ALC-JBC Budget Hearings

Good morning members are call the Legislative Council Joint Budget Committee. Third the meeting to order. We are Share I'm don't come with your legislative research and I'll give the agency a second to get up here and we'll get started just so everyone knows will be starting on page two hundred nine. Manuals two oh nine members. German more than about yourself that way we go right into questions when the. All right let's get through. I'm dexter Payne director for division of corrections. What Wembley of CFO or Department corrections. J. two German billionaire and secretary graves if you. Right we'll have a better recognized. Mr Mister I apologize I was multi tasking that's really my fault Sullivan gross said Terry corrections welcome glad to have you come in you're recognized thank you Mr chair so we start on page two oh nine this is the Division summary for administration shared services for the department of corrections. So starting now will look at the total agency request as you can see for fiscal year twenty four agencies requesting just under one hundred sixty seven million dollars for fiscal twenty five just over one hundred seventy two million dollars. so within the division we have to appropriations would change levels the first being the criminal detention facility of you that's located on page two hundred fourteen. So this preparation is for ensuring that review committees of hold state minimum standards and local in county jails funded through the criminal detention facility review account. Apart from the increases salary match that you can see the agency is requesting a fifteen hundred dollar increase in operating expenses and that is for laptops and data processing materials. The next change level appropriation is the department of corrections shared services paying account that's on page two hundred sixteen manuals. On top of salary matter just with the agency is requesting an increase in operating expenses appropriation just over six point six million dollars for fiscal year twenty four just under seven million dollars for fiscal year twenty five and that's for advertising training IT hardware and software and to account for reallocation from the division of corrections division of community corrections. Agencies also seeking increases in professional fees in the amount of thirteen point four million dollars for fiscal year twenty four and eighteen point five million dollars for fiscal year twenty five. This includes medical contract increases and reallocation from the division of corrections and the sentencing commission the second recommendation does provide for the agency requests but there is a difference the eight the executive recommendation has the medical contract line item separated out well the answer your questions and professional fees. Mr chairman that concludes the change levels for administration search services. Thank you senator grace you have a statement before we go to questions of the nose no service Mister will jump right in questions of any member has I have a. Smith. We have a representative Cavenaugh up for. Thank you Mr chairman all the way over to Iraq thank you all for being here my question's going to be on two eleven on county jail reimbursement does this amount that we're requesting does that I'm assuming this is the money that we pay the county jails for the prisoners at their housing thanks for an yes ma'am and this reflects the forty dollar increase of in the fiscal session one thing I hear all the time from the county jails is that they're having to pay for like their mental health that they're not getting reimbursed for that can you address that. The we will if there is an acute care situation whether it is mental health or Carty a case or something of that nature if they will contact the division we will fast track them in but otherwise as a matter of routine course the county is responsible for the cost of care and that is what the reimbursement rate is intended to offset of the county's cost of care for in individuals on the backup list. Well my understanding is if they're having to cover all that and it's a cute stuff they're having to cover the forty dollars is not going to cut it is we know that that that stuff gets expensive yes my. Can you for to us in the Committee through the staff how the county jails would be asked beg to requests that fast track sure so that we can be sure let all of our county judges now will get the ticket okay thank you. Thank you if you will Senate staff of reviewing you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman on the on the county jail situation. What does it cost us at the state level sixty five seventy dollars our our current per day rate in the Division of correction is sixty eight dollars and fifty one cents so what such a drastic difference I'm here I understand that you provide some services but forty forty of forty two dollars less of the I mean it's it's cost White County three hundred thousand dollars to take care of the state's problems. So we got to do something I mean are you all go away are you know they ask for anymore increase for the county jails increases and county jail reimbursement rates have traditionally been handled at the ministry's center level through the governor's balance balanced budget proposal and to be up in a that is traditionally not been a process that the department is responsible and we only act as the disperse or once the rate has been set well don't you think though the the the you're responsible for president prisoner care and their prisoners and their state prisoners they've been sentenced by a state court and we're expecting the counties to take care of that that's not. And I realize we're not going to pay it with maybe it's sixty eight dollars because there's services it shall provide but I would encourage all of play a bigger role in that I mean that's your responsibility okay Everest governor's office or who it is with some other guys step up is in these counties are spending money of their own treasury for is that not correct. I can't speak to how old the counties are funding their jail operation they're spending their money though is state prisons isn't. And in some cases I know there are counties where the reimbursement rate does not and cover their cost I know there are some counties from conversation tions that I've had was sheriffs where the reimbursement rate does cover the cost of care it flux to weights based on their size in the types of services that they're offering one thing I do want to reiterate to the committee you know our county jail reimbursement or county jail backup problem is the result of a capacity problem. We have of what a capacity problem we have been working for the last year to proceed with say expansion at the north central unit that will provide five hundred an additional bids for the division we have a R. if Q. out now for the design professional for their project additionally next Thursday I'll be taking a request to the board of correction to authorize us to begin site selection for an additional one thousand bed facility so we can have a project that we can begin discussing with the next legislature and the next administration long long term the biggest benefit we can give the counties is not solely through reimbursement rate increases that doesn't fix the problem the biggest benefit that we can give the counties is to ensure that on the state level we have adequate capacity to take care of our responsibilities another test on to that council we use the to put the bill or we need to take a. The prisoners so that's great commend you for doing that one more question. On the on the sanction bad save you all considered sanction but yes with a parole he comes in and they test hot they go ninety days or up the and no questions are out of the city they're out of the society and they go back if the test up on drugs one of our priorities in the department and and among the board of correction is to expand our capacity for parole violators sanctioning programs we are currently now of. Move finalizing plans to renovate the former White River juvenile detention facility which we purchased last year we're on track to begin renovations at that facility and January February of twenty three and we expect to have offenders in that facility and Q. one of twenty twenty four that's going to be about a hundred and seventy five bids and based on that forty five to ninety day timeline that you discuss we expect to be running about seven hundred offenders to that program a year instead of diverting that parole violator load to the counties which were having to in part do now do our short term replication program. Thank you thank service sector thank you Mr chairman thank you represent wouldn't I just added I'm told that the governor's or want to commend that ranked in county jails in the legislature can change you can amend that right if we want to step up and do it but well you know we we we would like to put it on somebody else but he can come right back to us we will tackle it thank you Senator Elliot you're recognized. Thank you Mr Mister graves has been determined definitely how we will find the one hundred bed facility that we you thank you mention one thousand bed the one thousand one thousand no ma'am we're S. as I said we're going to begin that process on Thursday by asking the board authorized us to proceed with site selection multimillion the final funding decision will be made by the next administration and the next general assembly is it just one site not to our with the request that I will be making on on Thursday is just for a one site okay And for our personnel that we had an issue with them from time to time of over the years do you feel now that we are budgeted In a way that. Hey is is not an issue for maintaining folks working in the system we are still an issue we are currently working with the office of personnel management and the office of budget now or on a a plan to modernize our compensation structure for our correctional employees we've got to catch up with the larger law enforcement market I I expect that will be an additional conversation that we will be having with the next administration and with the next generalizations leave the board of corrections has already signed off and to a concept but a the specifics of that plan and how we would obviously pay for that plan because this we can't just say we are going to pay staff something there has to be a revenue stream that that supports it that's going to require some long term conversations with legislative leadership and with the next administration I guess I can ask them but all as cute as well did did you and did the board up seek any input from other folks about. How old that you might restructure what that might look like you talked in the people working there for X. and yes this is actually been a Efford that I began shortly after my tenure in twenty twenty led by our chief of human resources and training who conducted salary surveys Nash nationally with the the correctional agencies and look at what are referred to as the SEC member states to see the good the bad and the ugly of their compensation structures and we feel like we are taking the best of what is common of across the region and across the profession we're not the only state that is having to catch up with the market in terms of modern modernizing our correctional employee compensation by I'm sure we're not on the the medical contract line yes ma'am it is medical contracts would you just just talk me through when with the S. on contracts one of the contracts that are involved in that line I as mystical alluded to the dis the recommendation on a page two sixteen to add a. A separate line item was made by the executive we don't object to that we are in the process now of soliciting bids for our next Health Services contract it is a single comprehensive contract that provide services to the Division of correction and the Division of community correction both divisions receive services under that single contract one thing that we are intending to do different under this procurement is expand services on the division of corrections side to include mental mental health care we've been conducting a pilot for the last year and our unit in Marianna with a privatized model of mental health care delivery and we've seen some ex extremely positive outcomes from that so we feel comfortable expanding that but. It's just one contract that will be paid out of the end of the line item bids are due back in December and we expect to select a better or I expect to make a recommendation to the board who will ultimately make the selection in late January only early February and then the review process and funding request will come to the legislature at that time so what they'll be like a normal procurement process so is is that mental health budget amount a part of what's on reflected on pages sixteen is that something different this is a projection because just for placeholder for lack of a better term I would not. Ask any member to consider this to be a hard number I have one either side but the final number of of what that procurement is going to potentially cost the state will not be ready until as I said January February of twenty three and just one last question weight when we put up the bids for the next this big comprehensive contract is it going to be in that kind of format going forward on and is this a contract we've had for what the last ten I want we discuss hello man we had a a privatized healthcare delivery model in Arkansas for about thirty years no I'm talking about the president the president is running out it's being your toes to ten year contract us are we going to do that are we going to put that contract out the the request Is it going to be for the comprehensive thing next time around or is it going to be the R. F. P. that was released and sept timbre is a comprehensive model as we've surveyed other states that are procured since our last procurement a decade ago we still believe it is the states in the state's best interest to do a favour waiver the department and the board of corrections us we continue to feel this in the state's best interest to do a bundle delivery model. So. Would it make sense to you to think about or talk to because we are the ones who get the call that we end up calling you and sometimes we don't even call you because you know it's it's just too much to carry What is it about the bundle model that makes you think that this is the best way to procure these contracts for for the best care for the folks that we have in our care economies of scale of what weight Kanemi of scale economy of scale not delivery of services saw not I was I was I was getting to that point now I would say the first point is a condom users of scale by having a bundle delivery model personnel is is easier for a single vendor to leverage personnel instead of multiple vendors with multiple personnel structures in something as simple as electronic health record system we're able to deploy one EHR across the entirety of our enterprise instead of having any age are related to direct care any age are related to medical any age are related to pharmacy any age are related to a radiological analogy and then the second point is in terms of a delivery of care by having a bundled model we have we are able to deploy a unified care approach and that's part of the reason that you don't have to go Now director pain and I started talking about the utility of bringing in his mental health care services because we know that when you have that Of physicians physician assistants nurse practitioner or working hand in hand with that Dennis working hand in hand with that optometrist working hand in hand in the case moving forward with that mental mental health care provider all on the same team all under the same system you don't have those barriers as you would if you had a company that did it the company that did why in a company that did that did see a message here this I want to get one more clarification because you. I've got a okay I've got a list okay I'll make it so have you done an evaluation I'm asking this question because I didn't think this was a good idea to start without just put it on the table this whole big bundle when we did this ten years ago or whatever it was have you done any evaluation to convince yourself in the boarding of valuation to think this is the best model yes and would you please share us the results without sure we started working on the procurement process in September of twenty one everything is running together at this point but we started working on the structure of our R. F. P. and September of twenty one to include working with other states across the country and saying the best and worst among the I what I ask for the evaluation you have done to convince you that this is the way we should go we can talk about that but that's what my question is not about everything else you said sure okay yes ma'am thank you feel free to get back in the queue of representative Tosh you're recognized. Thank you Mr. Secretary values and the Director buying I appreciate you all appreciate job you do. You know public safety is. Is something that we really need to be concerned about and I think as we move forward in crime is on the rise that public safety is going to be one of our priorities and okay one of the ways to promote public safety and to be able to fight crime is we've got to have the bed capacity to be able to the House these prisoners and people that commit those crimes you know or public correction doesn't need to be lack of revolving door and I and I know you're faced with that and as I was blessed into your testimony about the expansion I guess my question would be I know we have numerous people that are being backlogged in county jails and with the numbers that you put out while ago about the One thousand bed expansion and I can't remember all that you said but is that going to be another bandage to take care of the backlog that we have and as we move forward or we going to have the bedding in our department of corrections around this state to be able to house those are committing the crimes currently the back up in the division of corrections about fifteen hundred the expansions that I ran through we fully for representative wouldn't would address where we are today. We're going to have to have conversations both internally amongst the board with legislative leaders in and the incoming administration about long term what we do capacity has to be has to be a part of those conversations but making sure that we are implementing programs and services that as you as you said slow that revolving door has to be a part of those conversations I am I am a huge huge believer of person both personally and professionally in our community correction in our parole violator sayings in model making sure that we're pumping adequate resources into both of those interventions which we know work also has to be part of those conversations president printed prison beds I want peace but they're not the only piece of the solution long long term to meet our public safety goals. What I and I agree it is but it is one piece of the puzzle that we have to make sure that we have in place as we move forward to you notified crime and promote public safety we have to have that baiting to be able to house those individuals that are committing the crimes and I agree with that up I guess my question is I think you answered it so the expansions in the bands that you're moving forward with now is that going to be enough to couldn't catch all those numbers that will be enough to eliminate the backlog there in a county jails at this time it. It would if those bids or online today it would be enough to address our back of where we are today it what it is not going to be enough to address our projected growth if we don't implement efforts that continue to slow and hopefully reverse that growth during. Okay thank you one last question Mister I appreciate it up you talk about projected growth what's up just kind of bring me up to date for a have I know during the last fiscal session we we approved the probably the funding to be able to five hundred bed. The president is that correct yes Sir tell me what we're at with that and that that was not part of what you were referred to law to go when you were talking about the expansions is that correct that project at calico rock was part of of those numbers we issued the request for qualifications last week in order to secure the architect the design professional for that project we've spent the took about six months to craft what we believe to be a solid conceptual budget on conceptual plan for that R. if Q. that conceptual plan was approved by the board of corrections at its September meeting once we get bids back for the design professional they will draw final plans for the project which will allow us to proceed to selection for a general contractor wants that G. C. is engaged will have a final budgetary number my my hope is that it comes in close to what the legislature has already authorized obviously we all know first hands the violation air pressures that the entirety of our economy is dealing with right now so there potentially may be a need for additional conversations with the incoming administration and General Assembly if those numbers do not apply but that's where we are with that projects are okay thanks for the update thank you Mr. Thank you members to do have a full board so if you get a few questions in an and will rotate you back in the Senator Hammer you're recognized. I can assure you want. On the on the of federal prisoners or on the federal facilities were those that are in the back of a should be going to do you have any information about where the feds are about expanding make their capabilities in order for us to be able to move those or is that relevant at all to this discussion I'm not of plugged in with what the bureau prisons is doing with their capacity or the numbers that they have in counties upon follow your questions are you are I mean is one how many federal how many prisoners in the county back of jail are belong to the federal government they can't get moved out because the feds don't have the capacity to I would have or Senator mais as a good movie you know to the association of county sheriff's association but I wouldn't even begin to know that number okay and then on the discussion the representative Tosh was having about the current you're talking about a thousand member meeting few months ago that they projected in are you are you in your estimations considering that they're they're projecting like a ten percent growth rate for ten years out or whatever that percentage was so that we're not having come back in five years and have this discussion again if we get new jail built right now we're growing at about a percent and a half percent and one point seven percent over ten years ten year term these numbers reflect where we are what we need today to address our problems today we have may need is Cision that because there are some long term issues and where. Sixty days out ideas for ninety may be from a change in administration that a long term requests beyond where we are today is something that it would be best left for conversations with the incoming administration I can assure you it is my preference and the preference of the board of corrections that we don't trickle this out over the next several years that if we are going to have to make a. bid requests a multi thousand bed request that that be done sooner rather than later and not done over the next two three four by any our last questions on your budget shared services on page two sixteen yes Sir The phrase shared services as reflected in your budget is that within your agency or is that we shared services that we set up under legislation of a few sessions ago this our shared services model reflects the language that the General Assembly authorized this is these are administrative functions and procurements that much two or more divisions within the Department where we have identified that the most effective and effective and efficient delivery model is to centralize those under one umbrella these are things like accounting HR personnel legal procurement. Okay I see all right so as you move you because I noticed that the costs are going up from like I'm looking at twenty twenty one is at ninety five million you get on out to twenty twenty five that's a hundred fourteen million as you shift costs from other areas into the share transfer services are you reducing cost and other categories or is it just giving you breathing room to function within your budget reallocate those funds to some other usage of both well Boeser the increase year to year most recently we share it staff in our legal division and then our training academies to our shared services on broa we've also some additional contracts into our shared services on. Brillo for me in I look at things from two perspectives one I we've been doing all the controlling cost into are we improving service service delivery and every move that we make in to shared services or through our shared services Division properly meets both of those allowing us to reduce costs and improve delivery but in some cases cost estimating flat but we're improving our delivery of internal services thank you for your service or. Senator Chesterfield you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair of secretary Sullivan the rights bill unit. This is a part of the woods and levee system yes ma'am and I'm wondering any is there any place in your. Operating expenses are you working to try to mitigate the problems that we have there yes we are we have been in conversations well with your levee board for I know the last year for my understanding there looking at some external funding sources we take care of the maintenance of that levy but in terms of direct funding for upkeep when I say maintenance about clearing trees and brush those types of things in order to maintain these drugs stroll and integrity of the late everyone along our property but in terms of any direct funds no ma'am we don't have a funding stream to support operation of that levy or in other locations where we have levees running adjacent to our property is so if god forbid we have another great flood. It could have a deleterious impact on the Wrightsville unit along with others yes hello that's not the other that's not the only property we have that is bordered by rivers. One of the others Cummins and. Yes comings and rights bill so you you have made no recommendations as to how you're being a good partner you could work with those communities to mitigate the impact by making sure that the gates are opening properly and that kind of thing that I did it as I said you know our of a partnership with both levee boards have been in terms of maintenance clearing brush trees and other but Hey who's that eight to the structural integrity of those levies but in terms of those engineering type things the gates that is a responsibility of the levee boards thanks so when they asked me about it and they continue to ask me about partnering with you. When was the last time you guys clean all that stuff you're talking about that is a part of your operating expenses when was the last time that was done to. The we'll. Yeah we can follow up is an ongoing thing at both locations we can get with because I'm not hearing about and I'm just hearing that they're trying to get a meeting with you and they can get a meeting with you and I got I got a yeah but there's one suppose I'm coming up in rights bill I say I was in a meeting with one of my general counsel's last week and he mentioned that there is a meeting coming in contact with the board chair but will will clarified the timeline of recent communications and also of the work we've been doing on your levy and the one that I all right I appreciate it thanks Matt. Thank you representative Hodges you're recognized. Thank you Mr my question couple questions that it asked You know because public safety is is extremely important but my question is far as budgeting concern. In those conversations that you guys are having are you all looking at ways to. Cut back on the cost because you Arkansas incarcerate a lot and rather than look at measures on building more bed are we looking at measures on trying to. Get these guys transition. I have of these prisons and I and I heard a Senator Elliot mention about a mental health issue you know when we were dressed we've seen the fact a lot of these inmates have mental health issues if. Incarcerating them to answer do we need to look at building mental health facilities and state rather than adding more prison beds and what are we doing to save money rather than continue throw money at at our criminal justice system sure and I'll go back to the answer that I gave of weapons representative Tosh prison capacity is one piece of a larger of a larger solution two things that we've done one off a one highlight is legislatively as part of last sessions dream big initiative I am extremely proud of the work we've done to modernize our career technical education delivery within the department over the the last two years through the impact of that legislation we have been able to pump in about two million additional dollars into career technical education for our inmate population of the you may have seen recent media coverage of the heavy equipment simulator program that we implemented as a through that reorganization and not reallocation of resources that are Barney unit we now have a career technical education model that in terms of instructional delivery looks like what I'm sure all of you are proud of among your K. twelve schools in your district and that is what we wanted as a correctional system that the students within our school district whether they're getting GED instruction whether they're getting critical education instruction are getting a world class education that prepares them to be full fledged members of this twenty first century economy second thing will highlight as part of legislators later members and this was something that when I became aware of it really didn't sit well with me and that is we had a barrier in statute. To provide remedial instruction to inmates. We had made a decision at a state that we would restrict our school district to only provide services to inmates that don't have a GED or high school diploma the problem with that was simply getting a GED or high school diploma unfortunately in some areas of the state did not mean they were able to read write and spell their name into one plus want to get to. Yes we were trying to teach them how to weld yet we were trying to teach them how to be a H. back repairman yet we were trying to teach them how to be a heavy equipment or small engine mechanic we fix that in the last session and also now when we're putting a in made into a career technical education program before we even start them down that road we're able to do academic a proficiency based lining see what level they're functioning one and if they're not functioning at a level where they can meet the demands of that class then we're putting them into remedial instruction before we start there job training. In terms of mental mental health care we worked with the Department of Human Services as they were crafting the states most recent expansion waiver which I know we in is is I guess we still waiting on some approvals from CMS in Washington DC but part of that a waiver once fully approved by CMS we'll include a component where expansion dollars will be able to be received by our local hospitals for the delivery of substance use treatment we know the best place to treat someone with a substance use. Disorder with a mental health care issue is not in a car sold six. Unfortunately. Myself Director pain and direct Bradshaw are the largest mental health and drug treatment providers in the state of Arkansas that's the problem we've got to reverse that in one of the ways we think long term we can reverse that is through the implementation of of that revised waiver program once that comes out of CMS internally one of the things that government is Really good at is doing what it's always done. and that's not always a good thing. So year and a half ago when directed paid and I were having one of our regular conversations about what can we do different one of the things that we realize we could do different and we needed to do different is in hands are service are mental mental health care services we looked ADD where our highest need was where we were having the most problems in terms of recruiting and retaining mental mental health care staff and that was our unit in Brady's and we made the decision to self fund a pilot for eighteen months that a procurement runs through June of this year where we're partnering with us our health care provider to deliver mental mental health care at that location and we've seen increased outcomes from that both in terms of the quantity of services that are being delivered but also the quality of the services that are being delivered last thing I want to highlight in and and will follow up with staff there any other questions you have to realize the I'm seeing a lot of lights here one. Hey one of my one of my first actions as the secretary of corrections was to establish a quality improvement division within the Department and what the quality improvement division does is reporting directly to me they're taking a independent look at all of our programs and services across the department. Because what I wanted is to be able to articulate to my board articulate to my governor articulate to this legislature and future legislatures that when I have the opportunity to sit down across from you and talk about programming I can honestly tell you these are the programs we have that are working that are evidence base that are empirically sound that are having a positive impact on reducing recidivism these are the areas that we need to work in and these are and once we identify those areas that we need to work in that we're also able to implement actionable steps to address those areas approve of improvement and we've been able to do that over the last two years. Mr. You will follow up okay if you will we've got a full board okay I know that feel the life of that thank you. Six degree for for for all that information. The question going back you mentioned tech career technical programs last year in the third are getting a GED the thing that nature but you know. What are they doing to me that they didn't answer the question of recidivism as far as you know are they still in prison with the G. D. are they still in car so rate with this technical certificate what we do one to transition them out of the system so they can utilize these these programs they they received while they're incarcerated of so program completion in and of itself is independent of release determination. While the board of correction has through its statutory authority identified programming whether it is G. D. or whether it is vocational technical training whether it is treatment identified those programs where completion does allow an inmate to receive meritorious good time which speeds up their trek to the parole board ultimately is is that release determination by the parole board but from my experience with previous boards and with our current board there is strong weight given to inmates that have taken advantage of the self improvement opportunities that are available within our system. I have a ton more questions about. Thank you you get back in the queue of center Irvine you're recognized. Hi thank you thank you so much for the update about the education and the and how that's working out really appreciate that was really fun partnering with you on that and. Just so needed I think and I really appreciate that look forward to seeing the results of that Education restructuring as as we continue to make those improvements second thank you please pass on our appreciation to all the people that work in our correctional facilities it's tough job at third at I appreciate the move to eliminate the hazardous pay and roll that into the basic thing that's really important. Can you give me is that we have R. F. Q. That's going out for the construction at the north central unit to give a timeline on when that might be completed or. Any ideas about that. I know it's been a senator but I'll have to follow up with our procurement office and get the actual time line on with and will get bids back from design when bids are due from those interested design professionals okay and then and then the the idea is just to start construction as soon as one is selected yes based on other projects I would say we're probably. Factoring in the whole review process by the BA I would say we're probably the third quarter of twenty three okay will we be in a position to start turning their okay and then the final question at have you ever done a statewide assessment about county jail backup As to which one which which prisoners are being held there or inmates are being held there are there for at waiting for at trial date or waiting for a bed at the mental hospital at the state hospital or at are there because of lack of space in a prison the only numbers that we track within the department are those from the point of conviction for Detainees that are awaiting a court date or offenders that are waiting a bit an **** while I know those are issues for the shares we wouldn't be the best source of those numbers we can only give you transalpina conviction rate because the county jail backup is such a more complex issue it's not just about those that are convicted waiting for a bed at a prison it's it's about all those other things and so I'm trying to understand we have to have a way to really understand exactly to our or the detainees in a county jail in where that problem is because there's logjams at all these different areas and if you don't fix all of them or going to just continue with that same problem so I would I would there's got to be some. You know break down of the silos there so that we can have a better understanding and sounds I want to just give that back to you guys to try to figure out how we do that because a lot of it is waiting on at a court date because of the back up there or or abetted the hospital or a mental health and and I know that CMS and and DHS is working to try to identify county jails where they can actually created a mental health crisis unit within that same type of facility so just for the membership of the benefit of the membership that is ongoing so do appreciate that cooperation and collaboration I think that's really important so okay I just appreciate that but I would just task you guys to try to figure out a way to really assess that so we can get real numbers about those folks thanks yes ma'am thank you senator tester you're recognized. Thank you Director graves I think what you guys do is the most important thing we do in the state I appreciate all yes hard work I'd ask you a few questions of you know reason we're talking the phone about the new healthcare contract what he what he referred to that as the new ten year contract that's coming in there or if the of the of formal solicitation station is the department of corrections comprehensive medical health services procurement okay so the medical health. So you know it's a ten year contract maybe as much as a billion dollars in an I just kinda want to reaffirm that our conversation that or not we expect to have four or five or six bids in the said six people at least looking at it yes I just want some assurances that we're gonna have many people bid on this this can be very competitive process yes I will public publicly what I told Senator Hester last week we will receipt last last week we had mandatory site visits from vendors that had indicated an interest in potentially procure beating on this procurement opportunity I told you six the correct I was corrected after we talked the correct number seven of vendors that were on site last week for those site visits and location within the Division of correction and the Division of community correction we will receive bids back bids are due to the office of state procurement on December the seventh we will then begin a thirty day evaluation period which will culminate in early January with interviews of those bidders who returned bids in early December in we will at that point the evaluation committee while I will also be reviewing the bids death after they come in the evaluation committee will make a recommendation to me if that recommend Five accountable about the recommendation should not within sit down with the administration at that time and take a request to the board of corrections I expect early February and right now we are intending to post the anticipation of the award somewhere around mid February of twenty twenty three once that process is complete if there are any protests that have to be resolved that process is resolved and will likely early spring be sitting in front of a LC and review asking for legislative review of the come contract with the goal of implementing that contract July one of twenty three. The. Thank you any we've been we've been having some different to of discussions on EBT and stuff which is but but it got me thinking you know UAMS handles a lot of that person that certain parts of the state like what is it possible that you a mess could be a vendor for for all this health care they wouldn't you for to spend a billion dollars why Senator York or Chicago we could just spend it here in the state have we even entertained UAMS handling the health care of persons I know there of been conversations in the past about a hospital based delivery model I had I don't They there was no expression of interest this time around in those in those bids but we will have a have a conversation with the board set for next weekend of that's the issue we need to revisit we'll revisit it there may be some very clear reasons they can't do it but you know a hundred million dollars a year and leaving that here versus going somewhere else would seem compelling to me even thank you for your time Sir. Ripley radio number six. Thank. You know last year when we work and you know our budgets it came up about the loss of guns and ammo in some of our prisons and I just wonder where we are Sullivan is four Nays what's going on with the audit and where we're at because you know that could be a dangerous situation if not. Unhandled. Following legislative pass passage of the languages stab us sing a statutory requirement of a annual of firearms and ammunition audit within the department I issued a directive out of my office to implement that language the first review is due to my office by the end of this calendar year. Thank you so yes Sir thank you very much. The thank you sitting in representative grade C.. The representative right you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman and good morning Secretary grapes I came in a little bit late so if you dress the the parole absconder issue I apologize but I was checking the data the other day on the Department corrections website I think the number of parole and probation absconders or up to is north of twelve thousand six hundred currently. that seems like a staggering number it's higher than the population of about twenty different Arkansas counties so my question essentially is what is the department's view on that how concerning is it and is it going in the right direction in the wrong direction. It It is not where we wanted to be a direct pressure on me at the table we are constantly working to re engage those offenders on active supervision one of the things we've done over the last this almost six months now is expand all our of intensive supervision program focusing on Pulaski County and those counties that border Pulaski by putting fourteen additional officers out on this out on the street specially trained engaging in a case load that is high risk two it in. Attacking you from two ways one in by intensively supervising that population we're hoping that they don't absconds super super supervision because my be whatever's has has always been you're not going to abscond if you fully compliant if you're not using drugs if you're not engaged in criminal activity you have no reason not to show up to your officer when you're engaging in behavior that somehow violates the terms of your supervision that's when you're going to quit coming in so we want to make sure that we remain in contact with those individuals that we don't lose contact with them and they add to that twelve thousand which is unacceptably high. The other piece to it is what I talked about with representative will generally only on we've got to have a place to sanction them for their behavior when we re engage them. We're doing that with are when when a baby tions of the facility and Bates will we expect to every year to be able to run about seven hundred offenders through that we're on the look out now or other opportunities to established sayings chin centers across the state to address that behavior to give those offenders a wakeup call other than continuing to transfer them to the division of correction which only compounds the another problem which is not enough prison beds the Less than one a highlight is we're under undergoing an effort now to expand our efforts toward implementing a risk based supervision model part of that effort in includes making sure that we have a risk assessment tool that is validated and fictive Lee addresses and screens are populations once we do that one of my challenges in the board challenges to director Brad Shaw and his leadership team is that we are focusing resources are those on those who are at greatest risk for failure whether that failure is absconding or whether that failure is new criminal activity whether that failure is anything else that may lead to revocation of supervised years and when the to jury branch out Director Division of community corrections to answer questions Sir take that number very seriously over the last year we had an adverse weather officers to send them to three US marshals program so that they can fly armed and I am city people all over the country big people up a monthly although we haven't made a dent in it to my satisfaction over the last year it has remained static over the last year it grew quite a bit during the covid two years that time period it grew to where it is now but yes we are the Secretary grave spoke to a lot of these individuals this is because if it's purely is conning is considered a technical violation so those folks would go to a section center if they come back and they don't have to charges so it is important that we have that bed space board that thank you for that and I remember you bring up the issue of the need for adequate sanction space we'll we'd spoken previously I do have one additional. Question I am I think our heard you say in response to representative Tosh is questions about the thank you senator correct me if I'm wrong that the five hundred bed expansion at the north central unit would clear up the backlog in the county jails and I'm I'm curious how that would how that would be adequate sense with I think we have about sixteen hundred state prisoners in the county jails can you help me. But the cost was the five if today we had online the projected five hundred bed expansion at the north central unit plus the additional one thousand bids that on next Thursday I'm going to ask the board of correction to authorize me to begin the House site selection process taking those two projects together if they were online today you would address our back up as it stands today action that math makes more sense thank you Sir appreciate it thank you starting on repeat members Senator Hammer you're recognized. Thank you Mr I caught wind of a contract that you all or maybe negotiating or taking bids on for new security camera system do you know anything about that can you make quick update how that's going to impact your budget we actually met on Monday afternoon division directors meeting we will be taking a request to the board on Thursday to authorize us to so like I'll get that project approved as a capital improvement project we will be crafting a R. E. Williams I expect to go out in Q. one of twenty twenty three we don't have that on the street today we are actively talking internally as to what the scope of that project is one of the ways and I will give us a direct paying credit on this this is something that he's been a work working on for us almost two and a half three years now We can't we have to accept that the staffing challenges that we're facing in our profession. Is Chris Arkansas is creating opportunities for us to do better in two different in our profession and one of the ways we really feel like we can do different is by better leveraging technology especially surveillance technology to reduce the staffing burden that we have to account for now with our with our current car model is a priority of this we don't we don't have our best dollars as to what that is going ultimately cost but that is a conversation that we are currently having an there will be a R. if Q. out early twenty twenty three. So it is it is a currently are if you are R. F. P. that's out there there is no do we have on the we don't have a camera procurement out now we're we're actively working on correcting one. Okay. Okay thank you. Representative Cavenaugh you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair my question's going to be on page two sixteen under shared service pain we have a line item regional jails can you tell me what that payment is for that line item was intended to fund the south Arkansas regional jail between Drool and. Right Brad Bradley County school. With a but they have not brought that project online yet. Okay when you say well isn't are you trying to tell me they're not going to I have not seen movement from those counties to implement that project. Why are we still asking for the appropriation that money of he is I have. If that project could come online it would benefit us I will be very clear I'm not I'm not closing the door on that project but it has not come on come on line in the in the last two years we actually In trying to remember my last conversation. I don't want to speak for the council with the members are present governor if I could follow up with staff after the meeting with a status on where the project project is because my memory is beginning to fail me right now yes if you don't mind yes ma'am thank you. Thank you. Representative was you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman Mr secretary I have three areas will honor dress first one is on page two twenty two. under shared services you have an actual expenditure of eighty four million but in the in the future biennium you're asking for ninety six million US twelve million what what what it first of all what shared services is that and why twelve million dollar increase. that is is mystical is about me that is actually in the Division of correction on August we're still technically on the shared services budget of the committee is okay with move into the next division on a. All. We're going to have that. Contoh. So if I may add there are some transfers from the Division of correction to shared services I believe that's what is showing on the on the Division correction appropriation summary so there's no direct funding is still there is no direct funding give what is shared services that's money we transfer that money up from the division's central office to your central offices yes or yeah well you are sure services is housed in multiple locations across the department physically but yeah at the department level this still. I'm not. Is still six is still twelve million dollars more than that it has been and where is that money coming for two twenty two X. on the are you asking for an increase no Sir that is not new money that is reflective lines for money that is reflective of additional items that we are proposing to transfer to our share of services in the email that is additional contracting in a professional fees and also in in related to training H. are legal and IT and IT hardware and software needs. That is not new money no Sir it's just been a you're transferring within your central office the incorrect is that right and would you get especially what we did when we transferred shares services over in the last by you we mainly transferred positions over and we transferred eventually transferred some in mental for the training academy and for legal services in this by you went ahead and transferred all of the in the know for a county of procurement and and those functions so that's why it looks like it's a big increase which is transferring it from the divisions over to share service exists but it's existing money that's already we're just moving it from one bucket to another box yeah secondly on personnel. I have a report to show you have eighteen hundred eighteen hundred and thirty seven vacancy right within the Department across the department the US gross for hundred twenty of those are over two years old. And in the department of corrections. You have the. Forty fifty four budget in and forty percent of those or vacant fifteen hundred ninety three I know that a hundred six or over two years a question is is that primarily correctional officers yes I secondly what what makes the four hundred and six what what positions have been vacant for over two years old hello my H. R. TV will be the best person to say what those positions are but yes Sir majority of those vacant positions in the Division of correction are going to be correctional employees as I talked to as I referenced with Senate senator Elliott one of we're we are working with the office of budget now in the office of personnel in on a plan to modernize until we get our compensation to where it needs to be we're going to continue to have those challenges but more the vast vast majority of the challenges that are division directors are experiencing with vacancies are in our uniform staff will of the improve it to the information and so has the personnel committee on the on the research that's being done in the development of a new budget but the I'm asking about the hundred six of the bin vacant for over there years those are related to food services and security positions based on the notes I'm looking at these things can you age is it do you do of age trial balance on that relative to how long they've been vacant for years for years. Yeah. As I represent will continue as the could you ask the questions for me okay how many do you do you know the age of those positions yes some of and like it for five six years and and are they budgeted positions we can get that data for the last bill date in there and whether not their budget on budget Mister chairman of like if they would to provide us with a report on the on the the dollar amount of the budget positions that are budgeted event budget versus budgeted worsens but today so we'll know how much money we're time the in anticipated salaries that they will understand the battle that you're facing one last of the question you've talked to a lawful laws and I appreciate your your your vision of the future in talking about the new administration and the your board and then the legislature let me ask you this. Canelo's subjects and conversations that you're having or your developing a contingency plan to deal with the issue for us for the passes. The board of corrections at a recent call to the formal stands of expressing their opposition to issue for it. From a purely per a professional perspective. Any time you increase the prevalence of drug use you increase the risk of drug abuse and that is a the concern for the Department we see every day what that what that risk is individuals continually chasing that first high and when they're unable to achieve that first high proceeding to harder drugs or proceeding to more illicit ACT two bodies we're having we are having conversations internally about what that looks like but I I will say the concerns that the board of corrections expressed in their resolution of last month our our shared throughout the department leaders leadership at various levels of the and I and I appreciate that I mean up to to me that to contest or two for them to stand up and do that and I agree with that in your conversation and discussions have you been talking within the with the the chiefs of police the sheriff's association relative to how they perceive what's going to happen the year old streets whatever that becomes a legal should it become legal no Sir I am I get a preparation I have not. So this will concerns me I hear an awful lot of talk about forty five million slower than a law enforcement that some. Minuscule amount of money that is going to call such a study if if issue four passes and we have we're we're in I haven't you're the first person that I've had an opportunity to ask that question and I've had no one else the health department DHS or anyone else to express a concern relative to the cost of the taxpayers of this state and I guarantee you it will be more than four hundred fifty billion dollars thank you thank you for this thank you Mr chairman thank you represent button Kevin made a note and you get that personal information for you and your co chair senator Wallace for you personnel committee thank you thank you senator a you're recognized and Senator Hester okay. Thank you Mr chair director grades. With the for what on on a page two sixteen I think where we had the medical contracts we talked about I think you said the Mental health contracts or part that the cost is and then so does this mean the mental health contracts then will be funded separate from the vondle contract of that we have right now is that separate from that it would be a a standalone and not a part of that bundle contract no ma'am are into the Jan the and the did we have out on the street now provides for medical mental health dental pharmaceutical services all under one delivery model on the on the on the one delete currently the met the the mental health is not in it or do you currently in the division of community correction mental health care is already a part of the contract in the Division of correction at all units except for the East Arkansas regional unit mental health is provided through state F. T. E.'s at the East Arkansas regional unit we have a separate procurement that runs through June of this year for the delivery of mental health care services at that location so those council those contracts and then it will go away if and everything and then we'll have even more folded into the bundle kind. is there is there any. I don't know of anybody that so I know what I'm what I'm talking about here is there any of. Body and that in this state that could possibly qualify for that contract with. That with the bundle contract that will necessarily have to be an outside I've management I can't speak to the who who would be eligible or ineligible okay then is R. P. on your website because I could look at it and thinking through it out myself that someone is is posted on espys website okay And so for that you you said you've had based roughly what seven responses are you anticipate seven seven express have us submitted expressions of interest and the Office of State Farm and those are the ones who did who were and for required visit or whatever yes ma'am he happy stated that Do you have a notion that based on what we spend now on mental health out what the savings might be or just even the cost might be but it's what the savings might be as a result of folding all of the mental health into the bundle contract knows no one of the right now we're spending at East Arkansas which is a larger unit and has more dedicated FTE ease they have thirteen. Thirteen thirteen F. T. E.'s at East Arkansas dedicated to mental health care that contract is one point three million a year well one of the things we found when we put a bid when we solicited proposals for that procurement we found that our mental mental health care positions were paying at best forty percent below market rate which is understandable when you look when you consider the challenges that we have historically had with recruiting and retaining licensed mental health. So would it be fair to say that there is a possibility because I know that we gonna have three hundred we're going to have this hundred million dollar contract and none of that money then if we're folding mental health into this to. It's very possible none of that money will end up staying in the in our state well. No ma'am because he to the vendor we currently have in previous vendors you know that they're not flying in two to three hundred staff you know their payroll is made up of our Kansans is there been instances in the past with their sub subcontractors have been our Kansans their medical device suppliers have been our Kansas so no ma'am I will I would not agree that this money is completely leaving the state because it's not the what would you just sent what would you just share with me then who the subcontractors are with them up with that is it well path our our our current vendor is well that are okay would you share with me then who the subcontractors are with them in our state right now I will I will as I can speak to they have as a sub I'm aware previous vendors that I've had Arkansas also but I can't speak to who will pass I don't want to I don't want you to assume that I'm saying that our current vendor has Arkansas so because that is not what I was alluding to I currently but I will reach out to will will pass and asked an estate in formation as to where the if if they can provide that without of creating competitive bid bandage issues about where their where they're spending their sub subcontractor forces so they can hold that a secret from us to their sub Arkansas I can't speak for them but I I will I will I will ask and if that is something they can be released I will provide that the staff and and the final question then the answer because R. T. is is different for the the correction system from everybody you do your own release and all that right in the in the and who makes that final decision about who gets chosen by the in the past the Department administered is on. Aarthi with this procurement OSP is administering the in ministering the R. P. they're the ones that are receiving bids and doing all the leg work in terms of who makes the final selection at the end of at the after following the evaluation process I'll be brief by the evaluation committee which is comprised of staff within the department and then I will make a recommendation to the border corrections who will make the determination as to if we if they will proceed with that procurement process with that then sorry isn't it just and it is that that described him as an in house thing that you know was the border correction reviews it then just like any other contract it has to just come or review legislate for review and and in this case Fund and there will have to be an allocation of funds likely to go along with that contract and I found question here is just if a process question because we've been going through a lot of issues here on the budget specially looking a lot of personnel issues and some other other issues. That we're not going to make these big decisions until we have a new governor and they're going to have input by your timeline I think you said February so made a decision will be made and by then we will have a new governor already in office is there something that prevents us from extending the contract so that we could land the same kind of I guess curtesy to an incoming governor so that we don't have to carry this out at this point I I expect that the that is part of our transition process within the department that the that this will be a point of conversation I don't want to have any member believe that first conversation that we have with the next administration about this procurement is going to be Jane working that's not going to be the case our timeline is of the current procurement ends June thirtieth so we have we have to have a contract in place and from talking to staff involved in previous procurements it's about a sixty day lead time in terms if there were would be a transition between vendors so we need to have a contract in place by I would say may at the latest and otherwise we would be in a position of having to for a period of time do an emergency procurement extension with our current vendor so we don't have an interruption of services okay this is so if if if the next administration's going to have a more active role take the committee okay I'll wait go ahead Mr Senator Hester in in center Chesterfield. Thank you Director graves. I've recently due to air of a mentality jail in an I was expense and time in there and saw how important the ability for inmates to communicate with family that has to place some sort of a role in the mental health as well just being able to talk to their kids or their words spouse or family or whatever the when you guys are doing the I guess I don't that's called commissary communication whatever that is did you take into account what what that cost the the families or inmates is that is that a bigger part of it do you make money off that or is that just a pass through health how's that process of we make a small commission off of telephone we do not make a commission and the Division of correction all of the video visitation R. and I and actually that contract runs through. March March April of twenty three so we will have a R. if Q. four in may communications coming out it. Blake this year early January to address that piece but while we make a small commission it is not we've actually reduced costs throughout this requirement. Good is that it do inmates have unlimited opportunity to to to do that or is it so much per week. Yes that they can schedule that at any time during the week of the scheduled video visitation they could also utilize the phone as long as no one else's use phone they don't have their own personal phone but have no one else is on the phone they could make calls anytime they want why we watch today they could call home every some call home ten times a day okay all right thank you so. Senator just for you you're recognized I'm a executive read. I have a motion the second for exactly right all in favor aye. Post thank you Dylan for the department of corrections. Budget and now for the division of corrections Mr Coleman you are recognized again thank you Mr chair I will be looking at the Division correction division summary and that's okay on page two hundred twenty two of your manuals. So start with an totals the agency request for fiscal year twenty four is just over four hundred million dollars for skills one fiscale fiscal year twenty five is just over four hundred four million dollars we have five total appropriations a change levels and the first one is on page two hundred thirty that's the inmate care and custody appropriation. So fun for make in custody are made most made up mostly of general revenue but there are some cash and special revenues and the AMA Care in custody fund account and that is so the agency can account for population growth and adjusted as needed. The first change levels the note here our salaries and personal services matching so there's a couple things on packed with this firstly there is a a line item for holiday compensation five point five million dollars units at the bottom of the table there and that's been moved to the regular salaries line item the second thing unpack but this is there's fifty nine positions transfer to division of community corrections and that's to help with the White River correctional center and an Batesville secondly there's an increase in operating expenses of three point five million dollars in fiscal year twenty four and five point four million dollars in fiscal year twenty five. And these are due to increased cost maintenance and operations inflation along with reallocation to shared services in both years. In C. is also requesting an increase in capital outlay in both your the biennium the one point three million dollar quest for fiscal year twenty four and seven hundred forty nine thousand dollar quest for fiscal year twenty five for purchase of equipments throughout the division of corrections the exact recommendation provides for this request and appropriation only. And exchange those on page two hundred thirty four and this is the prison industry appropriation. As founder special revenue generated by selling products to public agencies and nonprofits. Apart from salary match judgments the prison industry preparation has to change levels. One million dollar increase in both years of the biennium for casa material such as wood still and capital increases of seven hundred fifty two thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty four and six hundred twenty nine thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty five and that's to replace aging equipment executive wreck provides for this agency request. On page two hundred thirty six we have the farm operations preparation. Our including salary match adjustments here there are three total change levels as appropriation operating expenses increase the one million dollars for each fiscal year due to rising costs of fertilizer seeds and production costs. The agency is also causing Capwell increases nine hundred thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty four and a hundred fifty thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty five and that's replace equipment I was previously sold at auction. A recommendation provides for this agency request. The fourth change level is inmate welfare treasury cash and that's located on page two hundred thirty eight manuals this provides inmates with the ability to purchase hygiene products paper and stamps and snacks and things like that. The appropriation is three total change levels firstly salary match exceed twenty three authorized due to rate adjustments. And the agencies also requesting one million dollars each year of the biennium to purchase more resell items for inmates request also includes capital outlay increases one three quarter million dollars for fiscal year twenty four and one million dollars for fiscal year twenty five and that is for laundry and kitchen equipment. In the final change of on page two forty AS nontax revenue receipts. So this is used for inmate assistance security equipment and general operations and is funded with proceeds from the telephone service provider for inmates at the agency is simply requesting reallocation to under sixty thousand dollars and operating expenses to shared services for both use the biennium and Mister chair that includes the Division correction tangible thank you Mr Coleman representative Senator Hammer you have the. A question you're recognized thank you Mister Committee for the agency subject is on the work force we've had some conversations about the work force not shown page two twenty three there's five hundred inmates who participate in a work release program first of all is there any opportunities to expand that number in order to get folks out into the work force other than what we're doing right now yes Sir of the board of corrections has recently approved a planned expansion fifty bids and our Mississippi County facility to take advantage the growth in the industrial market in that part of the state okay the cost of that expansion is what. Bridget two point five million. We're that's building only will be able to use existing staffing the man that additional beds okay and then. They're paying seventeen dollars a day once last time we raised that rate because if they're the beneficiaries of minimum wage increase or other increases that are offered do we need to look at raising that seventeen per day to keep up with additional cost and have them help paid a bigger portion we just had that conversation on Monday and no one on our leadership team remembers when it was not seventeen dollars a day with that require legislative action results of you do within your department it's that that ability set that rate is given a statue to the border correction okay so I wish you would look at that give a report back if you don't mind yes Sir and then the other thing is they get to keep a portion of that I'm I'm here hearing reoccurrence storage not often that some of the of inmates are able to leave with a large sum of money and I've also heard stories about thirty days later that that money's gone is there are constitutionally is there anything we can do that could help slow down their access to that money until they have a chance to adapt back out into the free world so as not to be taken advantage if they walk other with a large sum of money we only have the authority to hold on to their trust funds while they're in the custody of the Division of correction once they leave because the then we have to turn their funds over to them one of the things that And when we are aware of that issue so many of our work release programs have volunteers that come into specifically address issues related to financial literacy because for many of them that is the most amount of money that they have ever ever had in their lives other at all were legally so that is a concern of ours And Wisconsin working to engage communities of care that have an interesting coming in and and providing the financial literacy and education okay well some of one conversation Mr like to ask about farming operations but will involve thank you thank you. The Kevin no you're recognized thank you Mr chair back over here to the right I'm going to ask about some fund balances so you've got fund balance in work release cash fund balance and non tax receipts revenue receipts and fund balance and medical monetary sanctions. So what are we what are we have to do with those fund balances and how can they be. Yes so that is that is something that we have been working on in turn only for instance and work release the expansion that I just just discuss with Senator Hammer is being funded entirely out of the fund balance of for that out of that work release cash so would you see in front of you is actually we at we have actually authorized three million toward that project just on the off chance that cost of materials and construction should increase before we're able to start turning dirt on that same thing with our non rate that would leave you six million even if you took three out that legacy six million a work release cash yes ma'am we had we have additionally coming out of those funds another I'm looking at US three million in obligated projects that are not reflective in these numbers I believe these are run as of June thirtieth so there's another three million in projects that will that we are we have authorized internally that are not reflected in the reports that you have the projects these are security equipment emergency services equipment and. miscellaneous capital equipment purchases okay and have you asked for appropriations for those in another location not at this time okay we will if we do not have sufficient appropriation then that request would depending on the timing either come through J. B. C. R. ales the peer but we have those projects obligor mitigated and are proceeding at various places okay. And with those of the funds you write non tax revenue receipts which is page two forty and then medical monetary which is two forty four yes ma'am all too we have currently in that fund eight hundred and seventy eight thousand and commitments and additional in miss miss miscellaneous commitments excuse me additionally we have a planned emergency power project fancy name for generators at three hundred thousand and then miscellaneous I. T. and security equipment projects at two point five million obligated against those funds not reflected in the report you have a funny okay and are there are no stipulations on how these can be used they can be used for wherever you need to use them you can use them all out we have some funds for instance in may welfare is a restricted fund has to be used for the sole benefit of the inmate population of all of these funds are required approval of the board of corrections before they can be expense I believe you also ask for medical sanctions yes that the other one that that one is which is a restricted fund also any expenditures out of that fund our have to demonstrate to the board that they improve the health of the inmate population we currently have a hundred and sixty seven thousand dollars and obligations against that fund that fund also uses is also used to fund our third party medical auditor while we have the utmost faith in our of the ender in terms of the delivery of services we have an outside entity that comes in and on a by contract quarterly. Bases and then if there's an issue that the board has concerns about I've got concerns about or direct pain as concerns about we will assign that to that medical auditor to audit that delivery of care to make sure that it is of appropriate for the situation at hand and that auditor is paid entirely out of the sanction funds. This could this fund be used to help with the mental health issues that were experiencing of. Yes we are at we and we actually I'm sorry I was going to say that the contract that we had East Arkansas is being paid out in this fun but it's actually not it's being paid out of inmate welfare okay our thank you. Thank you representive eleven you're recognized thank you Mr chair senator graves my questions are regarding farm operations. the. The analysis on page two thirty five shows that. You have a proxy twenty thousand acres are devoted cash crops vegetables hay production livestock of that twenty thousand acres how much of that is currently farmed by the department corrections verses leased out to area farmers or large farming operations we do not only see any any acreage out all of our land is is work by the department okay and What is the it also states that Production sales the market will feel crops livestock what is the amount of income that is generally. Produced from the farming operation from the sales of the crops and livestock. I don't have the balance sheet in front of me the bottom line over the last two years we've seen about three million in profit in in net profit from our ag Division but how much of that is tied to read. Klay to roll cropped up follow back up and get the numbers that you're So we're providing useful and meaningful work the inmates as a program provides jobs for approximately three hundred inmates is there compensation is tied to that. So that number is actually what I what we consider to be skilled farm jobs we have far more than that that actually while work jobs we do not compensate monetarily inmates in the department of correction except for those that are placed in a work release program or in our correctional industries division through what is called a a pie a pie project which is an acronym so basically these. Three hundred and may that's. Like better words it's free labor. The of well. In the end this is not me words methods is what I generally believe in while we do not provide monetary compensation we do teach the dignity of work search for many of them absolutely they have not learned previously and one of things we started over the last year me is we actually have through our career technical education program we now have a agricultural technology certification program so inmates assigned to skilled jobs in the farm can also get a certificate of proficiency that if they choose to continue working in the agricultural industry they have a a a demonstrated a mastery of skills that from what we've been told by the industry that any farmer whether it's commercial or a private would be quick to certainly I would think that there would be a definite tangible value to preparing them with skills technical training to to enter back into the workforce so turning the page over two thirty six Looking at the farm operations salary lines. We are we're. The sixty three positions authorized for twenty two twenty three two point eight seven million that's an average of about forty six thousand dollars. Who are those employees those are all state employees and those are the administrative staff for the farm division and also the supervisory staff that manage the cruise clerical staff of farm security for managers yep so for the other state employees yes Sir okay and then last question thank you Mr please see is is looking that into twenty three twenty four based upon your preparation quest for we're reducing that by ten positions but keeping the line item flat at two point eight seven I'm assuming that the reduction those ten salary ten positions keeping the same amount that raises that averaged fifty four that's just to include. Raises Matching benefits and so forth for those employees so the a reduction of the positions is to the transfer where we took the security positions that were assigned to the Activision and though they have been transferred to the unit of assignment at wherever that program is located while the salary line item is the same of you know obviously if everyone is aware with the two percent of the cost of living adjustment last year merit increases so there shall the staffing number might have been on reduced there was increases in staffing costs that offset it in just by the need for keeping the increase from the state we're going from forty five five to three to four one then that that holds that long ago that are thank you thank you for answering those questions thank you Mr. Thank you representive eleven a representative will you're recognized. Thank you Mr chairman on back on the on the floor operations place to thirty six. I have several questions of first of all on the in our sales five hundred thirty eight thousand what was that what was that for How was that hand that was US scrap a commitment that were that was put out for disposition through auction. All right and and your cattle operation are you still Selling your calf crop the the to Alice study of. Selborne. President will we we seal the cattle to where we can get the best price so low we have sold out of state of Oklahoma by some believe the sale in Arkansas as we. How how's that control. When you run when you run a carefully the sale of Oklahoma who who who sees it you get the receipts back our our budget Department. Who's who's in charge of making sure that the. Who's in charge of making sure that the cavs will over there of the number that we so that that that some of the money you got back is the centre all it ever look at that or yes Sir internal audit does. C.. Sure but if you will when we actually don't release the cattle to the buyer until we receive funds to receive a okay okay now only of personnel signed have a little bit of trouble and and represent evinced of stolen we're we're of those ten positions going that you're reducing it down. You you had you had sixty three authorized you only own you only had forty three that you're asking for fifty three. So we're we're that we're or you relinquish of those ten positions or you move them somewhere else and or no Sir and there's actually what note at the bottom of page two variants and number of positions and authorizing ages courses due to single salary six session and appropriation act so if if you look at the appropriation for the Division of correction you just see one salary sakes ten for that division so those positions are in that same salary section instead of being listed on this page they're part of the X. number of thousand positions that are in the inmate Karen custody fund page where the. Majority of our positions in the direct Division of correction operate out of. Okay. Here's here's where I'm confused. Of the service line You show a budget of two point three million roughly before the positions under actual usual of forty three positions at a hundred thirty three thousand yes so that's that's only three thousand dollars a position so what in FY twenty two the majority of positions in the farm Division we may every year we sit down usually in Q. four and we determine you know do we are to the farm positions need to stay in general revenue where they're funded or do we need to transfer them to the farm fund to be paid out of those that say that again and all of our fund all of our positions are general revenue funds in the division of corrections at the end of each fiscal year we sit down internally and we decide whether or not we're going to leave those funds will make the accounting decision basically do are we going to leave those funds paid out of general revenue or do we pay them out of farm funds last fiscal year we made the determination instead of paying them out of farm funds to pay them out of general revenue. So you pay them so. So you paid you paid about of of form revenue so the other world Sir you look at those okay in the last fiscal year we paid farm positions out of general revenue which is why in the farm fund you only see a hundred and thirty three thousand dollars in salary expenditures the remaining two million and some change was paid out of general revenue fund okay so. We K. we. We're not we're not making a million dollar profit down the. In the farming operation with with with the way we move that can move the salaries or I am because the forty three positions in a cost one point nine million of somewhere that was paid right at a general revenue funds this is general revenues so this tell me what is the eight million not eight point six million dollars special revenue under funding sources what is that word is a co. That is the row crop income isn't row crop in the now this is just the appropriation. Or on the far the that a point six yes yes Sir is the real problem does the program provide new okay so so you could eight point six within you showing thirteen million remembers when I needed to clarify what I just said upon with my CFO Sturch answer because he's smarter than me but the eight point six million is All revenue went to the farm this row crop that it's cattle kill this is yes I figure it is if there. So so but now are you anticipating a gain of four million five million because you're you're you're you're showing income for the next biennium it at thirteen million and and this is just appropriation we're hopeful over the last year we've invested over a million dollars into precision leveling also a multi site irrigation mission project decision leveling the land fill it yes yes Sir and also a multi multi site irrigation should project to increase the yields out of our out of our lands good it in the in the in the leveling and all that feel use interrogation do you take into consideration all your costs you fuel because. And and that type thing and I was clear to keep those feel flooded with rice and soybeans and corn is that is that in the operating expenses. Yes Sir okay so everything's covered but you did you did you say that we made a million dollars last year. Last year's revenues were at this point one war three point one million three point one million yes Sir what well when you say revenue are you saying that was the profit just a minute prior was the profit was one of the three point one million less okay all right thank you thank you Mr chairman thank you Mr secretary thank you senator Hammer you're recognized thank you Mr picking up on that subject when you say we had three point one that me and seems like I remember a few years ago your sitting here losing money in my remember that right yes are you do you got a farm manager I guess I'm not sure she still down there the one was we do not we made some changes in operations but in in in terms of equipment utilization and modernize our some of our procurement process is just got more efficient feed science got smarter also the one of the things that is really helped us is in we we're drawing down from our the revenue stabilization fund loan that we have access to instead of as we did in previous years which was draw down the full amount we're drawing as we need those funds so if we don't need to for five point six that we're entitled to we don't draw down the full five point six okay that was gonna be my question so if you needed three point one million what you draw down off of the General Revenue creature one of three agencies if I remember right to get a cut off the top you only draw down what you need you're not you're not getting that set amount or percentage off of general revenue right is so last year we do down four point four. That and that in the the authors and we're yep forty instead you can be forgiven dollar for dollar based on it may consumption what that is certified by a legislative audit division okay when a quick question I wanna go back to the work force if you will the. How many dollars are taking in at that seventeen dollar day rate how much how much is that we're to show up in a the numbers we've got so we know how much that equates to what pager you know where that is. Two twenty three. Senate senator Hammer who if we could add that to the list of questions will get back with staff for okay if you would I'd like to know if there's five hundred inmates working with that three point three million I'm being told three point three million yup yeah if you look in on page two thirty four four hundred thirty four Page. Two twenty four. The cash fund line item under funding sources three point three one two million okay then if if you're looking at raising it you got a two and a half million dollar. Request you need to look at raising that you're looking at regent seventeen dollars a day up to what you're thinking that that is appropriation only okay so if if we do have a need to expand more than that two point five then we would just make a supplemental appropriation request okay and accountable leave eliminated where where it is right now all right and when you get that money and do you have the discretion to put it wherever you need to put it within your budget to be all of those are work release funds work lease revenue stays in the work release on it in then any expenditures are done out of that fund we can't we work release money from care and putting in another book our what's what's the cash fund balance in there there what's what's the number some looking at the right number. Me. The current balance before the commitments all right all to a representative Cavenaugh is eight point seven million that's what you've got sitting in there yes Sir. Let me throw this at you sit down there and Haskell which is not in my district but it's in my neighborhood we got building seventy we've had that discussion before yes Sir is there a reason you couldn't go in there and if you do raise that daily rate access that those funds in order repurposed building seventy to make it a more efficient model down there for work for services and maybe expand that population down there to that given the age of that building there are some other structurally shady to be resolved beside us new paint we we have had that conversation shin recently as to whether or not that move makes sense force is not completely off the table but that's and that would be a really significant pride project beyond just cosmetic issues okay all right we'll continue conversation but right now you get a million something in there to that's earmarked for workforce whatever before commitments of yes Sir and your commitments are two million something we had of the. About. Five. By five five is million in commitments okay our thank you thank Mr. Representative Cavenaugh you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair my question is also dealing with two thirty four to thirty six it's the forty two in the hundred thirty thousand salaries and I understand your explanation that you does it kept the number but you actually paid amount of another line item another place yes so did you have appropriations and both of those to cover those salaries yes ma'am would have to let us use we are received about seven million and COVID related salary reimbursements from both the state and female so there was in a need as in past years to pay those salaries out of special revenue funds either in prison industry or in our farm fund. Okay so for this ask have you got a man both appropriations yes all of our all of our positions have an appropriation in general revenue there is in the farm Fund in of the prison industry fund and also in inmate welfare because we have authority to pay commissary positions out of it may well for there are separate salary line items well what I would call the default line item is in general revenues okay but you've got appropriation and all three of you know that special revenue and general revenue to pay those yes okay thank you. Thank you representatives burger you're recognized. Good morning thank you Mr chair is it proper for motion at this time. Motion if you hold it yes I've got one more question of the right back to you. Representative payment you've got a question. Thank you Mr secretary of my the question again as one make sure I'm asking it the right way not not questioning how you answered us will make sure I'm asking the proper questions of the other twenty thousand acres that is under the control of the department corrections for farm operations all twenty thousand those acres are formed by the department corrections and not by anyone else outside of the department correct is any of that land after crop season is over is any of that land leased out for any type of. Commercial hunting or private use no Sir okay and and do you have any data and you don't want to give it to me today you're just interested look at of. The analysis between if you didn't have the income from the farm operation and the for the what the food production that it provides to the Department what the compare the cost would be if you had to go out and purchase that were you ever look at those numbers we do actually had the conversation with myself for the way over here this morning because I expected of this question to come up that's something where we we are we are going to look good and we can get back to stay I think the farm provides I think it's a tremendous asset to the state agreed there so many and angel benefits come fruit from it and I'm proud of the work that they do and and and want to make sure that we continue to do that if there's any way to build that up or expand on it I think we need to sort of look at that thank you Sir thank you for that. Just food you have some before represented Spranger motion. Jesus. Springer you're recognized thank you Mr chair I move for executive Rick. I have a motion and a second any discussion on the motion. Not all in favor aye aye opposed. Thank thank you all. Good excellent. Members we are now at the. Community correction. What rich Coleman if you're still with us you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair will start out with community corrections division summary on page two hundred forty six. The agency request total is just under one hundred thirty four million dollars for fiscal year twenty four and just over one hundred thirty five million dollars for fiscal year twenty five. So we have three change levels three appropriations would change I was in the the Division communicate action the first one being on page two hundred forty eight and that's the resident's Castro's re as preparations used for various projects to benefit all residents of committee correct facilities funded through resident purses of commissary supplies and income from the telephone contract. So appropriation is this your twenty three authorize the exception of a discontinuation of a hundred thousand dollars in capital outlay appropriations executive recommendation provides for these these changes. At the next next preparation change level we have is on page two fifty S. community corrections special preparation is use support probation parole services and special programs for substance abuse and mental health treatment the first change level here's a reallocation of roughly six six hundred fifty thousand dollars to shared services for both years of the biennium for IT in training expenses second changeable here's a decrease in capital outlay appropriation of eight hundred fifty thousand dollars for fiscal year twenty four the remaining three hundred sixty one thousand dollars in that line item we used to purchase vehicles for the intensive supervision program and the drug court positions. Agencies also requesting reallocation of two hundred thousand dollars from the community corrections program line item to the transitional housing line item to align with expenditure needs executive rack provides for this this changes well. At and the final change level and community correction is on page two hundred fifty three and this is the community correction state appropriation so this community correction general operations budget funding is primarily general revenue but they also receive some cash funds from building right on the at the Texarkana unit. The agency request the following changes a salary match due to the following there's ten positions need for drug courts restoration of fourteen growth pole positions and one federal grant position and a transfer of fifty nine positions from the division of corrections to support the White River correctional center in Batesville. The agency also is requesting operating expenses increase in fiscal year twenty four of two point six million dollars. And three point two million dollars in fiscal year twenty five. Hi this for new and existing drug courts the White River correctional center and various institutional prudence along with inflationary costs. The addition of drug courts in the White River correctional center also call for increasing conference and travel just over thirty thousand dollars for both years of the biennium. next the agency is requesting an increase in professional fees of two point twenty five hundred dollars for service contracts for the drug courts capital outlays been decreased from five hundred thousand dollars to one hundred twenty five thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty four. And to ninety thousand dollars in fiscal year twenty twenty five. As provisionally used to cover the purchase of kitchen laundry equipment for the White River correctional facility lastly yes Is crossing a two million dollar increase in both years of biennium and the re entry line item the increase in the cost of goods and services the second recognized provide for the answer questions appropriation only with the exception of the additional ten drug court positions. Mr chairman that concludes the change levels for any correction thank you must go on a representative Cavenaugh you're recognized. Thank you Mr chair I'm going to questions going to be on page two fifty. And I'm really just kind of curious on what the community correction programs are because we're asking for six million dollars in it but we only spent one point eight so I'm curious what that is. Representative Cavenaugh of if if we go we'll add that to the follow follow up list because I don't think we have a for sure answer for you right now okay and I'm also going to ask about that fund balance because it's large also it's fifteen point three million dollars so that fund is where all of our supervision fees go into that offenders on community supervision our Assessed we have again about Currently two point one million in commitments toward that fund another or one point two million in a roof project and then another or four million in miscellany and in a miscellaneous transfer to the division's operating fund one of the challenges that community correction has had over the years is historically when we especially with specialty court's will be given the specialty court positions through one time funding and we have in past administrations not consistently been given the. Funding one going so we've had to assume those cost internally so every year in order to meet payroll and operations requirements for the division and we have to transfer money out of our supervision fees on which is this account into our I rate the regular operating fund to meet salaries and other operating costs there's about four million of that and then director Brad Schoen are working through about another million and a half or so of additional projects predominately related to safety and emergency services equipment for staff that will also come out of this one. And if I may representative Cavenaugh We also I took a look at that and and and basically did write a breakdown of what it actually is at this very moment in time and right now it's listed as ten million but when you add in all the commitments that are out there that haven't been paid for yet it's actually two point seven right now okay so the commitments we're doing and I'm going to speak about this because this is community corrections and we've got community correction programs which I'd like to know but are we using this money to really help with repeat offenders so they don't keep coming back because I would think if they're paying the fees for supervision then we should be providing the some sort of you know help in the state and out back in the so that we're not having repeat offenders if we've got a big balance like that and we're we're we're saying we got community programs and we're asking for six million but we're only spending one point eight I mean they're paying the fees I'm a I'm a cow like if I'm buying a physician licensed but they're paying the fees and I mean we talk about this all the time about how we have to change our our the cycle of repeat offenders it looks like this would be a great opportunity where we can set up some programs to help those people so that they would not be repeat offenders and and we are most read you know this this this is how we operate the division that supervises that provides that treatment most states do not provide in house treatment to offenders on supervision where one of the states that does and we pay for that in house treatment both staff and through curricula through this fund most recently we actually adopted a new treatment model and just under a hundred thousand dollars in new curriculum material that the board of correction RES recently approved that was paid out of these monies so yes I'm I'm not gonna sit here misleading. Yes this this. In large part does go to operations cost to provide supervision provide treatment staff but there are direct services that are also paid out of these funds well you know if you're going to be asking for an appropriation of six point two million dollars for community correction programs I'd like to see the programs used to help these people is because that's what we need yeah we have to we have to find a way to make the difference and it worked out of fund balance and I know we need to spend it on you know other things and. But this is a huge issue I agree on one thing we talked about earlier was in our efforts to validate our risk assessment tool so we can become more of a we can become a state that focuses more on risk in each day supervision that is long term what our priority is both at my level and direct bread sauce level but also with our board we've just got a couple more pieces we've got to get through before we can get their vote we hear you and one hundred percent agree with you the one that uses for halfway house for transitional housing. That is we do of you already have a line item budget you're if you have a big fund balance we need more of those we knew of them we and we're constantly while working in our Transitional housing division to cultivate those you have us unfortunately not every area is receptive to having that kind of program in their community I thank thank you. Thank you members I'll stay here long as anybody else will will will probably finish up by twelve we do have a sentencing commission prone border areas represented with you're recognized. Thank you Mr will tackle the Arsenale. Is this for your parole officers this they're located in here yes in some parole okay on the your average Your average salary is thirty eight thousand. Thirty nine now. Thirty nine thousand. For parole officer. What kind of workload Laker and was there current number. Our workload is fully staffed which is really never the case you're always have a turnover but I is eighty four one if we work with the vacancies we have right now it's eighty eight eighty nine okay so with that but it does now it was in the nineties last yes I was in the US national average yes most of the national average do you know somewhere in the seventies. Okay is an and we'll do one more own One one of these you had seven forty four thousand dollars shared services it showed nothing in this by an ATM is that that IT training is what will Page joints are I thank you SO two fifty of. Two fifty. It was insured services seven hundred and forty four thousand. Yes that's a you know and we try to approve we were we look at additional areas to transfer a this is coming out of special revenues is likely additional I. T. and potentially professional services contracts but will join him is going to go out that's what that's for yes Sir but you didn't have any of that in this by any this is the school yes that the yes so there's a new money you're requesting or no revenue money this is is not just the purpose thank you Mr chairman thank you was. Thank you the representative Tosh you're recognized thank you Mr follow up representative would not know when twenty seventeen I was on the criminal justice task force and we authorized thirty new positions for a probation officers and the the recommendation for that was at that time the workload was I think about a hundred and twenty of. Individuals that were reporting to a parole officer and the goal there was to reduce that to around fifty but I just heard testimony that is still somewhere in the round eighty can you of those thirty positions failed is that in this capital outlays I'm just mention it on the east and we build those dirty positions and I guess my question would be if we have lines that the still up in the eighties and not in the fifties were we had targeted in twenty seventeen so represent because one of the things that the Division has done to their credit is when we look at our case load that's a mix of high medium and low risk offenders for most offenders form of officers except for our eyes P. officers who all they have is high risk offenders so when we look at those risk levels. We have a point based system so in effect a sixty high risk offenders are the equivalent of a hundred and twenty. Low risk offenders because of the amount of effort it takes into supervising those cases so when you look at that eighty four to one of fully staff right now we're at eighty eight eighty eight eighty nine to one based on what we have field those are it's not the same amount of work being dedicated to each offender so while it is not where we want it to be it is a far more manageable level then where we've been in past years but there is obviously wrong for continued progress okay thank you yes Sir. Thank you senator Chesterfield exactly read. Exactly right motion sir just fill in a second all in favor aye. Those thank you for that the sentencing commission. Director Wallace in and this is a load of Connie roll is the director all right Mister Coleman you're recognized thank you Mr chair. You can find the Arkansas sensing Commission summary on page two hundred and fifty eight. this is the only appropriation within the division this is the sentencing commission State operations appropriation act there's a total request for fiscal year twenty four of three hundred ninety five thousand five hundred fifteen dollars and roughly two hundred thousand Artes sorry roughly two thousand dollar increase for fiscal year twenty five. So this appropriation is funded by general revenue to the miscellaneous agencies fund and there to change levels for the sentencing commission for the upcoming biennium the first is for personal ServiceMagic the second is a reallocation just over nineteen thousand dollars a professional fees to shared services for the contract provides annual inmate population report and those are the only change levels with the Arkansas sensing Commission. Okay not saying any questions. Your motion. A motion and second own favor I. Thank you. For that and our last from today. Is the parole board. Thank you Mr chairman of another short one on page two hundred sixty one. This is the parole board's operation appropriation a total of two point four million dollars being requested for fiscal year twenty four and just this the twenty thousand dollar increase is requested for this year twenty five from that twenty four number I just on page two under sixty one again and this is funded through the miscellaneous agencies fund account there's only one change level FOR proboards and it's adjustments to salary match for each year the biennium and Mister chair that concludes proboards. And welcome Director fail to you every state that you'd like to make. You waited patiently you're okay with thank you for being here the housing any questions. I have a motion exactly recognized second all in favor aye. Posed. Wrecked fail to do very good thank you. Secretary grades and and the others we thank you for being here today answered all our questions. We are returned to. Tuesday. Members were adjourned till Tuesday at nine o'clock.