that's okay we'll do your first one number four okay the first quick question thank you all for this data I like to look at data so thank you very much for yet on page two of your report at the bottom you indicate the number of accidents crashes involving love tricks in Arkansas for a period between January one twenty fifteen February ninth twenty twenty one can you tell us the of of the amount of crashes that have occurred between December when this order went into effect and and then toward the end of the order that that would talk about all or even through February ninth twenty twenty one so that the time that the governor issued the order in the and ending February ninth twenty twenty one no ma'am we do we do not have that information at this time so do you have follow up on the green do you have do you have any data would respect to the roads in these particular areas the condition of those roads in that area. Mister Mister is pulling we're gonna pull up in a chair seeing is my. User my. We have all kinds of data and we can get you any of that to the I don't we don't have it with us today but we do have that data I would like to have that and I did And so you'll know I'm from South Arkansas and I know about hauling logs in this sort of thing so and my family is in that business so okay so I I would just like to know what was taking place in that area okay I'm I'm a little I live in little rock but you have a lot of family members that live in south Arkansas I understand thank you represented right you're next on the list question yes Sir thank you Mister chairman lowering a couple weeks ago. At three bridges it hours really concerned about. basically they will between the panto an interstate highway. Terrible condition and you promised that you would you do all you could I know you are. But the situation was this when I called and talked to Paragould they said John. We've come out the blacked out we can't just put black duffel talked to offer that anymore because that bridge will cave in. Nasdaq bridge caves in and what we have now it makes me wonder what would happen if we increased. Well that's it that's a real concern now with issue one we're going to work really hard over the next ten years to renew the posting and the structural deficient bridges but we do we have some very very poor bridges in the state in. It's just been from a lack of funding and also the conditions that they're subject to sell. Okay next misrepresent Hillman. Thank you Mr chairman. I just got one little question I'm a farmer from east Arkansas we all have our of row crop farmer and will hold that three months of the year and when I come back here in two years if this bill passes not come back and want you to raise the limit for row crop farmers ninety thousand pad you still gonna be opposed to that. Represented right you're recognized for a question. Thank you Mr chairman Director tutor my question is about the safety concerns that you've raised If the ninety thousand pound load. Is unsafe for Arkansas motors today in February of twenty twenty one I presume it would also have been unsafe last year when the executive order was issued. So my question is what you said in your testimony that. R. dot was okay with the emergency order why would your agency sign off on an executive order if you felt it put Arkansas motorists at risk. All I can say is that the term. We were just trying to be a team player and do what we could to help the bigger picture which was the critical shortages that were going on. I will say that our chief Thompson was really involved with that in discussions with the with the governor's office and whatever and and when they came and recommended to me that we that we go ahead and and and implement this waiver. All I can tell you is I thought it was the right thing to do but other than. The you know your rights I probably should have said no. At the time a. I was very very need director the and I I got on. Appointed my first day was March twenty third the same day that we send everybody home and all these executive order started and it to me it seems like what we need to do to be a team player and to help the nation and help our state all we could now looking back maybe I shouldn't have I understand what you're saying. But I did it with. You know I'll say I did it with the best intentions. Thank you okay next on the list represent Christiansen you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman. Director and and Brad can you tell me the cost per call the committee the cost roughly cost per mile right now that it is to maintain our secondary roads are gravel or chip seal or blacktop roads that are going to be impacted because as it stands we know this is going to keep these trucks off the interstate so what are we looking at in dollars and sense of what it is now and possibly projected dollars and sense of what it's going to be downrange. I do not have that information at hand but we can get that information and provided to the committee members of like like this something we would like but can you can you give us kind of an estimate of what cost per mile is right now to maintain gypsy electro yes of course there's the reins it depends on the the the type of road in the type of damage that we're trying to alleviate it remains a you know it it just ranges from for just a normal overlay about is it about a hundred thousand lane miles so about a hundred thousand Elaine mile and then you can go all the way down to lesser even less than that for chip and seal or some of the lesser improvements and then you can go over to about one point five million dollars per lane mile when you get into having to do full depth reconstruction because once the subgrade goes out being you have to rebuild the whole thing you just have to do the surface of it then it's it's less expensive so there's a huge difference in what what you're asking so what we can do is get that for you and and you can see I think I'd be good information for thank you followed Mister chairman Director of. When you look at the substrate that we have in Arkansas and we know that to grow timber it has to have a good water sources we know that a lot of the ground is shifting ground because log trucks to operate in the mud it's a heavy industry that we appreciate it's our natural industry this is not a castigate tion of that but the simple fact that in our heavy timber growing years is it not correct that we have a water table disclosure underneath the service and that's one reason some of the roads require more maintenance is the weight increases yeah definitely you've got the delta souls that is extremely expensive and may contract they expand with the water table in with the water amount is different at different times of the year the souls in southern Arkansas or problem we're always battling that is far as making sure those highways. A state Steve you know we go out there and we repair highway we spend a lot of money and then before we know it it's supposed to last say twelve twenty years instead it doesn't last that long and part of that not only is the loads that it's getting but also because of the souls the soles are problem in south Arkansas. Thank you Representative talent you're next on the list. Thank you Mr I like statistics so I'm I'm just curious of how that has are not ever done a study on how many miles of road pre coated that was rented up from like logging communities and everything else I mean the all track that especially in like high industry areas where there's more wear and tear on the roadways and if so how many miles on the of roadway does this Arkansas and you know currently have of that. Unfortunately I do not know that that number off top of my head we do have that information we have of we know the the number of miles that we currently have posted for weight restriction and often that is due to reading concerns and because it's an indicator of a problem with the payment structure itself. I followed Mr Abu all right so my next question is this may we seem to be wanting to restrict you know weight limits on highways or not highways but on on these side roads and everything else and we restrict these weight limits especially in areas that have asphalt truck to have farming trucks to have you know logging industry and everything else it seems to me like the solution to this would not be trying to restrict the weight that industry can handle it seems to me as R. dot as as we are replacing these roads that we need to up the strings and I don't know how much costs per mile additionally it would be but to up the strength of these roads as we replace them to handle the industry and the advancement of technology to be able to promote the economy in the state of Arkansas and so I would love to hear if you all are you all have a plan to address that. Yes Sir and it. There's a there's an argument either way of course you know that you know subsidizing. Those types of things but let me tell you there is a benefit cost. Engineering is all about this terminating within the resources we have the best solution to the problem will be we want to do the best we can with the with the trucking industry we are we know how important it is to this day to our economy what we're asking though is don't keep increasing that wait can we just stop right here and let us catch up you make those rose the best they can be knowing what the what the red trucks are going to be on those roads. Yes we need to design those roads to accommodate the traffic that using those roads but at some point I need everybody to say this is enough and we're going to take that issue one money we're gonna make this a great transportation system but please just stop it eighty five thousand pounds is a lot of weight it can't get on the interstate and I would think I was talking to someone out in the hall. And I think one of the things that needs to be focused on is not allowing more weight on our secondary more fragile roads but finding some way to may allow them to be on the interstates which are much more solid roads if they add additional axles or whatever to protect that infrastructure they were just talking about that if we can get more weight what they need to carry on the interstate so it take all these tricks off of our and city streets county roads state highways and we wouldn't be paying a huge amount of money to try to subsidize when they should really be on the Interstate anyway so that's a whole different argument but to day to day. I'm just asking that you stop at eighty five thousand don't move it any further no no ninety thousand licious eighty five thousands enough for right now yeah they may be rented anyway illegally and I'll tell you all that and all that major bill Baker staff talk about that but out in the field we allow variance would you please talk about it is a bit must go ahead continue with their questions we we've got several sorry many members got question so of. Riveter you've got a represent a firm in your next earliest. Thank you Mr chairman on the bottom of page one of this handout where you said for each log truck that increases its weight by five thousand pounds because additional twenty seven percent US more stress to the pavement I'm a little confused are you saying like if three log trucks for the same road Mike that's twenty seven per truck. That's. Causing that much more stress on the road. The the information is presented is for. It for each additional for each truck that would be operating at the new ninety thousand pound weight limit so recognizing five thousand pounds is owns less than a six percent increase in the weight of the vehicle. But it has a load factor associated with that in the way that it impacts the pavements in that load factor results in the twenty seven percent increase in damage to the pavement. Those load factors are what we use in our design of the payment it determines the life expectancy of that pavement so pavement structure has when we design it it has a certain life span based on the number of loads of that it will withstand over that life. If we increase the allowable loads. The goal are going over that the vehicle loads for using up that lifespan faster. So the pavement ages faster which means we have to provide maintenance sooner in that life cycle we have to do preventive maintenance center in that life cycle we have to start doing no fill operations are we take a portion of death portion of that facility off and replace it with new material eventually we're use up the life of the pavement and as stricter tutor already mentioned we have to reconstruct or completely replace replace that pavement so these additional this increase in the weight it is not so much the concern about the weight on the tires it's the impact to the pavement itself from that from the damage of that loading. Okay I thank you. Okay next on our list represented very you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman I apologize for being late was it another committee meeting but I did it was a question I believe the vice chairman had asked one of the follow up on because I don't know if I quite got the answer plate is when represent Wardlaw was testifying but the have you all done a Commissioner build on a. Cost analysis is the vice chairman's question on exactly the impact of of the roadways with the increase in weight or compare to look that an analysis of surrounding states of what their weight limits are and any issues that they dealt with. I know we we have not done any kind of analysis like that course we'd love to have the chance to do that and what we like to look at is not just the damage that was done under the over this brief tenements ninth month period of time but look at what it would mean over the next five ten years that's when you really start seeing sent at the scene where the damage is going to be it's not going to happen overnight it's going to happen over time so what we need what we love to do is do such an analysis and we have you know we have looked at other states of having googling the heck out of this since it it It surfaced last not last week but the week before and does some states have done an analysis to show it by increasing the weight to ninety thousand on there some of their trucks it increases the damage to the pavement and it costs the state the taxpayer's additional seventy eight million dollars a year well that's a whole different state a whole different set of of you know factors that they're considering so I'd like to do that for on state but just in general based on the American Association for state highway and transportation officials was what which is what we use when we design pavements that twenty seven percent additional pounding on the pavement per truck that reduces the life you know that that's just based on the whole the whole and. All the data across the nation is part of that that analysis but I'd like to do one just for Arkansas and our to our souls are expensive support souls down south Arkansas that that plays into it the freeze thaw. You think we the we've got problems now you just wait for a few minutes when this freestyle we just went through those payments were going to have a crop of pot holes it's going to rival your row crops five four hundred so just get ready for that but you know our payments take a beating they take a beating they've got a lot against and then we have to spend a lot of money to keep them up and so anyway hope of ads thank you Mr just quick follow up please we have the following Commissioner the so we focused a lot on south Arkansas in the trucking industry may tell you that there's a lot of trucking logging up in my district highway twenty three going to the big trail and you know the terrain in the the foundation for those roads are quite a bit different up north and I remember we had a road collapse I we twenty three collapsed some years back I don't know if you remember that the one's of been around and had a tremendous impact on on the economy just because and and trucking the the and logging in that answer because they they could move logs I've been down that road so how do you all look at the. The earth analysis in the roads and the potential for road is this additional weight gonna put those roads more at risk in the higher elevated areas such as my district. Let all that bread talk about that they have different issues. The short answer is yes it and it's for most of our soils the increase in the load is going to have a negative in field of affect on that payment structure because they were not designed for to carry ninety thousand pounds one of the other represented asked about could we design them with yes we can design them the the real question is do you to the people of Arkansas want to pay for them. you know these what we're talking about doing here exceeds the limits on interstate highways. Of we would not for not allowed to run these types laws on interstate highways that are designed at a higher standard but we're gonna run on our own state highway. were they can do even more damage you know that we have posted roads and and wait restricted bridges. Adding insult this weight to these vehicles we're going to have more posts growth or more roads that will need to be posted that's not something that we want to do but it's something that we do from an ethical standpoint two main try to maintain that infrastructure and to protect the operators of the vehicles and the other people using those roadways in those bridges but we're going to see an increase in those over time this might trigger tutor said you're not gonna see it next year you're not gonna see it the next session but over ten fifteen years we will see a definite impact from this. Okay thank. Represented Brooks your election Lewis for question. Thank you Mr chairman chair of two questions one for you Director tutor and one for the major first for you major thank you for your service to our state would certainly appreciate that particularly conscientious of safety concerns I'm an insurance agent so I hear about these things all the time in fact the crash report that you include I believe was just right outside my district I'm not far from my office was actually familiar with the actual accident my question though is do we have any data related to any additional accidents related to logging trucks after the emergency order was enacted so we've we one of our primary. Which backs on the bill is this is increasing or if it's potential for increased safety hazards on our highways so talk to me about what that looks like because now we've got a year of data on on increasing these weight limits so did that actually impact that and I'll have a follow up for you Director tutor. Okay merger entity she set up for you for you to please thank you chairman major Geoff Biggerstaff Arkansas highway police can you hear me. Okay so to answer your question no we do not have that data of the Arkansas state police we can get that data of however we don't have at this time but that that shouldn't be any problem getting that data for that time period as it pertains to logging trucks because typically we can search that filled by commodity follow up. Well that would that that include the specifications of whether the logging truck was running at over eighty five thousand pounds. Typically no of. From my experience with the log trucks once they have an accident we typically don't weigh on because are usually on their side or upside down or or the damage of that's been done to the vehicle prevented us from way and so we would know the origination weight of it correct not unless they had a low ticket and that that they're loading out in the woods and so no there there would not be. Thank you in Kerala Mr reporter so part of the. The information that you gave us in this package thank you that's that's very very detailed really appreciate that one of the states that you mention that seems really out of order in here is Missouri potentially have a weight limit of a hundred twelve thousand pounds out sounds based upon the discussion we're all having here that sounds kinda rate just to me so I would wonder again speaking back R. twenty to represent and said I'm I'm very I'm sorry stringer leave was talk about the importance of of having good data and I completely agree with her whole heartedly do we have something from Missouri that that discusses how this has impacted their roads because it would if it would seem to hundred twelve thousand pounds would just destroy everything. Definitely and when I saw that that's why there's a verifying bite because. I'll just say major Bickerstaff was trying to get me this the continuous states our neighboring states what they allow for a lot of tricks. And it was very difficult because the laws that surround our weight limits in all of our states have got all kinds of extent X. exemptions that they're very difficult so I finally I contacted my counterparts in New twenty states to get the answer the simple answer thirty would you speak in America yes sorry and now Missouri I was talking to a Senator Blake Johnson and he said he thought Missouri was eighty seven thousand pounds but based on what major bigger staff could tell from researching their website in their laws it was a hundred and twelve thousand pounds but there was a size is there a cubic size that they couldn't go over so I'm gonna let J. he did so much of this research for me so major beat Baker staff would you address Missouri please. Yes so of Missouri though what all they can get up to a hundred twelve thousand pounds however there's a couple caviar so that one is they also are governed by cubic inch and speaking with their force but personnel typically the volume there were worse or cubic yards that we're talking about rarely do they see anything over a hundred two. About a hundred two hundred three thousand pounds is about all the legal way that they can carry even though they can't get up to a hundred and twelve based on their links axle spacings and the cubic yards measured but again not to be a violation of the cubic yard is usually restricted them to about a hundred two hundred three thousand pounds if that if that makes sense. Okay thank you of next on the list represented Bryant your question. Yes Is as for the major how is the the weight tracked for logging industries that done at the point of delivery or two at way stations. So if they go travel through our way stations we will we will weigh them of at our way stations are fixed facilities we have of. Wait a motion sorters so as a come down the ramp if the system that they drive across determines that there could be possibly overweight based on the the variances we put in the computer it will push them over into the static scale lane will will weigh on a static scale and then if we write any kind of load Shia for overweight we track those by commodities so and then out on the road side it's merely of one of our patrol units see elements appear to be overweight then we will waive our portable scales. So yeah that we don't we don't go to the meal to see how much they're running or bring in a manner or anything like that is just of what well we noticed someone we're out in the field. Follow up for. So it looking at your data and then looking at my own that is through the federal website majority of states have eighty thousand pounds because of the federal weight limit that's why under I understand that but most states if not all states have exceptions for certain industries. In most states adopted extra five thousand pounds for the logging industry very few states except maybe Minnesota went up to say ninety thousand pounds what what was the thinking. When all the states or whenever. They they started adopting giving that extra five thousand but they're not going to be on five thousand do we know why that is so from my experience of being over twenty years at the department is from my experience and what we we were always taught was eighty thousand was the legal way because agricultural and forest products are loaded out in the woods and there's no way to scale those loads then they were given that five thousand pounds is really a very ants and their their allow that very ants because it's hard to tell if you're eighty or eighty one or eighty two or seventy eight and so those variances were given back many many years ago to allow and not put them under penalty for being overweight just because they were eighty one or eighty two and loading out the field. With the No what with no way to to measure that load before they left we have one more question from the committee past chairman Watson you're recognized. Question and a follow up to major Bickerstaff now see right what I have left a highway please this is actually the first time that I have been only if the MCSA as him as website since I left is a safety director you have done well little humor there you have killed you here hope it stays that way okay are let me focus just real real quickly that out then I'll be quiet used to it was the most say in the used to teach was a little BLT sandwiches bacon lettuce tomato in our world yells world now brakes lights and tires let's focus a little more expertise to that it this is not a test for you can you tell me about as far as entrada intrastate commerce as far as the The Federal motor carrier safety inspections of the officers do can you tell me about what the out of service percentages right now on the last day I had a ruinous force breaks go intrastate can you just that and then I'll explain further do you know about what it is. Mr chairman of so I don't have the break down of just strictly intrastate what at the data that I brought was particular to the logs and the woods okay the wood so I can get that data but what will that be the end so the break down on the break as Addison for that a suffice okay see here. So. Then go ahead tell you ahead of time so you could be focusing your has doubled the multi tasking what I want to see is how close it is to the a national the how to percentage windbreaks are passed a budget adjustment for five axle rig five that's already when it crosses that threshold that the considered out of adjustment Nash nationwide compared to if you have for conservatives will see if it's a close correlation that's kind of what efficient for okay so percentage wise Act Missy I can tell you the number out of service violations as it pertains to breaks okay of of the three hundred sixteen inspections were conducted on these carriers for all in the commodities that we're speaking about there's a. Three hundred and eight out of service violations as it pertains to breaks. Okay with that that should be as recent data is your did you guys are going to have correct yes this is up to February we did a. January to December I think it was the site which is pretty Colonel because she. Yes of January two thousand nineteen February twelfth of twenty one okay so I can say that continues to be a on going efforts stopping distance needless to say and No further thank you. Okay that's all the questions we have for you speaking for the bill correct man. The screen here. Okay of. Okay we have speaking against the bill Duggar one. Judge your when you. Would come their teacher Stephanie may proceed. Thank you. Of my name is Doug are when and I want to the Lonoke county judge job in the county judge for the past ten years I'm also legislative chair for the county judges association representing the county judges. And I want to thank you Mr chairman and and the committee that's here today you know this is certainly a controversial issue. But as a county judge We're tasked with the road system within the county. And far as my knowledge of of logging I also want to commend Arifjan Warlow FOR we're certainly not against logging we respect the industry they're hard working people a good taxpayers of state. And and appreciate that. On the other side of that coin we have about a hundred miles of what I call country road in in Lowell county. most logging takes place in rule Arkansas whether it be in northern Arkansas and I've talked with with our judges and and I'm speaking on behalf of them not just personally I'm speaking on behalf of the county judges. there's been a lot of information provided for you here today from the highway department and I won't bore you with going over some of the same information. But you know in one of our concerns is County judges is trying to maintain these roads on limited budgets I think that that's everybody's problem nowadays and and It's some point in time. If the the anest interstates based on the information that that the highway apartment for added today