ALC-Charitable, Penal, and Correctional Institutions

Jennifer is that they are recognized. Okay. Sullivan grow secretary corrections. Xtrafinder rector division of corrections. Jerry Bradshaw director of division of community corrections. Members the. If that afternoon missed Mr members of the soap Committee first of all want to thank you all for the opportunity to address all this afternoon nothing. These conversation tions are are are important as we collectively work to move our corrections system forward my comments are going to be limited to the slide deck that will was presented to staff and is on the screens in front of you summarizing the impact of the pandemic on our popular. Population in some specific numbers related to COVID cases and outcomes within our facilities and then we'll be happy to answer any questions from any member of the committee. Right to a since the beginning of the pandemic we have had 13000 300 38 of offenders test positive for COVID 19 as all of you are well aware individuals can test positive multiple times and we have seen that to be a case you'll notice that we really divide the pandemic in 2 halves of first from the end of March 20 through the with the fall of 2020 and then the period since that time where you have seen a precipitous a brew of representatives the Klein that has been sustained in our case counts of prior to the McCollum very it that we've all seen what that has done to our case counts throughout the state we peaked at 500 $0.94 the fall of 2020. Regarding hospitalizations of we have had 239 inmates in residence in inmates excuse me hospitalize due to COVID 19 or who have test positive due to COVID 19 we went a period of January 21 through December of 21 without having any hospitalizations our recent hospitalizations were actually individuals who tested positive for covid after they were transported out for a medical appointment and were not hospitalized due to their COVID infection. Deaths related to COVID have totaled 52 we have not had a in may die of whose death has been attributed to COVID 19 since January of 2021. We begin vaccinating against COVID 19 in March of 2021 you'll note on the slide deck that a a right at 100 inmates were vaccinated prior to that point those individuals were vaccinated through our work release program their employer is who was responsible for their vaccinations the 2 points you see there are when we initially began our vaccines in March of 21 and then when we rolled out our booster program in November of 21 to date we have administered 20 2000 total vaccinations within the Department across both of our divisions. Of the remainder of this lad death reflects our population during the period of time of the COVID 19 pandemic of regarding the in house population within the Division of correction which is our state prison system you'll see a a low point in January of 21 rebounding says since then remaining relatively constant as we have continued to bring in new intakes through the department currently we're at about 14400 within the Division of correction. Within the division of community corrections residential centers we have been relatively constant throughout the pandemic low water mark of 966 we're currently at 1000 24 offenders within the division of community corrections. Our parole case load has steadily the declined since 2021 as as we have seen a decrease in the rate of releases to parole supervision currently we're at 20 4000 213 individuals on parole supervision as of January 15. Regarding probation intakes we uh seen a slight rebound in our probation caseload numbers we have not yet reached the numbers we were at at the start of the Kobe 19 pandemic currently we're at 34730 of probe probation case load obviously is driven by new when takes from the court and also revocations of probation is by the courts. Regarding the county jail backup C. of a bit of a see saw here we are at a only afford to within our county jail backup population currently at 20 200 51 low water mark 500 79 in may of 2020. Regarding the back up for the division of community corrections low water mark of 21 in may of 20 up 275 now will know as opposed to the Division of correction where we do not have excess capacity we we do have available capacity within the Division of community correction unfortunately due to our quarantine protocols we are at all of our centers right now currently on a a lot does that is due to COVID quarantines and isolations we'll be able to address most of that back up next week as many of those facilities complete their quarantine and isolation periods. Of these last 2 slides some someone summarize emissions and releases by moss in our respective divisions darker lines are the numbers coming in the ladder bars are the number of individuals being released by those respective divisions during the period of the COVID 19 pandemic. Mr chairman Bruce do that fairly quick but I'll be happy to answer any questions regarding our pop populations or any other questions please hold on for your question members let me let the record paying and and the rector brush up in itself if you have that much to add on to that the event will take all questions one time. The record fine. Yes Sir Mr chairman of that that's all I it all right this is the combined report okay read Russia a yes Sir chairman currently the case loads information pro you saw the drops in parole they've remained relatively steady because of that the current a regular case load and regular probation parole with vacancies is about 92 to one I will point out that of the 32000 individuals on active supervision about 15000 them or minimum risk offenders and we've been trying to do some things during the past through the pandemic to see them. Virtually and things of that nature so it's not down the workload of the officers that is made that better in our. Drug courts the average case load for just drug court offenders is 21 to 1 but we also give those court officers regular cases as well an additional 41 to 1 so they're running about 611 in specialty court's grant of do you know what area of what region that you got a big off case load than other other regional quest that top bottom. A yes Sir in area one which is the northwest Arkansas it seems to be growing the fastest that's where our largest case load in the biggest growth this year Senate Johnson you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman of. First of all thank you gentlemen for coming. My questions are and I'll address into Secretary graves yes Sir Sullivan I'm not picking on you I'm picking on what's going on in the State of Arkansas that you're as we have that joke about things run down hill and I know you're there having to deal with and I this is not anything about you or your subordinates in the department but. I was it was pointed out to me actually had conversation with lieutenant governor who is visiting with the sheriff in a large county in the state about what we're we're going to build a new jail we need to build a new jail marked ask people for some of the tax bill jail and so let's go to ask you how many states in writing so you have seen as you will read at almost 200. Ms Sherri thinking. We have shifted the burden in inflation that case and probably a lot of others you could probably tell me more about it than than I would. Of the state of Arkansas has shifted responsibility for these people who are convicted and are essentially should be an apartment corrections to our our local governments and and believe me I I'm you know I'm not alone in this room of hearing from our our county judges are sure to point out to me that the reimbursement rate. Doesn't cover the actual cost of housing those inmates in that particular County and I know that may be a variable because it costs more in one place to another but my question to you has to do with are we just supposed to bop along here and just try to meet you sometimes I look at your job as the the guy that was on the ad Sullivan show that was spent in the plates on the sticks you member and he had to move around and you just keep all spending and you've really done a good job I think of just keep him spending but I'm asking myself is this our future do we have to continue to do that are there some things that we can do to solve this problem in the lieutenant governor's already said he's coming out for basically starting to do what the feds do on on truth in sentencing and we're not gonna have the parole like we've had in Arkansas we need to seriously keep people locked up for 85 percent of their at least of their their sentence and that's obviously going to necessitate more tales based more money spent but it's not like we're not spending it we're spending it to the counties we're spending it on you know offenders that probably should still be locked up but they've for number reasons are out they've been paroled you guys are crowding issues COVID is complicated that staffing problems that you could could tell me and I want you to tell me more but have complicated that. How long can we keep those plates spending I know that's a metaphor but could you address that from a standpoint of is this what we're stuck with it for eternity or is there at least a general direction that we in the General Assembly could do to move in the direction of a fixing this law. US senator Johnson thank you for the question I'll begin my answer by saying emphatically before this subcommittee we need additional capacity within our state system. Now as and this is a conversation that our leadership team is happy with our board as had with our governor and they all agree we need additional capacity within the system now capacity is more than just build the the first piece of this puzzle is we've got to right size our utilization of our community correction Division this is not a COVID problem this is been a problem that is been exacerbated by the pandemic but we have individuals who are eligible to go to a community correction center those beds depending on what track of programming they go into can turn over as fast as every 6 months those individuals are going to the Division of correction one again thing with representative Dalby for working with us on legislation that gives us a mechanism it ministration of Li to right size that population we have promulgated the rules for that those rules are out for public comment through the early part of February and depending on if how rules meets during the fiscal session the rules implementing that program should be finalized by March no later than April and will begin the process of screening individuals for administratively transfer administrative transfer back to the community correction Division we have about 600 right at 700 inmates right now when the Division of correction that could be screened for community correction placement now all of those individuals will be able to leave the extra gold chair but even if we word to look at 250 or 300 of those that makes a real impact on direct direct pains population and allows us to utilize the capacity that we're funded for within the Division of community correction. AS challans number one that's issue number one we've got to fix. Issue number 2 is you know and this is a on going conversation that direct brats on our our having along with our board and that is what does our transitional housing and reentry capacity in the state look like and what can we do as a system to support the growth of transitional housing and reentry centers in the state because that those 2 programs provide additional capacity by allowing us to get eligible individuals into community based housing the third piece of it is going to have to be the exploration of additional hard baits construction within the Division of correction we've begun having that conversation we're not at a point of finalizing a plan I expect there will be more conversations around that point of regarding a specific direction when when a correction meets on February 3 but we will have to have a conversation about construction but construction if everything works and you all give me all the money I ask for whenever we get to that point we're still talking about a 2 year long process from when we start turning dirt to when we can open the doors so we got a look at some things administratively that we can do within the department of the final thing is a conversation that we are also having and that is looking at our release mechanisms and are we moving as efficiently as we can to release individuals. Who are who are eligible who the parole board has said they've been to their program and they have been successfully rehabilitated we don't consider them to be a threat to the public so we're going to sign off on their parole are we doing everything we could as quickly as we could to get those individuals out on time as opposed to delaying that of process do due to administrative actions within the department it's a comprehensive solution and it is a solution we will continue to look at in parts and continue to implement in parts but without question soon Senator we need additional capacity but that is more than just our construction you quick follow up I could Mr chairman all right. Would you say Mr secretary that the the greater challenge obviously capital expense is a big thing and and we don't we know we need to do it the how and and why and where is important but the personnel issue which you've had actually had to deal with more we can talk about covid related that can certainly that's affect how much greater is is it as far as a challenger your some of your numbers look good as far as keeping things under control with COVID and and you know very very few deaths I mean they're all tragic button you've you've you've kind of kept it under control from the the early days of how much more important is the the personnel side of the shortage then the bachelor. Per S. per person there has been a challenge that has been exacerbated during the pandemic we had fallen behind in terms of competitiveness within the job market in general but within the law enforcement community specifically I am grateful to the support from the Legislative Council last month along with our board and OPM in the governor's office for approving our salary grid that we've been able to implement that has even already been a game changer for us because we're getting applicants now and that's in back of her simple thing but if we had had this conversation 2 months ago I would get applicants the Department wide across both our divisions we we were getting 40 correctional officer applications a week since we implemented that salary greed and word is gotten out through social media and and and what about word of mouth and the press since December we hat we spiked up to 298 applications one week of the sense that greed was implemented we haven't had less than 153 applicants for correctional officer positions were also seen a similar not the same volume but fortunately an upward tick in our parole and probation officer application since 2 so we're hopeful that we're turning the corner now that we are able to implement a competitive compensation structure as as I said last month before the personnel sub committee that gets us to where we need to be today modernizing law enforcement compensation as all of you aware has to be a long term conversation of this of this state in order to maintain the public safety by having a fully staffed with criminal justice system. Thank you for your answers Mr secretary gentleman thank you Mr yes Sir thank you Mr secretary remember our conversation. You're recognized. All. My questions are by law of conversation so we might. I. I'll just I'll pull that off for you this now I am I just said I I I hope my questions are not impacted by US private conversation so you have a list of those who got a hole that for whatever okay. That's what I figure that's why I ask well I'll go with my main 2 questions and if I get a chance come back if you're nice enough to be Mr will for the for the jail that was built in conjunction with the ADC in. Drew County Bradley County that have what's the status of that that project has not come on line yet they are still engaging in conversation is only about the financing op operations of the facility and when it does come online the the projected number of folks that will be under the auspices of ADC or how many of right at 400. Okay. And for. The need to build Biltmore 9 that's always a big thing because I don't I can't. I think it's pretty general knowledge that but when you build it you just feel it and then we need some more I don't mean you personally that's just what happens what I would suggest to me there must be something else going on much further back down the line because when we don't address things. In the public arena we just bring them to 80 CNC the FX. And so I'm wondering if you look at the growth that we have now or if there's been a spike in growth in certain areas. Is there a pattern of the kind of crimes that or of feeling beds more quickly than anything else if so do you know what that is we actually have a consultant that is been engaged by the state for the last 20 years that does population projections Morrison about a conversation tion with staff and the chairs of indicated at a future meeting they want to hear from our of our population project consultant. If we had had this conversation 7 and half years ago we were growing at 3 percent mmhm through partnerships with the legislature and and through the administration we've slow that growth to a person point 5. But growth is still growth as this as as population grows we are colleges the system has to keep up with it and that's where we are we've got to address population H. shin growth which is if we don't do anything else is going to necessitate additional capacity specific to your question in this is detailed in our population in our work most recent report from our consultant our population is being driven by of violent crimes. In a particular homicides batteries. And and the and I'll just try to get this clarification is there somebody. Who can look at it is looking that way why is that the case that we have so many of those kinds of crimes 2 weeks because I I don't expect that you guys going to do that there's somebody out there who can give us something to do before we get to you guys and I know they're bad people. But there's a reason this is happening at and and I just think we don't go back far enough in yeah a. Thank you just Senate right there you know the going back we're at the part of the system where we're dealing with the end result of of our criminal justice system and and and dealing with the state of our society today and unfortunately in his are to turn on the news most days and not see a violent crime in a community and those individuals will end up in our care for 101520 years and we need to not just have capacity but the appropriate type of capacity to handle that problem was with my question served on many interesting but I can feel left center field in St hurry up. You might when I'm getting at not do you do it I understand when it gets to where you are the but do you know if there's any field of study or if anybody is. Second look at that what's the impetus for the commission of all these kinds of crimes it's easy to say that is is something bad let's lock him up that's what things you know we keep building and building and building I'm trying to think about a way of what do we need to be addressed and before they get to you because otherwise we're gonna have unit position just needing beds beds beds all the time so I'm just asking do you know if there is any not that you have to do it because that's not your job if there's any kind of study or any kind of group that looks at that kind of thing because it is quite possible there are things we can do as a legislature just like we trying to do with what's 2009 I think we had a big change. And what we see not to do that so. I'm sure there is there is not a group that I mean come on but I'm sure there were there is one out. Okay all right thanks messages thank you culture filter thank you Mr chairman I appreciate that. Sullivan I don't I don't know how old you are no no well right you you and I've lived almost as long Senator Elliot she knows I'll have to. In your in your lifetime have you ever seen. Not only. State but in in the country at a disregard for human life. Like we're seeing now in this country that we just witnessed over the weekend 5 police officers for murder. 4 police officers just as past weekend 300 and some police officers killed this year. Have you in your lifetime seen such a disregard for human life like we're seeing now in the United States of America the the growing violent violent crime rates specific in this community as a as a community as us as a state is probably the most challenging I've seen in my career and from my current role it it gives me pause because we have to we have to have a system that is appropriate to the House the type of individuals that are coming coming into our care custody hi this is this takes me back to the question. I was going to ask you a few minutes ago you you mentioned that the that the COVID was not responsible for what we're seeing now in the state regard to to the crime but. It has exacerbated it thank those were your words what do you mean what do you mean by a COVID has exacerbated the problem some specific to staffing of. The. Congregate settings by their very nature are high risk locations when it comes to managing the pandemic and under understandably there are individuals who that Kong working in that congregate setting gives them pause and that is why it is been so important to myself into our division directors our entire leadership that we had a compensation structure that reflects the unique challenges that are uniformed staff whether working in a facility or work working in the community are facing today as a result of covid but engine in general because of the nature of of the work that we do. Would you agree and I talked a lot of law enforcement officers would you agree that our jails many of our jails have become nothing more than revolving doors for criminals who passed through. It in their home before the officer gets report filled out by your group with that of with that specific term term terminology no Sir I would but I would I would say that we do have a problem going back to having the ability to right size our population we need we know we have in a certain segment of our population that we need to have a secure bid for we need to be able to hold them without feeling feeling those pressures of their behaviors and that is why we will we will be in a position to continue to move forward to increasing the capacity of our system so we can focus on those higher is violent offenders that give all to give the 3 of us pause and give all of you pause. Are you said you had 52 DS Chris yes Sir total debt to the covered. All those were directly attributed to covid no Corning comorbidities involved in any of those this at all they were there they were attributed to covid by the corner health professionals some of a copy of the death certificate we do have access to the death certificates do you read those death certificates are I don't post personally obviously are medical staff for the eagles well the reason I ask is that is is committee the death certificates and I've talked a lot of people have lost a loved one who may be they claim that died of a heart attack or stroke or something else and they got a death certificate that had COVID related on the death certificate I'm just curious as to how many of those death certificates the 2 presidents have received that have COVID related. Because that could that could mean a number of things we can go back in and how how how of our medical staff I would like I would like to see that numbers yes exactly how many of those how many did you mention how many parolees. We have now. Right. It is what is our county jails. Right now it's we have 24213 parolees on active supervision and mentoring county jails. All these are individuals on a active case little being supervised by by officer the number of offenders we have backed up in the county's dress that's what I want that number is 2200. 2200 yes Sir throw leasing county jail not necessarily some of some of those may be parole violators coming coming back but the large number of those are new commitments. In individuals who are receiving letters of large number of it is being the high as we have been in over a year it certainly leading to overcrowding in county jails would you Sir I was I was we spend our Sunday with the sheriff's association now about our. Can a county jail backup population and we all agree that the county jail backup is growing at a what what will be a continue to be a challenging rate for all partners in the county jails to direct Bradshaw's credit he is looking at ways to bring in some of that a pipe population into his excess beds we are with the new quarantine timelines that have come down from the CDC where we're able to to hopefully turn over a quarantine bits quicker so we are in a position moving forward to bring in individuals that more of the steady steady clip at the Division of correction but yes I would agree that our back up is is posing a challenge for unsustainable number correct. We cannot continue to stay in that number I'm I'm going to deferred to the shares as to what they can sustain I will tell you from my perspective it is it is a challenge that we need to address how many more best we need. Based in the community corrections within the Division of community correction we feel comfortable with our capacity now and right at 1700 to meet the need but we've got to be able to get that population over into those beds and we're working to do do that based on our consultants population projections if we don't do anything different by 2031 our population within the Division of correction commonly referred to as a DC is going to be 19000 160 so so will the additional White River to be independent council best those will be sufficient to those those beds are going into our community correction division to increase capacity with our short term revocation program which is going to give give the share some relief when those come online we expect probably about a year point 5 out with the construction. This this this provision and jails are they getting treatment the it is on the county of some some counties do have treatment options for detainees in their jails and some and some do not. Her thank you Mr thank you of the R.. Thank you Mr chair of first I want to thank you for the consistency of the the bar graphs it makes it especially when many of these the the statistics actually have in a relationship and help city. Be easier for us to be able to track that having said that I was looking at the the code numbers and the spike that you had it seem to correspond and I know that there are always a lot of different moving parts but it seem to correspond with a dip of it shows that it's a lot larger dip but really in terms of numbers it's not but a dip in the in house population in the spring of 2020 and so started looking to some of the other charge to find out where of those prisoners may have been got going and I saw that there was a dramatic difference between releases and intec. What's that more in relation to there's also an increasing County population state prisoners in county population was that more due to a suspension of jury trials in the courts in terms of fully adjudicating some of those state cases and then there being a reciprocal increasing County population is obviously what someone is still being tried even though it may be on a state crime they're going to be in the county the county lock up rather than being sent to state prison in back to court or those the 2 into relationships there so if if you're for or to was on slide 11 admissions and releases yes so in the dip you see in admissions and releases beginning in June continuing through August 20. During that point we had a spike in COVID cases at the Ouachita River unit which is our intake facility for the Division of correction as a result we didn't bring anyone into Washita 4 probably about half of June through August of 20 so that's why you see a very unbalanced drop in the number of admissions because our intake facility was completely quarantine under happier now because I I noticed that there's really not I mean even though it it does rise and fall there's not a significant difference from month to month on releases so it's not as if I mean someone could look at and go will have many prisoners were we releasing early because of code it's not that it correct you are our release numbers were as as you will know that yes pretty contrived somewhat but they've been fairly consistent throughout the period of time okay the other question I had in this is really and I know you your operation is different from county jails but I I was just privy to a conversation recently where the the Pulaski County sheriff is frustrated because of their vending machine profits commissary profits are supposed to go directly to their ability to make improvements in the jail but in his situation he's having to go to the county judge to get permission for his money and it's not and and they've got a problem with locks not working do you have complete control over those kinds of revenues I mean it not having to go the money goes to the state and then you've got to go ask permission to access that money to make improvements may not even be and locks it maybe just in terms of maintaining of prisoner of morale and welfare do you have direct access to those figures. To that or not both divisions have restricted special revenue funds that their commissary proceeds go into in the division of correction and in the division of community correction those funds are restricted to as you as you said go toward the welfare of the offender populations and facility upkeep okay and that includes I know that there was an issue several years back about the contracts on phone calls the cost of phone calls and the money that is generated from that and there's been some controversy about prisoners feeling like they were being disproportionately charged for that and there was a spike in profits on that we're we're we on that issue and also to those monies also stay so that they're in a fund that can be used for prisoner welfare in the division of community correction the yes those telephone pros proceeds going to the residential server Services Fund in the division of correction they go into what's called a nonrevenue receipts cash fund which is used to support facility operations but it's a little bit more flicks the ball in terms of what it may be used for that fund is also used to make room make construction fund construction projects within the Division also allows Director pain to purchase emergency equipment with within its division also allows us to support of technological upgrades within the division okay all right thank you very much thank you Mr thank you. Senator Rapert you're recognized. Thank you Mr Mister durian do. Always try to tell you Richey junior staff all the the things Joe deal with and do a great job we're glad that we were able to get some want to take some. Sure off in addressing a little bit of my colleague Senator A. it's question in there are we able to. Act really segregate the the ballot. Minerals in the. The. I will say petty thieves through the department now still with COVID are we able to to. Try to not make hardened criminals out of some that come in that not so much and let me let me go and give the rest this weren't going because the question was asked what can we do and what causing this what's the symptoms and I'm going to give you a little bit of a day on it's not something that that you're responsible for but something you're dealing with. Not for last the first time ever we had somebody get around our security locks in a warehouse carried a couple $0 worth of merchandise out across parking lot put it behind a dumpster I guess they can these will come back get it. Mr Munson's book tomorrow we got a call next morning what's the stuff that out here. It's I have never in my life I'm I'm 67. I've been in retail all my life I've never seen. The number of young people walking the streets. Some sleeping in the day coming out only at night we're having in our county and I'm not I'm here and all over. Are breaking in cars breaking in businesses if you leave it and it's not a lot but I am it's going there is no fear. I wanna make sure we we've got would you say 400 beds nous New South Arkansas facility if if their project is able to come online yes Sir but that that would be considered a minimum to medium security population may we are seeing a slide down hill in in our society we know that but if we if we're not able and I. I don't lock everybody up I'd like reform people that we can reform but until there are until they have respect or fear they're not going to do that do you have integration with this new coming on may have coming online. Are you gonna be able to staff up. Intake something if the judicial system would do what they need to be doing and we get out from some this call would scare the judgment I understand. And get our system back because. It's getting worse day by day I again I've never seen a lack in our county and our guys are trying but but they can't they can't seem to get a handle on it in the. I'm for sending you some more business and will try to help you. But we but tell us what. We need if we're not doing some things right. Is is do we need to broaden community correction for some of this stuff before they get to be a hardened criminal or or give me just a quick bill I don't I yep all. To the first question the. Proposals that Director pain is preparing for a myself and the board will will meet the need of the type of population we're saying coming into the system. For for the to answer your first question the second part of your question we're at a good point with community correction population especially when we're able to close on the purchase of that fateful property because that's going to bring another hundred and 50 bets online for direct branch all to use in the immediate short term as a short term revocation center but you to give him some flakes X. ability that if he needs to convert that to a community correction center as that population grows in the future if you get a give him a flexible location our our our focus is is going to have to be catching up in the in the Division of correction you know we've been able to get good support from our board and and from the governor's office about moving forward with those conversations and I expect that we will be and be in a position to discuss a proposal that a part of this year. Thank you thank you Mr thank you. Represent him. Thank you Mr chairman of secretary Sullivan I want to say first off I don't know anything about prisons I don't wanna know anything about him I have claustrophobia and I just the fear of even going in the door scares me to death. Of but the. From what I've heard day you thank you 82230 500 new pants by the end by 2031 is that what you said. If we don't do anything different. Our consultant and and I always like to of frame this answer by saying that if we don't do anything different as a state. By the end of this 10 year period we will will grow our popular popular our in house population by over 3000 okay. All right and and there's you can't there's no way you can convert a minimum or medium security facility into a maximum security that's not is that not feasible no one has you can go down which can go okay and and that's and and that's the challenge when it comes to construction the common misnomer is that if you build a facility with single or double man sales you have to operate that as a maximum security facility that's not true you can operate a sale based construction as a general population minimum medium security housing structure but what that sale based housing structure allows you to do is as our population does harden it's a matter of converting doors. It is the extent is the extent of the internal physical plant you need to address their may be some external things you need to look at in terms of fencing and recreational yards but the most expensive piece of the construction is already done okay all right of. Now this to can we go back to the the state prisons that the county jails have now I think about the verse in the Bible courses the Porsche be with you always and and ever since I've been over here which is I have several years of we've always had this put this problem of the counties take care the provisions for the state and I don't think that's going to change in the long run it hadn't changed in the time I've been here but the is there any plan that that might get reduced for a bit or else increase the payment to the county jails to actually what it calls and we keep the state prisoners so second part of your question the department of correction is the disbursing officer for the county jail reimbursement we don't stay at the reimbursement rate that is that decision is made by the governor and the CFO of the State based on the availability of funds in terms of reducing the county jail backup capacity that's going to you know one dependable on what is the load coming in from the court but also what is the capacity that we can generate within the system and as I said on the front end that capacity is not necessarily related to construction that capacity can be achieved through policy an op op operational adjustments okay all right thank you very much thank you Mr chairman thank you how much they will come to the county jail. How much will county jail Branscum all we are caught up with payments will not affect if we're if there is a doctor. Well sure we if if we owe them anything I don't think I would have got I got out there but we're caught up on payments that has been on a priority of of of our fiscal staff to make sure we stay all right thank you thank you thank you senator Hammer senator Hammer. All right. Thank this medium that's it thank you Mr okay thank you Mr your consultant that you have hired do they do a cost analysis of. The cost to build a standalone prison versus raising the reimbursement rate to the county to see if that's the more efficient route to go. Knows his or they they don't look at cost they just look at overall overall population. And so what's the purpose of the consultant are they advising you and policy then or what is our role there though role of JFA is to give the board of corrections an objective look on the needs of the corrections system whether that us in terms of managing our secured population or supervising individuals on parole and probation supervision. So when it comes to policy that is going to turn that number down 10 years out are they looking at best practices across the nation and and when we talk about turning that number down. Are they advising used to what we need to be aware of that they have been active in those types of conversations with the board and leadership and department leadership in the past and we've done a lot of that over over over the last decade we've done things like revising our up roles to supervision guidelines to take an evidence based approach to how we address violations of conditions of supervision we we've had those conversations within the department about priority of being in a position to prioritize our heart present bids for individuals who are committing crimes prioritizing community correction say shin beds for those that committed code violations that's what I said in response as soon Senator Elliot we slow the growth but. The growth is going to be an ever present part of our system that we have to address okay shifting gears for their subject I want to commend you all because when it comes to work release thank you adapted your policy not to shut it down and let the work release population go out into the community and for industrija Meyer that that's a huge thing and so I appreciate you just in the policy when it when it comes to the availability of the population is in jail and I think I left word and I just wanna get your initial reaction we've got construction projects going on and they're starving for labor the the limitations of being able to use workrelease population in a mobile work environment are those dictated by the Department those dictated by the feds or what are the regulations that prohibit being able to let the inmate population be able to work in the work force if it involved mobility. All all all of the direct direct pain talked about the work release program Janet generally what we want is a secured work site where we're able to maintain knowledge of where those offenders are or should be added at any given time but. Senate member of yes Sir it any at any given time select secure Gracie we would like to know where the fenders are it is a risk of course if you if you of placing the fender somewhere mobile work site they want me to be all day long and and and working in a is that may involve every traffic high traffic areas that that is a risk for our friend a population okay we'll talk a plan less less subject used to farm give a ship date whichever one you all want to give us the update because I know that that is funded a portion I think a general revenue what what's the status of the financial outcome of the farming operation this year what should we expect going into the fiscal session. Okay. Senate issue I think the farm is going better than it has done in previous years we've of not even borrowed over $2000000 of that 5.6000000 that we normally get every year so and I don't I don't foresee us having to borrow anymore the rest of the year the farm the pharmacist is doing fairly will at this time I know you got a new manager and hopefully at that AS help make a difference I have show years ago DO get access to the unused portion or you only get to use the portion that you actually need I forgot what. If you have your own 5 and you don't get the balance if you don't need for the farm yet the 5.68 we don't draw down the 5.60 stays in the revenue stabilization trust law. Okay thanks thank you Mr thank you rather the opposite. Thank you and thank you Mr chair for allowing me to be a part of this committee is the chair of judiciary I do want to commend this group they come to our committee often times and we're very familiar with a lot of the programs that they're doing and I I I just want to commend them on the programs of what they're doing with in the prison system itself of within community corrections of trying to rehabilitate now and I think that would be an important discussion in a program a presentation at some point in time I really didn't have a specific question other than it's kind of what don't you agree kind of of the question. The answer to all of this is a multi faceted puzzle really and truly all right correct. It is worth it you know it it we it's easy to point at it and I've been on the judiciary I have put people in prison so I understand that I've also on a Friday afternoon gone through the jail list in the county jail and figured out who the lead out for the weekend because we're now overcrowded and who do we let out so we we have all of that it it it it starts I think a lot earlier than it when we finally get to someone standing in a court room or someone having to have been arrested and I had this discussion yesterday after a meeting at the shares conference that. Our specialty court's can help because he often times those who are committing murder are similar hideous crime that's usually not their first crime is not their first trip to the rodeo and if we can stop some of that that may take some of it we have an education P. shall we're doing a great job with that. It is my understanding when you appeared before the committee we can't just always take the position walking up and throw away the key because that creates inmate problems of when the inmate see no hope of a cure it or no hope of getting out and doesn't that create problems within your system we've. Is that right yes and so is so I guess my point in my question is do we as Legislative wars. And I hate to ever form a task force that come together as a group of a multi level so that we can look at. The education piece the judicial piece as to what the court can do on the Friday and to keep them from being in the pipeline whether it's in the juvenile juvenile arena because we know a lot of times that so. Routing ground in my experience you know where they come together steaming you look at someone's packet before they've had a ton of juvenile thing so to look at that we've done some things on the juvenile front but to kind of build on that I think we all agree that there is a need for extra bids that we can't continue. To House everybody we've got to figure out what we can do to keep the most violent offenders out in to help those who can and I guess my question to you would you be willing to try to put together a multi agency group a working group to see what we can do to address so those of us who are policy makers will understand at no what to do is to do we need to beef up this program in juvenile do we need to be beef this up in the judicial system what do we need to help you in your education and rehabilitation system and then. Also what can we do for those who are then tasked with supervising for those who are released and do you see that as a valuable approach to helping you in the problem that you now have yes yes ma'am without a doubt as listed on our front end capacity is more than just building programming is a definite part of that and I and I would I'll be excited to participate in a conversation that allows us to highlight the work we have been doing about closing that gap between the juvenile justice system and the adult side to talk about the reforms we've made within our school district over especially around career technical education and providing individuals a marketable skill within this 20 first century economy. All right thank you representative clout. Very yes that's right thank you thank you Mr chairman and Special take my question not being a member of the committee and secretary Grays and director pain and direct batch all thank you for your outstanding service appreciate everything it's all doing very difficult environment my question is right my background of course dealt a lot with long range strategic planning and unfortunately I see us and state government that many times our long range planning is one legislative session to the next and you know when I look at long range strategic planning I look at the 25 to 30 year planned so my concern is just like we see it already in the crime lab we've outgrown that facility over there we're seeing it in the law enforcement were seen at the in the cities and the counties in our communities when it comes to the safety and security of by the citizens of Arkansas but has there ever been a long range ka comprehensive long range strategic study of the correctional system in the state of Arkansas and it and and it has to be comprehensive right when I talk about that it's is not only facilities beds but it also takes into consideration the rehabilitation piece of technology aging inmates the more we throw in jail for life sentences then we're going to start having issues and and providing for the needs of our our ageing of prisoners but has there ever been a long range comprehensive strategic plan for the future of correctional system in the state of Arkansas you know if if there is I'd I'd love to be able to see that. We are anxious us as we in the midst of that effort now last year I with bill Board approval or entered into a 5 year contract with the universe of Arkansas at Little Rock School of criminal justice to conduct that planned that not just looks that at a very micro level how many people does it do Sullivan dexter Jerry have a day and how many will they have tomorrow but also is comprehensively looking at our programming across all of our divisions looking at our interactions with our stakeholders are of families the impact that that has on recidivism look looks at the structure of our school district and how does that impact recidivism so we are we'll get the first iteration of that report later this summer and then receive success of reports through the end of end of that agreement okay and so I think we we just like to say we see it already with the the crime lab that I know director Brad shot so he has to have capacity in order to take care of those inmates that are released into the into his care and and really I think he has a I need right now for greater capacity and I community corrections so when when we again we look at all in a plan I hope that we consider of where the state of Arkansas is going to be in 30 years so we as a legislative body can me help you make sure that we meet those needs because really have a concern more more for those violent inmates that you have their own life sentences and then it's going to get to the point where we have to care for them as elder inmates and so anyway that's the common I have in a one last thing your paws in prison program which is from. This program that you all have and it's great in for rehabilitation of your inmates it's great for that You main society and so forth so at are you all extent expanding that program process adopted a pause and all I was is Chris my son's Christmas gift last year but we did expand that program last fall to the women's unit in Newport excited about that partnership and with the rescue out of the out of Independence County that's working with us there good deal thank you Mr chairman and thank you again secretary graves for you and a Director painted director Brad Shaw FOR a a tremendous job in a in a extremely difficult environment I really appreciate all to do thank you. There will wind it down of my culture let me see it so you're recognized. Records. Thank you Mr chair I I I think that probably there other legislators who got an email from several people with several questions about what's happening now be a code that and several other things and I don't I just wonder if you got anything like that kind of in a mass email from several people with several questions about what's going on now. I received the email from couple members over the weekend that just asked about. Our quarantine structure and where we following public health recommendations and things of those if the lines of that what you're referring to. I get I think it is because it's it's along those lines and there's some other questions as well and I just want my I'm just curious about what kind of response we can up to them I don't know how to answer a law it should I send this to some. Forward it to me I will okay we'll take care of getting getting the constituent response okay so we can get an answer and I in my last thing is I I do want to just really agree with what representative Dalby said and and representative berry talked about because as long as I've been here I have lost the battle on getting us to look at our systems not in isolation but connected and think about something said a north star for what we want to be and what we want to do and work toward that as we have to serve all the systems operate separately and we've done that and look how successful that's not been so I really do think and I appreciate your the study that you have been done now because we can't fix this problem by every time just we'll we'll have the Education Committee down here where I have you know the justice system down here that's just not and we and we think it's going to work on it got to do is look at where we are now see no that's not working so and I know that there a lot of people in the public who care about this who really not just to complain but they really do want to be a part of of of helping and I talked to a group just yesterday and this was the same may well and they're just regular people who want us to do something and not just keep building prisons not to say okay we'll take it over here take and then nothing ever comes together they may be deviated beat up each other all right so thank you and I appreciate it also good good way to close reforming our system increasing capacity is more than just building it is programmatic be cities that human element that we ought always all hold side of. Thanks service. Slash 4 grass one last one. She claims to rise with restaurant you know how much I appreciate the job you do because. When I think about the stress and anxiety that some of us go through here I cannot imagine what you see on a daily basis and I how you deal with so I appreciate all you do let me say something this is in reference to what major very us set by general brewery representative berry of representative Dalby it It is Centel is it concerning the multi faceted answer to a lot of these problems and I have worked in I've looked and studied and researched on this for years. Figure out what is going wrong you know what I found out that comes up most of the time. Is the number one factor that determines whether child will either end up in poverty or trouble with the law or in prison. You know what it is. Being born without a date on. Not having a father a role model at home that's the number one factor all over the world every study I've looked at. So. I'm not so I'm just saying that we need to consider that. Whatever we would look at the problems that we're having today in in regard to crime because that is a. That's the big deal I was reading the script Development a reading James was 5 groups of people that were first price for you know what the second one James said our prisoners. We must pray for priests. So thank you for being here today thank you for this information and I hope that we can find an answer this. Thank you Mr chairman thank you thank you have raised thank you for con men directed paying direct ratio back up will come in and make your testimony pressure very much members we always on.